“Time, Times and a Half Time” is Not 3 1/2 Years

[Joyous Song]

“Time, Times and a Half Time” is Not 3 1/2 Years


JS: This is an except from our study of Revelation 12. In it we explain how to calculate the phrase above and how our calculation connects back to the star sign described in this same chapter that was actually seen over Israel the evening before Rosh Hashanah and their High Holy Days began in 1999.



The except:


“But the woman was given two wings of a great eagle, so that she could fly from the serpent into the wilderness, to her place where she will be nourished for a time, and times, and a half time.” 14


“The eagle has landed,” said Al Armstrong as he stepped onto the moon. America is the modern eagle and she did play a major role in Israel’s birth and first years of survival. In her Jewish population, a more militant Zionism was born. Later as Israel’s population expanded too quickly for Israel to absorb financially, the US Governments was among Jewish groups in providing substantial aid and helping her to settle in.

It lasted for a time, which is a year, times, or 50 years (shemitah year of judgment- no other times number, 2 , 3, 10 or 7, work as well), and a half time, a half year or 51 ½ years of nourishment since Israel became a nation in May 1948.

So what was that “nourishment”? Little David is a perfect example (a weapon that made a big bang and send Arabs running) to sum up that nourishment. From 1948 on when Israel was attacked and small precious miracles happened so that she gained, not lost, land. Then came the peace process of the nineties and everything changed. It would be the end of those nourishing miracles and it came 51 ½ years later on evret Rosh Shashana, September 12th 1999 (1948 + 5 months +51 1/2 years leads to 1999 plus ten months).

So a time, times, and a half times takes us back to the seeing of that sign above Israel on Rosh Hashanah. It was there to confirm that date long before that sign was to be seen. Since then Israel has lost territory while (fruit of Oslo) Arabs have claimed her unjust, Palestine and Gaza are in turmoil and world opinion has crumbled.


JS: The peace talks failed as they reached the Last Status Talks lifting Jerusalem, that heavy stone of Zech.12.2-3, another connection. A intafata was declared the next year in the fall and a year later the two towers fell on September 11th, 2001.

All this was to fulfill that those who lifted Jerusalem in those Last Status Talks would be grievously hurt: America, Israel and Palestine. The suicide war and bombing of Israel has followed like that flood with the earth swallowing it up and forming new yet not improved peace variations of processes will all ultimately lead to Armageddon.

Now that war is targeting the western nations where Christians, Judah’s offspring, now live.The nations with Ephraim have been hit particularly hard. From all this we know the anti-Christ will rise from this persecution, indeed the beast with a mortal wound that would be healed, was healed in 1989....

 

[Brian Mcnamee]

no prophecy is of any private interpretation and your speculation is like many others that have come and gone before it a private interpretation that makes a little sense that will fail. All these prophecies in Daniel and Revelation talk about the events leading up to the 2nd coming. In Rev the beast is given 42 months. In Dan 12 from the abomination of desolation we are told 1290 days to go. Now the term a time times and half a time occurs also in Dan 7 and again it is in reference to the coming of the kingdom and a pompous guy is raised up who will persecute for that length of time and he is destroyed and given to the flame when the kingdom comes. This is exactly what happens to the beast who is also persecuting for 42 months then the kingdom comes. Now in Dan 9 the 70 weeks talks about the sacrifice being taken away in the middle of the week so if the week is 7 years the middle would be with 42 months to go. This view can be extracted from the scripture without being a private interpretation.

 

[BobRyan]

“Time, Times and a Half Time” is Not 3 1/2 Years


JS: This is an except from our study of Revelation 12. In it we explain how to calculate the phrase above and how our calculation connects back to the star sign described in this same chapter that was actually seen over Israel the evening before Rosh Hashanah and their High Holy Days began in 1999.



The except:


“But the woman was given two wings of a great eagle, so that she could fly from the serpent into the wilderness, to her place where she will be nourished for a time, and times, and a half time.” 14


“The eagle has landed,” said Al Armstrong as he stepped onto the moon. America is the modern eagle and she did play a major role in Israel’s birth and first years of survival. In her Jewish population, a more militant Zionism was born. Later as Israel’s population expanded too quickly for Israel to absorb financially, the US Governments was among Jewish groups in providing substantial aid and helping her to settle in.

It lasted for a time, which is a year, times, or 50 years (shemitah year of judgment- no other times number, 2 , 3, 10 or 7, work as well), and a half time, a half year or 51 ½ years of nourishment since Israel became a nation in May 1948.

So what was that “nourishment”? Little David is a perfect example (a weapon that made a big bang and send Arabs running) to sum up that nourishment. From 1948 on when Israel was attacked and small precious miracles happened so that she gained, not lost, land. Then came the peace process of the nineties and everything changed. It would be the end of those nourishing miracles and it came 51 ½ years later on evret Rosh Shashana, September 12th 1999 (1948 + 5 months +51 1/2 years leads to 1999 plus ten months).

So a time, times, and a half times takes us back to the seeing of that sign above Israel on Rosh Hashanah. It was there to confirm that date long before that sign was to be seen. Since then Israel has lost territory while (fruit of Oslo) Arabs have claimed her unjust, Palestine and Gaza are in turmoil and world opinion has crumbled.


JS: The peace talks failed as they reached the Last Status Talks lifting Jerusalem, that heavy stone of Zech.12.2-3, another connection. A intafata was declared the next year in the fall and a year later the two towers fell on September 11th, 2001.

All this was to fulfill that those who lifted Jerusalem in those Last Status Talks would be grievously hurt: America, Israel and Palestine. The suicide war and bombing of Israel has followed like that flood with the earth swallowing it up and forming new yet not improved peace variations of processes will all ultimately lead to Armageddon.

Now that war is targeting the western nations where Christians, Judah’s offspring, now live.The nations with Ephraim have been hit particularly hard. From all this we know the anti-Christ will rise from this persecution, indeed the beast with a mortal wound that would be healed, was healed in 1989....

Dan 4:16 is a non-apocalyptic dream where " seven times" (seven years) passed over Nebuchadnezzar while he was as an animal/cattle in the field.

Rev 11 and 12 tell us that 42 months = time(1) times(2) and half time(.5) = 1260 days.

And that means 30days/month 12 months/year. So then 3.5 times = 3.5 years = 42 months = 1260 days.

Where all apocalyptic timelines in Dan and Rev use day for year. So then that time.times.halfTime in Dan 7 and Rev 11 are 1260 years of the dark ages. And they have already ended.

 

[Joyous Song]

Brian Mcnamee: no prophecy is of any private interpretation and your speculation is like many others that have come and gone before it a private interpretation that makes a little sense that will fail.

JS: Please explain why my and my husbands understanding of this scriptural passage "makes a little sense".

Brian Mcnamee: All these prophecies in Daniel and Revelation talk about the events leading up to the 2nd coming. In Rev the beast is given 42 months. In Dan 12 from the abomination of desolation we are told 1290 days to go. Now the term a time times and half a time occurs also in Dan 7 and again it is in reference to the coming of the kingdom and a pompous guy is raised up who will persecute for that length of time and he is destroyed and given to the flame when the kingdom comes. This is exactly what happens to the beast who is also persecuting for 42 months then the kingdom comes. Now in Dan 9 the 70 weeks talks about the sacrifice being taken away in the middle of the week so if the week is 7 years the middle would be with 42 months to go. This view can be extracted from the scripture without being a private interpretation.

JS: our interpretation also links to the second coming so this is a non-issue. That the beast is given 42 months is not argued just why its link to this passage. One rule of Biblical interpretation is that the passage explanation or illumination is usually with the same chapter or the one next to it (since chapters were created by interpreters, the originals were not in chapter form).

Our interpretation links back to the star sign in the same chapter and the woman Israel who was in the star sign links to time, times and a half time, in fact the star sign's latter image that played out during the High Holy Days in 1999, matches the flood that follows the passage we quoted. Further, nothing in that text says times is two! times is merely greater that time!

So hopefully this helps explain our position a little more clearly.

 

[Joyous Song]

Dan 4:16 is a non-apocalyptic dream where " seven times" (seven years) passed over Nebuchadnezzar while he was as an animal/cattle in the field.

Rev 11 and 12 tell us that 42 months = time(1) times(2) and half time(.5) = 1260 days.

And that means 30days/month 12 months/year. So then 3.5 times = 3.5 years = 42 months = 1260 days.

Where all apocalyptic timelines in Dan and Rev use day for year. So then that time.times.halfTime in Dan 7 and Rev 11 are 1260 years of the dark ages. And they have already ended.

JS: again times being 2 is an assumption or an interpretation just like our using fifty. Yet fifty years brought judgment which fits context while duality, or unity does not.

 

[Brian Mcnamee]

Dan 4:16 is a non-apocalyptic dream where " seven times" (seven years) passed over Nebuchadnezzar while he was as an animal/cattle in the field.

Rev 11 and 12 tell us that 42 months = time(1) times(2) and half time(.5) = 1260 days.

And that means 30days/month 12 months/year. So then 3.5 times = 3.5 years = 42 months = 1260 days.

Where all apocalyptic timelines in Dan and Rev use day for year. So then that time.times.halfTime in Dan 7 and Rev 11 are 1260 years of the dark ages. And they have already ended.

Hi the 1st time a week of years is mentioned is in Gen where Jacob served for Rachael and got Leah instead so he did another week of years for Rachael. The many many prophecies about Jesus redeeming man coming as savior had a rapid fulfillment at the time he started his ministry until the time he went to the cross and then ascended. It is much more likely that a day means a day and a month means a month and half a week is 42 months and a time times and half a time is 42 months as well. Jesus said to watch for the abomination of desolation daniel warned of and if we look at 2 Thes 2 Dan 7 and Rev 13 all show a single man rising up with power who is accepted as a God in 2 then and Rev and persecutes fin all 3 and for 42 months in 2 of them.

Brian Mcnamee: no prophecy is of any private interpretation and your speculation is like many others that have come and gone before it a private interpretation that makes a little sense that will fail.

JS: Please explain why my and my husbands understanding of this scriptural passage "makes a little sense".

Brian Mcnamee: All these prophecies in Daniel and Revelation talk about the events leading up to the 2nd coming. In Rev the beast is given 42 months. In Dan 12 from the abomination of desolation we are told 1290 days to go. Now the term a time times and half a time occurs also in Dan 7 and again it is in reference to the coming of the kingdom and a pompous guy is raised up who will persecute for that length of time and he is destroyed and given to the flame when the kingdom comes. This is exactly what happens to the beast who is also persecuting for 42 months then the kingdom comes. Now in Dan 9 the 70 weeks talks about the sacrifice being taken away in the middle of the week so if the week is 7 years the middle would be with 42 months to go. This view can be extracted from the scripture without being a private interpretation.

JS: our interpretation also links to the second coming so this is a non-issue. That the beast is given 42 months is not argued just why its link to this passage. One rule of Biblical interpretation is that the passage explanation or illumination is usually with the same chapter or the one next to it (since chapters were created by interpreters, the originals were not in chapter form).

Our interpretation links back to the star sign in the same chapter and the woman Israel who was in the star sign links to time, times and a half time, in fact the star sign's latter image that played out during the High Holy Days in 1999, matches the flood that follows the passage we quoted. Further, nothing in that text says times is two! times is merely greater that time!

So hopefully this helps explain our position a little more clearly.

Hi another rule of Bible interpretation is the 1st mention is often a key thing to note and in Genesis a week of years is mentioned in Jacob serving for Rachael and indeed a week of years is 7 years. The man of sin is revealed in the temple and claims to be a God and if you look at 2nd Thes 2 Rev 13 and Dan 7 we see many overlapping specifics that show a evil guy who is persecuting is also the one revealed in the temple with lying signs and wonders and even the elect would be fooled if it were possible. Jesus predicted the destruction of the temple and Jerusalem. Hosea links the return of the sacrifice to the return of the kingdom in chapter 3. 4 For the children of Israel shall abide many days without king or prince, without sacrifice or sacred pillar, without ephod or teraphim. 5 Afterward the children of Israel shall return and seek the LORD their God and David their king. They shall fear the LORD and His goodness in the latter days.

Now Dan 9 also is looking out towards the 3rd temple too. He predicted from Babylon while Jerusalem and the temple are in ruins that 7 and 62 weeks from teh order to rebuild Jerusalem and its walls until the messiah and he shall be cut off not for himself then the people of the prince who shall come will destroy the city and sanctuary.

Right here these events come with the 70th week still to come. Jesus came and was cut off as he noted Israel did not know the day of their visitation. 483 years from the order he road in on the foal of the donkey. Now the people of the prince to come did destroy Jerusalem and the sanctuary. This prince to come is the AC and he will put an end to the sacrifice in the middle of the week. He is the one in 2 thes 2 revealed in the temple and it is what Hosea saw Israel going many days without a sacrifice but in the latter days it is clearly implied they have it again. This sets the stage for the literal 42 months , 1260 days.

Also referring to this time Jesus notes unless those days were shortened no flesh would remain alive. This makes no sense in you calculations.

 

[Joyous Song]

Hi the 1st time a week of years is mentioned is in Gen where Jacob served for Rachael and got Leah instead so he did another week of years for Rachael. The many many prophecies about Jesus redeeming man coming as savior had a rapid fulfillment at the time he started his ministry until the time he went to the cross and then ascended. It is much more likely that a day means a day and a month means a month and half a week is 42 months and a time times and half a time is 42 months as well. Jesus said to watch for the abomination of desolation daniel warned of and if we look at 2 Thes 2 Dan 7 and Rev 13 all show a single man rising up with power who is accepted as a God in 2 then and Rev and persecutes fin all 3 and for 42 months in 2 of them.

Hi another rule of Bible interpretation is the 1st mention is often a key thing to note and in Genesis a week of years is mentioned in Jacob serving for Rachael and indeed a week of years is 7 years. The man of sin is revealed in the temple and claims to be a God and if you look at 2nd Thes 2 Rev 13 and Dan 7 we see many overlapping specifics that show a evil guy who is persecuting is also the one revealed in the temple with lying signs and wonders and even the elect would be fooled if it were possible. Jesus predicted the destruction of the temple and Jerusalem. Hosea links the return of the sacrifice to the return of the kingdom in chapter 3. 4 For the children of Israel shall abide many days without king or prince, without sacrifice or sacred pillar, without ephod or teraphim. 5 Afterward the children of Israel shall return and seek the LORD their God and David their king. They shall fear the LORD and His goodness in the latter days.

Now Dan 9 also is looking out towards the 3rd temple too. He predicted from Babylon while Jerusalem and the temple are in ruins that 7 and 62 weeks from teh order to rebuild Jerusalem and its walls until the messiah and he shall be cut off not for himself then the people of the prince who shall come will destroy the city and sanctuary.

Right here these events come with the 70th week still to come. Jesus came and was cut off as he noted Israel did not know the day of their visitation. 483 years from the order he road in on the foal of the donkey. Now the people of the prince to come did destroy Jerusalem and the sanctuary. This prince to come is the AC and he will put an end to the sacrifice in the middle of the week. He is the one in 2 thes 2 revealed in the temple and it is what Hosea saw Israel going many days without a sacrifice but in the latter days it is clearly implied they have it again. This sets the stage for the literal 42 months , 1260 days.

Also referring to this time Jesus notes unless those days were shortened no flesh would remain alive. This makes no sense in you calculations.

JS: we tried seven or perfection but it did not link back to anything.As we pointed out 50 bring time, times and half time to 51 1/2 which added to May 1948 the date of Israel birth to September 1999 when that sign was seen in the night sky during the High Holy Days, Fifty is Judgement and the High Holy Days are about HaShem finial judgment of mankind. All this links together to form that opinion and we never left the chapter to form those links.

 

[Douggg]

“But the woman was given two wings of a great eagle, so that she could fly from the serpent into the wilderness, to her place where she will be nourished for a time, and times, and a half time.” 14

Revelation 12 - the seven years.

1260 days + the war in heaven (second heaven) time + time/times/half times = the 7 years.

Revelation 11 - the seven years.

1260 days + 3 1/2 days + 42 months = the 7 years.

 

[BobRyan]

It is much more likely that a day means a day and a month means a month and half a week is 42 months and a time times and half a time is 42 months as well.

Outside of apocalyptic prophecy that is the case. But within the context of apocalyptice timelines such as in Daniel chapters 7,8 and 9 and also Rev 11,12,13 - it is always "day for year" and it is interesting that almost all Bible scholars know this to be true in the case of Daniel 9.

Jesus said to watch for the abomination of desolation daniel warned of and if we look at 2 Thes 2 Dan 7 and Rev 13 all show a single man rising up with power who is accepted as a God in 2 then and Rev and persecutes fin all 3 and for 42 months in 2 of them.

2 Thess 2 does not mention the 3.5 years.

Daniel 7 does show an empire that rises up after pagan Rome - but almost all Protestant scholars of the reformation admitted - that entity is not a single man but an entire religious system.

Hi another rule of Bible interpretation is the 1st mention is often a key thing to note and in Genesis a week of years is mentioned in Jacob

The term "week" is often a literal 7 days in the Bible it is not limited to "a week of years".

Now Dan 9 also is looking out towards the 3rd temple too. He predicted from Babylon while Jerusalem and the temple are in ruins that 7 and 62 weeks from teh order to rebuild Jerusalem and its walls until the messiah and he shall be cut off not for himself then the people of the prince who shall come will destroy the city and sanctuary.

Right here these events come with the 70th week still to come.

1. All Bible timelines are contiguous. So for example
a. Dan 7 - times time and half-time ... 42 months, 1260 day-for year. Contiguous timeline
b. Dan 8 -2300 days = 2300 years a contiguous timeline
c. Dan 9 70 weeks -- weeks of years - 490 years a contiguous timeline

Jesus came at the start of the 70th week in Dan 9 and was cut off in the middle of that week - after 3.5 years of ministry. The 70th week ended 3.5 years after that.

 

[Douggg]

Outside of apocalyptic prophecy that is the case. But within the context of apocalyptice timelines such as in Daniel chapters 7,8 and 9 and also Rev 11,12,13 - it is always "day for year" and it is interesting that almost all Bible scholars know this to be true in the case of Daniel 9.

Bob, day for a year is not in Daniel 9. It is weeks, which represent 7 years, or the shemitah cycle.

The day as a year was a special case when Ezekiel laid on his side, which is stated explicitly in the text.


Ezekiel 4:5 For I have laid upon thee the years of their iniquity, according to the number of the days, three hundred and ninety days: so shalt thou bear the iniquity of the house of Israel.

6 And when thou hast accomplished them, lie again on thy right side, and thou shalt bear the iniquity of the house of Judah forty days: I have appointed thee each day for a year.

But that was not a universal application to days found in other prophecies in the bible, such as the 2300 days, the 1260 days, the 1290 days, the 1335 days, the three and half days.

What SDA did was to get creative and claim that days are years - universally - in order to piece together a timeline argument to support their position on the pope/papacy being the Antichrist, and SDA's objection to Sunday church day of worship based on the church belief that Sunday was the day Jesus resurrected from the grave.

 

[BobRyan]

Bob, day for a year is not in Daniel 9. It is weeks, which represent 7 years, or the shemitah cycle.

The weeks translate to days and the days to years - that is the only way it turns into a 490 year timeline so that the "midst of the week" is 3.5 years -- from 3.5 days.

Dan 7 is "times time and half a time" even so it has to be translated to days.. .and then the same rule as for 70 weeks to 490 days - that becomes 490 years.

This same rule works for all apocalyptic timelines in Daniel and Revelation

What SDA did was to get creative and claim that days are years - universally

Not correct
1. It was not SDAs that were around for that during the 1830's it was Millerites and they did not start it either.
2. It is not universal - but rather - only apocalyptic timelines use it so as we see in Daniel 9, the 70 years of Jeremiah mentioned in vs 1-6 use "years" but the 70 weeks of 490 days uses day-for-year not just 490 days.

from:https://en.w ikipedia.org/wiki/Day-year_principle
"The day-year principle, year-day principle or year-for-a-day principle is a method of interpretation of Bible prophecy in which the word day in prophecy is considered to be symbolic of a year of actual time.[1][2] It was the method used by most of the Reformers,[3]
"

The details are key -

 

[Brian Mcnamee]

Outside of apocalyptic prophecy that is the case. But within the context of apocalyptice timelines such as in Daniel chapters 7,8 and 9 and also Rev 11,12,13 - it is always "day for year" and it is interesting that almost all Bible scholars know this to be true in the case of Daniel 9.



2 Thess 2 does not mention the 3.5 years.

Daniel 7 does show an empire that rises up after pagan Rome - but almost all Protestant scholars of the reformation admitted - that entity is not a single man but an entire religious system.



The term "week" is often a literal 7 days in the Bible it is not limited to "a week of years".



1. All Bible timelines are contiguous. So for example
a. Dan 7 - times time and half-time ... 42 months, 1260 day-for year. Contiguous timeline
b. Dan 8 -2300 days = 2300 years a contiguous timeline
c. Dan 9 70 weeks -- weeks of years - 490 years a contiguous timeline

Jesus came at the start of the 70th week in Dan 9 and was cut off in the middle of that week - after 3.5 years of ministry. The 70th week ended 3.5 years after that.

Hi Jesus tells those who see the abomination of desolation to flee to the mountains and not look back. So if this happens in the middle of the week they will be hiding in the mountains for 1260 years? 2 thes 2 notes the man of sin being revealed in the temple who exalts himself as God in the temple. Now this does not mention 42 months but it is not a stretch to conclude that this is what happens when the sacrifice is stopped in the middle of the week. It would match Rev 13 with the mark and image of the beast coming at the same time. In Rev 13 the 42 months features persecution for that long and then the kingdom comes. This is the same time line in Dan 7 when the kingdom comes and the pompous one is persecuting for the exact same time span. You can hold you year day view but we are watching a one world government rise that is opposed and poised to persecute jews and christians and bring back the temple while merging all religions as equal paths to God. My view is tracking in real time with expectations.

 

[Original Happy Camper]

What SDA did was to get creative and claim that days are years - universally - in order to piece together a timeline argument to support their position on the pope/papacy being the Antichrist,

Doug please consider history before making statements on the history of the SDA CHURCH

Calvin and Luther were not the only church leaders to identify the Antichrist. A host of reformers identified the Antichrist as the Papacy, such as Thomas Cranmer ("Whereof it followeth Rome to be the seat of antichrist, and the pope to be very antichrist himself. I could prove the same by many other scriptures, old writers, and strong reasons"vii), John Knox ("Hitherto the pope has been antichrist"viii), John Wesley ("He is in an emphatical sense, the Man of Sin, as he increases all manner of sin above measure. And he is, too, properly styled the Son of Perdition, as he has caused the death of numberless multitudes, both of his opposers and followers"ix), John Wycliffe, John Huss, Jerome, and John Melanchthon

Others who identify the Antichrist

day year principle
There are three primary precedents in Scripture that show the day-year principle:

1. Numbers 14:34. The Israelites will wander for 40 years in the wilderness, one year for every day spent by the spies in Canaan.
2. Ezekiel 4:5-6. The prophet Ezekiel is commanded to lie on his left side for 390 days, followed by his right side for 40 days, to symbolize the equivalent number of years of punishment on Israel and Judah respectively.
3. Daniel 9:24-27. This is known as the Prophecy of Seventy Weeks. Read about the 70-week prophecy here. The majority of scholars do understand the passage to refer to 70 "sevens" or "septets" of years—that is, a total of 490 years.

Jon Paulien has defended the principle from a systematic theology perspective, not strictly just from the Bible. (Jon Paulien, "A New Look at the Year-Day Principle", talk at the 2008 Evangelical Theological Society meetings)

This view was recognized by the Jews. The Protestant Reformers were well established on the day/year principle and it was also accepted by many Christian groups, ministers, and theologians.

1. Elliott, EB (1862). Horae Apocalypticae III (fifth ed.). p. 281.
2. du Ion, Francois (1596). The Apocalyps. p. 124.
3. Nigrinus. Antichrists Grundtliche Offenbarung. p. fils 28v,29r.)

Others who expounded the Historicist interpretation are John Wycliffe, John Knox, William Tyndale, Martin Luther, John Calvin, Ulrich Zwingli, Phillip Melanchthon, Sir Isaac Newton, Jan Huss, John Foxe, John Wesley, George Whitefield, Charles Finney, C. H. Spurgeon, Matthew Henry, Adam Clarke, Albert Barnes, and Bishop Thomas Newton as exponents of this school.

The Day-Year Principle - Powered by Kayako Resolve Help Desk Software

 

[Original Happy Camper]

This what the reformers believed and taught

Others who expounded the Historicist interpretation are John Wycliffe, John Knox, William Tyndale, Martin Luther, John Calvin, Ulrich Zwingli, Phillip Melanchthon, Sir Isaac Newton, Jan Huss, John Foxe, John Wesley, George Whitefield, Charles Finney, C. H. Spurgeon, Matthew Henry, Adam Clarke, Albert Barnes, and Bishop Thomas Newton as exponents of this school.

The Day-Year Principle - Powered by Kayako Resolve Help Desk Software

This is what the counter reformation taught

Futureism
Francisco Ribera
In 1585 Jesuit scholar Francisco Ribera (1537 - 1591) appears. He started the futurist interpretation by publishing a 500-page commentary on the book of Revelation. Ribera took the last “week” (seven day-years) of the 70-week prophecy of Daniel 9:25, divided it into two 3 ½ year periods, and applied it to a future Antichrist, while avoiding any application to the papal system.

Preterism
Revelation [is] described [as] the plight of Christians in the late first century, and its apocalyptic symbols pointed directly to [the city of] Rome as the church’s persecutor...Most modern [preterist] interpreters...insist that the book was never intended to predict conditions or events beyond the first century.ii

Futurism and Preterism

 

[Douggg]

Doug please consider history before making statements on the history of the SDA CHURCH

Calvin and Luther were not the only church leaders to identify the Antichrist. A host of reformers identified the Antichrist as the Papacy, such as Thomas Cranmer ("Whereof it followeth Rome to be the seat of antichrist, and the pope to be very antichrist himself. I could prove the same by many other scriptures, old writers, and strong reasons"vii), John Knox ("Hitherto the pope has been antichrist"viii), John Wesley ("He is in an emphatical sense, the Man of Sin, as he increases all manner of sin above measure. And he is, too, properly styled the Son of Perdition, as he has caused the death of numberless multitudes, both of his opposers and followers"ix), John Wycliffe, John Huss, Jerome, and John Melanchthon

Others who identify the Antichrist

day year principle
There are three primary precedents in Scripture that show the day-year principle:

1. Numbers 14:34. The Israelites will wander for 40 years in the wilderness, one year for every day spent by the spies in Canaan.
2. Ezekiel 4:5-6. The prophet Ezekiel is commanded to lie on his left side for 390 days, followed by his right side for 40 days, to symbolize the equivalent number of years of punishment on Israel and Judah respectively.
3. Daniel 9:24-27. This is known as the Prophecy of Seventy Weeks. Read about the 70-week prophecy here. The majority of scholars do understand the passage to refer to 70 "sevens" or "septets" of years—that is, a total of 490 years.

Jon Paulien has defended the principle from a systematic theology perspective, not strictly just from the Bible. (Jon Paulien, "A New Look at the Year-Day Principle", talk at the 2008 Evangelical Theological Society meetings)

This view was recognized by the Jews. The Protestant Reformers were well established on the day/year principle and it was also accepted by many Christian groups, ministers, and theologians.

1. Elliott, EB (1862). Horae Apocalypticae III (fifth ed.). p. 281.
2. du Ion, Francois (1596). The Apocalyps. p. 124.
3. Nigrinus. Antichrists Grundtliche Offenbarung. p. fils 28v,29r.)

Others who expounded the Historicist interpretation are John Wycliffe, John Knox, William Tyndale, Martin Luther, John Calvin, Ulrich Zwingli, Phillip Melanchthon, Sir Isaac Newton, Jan Huss, John Foxe, John Wesley, George Whitefield, Charles Finney, C. H. Spurgeon, Matthew Henry, Adam Clarke, Albert Barnes, and Bishop Thomas Newton as exponents of this school.

The Day-Year Principle - Powered by Kayako Resolve Help Desk Software

Information duly noted. When someone can provide the reformers timeline of events for the time frame expressions for the end times as found in the bible - using the day is a year principle - let me know, and please post it. Perhaps in another thread.

 

[BobRyan]

Hi Jesus tells those who see the abomination of desolation to flee to the mountains and not look back. So if this happens in the middle of the week they will be hiding in the mountains for 1260 years? .

The 1260 years has nothing at all to do with the 490 years or the midst of the last set of 7 years of the 490 years.

All Bible timelines are contiguous.

So the 1260 years that we are informed about in Dan 7 and Rev 11,12,13 is one single timeline.
The 2300 years of Dan 8 is one single timeline
The 70 years of Jeremiah mentioned in Dan 9:1-5 is one single timeline
The 490 years of Dan 9 are one single timeline.. no splicing slicing and inserting gaps of unknown time in it.

 

[Brian Mcnamee]

The 1260 years has nothing at all to do with the 490 years or the midst of the last set of 7 years of the 490 years.

All Bible timelines are contiguous.

So the 1260 years that we are informed about in Dan 7 and Rev 11,12,13 is one single timeline.
The 2300 years of Dan 8 is one single timeline
The 70 years of Jeremiah mentioned in Dan 9:1-5 is one single timeline
The 490 years of Dan 9 are one single timeline.. no splicing slicing and inserting gaps of unknown time in it.

the mission of Daniel 9 is regards to Daniels people and the hold city Jerusalem and we see the 6 accomplishments are
“Seventy weeks[fn] are determined
For your people and for your holy city,
To finish the transgression,
To make an end of[fn] sins,
To make reconciliation for iniquity,
To bring in everlasting righteousness,
To seal up vision and prophecy,
And to anoint the Most Holy.

Now when Daniel was confessing the sins of his people no doubt this is referring to Jews and Jerusalem.

I pointed to LUKE one which talks about Jesus keeping the covenant with the fathers and delivering them from their enemies so that from that time on they serve without fear and in holiness. You see in every aspect of the 2nd coming Israel is transformed and receives the new heart promised in Jer 31 and reaffirmed to those In Ezekiel who are gathered back to the mountains of Israel which had long bee desolate.

Jesus took the scroll of Isaiah 61 and read a portion of a sentence and noted that this day it was fulfilled in their hearing. He got to the point where he was declaring the acceptable year of the LORD. The rest of the chapter the same person is to bring in the day of vengeance of our God. This section is Zion centered and the type of before and after picture again is told.

The prophecy of Isiah 9
For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
7 Of the increase of His government and peace
There will be no end,
Upon the throne of David and over His kingdom,
To order it and establish it with judgment and justice
From that time forward, even forever.
The zeal of the Lord of hosts will perform this.

Jesus is not on the throne of David as of yet the day of vengeance is still to come and it is when the 6 things mentioned in Daniel and Isaiah 61 and here in chapter 9 come to pass. Every prophecy tell the same story.

 

[BobRyan]

the mission of Daniel 9 is regards to Daniels people and the hold city Jerusalem and we see the 6 accomplishments are
“Seventy weeks[fn] are determined
For your people and for your holy city,

The coming of Christ is the focus of the prophecy in Daniel 9 - and "God so loved the World" that He gave... not just "God so loved the Jews that He gave".

But it also dealt with probation for the Jewish nation "Behold your house is left to you desolate" is the warning Christ gives in Matt 23.

 

[Douggg]

The 1260 years has nothing at all to do with the 490 years or the midst of the last set of 7 years of the 490 years.

Bob, in Ezekiel 39 there are two time expressions found. One is seven months. The other is seven years. How do you reconcile those as being a day is a year, in SDA approach to bible prophecy?

 

[BobRyan]

The 1260 years has nothing at all to do with the 490 years or the midst of the last set of 7 years of the 490 years.

All Bible timelines are contiguous.

So the 1260 years that we are informed about in Dan 7 and Rev 11,12,13 is one single timeline.
The 2300 years of Dan 8 is one single timeline
The 70 years of Jeremiah mentioned in Dan 9:1-5 is one single timeline
The 490 years of Dan 9 are one single timeline.. no splicing slicing and inserting gaps of unknown time in it.

1. Each Bible timeline is contiguous - so then Dan 9 has a 70 week contiguous timeline using day for year method of interpretation.
2. all Apocalyptic timelines use day-for-year.

Bob, in Ezekiel 39 there are two time expressions found. One is seven months. The other is seven years.

Seven years of burning weapons of their enemies in the unknown future event in this non-apocalyptic prophecy

6 “And I will send fire upon Magog and those who inhabit the coastlands in safety; and they will know that I am the Lord.
7 “And I will make My holy name known in the midst of My people Israel; and I will not allow My holy name to be profaned anymore. But the nations will know that I am the Lord, the Holy One in Israel. 8 Behold, it is coming and it shall be done,” declares the Lord God. “That is the day of which I have spoken.
9 “Then those who inhabit the cities of Israel will go out and make fires with the weapons and burn them, both bucklers and shields, bows and arrows, war clubs and spears, and for seven years they will make fires of them.

Seven months of burying the dead predicted in an unknown future event in this non-apocalyptic prophecy -

11 “On that day I will give Gog a burial place there in Israel, the valley of those who pass by east of the sea, and it will block the way of those who would pass by. So they will bury Gog there with all his horde, and they will call it the Valley of Hamon-gog. 12 For seven months the house of Israel will be burying them in order to cleanse the land. 13 And all the people of the land will bury them; and it will be to their renown on the day that I appear in My glory,” declares the Lord God. 14 “They will also select men who will constantly pass through the land, burying those who were passing through, those left on the surface of the ground, in order to cleanse it. At the end of seven months they will conduct a search.

How do you reconcile those as being a day is a year, in SDA approach to bible prophecy?

Just like the 70 years of Jeremiah's non-apocalyptic timeline prophecy mentioned in Daniel 9:1-5 are literal and yet the 70 weeks of years in Dan 9:24-27 are "day for year" as almost all Bible scholars on earth admit. So also with all the other non-apocalyptic texts as compared to apocalyptic ones - the non-apocalyptic ones are literal and the apocalyptic ones are day-for-year.