Affabel OCD nightmare! :(

[unpardoned1]

Ok, this may sound a little strange to some of you, but here goes. My husband told me about a great series he was listening to at work. One of his co-workers gave him a series called Affabel, driven for eternity. Anyway in the story the author(a pastor, I believe) lines up the characters and the places in the story with the Bible. For example, Affabel= Heaven. Jalen=God. Its a story of five friends that each go to get judged by Jalen(God) only two of them make it into Affabel(heaven) The rest went to hell for things that I DO EVERYDAY!!!!
The first went to Hell for not being a Christian, totally understandable, he rejected Jalen(God), The second went to hell for holding a grudge against a man that cheated on her. She did everything right, she accepted Jalen(God) but God said that he wouldn't acknowledge her and that all the good things were cancelled out. The third was cast out because of not living like a Christian! They let foul language slip ect...

This is a VERY abbreviated version, I'm blessed (rolls eyes) to have the whole version on cd and I can get exact reference to the parts I'm talking about that are scareing me, but it will take time.

I'm very upset because NONE of us can be that perfect! So if you sin after your "saved" you will be unsaved. Eternal security isn't real? If you have a hard time forgiving you will go to hell? I try to forgive but I hold grudges I can't get rid of and they keep coming up so its not real forgivness, I'm DOOMED! I actually thought about just ending it all last night so God could throw me in hell early. Thats what he wants right???? I don't know what to do.

 

[OptimisticSmile]

I have been there but trust me the bible never says that a christian can lose salvation. once you are known by God you cannot be unknown by God. Christ's atonment covers a multitude of sins past present and future. He saved you despite knowing the sin you would fall into after your salvation.

Just curious but what kind of relationship did you have with your father. this may play into the way you view God.

I see perfectionism all over this and you just have to take that as evidence that you have OCD. Live with the uncertainty do not force certainty here. You do not have to have a perfect relationship with God ALL the time. You just have to follow him the best you can. He has done the good work in you. Everything you need he is and he has already settled the issue of your eternity.

I have been there to with the suicidal thoughts and believe God wanted me to just end it all sense I was condemned. Now months later by the graciousness of God I am getting married monday to a wonderful hristian woman who would never marry or date a non-believer and we are planning on ging on a mission trip together. This will be my second time going and teh first time I was obsessing 24/7 and I returned to find myself more obsessive and depressed which led to the suicidal thoughts.

I am 22 and to be able to do more than one trip around the world is (in my opinion) a rarity. I give God the glory for this. None of that would have happened if I would have continued to listen to the thoughts.

pryaing for you.

God promises to save, he will never go back on that promise. salvation is a gift that cannot be taken back.

 

[ObsessedButBlessed]

Goodness. Well, based on what you have written as a synopsis of this audio cd, I can't see how this is Biblically sound. Sure, God commands us to live according to His Word (which includes not swearing), but we are not saved by good works, but by His astounding, unconditional grace. If works do not save us, then how can works unsave us?

And how many sins does it take to lose what God provides as a GIFT, out of what Christ did, not our works?

If that were the case, nobody would get into heaven. Nobody. Even this author. Sins are not measured in a degree of bad to worse; one sin is not worse than the other. They are all equal in God's eyes.

Grace is a gift to us, regardless of what we did the previous day. God loves us that much... he wants the best for us. It sounds like this guy is one of those preaches that tries to convert people based on fear, not on the love and free gift of grace that our loving God offers to us.

Should we be eternity-minded? Absolutely. We should set our sights on the things above, not on earthly things. But to suggest that God's grace and forgiveness are wiped out because we have sinned is absolutely un-Biblical. THAT you can be certain of.

I am angry for you and that you had to hear this. Even I got anxious just reading your synopsis of the book. Pardoned, when all else fails, refer to the Word of God - we know what is written in the Bible is TRUE, and cannot be argued against. Christ says we are held in the palm of His hand, and no one (not even sin) can take us from His grip.

Though this has obviously affected your OCD (no surprise!), for right now, try to live in the uncertainty. And take it to a new level - call into uncertainty this pastor's viewpoint. Give yourself the freedom to believe in the solid word of God, not what some other guy says. Say "he might be right, he might be wrong, so for today, I choose to love God and act according to his will as best as I can" which is all God asks of us in the first place.

Praying for you. Let us know how you're doing.

 

[jc9992]

I'm very upset because NONE of us can be that perfect! So if you sin after your "saved" you will be unsaved. Eternal security isn't real? If you have a hard time forgiving you will go to hell? I try to forgive but I hold grudges I can't get rid of and they keep coming up so its not real forgivness, I'm DOOMED! I actually thought about just ending it all last night so God could throw me in hell early. Thats what he wants right???? I don't know what to do.

Ive a heard a little bit about that series and i think overall it has a good message, but the author of the book has no right to make people think that they HAVE to be perfect.

The bible says "For all have sinned and come short of the glory of God." Yes we should try to stop sinning ,but no matter what ,we will never get to a point in our life where we are without sin.Since this series bothers you as much as it does and i can see why, I recommend that you discuss the theology of it in relation to the Bible with an elder or trusted member of your church(if you dont have anybody to discuss this with you should try the "ask the pastor" boards on the main forum.)

God bless.

 

[amItrue]

Wow, I'm so sorry that this has made you so upset! I'm not familiar with the series so I'm not judging it or the pastor.... but I know that God would not want anything to make any of His children feel like they'd want to kill themselves. I've heard things from other people or pastors that have made my mind go into a tail spin also so I understand the feeling.

I often get fearful thoughts thinking I can never be good enough to be with God.... but we need to remind ourselves that if God loved us so much (as sinners) to send His only son to die for us.... how much more does He love us when we become His children!

I think that's probably one of the oldest tricks of the devil to make us think of our heavenly Father as some dictator who we can never please. Do you think God would give us His most precious treasure (His Son) if He was so willing to cast us off? I speak these things to myself as well, as I am also in a struggle with similar thoughts. I'll pray for you and may God comfort you and protect you!

"Can a woman forget her sucking child, that she should not have compassion on the son of her womb? yea, they may forget, yet will I not forget thee." Isaiah 49:15

 

[Jayangel81]

This series sounds horrible trying to make people believe they need to be perfect

/quote
I often get fearful thoughts thinking I can never be good enough to be with God.... but we need to remind ourselves that if God loved us so much (as sinners) to send His only son to die for us.... how much more does He love us when we become His children!




Praying for you my sister!

 

[marcb]

Pardoned1,

I don't know anything about this series, but from what you have described, this message does not sound consistent with the Gospel. When God judges us as Christians, He sees Jesus, for our lives are "hidden with Christ in God" (Collosians 3:3). We are all filthy, but our righteousness is from another: Jesus Christ!

I've made Psalm 103 my mantra:
"....The LORD is compassionate and gracious, slow to anger and abounding in love.
He does not always accuse, nor does He harbor His anger for ever.
He does not treat us as our sins deserve, nor does he repay us according to our iniquities.
For as high as the heavens are above the earth so great is His love for those who fear Him.
As far as the east is from the west, so far has He removed our transgressions from us.
As a father has compassion on His children, so the LORD has compassion on those who fear him,
For He remembers how we are formed, He knows that we are dust...."

 

[marcb]

P.S., "What Sad said!" Loved your response!

 

[gracealone]

Pardoned One,
The CD seems to be more clearly based on human character rather than the merciful Character of God. I wouldn't listen to it again, not even once.
It's certainly no surprise that your OCD would latch on to this negative view of who God is and who you are to him. OCD is always looking for something to chew on.
Remember what the definition of grace is :
Something for nothing to those who deserve nothing.
If we begin to make our salvation in any way about our own efforts rather than the substitutionary death of Christ on the cross for us then we frustrate that grace.
I know that I am a great sinner - but I also know that Christ is a greater Savior. His "grace is greater than all my sin".
If Christians never fell or never sinned then we might as well do away with most of the new testament letters which was written to Christians to encourage them in their every day struggle with sin.
Having said all that, I completely understand how this started you obsessing as well as the depairing feelings it gave you. Just remember that the feelings of anxiety that came from all those negative spikes do not mean that the content of the spikes are valid.
So kick all those thoughts to the curb and don't give them any more attention. Even if your brain throws a major hissy fit about it and makes you feel even more anxious. It's always best to ignore anxiety tantrums.
Praying for you,
Mitzi

 

[gracealone]

Amen and Amen Sad!! Great Post.

 

[gracealone]

Yeah Marc!!! Thanks for those scriptures. Mitzi

 

[unpardoned1]

Thank you all, I am going to try to set up a link so you can hear the parts I'm talking about. Thanks.

 

[BeccaLynn]

I definitely can understand the fear and the overwhelming sense of "what's the use" that you're feeling. I used to make myself read books and listen to preachers seeming to talk right to me about being saved. Fear was so thick within that it crowded out all reason and truth. My fear overrode what God's word said because my mind would twist it, and the true nature of God was lost in it all. God absolutely did not create us to send us to Hell. That's actually how I felt. I thought that I might as well die and go on to Hell rather than living my life in dread of what I thought was certain. I'm so thankful that God didn't leave me like that. He created us to love and to be loved by Him. Nothing can change that. Some of my favorite verses are in Romans 8:38-39 where the Bible says that NOTHING can separate us from the love of God. When we with ocd feel fear over something we've heard or read, it seems to validate to us that it's legitimate, but that is definitely not the indicator of truth. I'm coming to believe that God's love for us, and our personal knowledge of His unconditional love, is supposed to be the motivating force for us to choose Him and to be repentant when we have understood that something is a sin and have chosen it anyway. I think that when we truly believe in God's supernatural love, that we can hurt when we do something that we know is in opposition to what He would choose for us. Reverent fear is different than the kind of fear that makes us think that God is just out to get us. It would usually take me several days, sometimes a lot longer, to start coming down from a spike like you're speaking about. God is the author of life, so anything that would make you feel like ending the gift He gave you is not something He's placed in your mind. Please ride this out and do not read or listen to it again. I pray God reveals His real character to you. It's taken me (and He's still working on me) a long time to look beyond what I've always thought God was like to see His true nature. It's so different than I thought it was! It makes it so very much easier to serve Him. It's too hard to want to love and serve a dictator who's out to destroy us. He's not that way. Do you have anyone you can talk to, a pastor maybe, who you trust to counsel with you? Finding that person was a real changing point in my life.

 

[seajoy]

Yep, I sin too...everyday. It's why Christ came into this world, even for a lowly skunk like me. That series sounds awful, even for folks without ocd. Too much Law....what about the Gospel!

 

[unpardoned1]

My husband still has the series and is listening to it again in his truck while he drives to and from work. I don't get it. Its not in my home and I can't find any link to the words that bothered me. I wish I could find a link to it. Theres like four chapters and it was the end of the 3rd dvd and the 4th one. This was where the five friends got judged one by one. It explained each of their judgements and why 3 of them were sent to "lone" the authors version of Hell. I've found other people who have reviewed this series and they too have felt the same way. They said that they felt condemned.

 

[gracealone]

Hi Pardoned 1,
You don't have to prove to me that the content of this series was inappropriate. Why Christians spend so much time trying to conclude whether someone else is a real Christian or not is beyond me. Truthfully it is only God who can make this determination.
I was thinking that this series is a lot like what we with OCD do to ourselves. It's kind of like a reverse of Jeff Foxworthy's ,"you might be a redneck if ...". For us it's, "you might not be a Christian if....". We spend enough time doing this all on our own without any encouragement from something as negative as this series.
I know that I will always struggle with the tendencies of my old nature until I pass from this life into the perfected state of eternity. But that struggle affords me an opportunity to show my love and loyalty to Christ. It gives me the chance to choose Him and His righteous paths over my own. I know this is true because He has said, "if you love me, keep my commandments." He wouldn't have had to say that if He didn't know that I wouldn't do so automatically but that I would have to willingly choose to obey them even when my old nature was dragging me the other direction.
Try not to dwell on it anymore. When the thoughts about it pop into your head, just say, "yep that's right I'm by no means perfect and that's exactly why Christ died for me." Then shift your focus to something else.
I know it's hard to do this as those words will keep popping into your head. The exact same thing happened to me last winter after listening to a sermon that had a similar theme. I felt like the pastor was pointing his finger directly at me and saying..." you might not be a Christian...."
In retrospect I could really see how my OCD was the main player in grabbing onto all that negativity.
Praying for you.
Let it go... it's not you.. it's your OCD.
Love and prayers,
Mitzi

 

[stacii]

Yeah - the ideas in this book are totally bogus. The Bible doesn't say that at all. Just because someone is a pastor doesn't mean you should listen to them....

 

[forgiveable]

I have listened to the cd and thought that it was a good parable. John Bevere is the author and if you listen to the way he portrays, perfection it is accepting Jesus as our Lord and savior and accepting that he paid the price for us to be perfect when we are in agreement with His will. I have heard several teachings by the Bevere's and I see how struggling with OCD and listening to this series would be very difficult. Especially with OCD the thoughts that try going through your head are as if they were pulled through by a magnet and you do not want them there.