Centering Prayer/Christian Meditation.

[Alex.C]

Does or has anyone here practiced it. If so did you find yourself drawing closer to God and experienceing more of his manifest presence.I know James Goll has written a book on it

 

[Faulty]

I recently read Thomas Merton's book on it, along with a few others.

Time and again, stuffed away in these books (if they are honest about it), they mention that once you reach a certain prayer level, which should raise all kinds of red flags in itself, that evil spirits manifest themselves to you, either visually, or more commonly inwardly as voices, telling you not to listen to another voice they identify as "God". In the case of Merton, he warns not to listen to those voices, rather listen to the other voice that sounds different, because that one has to be God.

Really what I think is going on is a demonic form of good cop/bad cop, one voice is overtly evil which causes you to rely on and trust in the voice that seems nicer, but is actually just a demonic "angel of light".

Another common theme in these books are that these types of contemplative, or centering prayers is the universal usefulness. Merton's book on the subject has a foreword written by Buddhist zen master Thich Nhat Hanh, who praises this type of prayer as his direct line to "God", both inside him and outside. (As an after thought, I counted the nimber of times the buddhist referenced Jesus in the foreword, and how often Monk-man Merton did so in the entire body of his book. The buddhist won by quite a bit.)

Often in these books, and not only those on contemplative prayer I've read recently, but also on the usage of prayer labrynths, the common theme is that it is a type of prayer for all religions to contact "God", either inside themselves or outside, as the spirits involved seem to be accommodating either way. All of them that go into detail mention that we will also discover the "god" inside ourselves as well.

These are occultic spiritual practices, pure and simple. I encourage you to get Merton's book and read it for yourself. The level of deception is amazing.

Just because someone sticks the word "christian" in front of it don't actually make it so. Suppose an abortion clinic offered "christian" abortions and said they play "Jesus loves the little children" over the loud speakers during the procedure, and even sing along, would that abortion then be "christian"? Of course not. It's still murder no matter how its dressed up. It's the same here, demon-worship is still just that, no matter how it's dressed up as "christian".

 

[Alive_Again]

Time and again, stuffed away in these books (if they are honest about it), they mention that once you reach a certain prayer level, which should raise all kinds of red flags in itself, that evil spirits manifest themselves to you, either visually, or more commonly inwardly as voices, telling you not to listen to another voice they identify as "God". In the case of Merton, he warns not to listen to those voices, rather listen to the other voice that sounds different, because that one has to be God.

These described practices are likely not the ones Goll describes. I haven't read the book, but terminology may be similar, but that's where it may end. I remember when the "positive confession" thing came out and everyone thought it was like Zig Ziglar or others in a more worldly mold. That wasn't the same at all. In charismatic Christianity, "positive confession" was simply agreeing with God in faith and not having a "froward mouth".

If people are only talking about getting into the peace of God and reaffirming His Lordship, in contemplative prayer, then all should be well. If you pray in the Spirit a lot, you'll be more in tune with the spirit realm and be much sharper and more centered.

I haven't read Goll's book, but his book on Angels had some very edifying stuff that pointed out just how God feels about Christians partaking of man things in the world, particularly movies and TV. I would be surprised if Goll was misleading anyone, but I have not read the book. If anyone has some quotes, that would be helpful.

 

[Alive_Again]

Clicked button twice!

 

[Deba]

I disagree with Thomas Merton on many things and this is one. I think that if you read a book and experiment with thoughts and actions that are not your own, you are setting yourself up to possibly have a bad result.

I meditate daily (almost). Sometimes it's a phrase or a word from the Bible or a phrase penned by Oswald Chambers or the other devotional I use. But for me the point is not to come up with a deeper understanding or knowledge at that time.

Experience has shown me that God will frequently use what I though about at a later time, then I have understanding and have gained wisdom.

If your heart wants God, He won't let you be tricked by someone else. He has not drawn us into a spiritual kingdom to leave us without out a guide. He gave us the Holy Spirit for just such a job.

 

[tturt]

Sometimes I think we draw conclusions based on terminology alone. If you just say the word meditation to some folks, they go nuts. But the Scripture says meditate. Some say it means to murmur and you've got to think it to say it so that's not emptying your mind.

 

[Faulty]

Fighting for the Faith: The Inventor of Centering Prayer Teaches Us What It is For

Interview with Thomas Keating, one of the Cistercian Monks Who Invented Centering Prayer Explains the Theology/Spirituality Behind the Practice and What Centering Prayer Is Ultimately For

 

[Faulty]

Sometimes I think we draw conclusions based on terminology alone. If you just say the word meditation to some folks, they go nuts. But the Scripture says meditate. Some say it means to murmur and you've got to think it to say it so that's not emptying your mind.

If you are talking about thinking over the scriptures, that's one thing, but that IS NOT Centering Prayer. Please don't confuse the two.

Centering Prayer is a journey where the end goal is for one to find God within themselves. You cannot hear the interviews, or read the "how to" books and come away with any other conclusion, because this is what they say.

 

[Forge3]

Mantric prayer is a very old practice. The Desert Fathers used to pray/meditate in the caves on "Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me a sinner" or a shortened version. This was known as the prayer of the heart. Some did it in sync with their heart, or breathing. It became autonomic.

Now in deeper prayer a quality is that words of any sort lose their utility. Or rather the soul is put into a hush simply resting in God in silence. The forms of prayer may be instrumental in ushering in such a state though it is likened unto:

"Make a way for the Lord" as the Lord is doing the work through grace.

Deeper intimacy is sought and in the process one bears themselves before the Lord as they are in the moment and letting God be God. There is no literal formula I know of for that. It is simple trust, and being vulnerable.

 

[Faulty]

I disagree with Thomas Merton on many things and this is one. I think that if you read a book and experiment with thoughts and actions that are not your own, you are setting yourself up to possibly have a bad result.

I meditate daily (almost). Sometimes it's a phrase or a word from the Bible or a phrase penned by Oswald Chambers or the other devotional I use. But for me the point is not to come up with a deeper understanding or knowledge at that time.

Experience has shown me that God will frequently use what I though about at a later time, then I have understanding and have gained wisdom.

If your heart wants God, He won't let you be tricked by someone else. He has not drawn us into a spiritual kingdom to leave us without out a guide. He gave us the Holy Spirit for just such a job.

That is not Centering or Contemplative Prayer. Please don't give such a practice a pass due to a confusion of terms.

 

[Alive_Again]

There is a book on a (seemingly) similiar subject. It is not centering prayer. While searching for this I came across a lot of pseudo "watchdog" websites who seem quick to condemn what he says based on the similarity of terms. I think the descriptions sounds like a very balanced teaching, though I haven't heard it and I won't judge it until I do.

Goll is a gifted minister of the gospel.

The Lost Art of Practicing His Presence

Your heart has been created for the Presence of God, and it is not complete without His Presence living within. Naysayers try to convince you that His Presence is elusive and subjective but their voice is silenced by the desire yearning from within for a union with your Lord and Creator.

As a credible response for those who want to fill that inner void with His perfect union, The Lost Art of Practicing His Presence was written. Author James Goll's own journey into His Presence has brought him face-to-face with angels and the Lord. Jim has heard His voice and has moved in His Presence for many years, carefully recording what he now shares with you.

Joyfully you will discover how the Lord covets union with you as much as you seek His Presence. You will also:

Discover the delight of quiet meditation.
Learn to wait and to watch with your Lord.
Experience the joy of contemplative prayer.
Understand the fire of His love.
Learn about others' journeys who sought and found the sweetness of His Presence.

The wisdom contained in this book will give you moment-by-moment confidence and hope as you journey toward the joy and pleasure of His Presence.


Chapters

The Road to True Intimacy
Understanding Contemplative Prayer
Journey Into the Interior Castle
Extravagant Worship
By the Quiet Stream
The Center of Quiet
Reflecting on the God Who Promises
The Ponderings of the Heart
Toward Greater Union with Christ
The Fasted Life
Walking Through the Tabernacle
Live Coals of Fire

Another book is called: Consecrated Contemplative Prayer.

The study guide for it is available as a pdf online.

If anyone finds anything questionable, feel free to post it and bring it into the light.

 

[AudioArtist]

There is a book on a (seemingly) similiar subject. It is not centering prayer. While searching for this I came across a lot of pseudo "watchdog" websites who seem quick to condemn what he says based on the similarity of terms. I think the descriptions sounds like a very balanced teaching, though I haven't heard it and I won't judge it until I do.

Goll is a gifted minister of the gospel.

The Lost Art of Practicing His Presence

Your heart has been created for the Presence of God, and it is not complete without His Presence living within. Naysayers try to convince you that His Presence is elusive and subjective but their voice is silenced by the desire yearning from within for a union with your Lord and Creator.

As a credible response for those who want to fill that inner void with His perfect union, The Lost Art of Practicing His Presence was written. Author James Goll's own journey into His Presence has brought him face-to-face with angels and the Lord. Jim has heard His voice and has moved in His Presence for many years, carefully recording what he now shares with you.

Joyfully you will discover how the Lord covets union with you as much as you seek His Presence. You will also:

Discover the delight of quiet meditation.
Learn to wait and to watch with your Lord.
Experience the joy of contemplative prayer.
Understand the fire of His love.
Learn about others' journeys who sought and found the sweetness of His Presence.

The wisdom contained in this book will give you moment-by-moment confidence and hope as you journey toward the joy and pleasure of His Presence.


Chapters

The Road to True Intimacy
Understanding Contemplative Prayer
Journey Into the Interior Castle
Extravagant Worship
By the Quiet Stream
The Center of Quiet
Reflecting on the God Who Promises
The Ponderings of the Heart
Toward Greater Union with Christ
The Fasted Life
Walking Through the Tabernacle
Live Coals of Fire



The study guide for it is available as a pdf online.

If anyone finds anything questionable, feel free to post it and bring it into the light.

Thanks for bringing this up. I have looked into the book and now have ordered it.