But thou shalt love thy neighbour "as thyself"

[Studyman]

As I lay in bed last night, pondering the Word of God, these Scriptures came into my mind.

Lev. 19: 17 Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him. 18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.
Jesus brought these Scriptures up when HE was pointing out what the corrupt priests "Them of old time" had omitted in their religious philosophy (Matt. 5). I thought about the qualifications or guideline God used concerning what kind of "LOVE" I was to show others. To Love them, "as I Love myself". And also, that I was to "Rebuke" others, and not suffer (Stay quiet about, in my understanding) Sin upon them.

I never really thought about this before in a deeper sense. But this scripture is a commandment to make a judgment regarding the behavior of others and God is calling this "Love", but puts a qualifier on it, "As I love myself". I believe Jesus spoke to this very thing.

Luke 6: 41 And why beholdest thou the mote (Sin) that is in thy brother's eye, but perceivest not the beam (SIN) that is in thine own eye?

42 Either how canst thou say to thy brother, Brother, let me pull out the mote that is in thine eye, when thou thyself beholdest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, cast out first the beam out of thine own eye, and then shalt thou see clearly to pull out the mote that is in thy brother's eye.

Think about this for a moment. Is it not "God's definition of Love" to rebuke His Children so as not to Suffer sin upon them? And so, it is exhibiting God's LOVE for my neighbor to warn him of transgressions. But look what Jesus exposes here. I must "First" Love Myself, before I can Love my Neighbor "As Myself".

42 Either how canst thou say to thy brother, Brother, let me pull out the mote that is in thine eye, (How can I Love My Brother) when thou thyself beholdest not the beam that is in thine own eye? (When I have not shown the same Love for myself) Thou hypocrite, cast out first the beam out of thine own eye, ( First Love myself) and then shalt thou see clearly to pull out the mote that is in thy brother's eye. (Then, knowing the Love of God, I can Love my Brother)



The Scriptures started pouring into my head after these thoughts about "How do I Love myself" according to God?

Deut 30: 19 I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live: 20 That thou mayest love the LORD thy God, and that thou mayest obey his voice, and that thou mayest cleave unto him: for he is thy life, and the length of thy days: that thou mayest dwell in the land which the LORD sware unto thy fathers, to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob, to give them.

Ez. 18: 31 Cast away from you all your transgressions, whereby ye have transgressed; and make you a new heart and a new spirit: for why will ye die, O house of Israel? 32 For I have no pleasure in the death of him that dieth, saith the Lord GOD: wherefore turn yourselves, and live ye.

Luke 13: 3 I tell you, Nay: but, except "ye repent", ye shall all likewise perish.

John 6: 53 Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except "ye eat" the flesh of the Son of man, "and drink" his blood, "ye have" no life in you.

Rom. 2: 7 "To them" who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:

Rom. 6: 16 Know ye not, that to whom "ye yield yourselves" servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

Rom. 12: 1 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that "ye present" your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.

Eph. 4: 23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind; 24 And that "ye put on" the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

2 Cor. 9 Wherefore "we labour", that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him.

Matt. 6: 33 But "seek ye first" the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.

These Scriptures and many more define for God's People how we "Love ourselves" first, so we can know how to Love others, not with fleshy man's love, but with the Righteous Love of God.

 

[bling]

John 15:12
My command is this: Love each other as I have loved you.

 

[Studyman]

John 15:12
My command is this: Love each other as I have loved you.

And who is the "I" here?

Phil. 2: 8 And being found in fashion as a man, "he humbled himself", and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross. Is this not the same Christ who Inspired Leviticus 19?

Heb. 5: 8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; 9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him; Is this not the Same Christ who Inspired Lev. 19 when HE was Up where HE was before becoming a man?

Was HE not "Loving Himself" from the age of 12, to about the age of 30 as God instructs, before HE began to rebuke others?

Luke 2: 46 And it came to pass, that after three days they found him in the temple, sitting in the midst of the doctors, both hearing them, and asking them questions.

Luke 2: 49 And he said unto them, How is it that ye sought me? wist ye not that I must be about my Father's business? 50 And they understood not the saying which he spake unto them.

And what would be His business at that age? Would it not be learning to "Love Himself" so HE wouldn't be a Hypocrite, like those in the churches?

52 And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and in favour with God and man.

For about 18 Years Jesus increased in Wisdom and Stature until that time when HE was ready to promote the Love of God.

Matt. 3: 16 And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him: 17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.

How did this Jesus Love Peter?

Matt. 16: 21 From that time forth began Jesus to shew unto his disciples, how that he must go unto Jerusalem, and suffer many things of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised again the third day. 22 Then Peter took him, and began to rebuke him, saying, Be it far from thee, Lord: this shall not be unto thee. 23 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.

24 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him "deny himself" (First), and take up his cross, and follow me.

So when the scriptures are actually considered, Jesus followed the Leviticus LAW "Perfectly". He didn't hate Peter in His heart, but He did not suffer sin upon him. Truly HE Loved Peter "AS HE LOVED HIMSELF".

And so, I am to Love others, as HE Loved me? Therefore because of HIS Truth I would, like HIM, learn to Love Myself first, just as Jesus did, as His Father Commanded so as to obey the Commandment "but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD..

If you have Scriptural reason for disagreeing with this understanding, please show them.

 

[Mark Quayle]

As I lay in bed last night, pondering the Word of God, these Scriptures came into my mind.

Lev. 19: 17 Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him. 18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.
Jesus brought these Scriptures up when HE was pointing out what the corrupt priests "Them of old time" had omitted in their religious philosophy (Matt. 5). I thought about the qualifications or guideline God used concerning what kind of "LOVE" I was to show others. To Love them, "as I Love myself". And also, that I was to "Rebuke" others, and not suffer (Stay quiet about, in my understanding) Sin upon them.

I never really thought about this before in a deeper sense. But this scripture is a commandment to make a judgment regarding the behavior of others and God is calling this "Love", but puts a qualifier on it, "As I love myself". I believe Jesus spoke to this very thing.

Luke 6: 41 And why beholdest thou the mote (Sin) that is in thy brother's eye, but perceivest not the beam (SIN) that is in thine own eye?

42 Either how canst thou say to thy brother, Brother, let me pull out the mote that is in thine eye, when thou thyself beholdest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, cast out first the beam out of thine own eye, and then shalt thou see clearly to pull out the mote that is in thy brother's eye.

Think about this for a moment. Is it not "God's definition of Love" to rebuke His Children so as not to Suffer sin upon them? And so, it is exhibiting God's LOVE for my neighbor to warn him of transgressions. But look what Jesus exposes here. I must "First" Love Myself, before I can Love my Neighbor "As Myself".

42 Either how canst thou say to thy brother, Brother, let me pull out the mote that is in thine eye, (How can I Love My Brother) when thou thyself beholdest not the beam that is in thine own eye? (When I have not shown the same Love for myself) Thou hypocrite, cast out first the beam out of thine own eye, ( First Love myself) and then shalt thou see clearly to pull out the mote that is in thy brother's eye. (Then, knowing the Love of God, I can Love my Brother)



The Scriptures started pouring into my head after these thoughts about "How do I Love myself" according to God?




These Scriptures and many more define for God's People how we "Love ourselves" first, so we can know how to Love others, not with fleshy man's love, but with the Righteous Love of God.

You might want to read those in several different translations. They don't quite mean what the KJV's old English means nowadays.

 

[Studyman]

You might want to read those in several different translations. They don't quite mean what the KJV's old English means nowadays.

I always compare the CLV, RSV and KJV. I just don't always show the comparison to keep the post shorter, unless they significantly contradict one another, which is rarely the case. I can honestly say I don't compare the religious philosophies of Calvinism or Catholicism or Adventism or Armenism when I study, as I stopped adopting the religious philosophies of this world's religions "who come in Christ's Name" years ago.

If you believe my understanding is flawed because of something in the translation, I would love to hear it. The purpose of the thread is to prompt honest, unbiased discussion of scriptures. I found the topic "As you love yourself" as a qualifier of the Love we are to share with our neighbor interesting.

 

[Clare73]

And who is the "I" here?

Phil. 2: 8 And being found in fashion as a man, "he humbled himself", and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross. Is this not the same Christ who Inspired Leviticus 19?

Heb. 5: 8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; 9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him; Is this not the Same Christ who Inspired Lev. 19 when HE was Up where HE was before becoming a man?

Was HE not "Loving Himself" from the age of 12, to about the age of 30 as God instructs, before HE began to rebuke others?

Luke 2: 46 And it came to pass, that after three days they found him in the temple, sitting in the midst of the doctors, both hearing them, and asking them questions.

Luke 2: 49 And he said unto them, How is it that ye sought me? wist ye not that I must be about my Father's business? 50 And they understood not the saying which he spake unto them.

And what would be His business at that age? Would it not be learning to "Love Himself" so HE wouldn't be a Hypocrite, like those in the churches?

52 And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and in favour with God and man.

For about 18 Years Jesus increased in Wisdom and Stature until that time when HE was ready to promote the Love of God.

Matt. 3: 16 And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him: 17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.

How did this Jesus Love Peter?

Matt. 16: 21 From that time forth began Jesus to shew unto his disciples, how that he must go unto Jerusalem, and suffer many things of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised again the third day. 22 Then Peter took him, and began to rebuke him, saying, Be it far from thee, Lord: this shall not be unto thee. 23 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.

24 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him "deny himself" (First), and take up his cross, and follow me.

So when the scriptures are actually considered, Jesus followed the Leviticus LAW "Perfectly". He didn't hate Peter in His heart, but He did not suffer sin upon him. Truly HE Loved Peter "AS HE LOVED HIMSELF".

And so, I am to Love others, as HE Loved me? Therefore because of HIS Truth I would, like HIM, learn to Love Myself first, just as Jesus did, as His Father Commanded so as to obey the Commandment "but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD..

If you have Scriptural reason for disagreeing with this understanding, please show them.

Love of myself is commitment to my own well being.

Love of neighbor is commitment to his well being, to do for him what is necessary that he cannot do for himself.

Jesus gave us the example of loving our neighbor in the good Samaritan.

 

[Studyman]

Love of myself is commitment to my own well being.

Love of neighbor is commitment to his well being, to do for him that which is necessary that he cannot do for himself.

Jesus gave us the example of loving our neighbor in the good Samaritan.

I'm more interested in what the Scriptures actually say, than popular religious philosophy of one religious sect of this world, or another. Jesus also gave us the example of whipping men who turned His Father's Word into a religious business.

Should we not at the very least "Hear" EVERY WORD HE speaks? And better yet, Love ourselves by believing Him and being a "Doer", not just a hearer of His Words?

 

[Clare73]

Should we not at the very least "Hear" EVERY WORD HE speaks? And better yet, Love ourselves by believing Him and being a "Doer", not just a hearer of His Words?

Those not born again cannot love themselves "by believing Jesus and being a Doer, not just a hearer of his word."
Nevertheless, they love themselves, so that is not what loving oneself means.

Loving oneself is not about faith, it is about commitment to one's own well-being.

 

[Studyman]

Those not born again cannot love themselves by believing Jesus and being a Doer, not just a hearer of his word.
Nevertheless, they love themselves, so that is not what loving oneself means.

Loving oneself is not about faith, it is about commitment to one's own well-being.

And I'm inclined here to remind you that this is not rocket science. . .however, I will forego doing so at this time.

Again, I'm sure you believe your own words and are eager to declare them. But I am only interested in the Inspired Words of God "for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness". Which, according to this Same God, were Created for "MY" wellbeing, for "My Sake no doubt", for "My Admonition". So for me, it's all about Faith.

 

[Clare73]

Again, I'm sure you believe your own words and are eager to declare them. But I am only interested in the Inspired Words of God

Which say nothing about loving ourselves being love of God.

 

[Studyman]

Which say nothing about loving ourselves being love of God.

Of course you must defend and preserve your religion, so you won’t address what is actually written. We have been here many times.

But surely even you must understand that God teaches the difference between carnal fleshy love and Gods Love. And certainly, even you would understand that it is Gods Love that He wants His people to share one with another, and not man’s Love.

 

[Clare73]

Of course you must defend and preserve your religion, so you won’t address what is actually written.

Nowhere is it written that loving ourselves is loving God.

 

[Studyman]

Nowhere is it written that loving ourselves is loving God.

17 Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him. 18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.

You are free to omit God and His Love from any part of your life that suits you. You are free to love your neighbor with your own carnal, fleshy love. We certainly see a lot of that in the "Many" who come in Christ's Name". But only a fool believes God means fleshy, carnal love in this commandment. Of course, you will want to last word.

 

[timothyu]

Apart from the usual definition of not taking from others what we wouldn't want taken from ourselves, you know such as money or property or mates and the like, we continually forgive ourselves using the ol' phrase "I'm only human". What we are saying is we are bound to slip up now and then, some waaaay worse than others, but we all started out on even footing and it is the influences of life that changes us, for better if we learn or worse if we don't. None are free from the guilt of making mistakes so when we judge others we are indeed judging ourselves.

I often wonder how when man sets a penalty for a so called crime and that penalty is paid, that man will continue to harass the offender after they have paid the price we have decided. I wonder if God will do the same for us?

 

[ViaCrucis]

I'm more interested in what the Scriptures actually say, than popular religious philosophy of one religious sect of this world, or another. Jesus also gave us the example of whipping men who turned His Father's Word into a religious business.

Should we not at the very least "Hear" EVERY WORD HE speaks? And better yet, Love ourselves by believing Him and being a "Doer", not just a hearer of His Words?

Jesus didn't whip any people. Do a study on the grammar of the text, when it says that Jesus took a whip and drove "them" out, it is referring to the animals.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Mark Quayle]

Lev. 19: 17 Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him. 18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.

Literal Standard version: "17 You do not hate your brother in your heart; you certainly reprove your fellow, and do not permit sin on him. 19 You do not take vengeance, nor watch the sons of your people; and you have had love for your neighbor as yourself; I [am] YHWH."

NIV: “'17 Do not hate a fellow Israelite in your heart. Rebuke your neighbor frankly so you will not share in their guilt. 18 Do not seek revenge or bear a grudge against anyone among your people, but love your neighbor as yourself. I am the Lord.'"


No criticism. Just interesting differences.

 

[Studyman]

Jesus didn't whip any people. Do a study on the grammar of the text, when it says that Jesus took a whip and drove "them" out, it is referring to the animals.

-CryptoLutheran

So then, let me get this right. The religious business you have adopted and are now promoting, taught you that Jesus made a scourge because HE was angry with, and wanted to drive out the oxen and sheep, but not the children of the devil who had turned God's house into a religious business.

14 And found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, "and" the changers of money sitting:

15 And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, "and" the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers' money, and overthrew the tables;

If I were you, I would "Come out of" this religious business you have adopted, "who comes in Christ's Name", that is teaching you this stuff about God's Word just as fast as I could. "Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues"

The Jesus of the Bible warns you, It is my sincere hope you will believe in Him, over the "many" who call Him Lord, Lord.

Matt. 24: 4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, "Take heed" that no man deceive you. 5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I (Jesus) am Christ; and shall deceive many.

Read His Word's for yourself my friend, stay away from the "other voices" in the garden God placed us in, especially those who "Transform themselves" into Apostles of Christ.

 

[Studyman]

Apart from the usual definition of not taking from others what we wouldn't want taken from ourselves, you know such as money or property or mates and the like, we continually forgive ourselves using the ol' phrase "I'm only human". What we are saying is we are bound to slip up now and then, some waaaay worse than others, but we all started out on even footing and it is the influences of life that changes us, for better if we learn or worse if we don't. None are free from the guilt of making mistakes so when we judge others we are indeed judging ourselves.

I often wonder how when man sets a penalty for a so called crime and that penalty is paid, that man will continue to harass the offender after they have paid the price we have decided. I wonder if God will do the same for us?

Thank you for your personal musings.

It would be appropriate though, and more edifying for all in my view, to actually address the OP and acknowledge and engage in honest discussions about the Scriptures referenced therein.

After all, the Holy Scriptures are Inspired by God, and can be trusted for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness., according to Scriptures.

Your imaginations however, though most likely held precious by you, may not be inspired by God. Therefore, I am warned to "Take Heed" and beware of the Philosophies, Traditions and doctrines of men. You have free will to do as you please. But I would prefer an actual discussion about the Scriptures posted, and the meaning that God assigned to them.

Thank you.

 

[Studyman]

Literal Standard version: "17 You do not hate your brother in your heart; you certainly reprove your fellow, and do not permit sin on him. 19 You do not take vengeance, nor watch the sons of your people; and you have had love for your neighbor as yourself; I [am] YHWH."

NIV: “'17 Do not hate a fellow Israelite in your heart. Rebuke your neighbor frankly so you will not share in their guilt. 18 Do not seek revenge or bear a grudge against anyone among your people, but love your neighbor as yourself. I am the Lord.'"


No criticism. Just interesting differences.

I have heard of this philosophy Mark. The implication is that a man can be deceived into believing lies about God, and further this deceit onto others by relying on one English Translation over another. I've seen competing religious businesses and sects argue over translations since my youth.

This is a very common practice used by this world's many different religious sects and businesses, as they compete with each other to fill the seats of their manmade shrines of worship. As more and more religious sects and businesses enter the market, and they will because historically there is big money in religion, new Bible translations will also be created and used in the same fashion. What is there now, over 400 English Translations alone? And why so many? Because of competing religious businesses, according to my studies.

This practice has gone on for centuries.

This philosophy is founded on one universally believed principle. And that is that God is not capable of preserving His Necessary Truth in English Translations.

Since I have left this world's religions, some 30 years ago now, and studied apart from the competing influence of ANY of them, I have come to a different understanding. If all I had was the NIV or the LSV, and I was seeking God from my heart, I would find HIS SAME Truth in them that I would find if all I had was the KJV or the RSV. And your post confirms what I have found to be the truth. There isn't a nickel's worth of difference between the KJV, NIV and LSV translations where Lev. 19:17 in concerned. I could use any one of the 3 in the OP, and nothing would change.

I don't have to "search" for some religion or religious business to suit me, I simply trust the Scriptures, instead of religions, KJV. "for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness". NIV "for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness", LSV for teaching, for conviction, for correction, for instruction that [is] in righteousness,

And since I have not adopted the religious philosophies of this world's competing religions, I am not bound by them and therefore I have no need to shop for competing translations which may be interpreted to support them.

As Prophesied, I have the Oracles of God in my own home, in my own mind. I am now sitting in Moses Seat and am no longer bound by the need or required to seek out "many" who come in Christ's Name, to read God's Word to me.

Truly the freedom in Christ.

Great topic, perhaps we should start a thread about it.

 

[ViaCrucis]

So then, let me get this right. The religious business you have adopted and are now promoting, taught you that Jesus made a scourge because HE was angry with, and wanted to drive out the oxen and sheep, but not the children of the devil who had turned God's house into a religious business.

No. I've done my own study of the grammar of the text. And encouraged you to do the same.

14 And found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, "and" the changers of money sitting:

15 And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, "and" the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers' money, and overthrew the tables;

If I were you, I would "Come out of" this religious business you have adopted, "who comes in Christ's Name", that is teaching you this stuff about God's Word just as fast as I could. "Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues"

The Jesus of the Bible warns you, It is my sincere hope you will believe in Him, over the "many" who call Him Lord, Lord.

Matt. 24: 4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, "Take heed" that no man deceive you. 5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I (Jesus) am Christ; and shall deceive many.

Read His Word's for yourself my friend, stay away from the "other voices" in the garden God placed us in, especially those who "Transform themselves" into Apostles of Christ.

That's a lot of unnecessary slander on your part. But I hope you have a nice day.

-CryptoLutheran