Bill Maher tells actor he’s ‘crazy woke’ for refusing to 'judge' Islam over its treatment of women

[Vambram]

'You would never allow something like that to happen in this country,' Maher told Cryer of laws in Muslim countries requiring women to cover their face.

Bill Maher called "Two and a Half Men" star Jon Cryer "crazy woke" after the actor refused to criticize Islam over its strict dress code for women while on Maher's "Club Random" podcast on Sunday.

The show was off to a rocky start after Maher brought up the presidential election and Cryer dismissed Maher's point that the illegal immigration issue hurt the Democratic Party.

Maher moved on to address the decline of western standards in areas like London, where nearly 4 million people self-identified as Muslim in the 2021 census.

He referenced a "60 Minutes" report where a woman was "screamed at" for walking through a Muslim neighborhood in London while wearing a skirt.
"The point of it was that there are places in western civilizations that are not run by western standards and that doesn't mean they're just different," he told Cryer.

"We should agree that women should be able to wear what they want," Maher continued. "If you don't agree with that, you're not a liberal to begin with."

Cryer pushed back on Maher's point, saying that while he agreed that women should be able to wear what they want, there were many places around the world where women didn't have the freedom to dress how they'd like.

"In many places they used to get catcalled all the time," Cryer argued, which Maher scoffed at.

Cryer was reluctant to criticize the strict rules for women in these places, saying, "it's not my culture."
"You won't judge it?" Maher asked.
"I'm not going to judge it," Cryer replied. "No."
"That's crazy woke to me," Maher remarked.
The talk show host, who frequently rails against the far-left, said liberals who accept intolerance in the name of diversity had gone "off the rails."
"That's where it went off the rails, when we became so tolerant that we tolerate intolerance," Maher said. "You would never allow something like that to happen in this country."

Later, the pair argued over "woke" politics within the Democratic Party and illegal immigration hurting Democrats in the election. Maher argued that "stupid wokeness" got Trump re-elected along with the open borders policies of the Biden administration.

Cryer, who quipped he was "stupid woke" at the start of the show, claimed the real reason why President-elect Donald Trump won the election was because Americans hated inflation, Black women and transgender people.
"I think Americans hate inflation. They hate inflation, they hate riots, they hate Black women, and they hate trans people. They just spent hundreds of millions of dollars demonizing trans people and that's disgusting," Cryer remarked to Maher's dismay.
"Oh Jon," Maher sighed heavily. "We shouldn't talk politics."

Bill Maher tells actor he’s ‘crazy woke’ for refusing to 'judge' Islam over its treatment of women

Bill Maher called actor Jon Cryer "crazy woke" after he refused to judge the strict dress code for women in the Islamic religion, while on Maher's podcast.

www.foxnews.com

 

[iluvatar5150]

I think the only people watching Bill Maher at this point are right-wing commentators and maybe a handful of dudes over the age of 50. Even if you agree with him, he's been doing the same stale schtick for 30 years.

 

[Landon Caeli]

I think the only people watching Bill Maher at this point are right-wing commentators and maybe a handful of dudes over the age of 50. Even if you agree with him, he's been doing the same stale schtick for 30 years.

You guys are going to go so far down the rabbit hole, you'll never find your way out.

...The Left will wither away into nothing, because of people like Jon Cryer.

 

[rambot]

If a woman CHOOSES to wear a hijab, I am in support of it. I am not in support of it being forced. It is strange to me though that Jewish Orthodox women have expectations on them as well but I never hear them getting any support.

I don't see the benefit of standing atop the mountain and saying "I judge thee, muslims for ....."

What's the point in that?

 

[Laodicean60]

I think the only people watching Bill Maher at this point are right-wing commentators and maybe a handful of dudes over the age of 50. Even if you agree with him, he's been doing the same stale schtick for 30 years.

Who watches J Stewart? He seems critical sometimes with left policy and media.
Cryer shows his elitist attitude about immigration and this was part of the reason for the loss.

 

[iluvatar5150]

You guys are going to go so far down the rabbit hole, you'll never find your way out.

...The Left will wither away into nothing, because of people like Jon Cryer.

What rabbit hole? Between Maher and Cryer, you have two people who nobody cares about outside of right-wingers who think Maher has purchase on the left.

Who watches J Stewart? He seems critical sometimes with left policy and media.
Cryer shows his elitist attitude about immigration and this was part of the reason for the loss.

I have no idea who watches John Stewart anymore. He left the Daily Show almost 10 years ago (yes, I know he returned last year as a weekly guest host), at which point, his relevance seemed to drop off pretty quickly. His advocacy work for 9/11 responders had traction a while ago, but most mention I've seen of him lately has been mildly critical.

 

[durangodawood]

.....Maher.

Never watched him. I heard he said mean things about religion generally, including Christianity.

.....Cryer.

Never even heard of him.

 

[RileyG]

Never watched him. I heard he said mean things about religion generally, including Christianity.

Never even heard of him.

He was in Pretty in Pink with Molly Ringwald.

 

[RileyG]

If a woman CHOOSES to wear a hijab, I am in support of it. I am not in support of it being forced. It is strange to me though that Jewish Orthodox women have expectations on them as well but I never hear them getting any support.

I don't see the benefit of standing atop the mountain and saying "I judge thee, muslims for ....."

What's the point in that?

I do agree with you, but I don’t think Maher was referring to just the hijab, I think he was referring to the burkha, where the entire face and body is covered.

 

[Vambram]

I think the only people watching Bill Maher at this point are right-wing commentators and maybe a handful of dudes over the age of 50. Even if you agree with him, he's been doing the same stale schtick for 30 years.

Real Time with Bill Maher​

Real Time with Bill Maher is a U.S. television program broadcast on HBO since Friday, February 21, 2003. Real Time with Bill Maher is watched by a total number of 601,000 people (0.19% rating, up +11% from last week) as of the daily audience measurement on November 22, 2024. Real Time with Bill Maher is also shown on CNN since March 2024. Real Time is hosted by William Maher

Real Time with Bill Maher Ratings

Latest Nielsen ratings of Real Time with Bill Maher television program on HBO.

ustvdb.com

Real Time with Bill Maher
Real Time with Bill Maher is a U.S. television program broadcast on CNN since Saturday, March 23, 2024. Real Time with Bill Maher is watched by a total number of 723,000 people (0.23% rating, down -2% from last week) as of the daily audience measurement on November 23, 2024. Real Time with Bill Maher is also shown on HBO since February 2003. Real Time is hosted by William Maher

Real Time with Bill Maher Ratings

Latest Nielsen ratings of Real Time with Bill Maher television program on CNN.

ustvdb.com

 

[iluvatar5150]

Real Time with Bill Maher​

Real Time with Bill Maher is a U.S. television program broadcast on HBO since Friday, February 21, 2003. Real Time with Bill Maher is watched by a total number of 601,000 people (0.19% rating, up +11% from last week) as of the daily audience measurement on November 22, 2024. Real Time with Bill Maher is also shown on CNN since March 2024. Real Time is hosted by William Maher

Real Time with Bill Maher Ratings

Latest Nielsen ratings of Real Time with Bill Maher television program on HBO.

ustvdb.com

Real Time with Bill Maher
Real Time with Bill Maher is a U.S. television program broadcast on CNN since Saturday, March 23, 2024. Real Time with Bill Maher is watched by a total number of 723,000 people (0.23% rating, down -2% from last week) as of the daily audience measurement on November 23, 2024. Real Time with Bill Maher is also shown on HBO since February 2003. Real Time is hosted by William Maher

Real Time with Bill Maher Ratings

Latest Nielsen ratings of Real Time with Bill Maher television program on CNN.

ustvdb.com

Thank you for those links (sincerely), but I am amused at how right I was - his audience is small and less than half of them are under 55.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

I think the only people watching Bill Maher at this point are right-wing commentators and maybe a handful of dudes over the age of 50. Even if you agree with him, he's been doing the same stale schtick for 30 years.

But to his credit he seems to have his finger on the pulse of where a good-sized chunk of society is on certain issues (especially independents and moderates), I suspect that if the Democratic ticket would've put someone up who had the ideological positions of Maher, there's a chance they could've won in 2024.

If what we saw in the election was exclusively a US phenomenon, then perhaps it'd be at least somewhat reasonable to posit that whatever "ism"/"phobia" du jour was potentially a catalyst.

However, we've seen the progressive parties in several different countries get "rebuked by the public".

Portugal, Germany, Greece, The Netherlands, and most recently, Canada, have all seen their countries' liberal parties experiencing setbacks in the past 3-4 years. The most commonly cited reasons are a combination of Immigration policy and social issues. All of those countries are arguably far more progressive than we are, as a whole, across a variety of issues.


Several countries have now figured out where the left-boundary is of their respective Overton Window, and hopefully are formulating to bring things back to the center a bit.


To Justin Trudeau's credit, he's stated that moving forward, he wants to see his country moved to a ranked choice voting system.

I've been touting that system for years, it's a great idea...I'll give credit where it's due.

Not only does it provide a better system for the voters themselves, it's also a great indicator (for the parties themselves) for where the public is really at with regards to certain policies.


For instance, in a 2-party election, if you see the final result is
51% democrat
49% republican

That doesn't really give a great indication of whether or not that was the result of every democratic voter loving the policies as-is, or if they were merely holding their nose and voting against the other team.

Whereas, in a ranked choice system, there's more data insights.

If democrats ultimately end up winning with 51%.:
Knowing
"Hey, we won, but 30% of those voters actually picked the libertarian party as their first choice, and ranked us 2nd, and only 10% of them ranked the Green party as 2nd"
vs.
"We won, and we were the overwhelming 1st choice among most of those 51%, with a significant number ranking the Greens as #2"

Those two scenarios tell a very different tale about which direction the DNC needs to move to have their finger on the pulse.

 

[iluvatar5150]

But to his credit he seems to have his finger on the pulse of where a good-sized chunk of society is on certain issues

In what way? That a lot of people like being snarky and pointing the finger at others? Sure. Does he have any actual policy positions he promotes?

 

[Hazelelponi]

'You would never allow something like that to happen in this country,' Maher told Cryer of laws in Muslim countries requiring women to cover their face.

Bill Maher called "Two and a Half Men" star Jon Cryer "crazy woke" after the actor refused to criticize Islam over its strict dress code for women while on Maher's "Club Random" podcast on Sunday.

The show was off to a rocky start after Maher brought up the presidential election and Cryer dismissed Maher's point that the illegal immigration issue hurt the Democratic Party.

Maher moved on to address the decline of western standards in areas like London, where nearly 4 million people self-identified as Muslim in the 2021 census.

He referenced a "60 Minutes" report where a woman was "screamed at" for walking through a Muslim neighborhood in London while wearing a skirt.
"The point of it was that there are places in western civilizations that are not run by western standards and that doesn't mean they're just different," he told Cryer.

"We should agree that women should be able to wear what they want," Maher continued. "If you don't agree with that, you're not a liberal to begin with."

Cryer pushed back on Maher's point, saying that while he agreed that women should be able to wear what they want, there were many places around the world where women didn't have the freedom to dress how they'd like.

"In many places they used to get catcalled all the time," Cryer argued, which Maher scoffed at.

Cryer was reluctant to criticize the strict rules for women in these places, saying, "it's not my culture."
"You won't judge it?" Maher asked.
"I'm not going to judge it," Cryer replied. "No."
"That's crazy woke to me," Maher remarked.
The talk show host, who frequently rails against the far-left, said liberals who accept intolerance in the name of diversity had gone "off the rails."
"That's where it went off the rails, when we became so tolerant that we tolerate intolerance," Maher said. "You would never allow something like that to happen in this country."

Later, the pair argued over "woke" politics within the Democratic Party and illegal immigration hurting Democrats in the election. Maher argued that "stupid wokeness" got Trump re-elected along with the open borders policies of the Biden administration.

Cryer, who quipped he was "stupid woke" at the start of the show, claimed the real reason why President-elect Donald Trump won the election was because Americans hated inflation, Black women and transgender people.
"I think Americans hate inflation. They hate inflation, they hate riots, they hate Black women, and they hate trans people. They just spent hundreds of millions of dollars demonizing trans people and that's disgusting," Cryer remarked to Maher's dismay.
"Oh Jon," Maher sighed heavily. "We shouldn't talk politics."

Bill Maher tells actor he’s ‘crazy woke’ for refusing to 'judge' Islam over its treatment of women

Bill Maher called actor Jon Cryer "crazy woke" after he refused to judge the strict dress code for women in the Islamic religion, while on Maher's podcast.

www.foxnews.com

I agree with Maher. Anyone who thinks it's fine for some group of people to force or coerce a woman to cover her face in public against her will they can't call themselves liberal.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

In what way? That a lot of people like being snarky and pointing the finger at others? Sure. Does he have any actual policy positions he promotes?

Actually yes:

In terms of liberal values
He's pro-environment
He's in favor of the Medicare for all approach to healthcare
Supports paid family leave
He was in favor of marijuana legalization (that's since been achieved in most places)

On the more moderate positions:
He's pro-choice (but acknowledges some realities about that debate)
I would say he's moderate on LGBT issues
Favors some additional gun control measures, but not outright bans
He's staunchly free-speech, and critical of some of the "PC stuff"


He's basically on par with a "late 90's/early 2000's democrat", which is actually where a good chunk of society is present day.

 

[iluvatar5150]

Actually yes:

In terms of liberal values
He's pro-environment
He's in favor of the Medicare for all approach to healthcare
Supports paid family leave
He was in favor of marijuana legalization (that's since been achieved in most places)

On the more moderate positions:
He's pro-choice (but acknowledges some realities about that debate)
I would say he's moderate on LGBT issues
Favors some additional gun control measures, but not outright bans
He's staunchly free-speech, and critical of some of the "PC stuff"


He's basically on par with a "late 90's/early 2000's democrat", which is actually where a good chunk of society is present day.

Maybe that explains why his schtick hasn't evolved since then, either.

I mean... I appreciate that that was a direct answer to my question, so maybe I should've asked a different question. Or made a different point.

I don't think Maher has his finger on the pulse of anything. There's always a segment of the population that's going to be grumpy and contrarian, which is his target audience. He's outrage fuel for people who fancy themselves too urbane for Sean Hannity and too old for Joe Rogan.

Cryer's obviously over-correcting in what's quoted here, but he's right to be a bit gunshy of criticizing Islamic culture from over here, because it's not going to do any good - Maher's audience is primarily American and likely has little-to-no sway in the middle east. But what those comments will do is foment anti-islamic bigotry here in the US, which is bad. Unsurprisingly, it was the anti-Muslim sentiments that the OP's Fox News article latched onto the most.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Maybe that explains why his schtick hasn't evolved since then, either.

I don't think Maher has his finger on the pulse of anything. There's always a segment of the population that's going to be grumpy and contrarian, which is his target audience. He's outrage fuel for people who fancy themselves too urbane for Sean Hannity and too old for Joe Rogan.

It's not so much about how much he, himself has or hasn't evolved...as you said, his position hasn't changed much since the 90's, the overton window shifted left around him.

I think it's a case where a decent sized percentage of the population has evolved into his relatively static position (in addition to the percentage that was already there)

Grumpy'ish, dry-humor critiques of things have always been his shtick, that's his brand of comedy. So his delivery mechanism isn't the focal point.

If you look at public polling on the various issues in question:

The Democrats Need an Honest Conversation on Gender Identity

The party went into an election with policies it couldn’t defend—or even explain.

www.theatlantic.com

Apologies if you didn't want to go that far into the weeds on various polls and infographics...

But I posted all of that in order to say, I think one can reasonably say that the view of Maher, represent the views of 70-80% of democrats, 60-70% of independents, and 40-50% of republicans.

That's a decent-sized coalition.

One may even venture a guess and say, if a polished politician with the same positions as Bill Maher ran for public office, they would do quite well at the ballot box in most of the country.


Imagine you had a time machine, and you could go back and tell the democratic house reps and senators in 1995, "Hey, you know, 20 years from now, over half of regular republican voters will believe in climate change, support gay marriage, support legalizing pot, and will agree with a few additional restrictions on gun ownership"

They would be in disbelief and say "yipee, in the future we're going to win every single election from 2015 until eternity!"

...until you told them
"yeah, well, they kind of blew it because they could've just kept their policies from 2012 right where they were at, and absorbed a lot of those voters, but instead, decided to hitch their wagon to a bunch of controversial new issues that were wildly unpopular with 2/3 of the electorate, and as a result, a bunch of people got on board with Donald Trump"

"Wait, you mean that guy from NY who bankrupted casinos and keeps cheating on spouses???"

"Yep, that's the one!"

"Wow, did he at least surround himself with good people?"

"Hehe, it's funny you should ask...you know the Mayor of New York city?"

"Yeah, Rudy, he seems to have a good head on his shoulders, he's cleaned up NYC quite a bit and he was the prosecutor who helped deal massive blows to the NY Crime families and spearheaded RICO"

"...well, as luck would have it, he ended up going off the rails and ended giving a press conference about conspiracy theories in front of a landscaping company with hair dye running down his face because he booked the wrong Four Seasons"

Their heads would be spinning trying to absorb all that information.


But now I've gone down the rabbit hole lol. End of Time Travel fan-fiction rant lol

 

[iluvatar5150]

It's not so much about how much he, himself has or hasn't evolved...as you said, his position hasn't changed much since the 90's, the overton window shifted left around him.

I think it's a case where a decent sized percentage of the population has evolved into his relatively static position (in addition to the percentage that was already there)

Grumpy'ish, dry-humor critiques of things have always been his shtick, that's his brand of comedy. So his delivery mechanism isn't the focal point.

I disagree - I think Maher's delivery mechanism is all he has. It's snarky cynicism presented as a substitute for insight or cleverness. It's why Ann Coulter fit in as a regular on his show - because despite never being a good faith actor, she could deliver snark in a civilized package.

If you look at public polling on the various issues in question:

View attachment 359581

View attachment 359582
View attachment 359583
View attachment 359584

The Democrats Need an Honest Conversation on Gender Identity

The party went into an election with policies it couldn’t defend—or even explain.

www.theatlantic.com

Apologies if you didn't want to go that far into the weeds on various polls and infographics...

But I posted all of that in order to say, I think one can reasonably say that the view of Maher, represent the views of 70-80% of democrats, 60-70% of independents, and 40-50% of republicans.

That's a decent-sized coalition.

One may even venture a guess and say, if a polished politician with the same positions as Bill Maher ran for public office, they would do quite well at the ballot box in most of the country.

Like Joe Biden? Or Hillary Clinton? Or most other mainstream democrats?

Imagine you had a time machine, and you could go back and tell the democratic house reps and senators in 1995, "Hey, you know, 20 years from now, over half of regular republican voters will believe in climate change, support gay marriage, support legalizing pot, and will agree with a few additional restrictions on gun ownership"

They would be in disbelief and say "yipee, in the future we're going to win every single election from 2015 until eternity!"

...until you told them
"yeah, well, they kind of blew it because they could've just kept their policies from 2012 right where they were at, and absorbed a lot of those voters, but instead, decided to hitch their wagon to a bunch of controversial new issues that were wildly unpopular with 2/3 of the electorate, and as a result, a bunch of people got on board with Donald Trump"

"Wait, you mean that guy from NY who bankrupted casinos and keeps cheating on spouses???"

"Yep, that's the one!"

"Wow, did he at least surround himself with good people?"

"Hehe, it's funny you should ask...you know the Mayor of New York city?"

"Yeah, Rudy, he seems to have a good head on his shoulders, he's cleaned up NYC quite a bit and he was the prosecutor who helped deal massive blows to the NY Crime families and spearheaded RICO"

"...well, as luck would have it, he ended up going off the rails and ended giving a press conference about conspiracy theories in front of a landscaping company with hair dye running down his face because he booked the wrong Four Seasons"

Their heads would be spinning trying to absorb all that information.


But now I've gone down the rabbit hole lol. End of Time Travel fan-fiction rant lol

Right, Trump has been gaining ground despite surrounding himself with charlatans and continually saying stuff that's completely unhinged. Trump can hire Russian patsies and muse about annexing Greenland, but Dems are the ones who've gone too far off the deep end.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

I disagree - I think Maher's delivery mechanism is all he has. It's snarky cynicism presented as a substitute for insight or cleverness. It's why Ann Coulter fit in as a regular on his show - because despite never being a good faith actor, she could deliver snark in a civilized package.

But she was a regular on his show back when it was called "Politically incorrect" long before his liberal bona fides were ever in question. The fact that he can engage with people from both sides and have conversations about similarities and difference isn't a negative, it's a positive.

It's the same thing people don't get about Joe Rogan. He's popular specifically because he's willing to engage with people from both sides and be cynical.

The fact that he can sit down with Bernie Sanders and talk about similarities and then hold his feet to the fire about difference, and then do the same thing to Matt Walsh a few months later is what makes him popular

Like Joe Biden? Or Hillary Clinton? Or most other mainstream democrats?

Maybe like Joe Biden used to be...

Can you name one mainstream democrat who hasn't outflanked the moderate voter on the lefthand side by quite a bit on any of the polarizing issues? (at least in terms of rhetoric)

I voted for Biden in 2020 because he wasn't doing that......yet

It would seem as if the "mainstream democrats" have completely caved to the rainbow-colored hair college kid who says "there are 52 genders, and anything I don't like constitutes hate speech"

 

[iluvatar5150]

But she was a regular on his show back when it was called "Politically incorrect" long before his liberal bona fides were ever in question. The fact that he can engage with people from both sides and have conversations about similarities and difference isn't a negative, it's a positive.

It's the same thing people don't get about Joe Rogan. He's popular specifically because he's willing to engage with people from both sides and be cynical.

The beef I have with both Rogan and Maher isn't that they engage with people with whom I disagree - that's fine. I like that. The problem I have with both of them is that they aren't rigorous in their engagement and, despite that, Maher in particular tries to present his show as somewhat intellectual. When he does this shallow engagement with bad faith actors on the right, all he really does is elevate their bad faith messaging. There are loads of people on the right worth talking to; Coulter isn't one of them. She's always been an antagonistic firebrand. She was on the show because the made for good tv, not because she elevated the conversation.

Maybe like Joe Biden used to be...

Can you name one mainstream democrat who hasn't outflanked the moderate voter on the lefthand side by quite a bit on any of the polarizing issues? (at least in terms of rhetoric)

I'll concede I'm not up on everybody's rhetoric, but it's my impression that most Dem senators and governors would pass that test.

It would seem as if the "mainstream democrats" have completely caved to the rainbow-colored hair college kid who says "there are 52 genders, and anything I don't like constitutes hate speech"

Are you picking that up from the politicians themselves or from people on twitter?