Science: Can it be trusted?

[JohnR7]

There are lots of claims in regards to what science has given us. But I wonder, can science really be trusted? One thing Christians know a lot about is their Bible. We know that a lot of so called scientists can not be trusted at all when it comes to their knowledge and understanding of the Bible. So how can we trust them in other areas that they want to offer us their opinion on?

If they are not accurate in the area we can check them out in. Then how can we trust them to be accurate in areas that we are not able to confirm what they believe?

 

[lithium.]

There are lots of claims in regards to what science has given us. But I wonder, can science really be trusted?

Yes, if used right.

We know that a lot of so called scientists can not be trusted at all when it comes to their knowledge and understanding of the Bible.

How do you know? I mean do you know every scientist?

So how can we trust them in other areas that they want to offer us their opinion on?

You shouldn’t if they don't give evidence backing up there claims. But the best scientists in the world always backup there claim.

If they are not accurate in the area we can check them out in.

Again, how do you know that they are not accurate in the area of the bible?

Then how can we trust them to be accurate in areas that we are not able to confirm what they believe?

What are you talking about anyone can confirm anything in science. It's just some are lazy or they just don’t know how, or something. Science is open to all people.

 

[Mr.Cheese]

Science isn't concerned with the bible. It's not some heretical enemy. We make it that.

What if the bible wasn't concerned with science?

 

[Pete Harcoff]

Well, I'm sitting here in a comfortable home, with electricity, light, heat, listening to some digital music, all while typing out messages on a computer so that people the world over can read them.

Considering what science has accomplished, I really think claims of "science can't be trusted" or whatever other conspiracy and doubt you want to put forth are pure poppycock.

Not that every single individual scientist can be trusted, mind you. Of course, that also holds for lawyers, plumbers, musicians, Christians... pretty much ever group has untrustworthy people among them.

 

[JohnR7]

Originally posted by Pete Harcoff
Well, I'm sitting here in a comfortable home, with electricity, light, heat, listening to some digital music, all while typing out messages on a computer so that people the world over can read them. 

I buy my electric from the Electric company. I buy heat from the gas company. So are you saying that because they sell me Electric Power or Gas, that makes them a expert on the Bible?

So that I should trust their opinion of the Bible over someone who has a Phd in the study of the Bible & it's theology?

 

[Doctrine1st]

Originally posted by JohnR7
So that I should trust their opinion of the Bible over someone who has a Phd in the study of the Bible & it's theology?

Curious, would you trust a "liberal" bible theologist as long as they had a PHD, or just the ones with PHDs that agree with you?

Trust Marcus Borg, he has a PHD in theology?

 

[Praxiteles]

Of course science can't be trusted to interpret your Bible for you. Don't use it to analyse the plot of movies you watch, or to choose what music you'd like to listen to as you enjoy a beer on a warm afternoon.

Science is there to tell us about the physical world, and that is all it is there to do. To use it to answer other questions is a mistake, and to accuse science of not answering other questions is likewise a mistake.

Cheers,
Prax

 

[David Gould]

He wasn't alking about their expertise on the Bible - he was talking about their expertise in regard to science. If science was wrong, computers would not work, the space shuttle could not fly and TV dinners would not taste as yummy as they do (hang on .... )

The science does not comment on the Bible, except where people interpret the Bible to mean certain things which contradict what science has discovered. The earth is billions of years old; if it wasn't, our geologists would not be able to find oil as they are basing their search methods on the fact that it is billions of years old. Geologists can, however, find oil. Thus, the earth must be billions of years old. This is not a problem for most Christians. It is only a problem for those Christians who claim that the Bible says that the Earth is only a few thousand years old. It does not actually say that anywhere, of course, but they claim it does.

 

[Pete Harcoff]

Originally posted by JohnR7
I buy my electric from the Electric company. I buy heat from the gas company. So are you saying that because they sell me Electric Power or Gas, that makes them a expert on the Bible?

So that I should trust their opinion of the Bible over someone who has a Phd in the study of the Bible & it's theology?

I am confused. You originally asked, "So how can we trust them in other areas [other than the Bible] that they want to offer us their opinion on?"

Then you seem to assume I think Gas and Electric suppliers should be experts on the Bible?

What exactly are you trying to ask here, John?

 

[JohnR7]

Originally posted by Pete Harcoff
Then you seem to assume I think Gas and Electric suppliers should be experts on the Bible? 

Well, I guess the only thing you can really trust people on is the area of their study that they are a expert on. I had a friend who once use to say you to do not buy paint from a hardware store and you do not buy hardware at a paint store.

Someone who is a expert on Gas or Electric as you say, can not be expected to be a expert on the Bible. Neither can a research biologist tell you anything about the Bible, because that is not their area of study.

 

[David Gould]

Originally posted by JohnR7
Well, I guess the only thing you can really trust people on is the area of their study that they are a expert on. I had a friend who once use to say you to do not buy paint from a hardware store and you do not buy hardware at a paint store.

Someone who is a expert on Gas or Electric as you say, can not be expected to be a expert on the Bible. Neither can a research biologist tell you anything about the Bible, because that is not their area of study.

So you trust the geologists, then, who say the Earth is old, and the biologists who say that humans evolved, and so forth? Cool. I trust Bible scholars if there is general agreement. In most cases, there is no general agreement, hence the numerous different brands of Christianity.

 

[Douglaangu]

John, I suspect you're trying to use this as an argument of "Because what they say disagrees with my interpretation of the bible, and since they're not experts on the bible, THEY'RE WRONG about everything they say."

This doesnt work, because the bible is not the end-all-be-all of knowledge you seem to think it is.

 

[Orihalcon]

the bible says that what's inside it is right, therefore it's right. not only that, it's the direct word of god and contains everything you need to know.

 

[James D.]

Many scientists are also Christians.

 

[Orihalcon]

good for them, at least they don't let faith get in the way of work... i hope.

 

[Nathan Poe]

Originally posted by JohnR7
There are lots of claims in regards to what science has given us. But I wonder, can science really be trusted?

Trusted in what way? You mean, since Thomas Edison wasn't a theology scholar, the electric light was a fluke?

Apples and oranges, my boy. Apples and oranges.

One thing Christians know a lot about is their Bible. We know that a lot of so called scientists can not be trusted at all when it comes to their knowledge and understanding of the Bible. So how can we trust them in other areas that they want to offer us their opinion on?

By your logic (and I use that word loosely...)

One thing I know a lot of is Norse Mythology. I know that a lot of so called Christians (especially you) cannot be trusted at all when it comes to their knowledge and understanding of Norse Mythology. So how can I trust them in other areas that they (especially you) want to offer me a supposedly "divinely inspired" opinion on?

If they are not accurate in the area we can check them out in. Then how can we trust them to be accurate in areas that we are not able to confirm what they believe?

We don't trust them, we check for ourselves. Skepticism is inherent in the scientific method. Scientists don't claim to be inspired by any kind of "Holy Spirit." There are no mysteries, no forbidden questions, and no blind adherence to a dogma. If you don't believe a scientist, tell them so. They'll publish their work, and show you exactly how they got their answer. If their work is the result of an experiment, they'll tell you exactly how they did it. Don't trust their results? Try the experiment yourself, under the same conditions, and see what happens.

I hope this clears up the issue for you.... but somehow I doubt it.

 

[Mr.Cheese]

I'll leave you all with a quote from an early church father. Darned if I can remember his name though.

"All truth is God's truth."

 

[lucaspa]

Originally posted by JohnR7
One thing Christians know a lot about is their Bible. We know that a lot of so called scientists can not be trusted at all when it comes to their knowledge and understanding of the Bible. So how can we trust them in other areas that they want to offer us their opinion on?

If they are not accurate in the area we can check them out in. Then how can we trust them to be accurate in areas that we are not able to confirm what they believe?

First, it appears that many Christians know very little about their Bible.  You, for instance, have the quaint idea that Adam was created on day 8 in the Genesis 1 chronology.  An interpretation not shared by any other Biblical scholar that I can find, certainly only a handful of others at the most.

Second, you can check out any scientific claim yourself.  The scientific literature is completely open to the public.  It may be a bit difficult to obtain all of it from your chair in front of the computer.  You may actually have to get up and go to a library and walk around the stacks finding the copy of the journal you need, but it is doable.  Since science works only with intersubjective experience, it is even possible for you to recreate any data any scientist reports.  True, there are some practical difficulties, but it is possible to check any scientist on any scientific claim.

Third, remember that scientists check each other.  And scientists disagree even more vigorously among themselves than you disagree with them.  The AAAS meetings are open to anyone; this year's meeting is in Denver, I believe.  Go and sit in on some sessions.  The question and answer sessions make this board look like a love fest.  Or simply read some of the commentaries of Gould and Dawkins about each other (The Evolutionists by Henry Morris gives a good overview).  Therefore, when the vast majority of scientists agree on an idea, you can be sure that they do so only because the evidence is so overwhelming that they have no choice.

 

[lucaspa]

Originally posted by JohnR7
Well, I guess the only thing you can really trust people on is the area of their study that they are a expert on. I had a friend who once use to say you to do not buy paint from a hardware store and you do not buy hardware at a paint store.

Someone who is a expert on Gas or Electric as you say, can not be expected to be a expert on the Bible. Neither can a research biologist tell you anything about the Bible, because that is not their area of study.

John, this is pretty transparent.  You are having difficulties with many of us over your Biblical interpretations.  It appears that you can't answer the objections, therefore you want to dismiss them because we are not Biblical scholars.

What happens is that you test statements.  You don't necessarily have to be an expert in a particular field to do that.  Now, of course the testing and criticisms don't get a free ride.  You are quite within skepticism to criticize the criticisms.  However, it you can't find a way to refute the criticism, you can't dismiss the criticisms because the person offering them isn't an "expert".  If you notice our responses to Hovind, Ham, Morris, Behe, etc., we don't dismiss them because they are not "experts" in the field.  Instead, we show how the data shows them to be in error.

If you think our disagreement with you over your Biblical interpretations or claims about the Bible (I emphasized because these are not the same as the Bible itself) is in error, then refute it by Biblical scholarship.  If you can't, then consider our disagreements as valid and modify your position accordingly.

 

[judy]

Originally posted by JohnR7
There are lots of claims in regards to what science has given us. But I wonder, can science really be trusted? One thing Christians know a lot about is their Bible. We know that a lot of so called scientists can not be trusted at all when it comes to their knowledge and understanding of the Bible. So how can we trust them in other areas that they want to offer us their opinion on?

If they are not accurate in the area we can check them out in. Then how can we trust them to be accurate in areas that we are not able to confirm what they believe?

I see a great deal of tension between science and religion. Whenever science contradicts the bible, tempers flare and both sides start calling each other names.

But there's nothing mystical about science. Every toddler is already a scientist. Have you ever watched little kids experimenting? "Hmm, I wonder what will happen if I push this bowl of cereal off the table? Let's see...."

There is nothing more mysterious about science than that. It is elegantly simple. You say "I think this will happen if I do that" and then you test your hypothesis. If you claim something happened, and you tell other people about it, then they are free to test it out to see if you were right or wrong.

So you don't have to trust science. You can do your own research.

This is not how faith works however. You DO have to trust the bible, or whichever holy book your particular culture feels contains the "truth." You are not free to test out what you are told in your holy book. In fact, if you do start to question it, and start to doubt its "truth" you may have committed the unforgiveable sin.

Give me science any day.