Born again

[Tellyontellyon]

I get the impression that modern Christians put a lot of emphasis on Christ dying for our sins, bit reading the Bible, it is more about Christ being reborn... and that we die and are reborn in Christ... Is this right?

 

[Lukaris]

The Lord paid for our sins on the cross and in His sinless resurrection frees us from the everlasting pain of sin when we die to eventually rise again when we acknowledge Him as our Savior, repent, have lived by faith worthy of our repentance ( 1 Corinthians 15:20-24, Acts of the Apostles 26:20, Ephesians 2:8-10 etc.).

For how long we live from when we repent will vary of course. From the thief on the cross to living to be 100 year old.

 

[d taylor]

-​

A person who is an unbeliever. When they understand and believe, trust, have faith in The Messiah (Jesus) for God's free gift of Eternal Life. Then they are born again, they now are a child of God.

The born again is a spiritual born again that eventually will result in a new physical body after their eventual bodily resurrection.

 

[Dave G.]

I get the impression that modern Christians put a lot of emphasis on Christ dying for our sins, bit reading the Bible, it is more about Christ being reborn... and that we die and are reborn in Christ... Is this right?

If he had not risen from the dead then the death itself would be meaningless. He had a transformed body after He rose but He didn't need to be born again, as Him being God in the second person always existed, He just came to earth in flesh to die and raise again, to be the propitiation for our sins, a penalty that without Him we could never pay. . We do need rebirth and that rebirth is in our spirit when we believe on Him ( the death burial and resurrection), give our lives over to Him. We are changed then from the kingdom of darkness to that of light. We belong to God after. It's actually a legal transaction in heaven and we are written into the Lambs Book of Life.

We are secure in that, it's a promise from God and in 1st Peter 1 you can read a guaranty. We continue in the faith and not fall away. When we die then to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord ( for believers only). Buddha can not get you there. Read John the 3rd chapter, Jesus there says you must be born again to see the kingdom of God.

 

[timf]

The idea of being "born again" has become prominent in Christian circles since even before the 20th century.

Joh 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

However, in talking with Nicodemus, Jesus was most likely referring to the change that those of Israel would experience as a nation;

Eze 36:25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
Eze 36:26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
Eze 36:27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

This may be seen when Jesus asked Nicodemus if he was a teacher of Israel, why he did not know this.

Christians today experience something related in that we are regenerated with new life. It may be a subtle distinction and one can easily see how this could also be called being "born again".

The idea that the regeneration (being made a new creature) happens at baptism is not so easy to support. Much confusion comes from the translators reluctance to translate the Greek word baptizo and simply transliterate it. The word is best translated immersion.

Christians are immersed into Christ (and become part of the body of Christ) by being immersed by the Holy Spirit. This is a result of faith (trust) in Jesus.

 

[Dave G.]

Being reborn of the spirit, born again, regenerated are basically all the same. But we are changed, without the change you will not display the attributes of the fruit of the Spirit ( Holy Spirit), He generates that in us. Without the change, well there must be change that simple. We will grow in sanctification as the Spirit now leads our lives. Jesus said I will leave you but not alone, I will send another. That other is the Holy Spirit who indwells us, guides us, works in our souls and helps us to become more Christ like.

 

[ViaCrucis]

I get the impression that modern Christians put a lot of emphasis on Christ dying for our sins, bit reading the Bible, it is more about Christ being reborn... and that we die and are reborn in Christ... Is this right?

Reborn? You mean resurrected?

Rebirth--being born again--refers to a renewal and transformation of the human person from being estranged from God and out of communion with Him on account of our sinfulness to being a reconciled child of God's household. Like a prodigal returned home, a lost sheep returned to the pasture and comfort of the good shepherd.

The term Jesus uses in John chapter 3 in His discourse with Rabbi Nicodemus can be translated both as "born again" and "born from above"--it speaks of a re-birth from above (that is, from God). In this discourse Nicodemus responds to Jesus asking, "How can someone, already being born, be born again--do they re-enter their mother's womb?" Jesus expands what He says,

"Amen amen I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, they cannot enter God's kingdom. That which is born of flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Do not marvel that I said to you, 'You must be born again.' The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes from or where it goes. So it is with everyone who is born of the Spirit."

Jesus connects "you must be born again" with "born of water and the Spirit"; that's a very clear reference to Baptism.

Why does Jesus mention Baptism to Nicodemus when Jesus has not yet instituted Christian Baptism yet? Jesus institutes Christian Baptism after His resurrection, as recorded in the Gospel of St. Matthew chapter 28, "Make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit".

Jesus can, even before the institution of Holy Baptism, speak of the power of that baptism (for its power comes from Him, by His name and authority for the forgiveness of sins (see Acts of the Apostles 2:38) and by union with Christ--His crucifixion, death, burial, and rising again (Romans 6:3-4, Colossians 2:12, Galatians 3:27) because Baptism is prefigured in the Jewish practice of ritual washing (tevilah) which is often translated and called "baptism" in Greek.

In Judaism, both two thousand years ago and today, when a Gentile was undergoing the process of conversion to become a Jew there were a number of steps in that conversion process. Obviously for males (adults and children) conversion to Judaism meant circumcision; but for everyone (regardless of age or sex) a washing in the tevilah by immersion into water (usually at a mikveh, a bath specifically intended for tevilah) was essential. This conversion-tevilah wasn't just a meaningless bath, rather it signified the transformation and rebirth from being outside of the covenant people of God (a Gentile) to now being one of God's covenant people (a Jew).

So after Jesus says what He says to Nicodemus above, He continues,

"Are you a teacher of Israel and yet you do not know these things?"

Jesus' question presumes Nicodemus to know these things, or that he should get it--but for some reason doesn't. Nicodemus, a rabbi, should have picked up on what Jesus was saying. Christian tradition, does, of course say that Nicodemus did eventually get it, as Nicodemus would be baptized and become a Christian after Jesus' passion and resurrection. But here, in this text, Nicodemus seems either confused or, possibly, hostile in his questioning; but Jesus nevertheless answers and addresses Nicodemus seriously.

Baptism, in traditional Christian teaching, is the ordinary means of God to bring about our regeneration--our new birth by the power of the Holy Spirit; by giving us faith, a new and clean heart and conscience before God, and all the promises and gifts associated with Baptism in Scripture.

And that's important: Regeneration is the work of God to take us as we were and are in our weakness, our sinfulness, and faithlessness and give us faith, through which the full work of Christ is appropriated to us (Justification) and our being worked upon by God through the ongoing power and work of the Spirit in our lives as we live as Christ's disciples and live in the grace and truth of God's gifts and promises as members of God's Household: His Church.

Jesus wasn't "reborn", He didn't need to be regenerated because He's Jesus--He's the One who gives us new birth, because we need it. Our regeneration--our new birth from God--sets us in and with Christ and our being changed and renewed day-by-day into the image and likeness of Jesus our Lord.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Tellyontellyon]

The death aspect seems important to me.. to die to this sinful life.
I need this death.

 

[ViaCrucis]

The death aspect seems important to me.. to die to this sinful life.
I need this death.

That is the life-long journey of the disciple of Jesus Christ.

As Pastor Bonhoeffer put it, "When Christ calls a man, He bids him, 'Come and die'."

Every Christian is a sinner-saint.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Dave G.]

The death aspect seems important to me.. to die to this sinful life.
I need this death.

Slowly the death comes, our sinful flesh gives up lustful desires and the list goes on. To be crucified with Christ we leave it at the cross with the piles of sins there. But ultimate death of these bodies we all come to die once ( physical death at the end of our time on earth). And one day will be resurrected as He was, to be joined with us in glorified form. Perfection at last ! As long as we walk in these bodies we will be sinners ( thus confession in 1st John 3:9 ish) but have His righteousness imparted into us, we are joint heirs with Him in heaven but haven't passed on yet to be with Him yet.

We could be closer than we realize, my wife passed over in about 3 minutes from the time she called up the stairs for me. Nobody knew she would die Dec 20/2020. Thank God she knew our Lord, I get great comfort in knowing where she is and even given a wide awake vision of her entering through the gateway. So awesome because the outcome could have been so much worse. And she had simple faith, no need for legalism,she believed and she trusted with 0 doubt ! And I mean 0. She's not dead, we'd been on a trip through life together and she went home ahead of me. Just left her body behind for the time being. We are not guaranteed tomorrow as we know life on earth but Jesus is the only one who assures eternal life.

 

[timf]

When a person becomes a Christian, he still has influence from the flesh. We are told to mortify (put to death) the deeds of the flesh. This is done through starvation as if we do not feed the flesh and its desires, the work of the Spirit transforming us into better people can proceed with less hindrance.

Gal 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
Gal 5:23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
Gal 5:25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.

 

[Clare73]

The idea of being "born again" has become prominent in Christian circles since even before the 20th century.
Joh 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
However, in talking with Nicodemus, Jesus was most likely referring to the change that those of Israel would experience as a nation;

Do you think so in light of the context. . .he is speaking of the Holy Spirit (John 3:5-8) and the kingdom of God, both of which are spiritual, his kingdom being not of this world (John 18:36), but of the spiritual world, invisible and within (Luke 17:20-21) the hearts where he reigns and rules.

 

[CallofChrist]

The Kingdom of God is already-not-yet. Jesus proclaimed the kingdom,and all believers are citizens of that kingdom, but it will not be fully consummated until he returns again in glory and he rules the new heavens and the new earth:

2 Peter 3:13 - But according to his promise we are waiting for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells.

 

[James_Lai]

I get the impression that modern Christians put a lot of emphasis on Christ dying for our sins, bit reading the Bible, it is more about Christ being reborn... and that we die and are reborn in Christ... Is this right?

Absolutely. Without resurrection, there’s no salvation