Iran Launches Attack on Israel

[Chesterton]

People to tend to associate Islam and Arab ethnicity as inseparable, forgetting many Arab Christians and the fact that Iran is not Arabs they're Persians, and the countries with the most Muslims... none of them are Arab (Pakistan, Indonesia, India, Bangladesh)

Yes, my church is Antiochian, so it's chock full of Arabs.

 

[Jamdoc]

Yes, my church is Antiochian, so it's chock full of Arabs.

praise God for that because Arab Christians are how we'll be able to avoid the rather grim fate in Obadiah, where every descendant of Esau perishes.

 

[Lukaris]

Palestinians are "cannon fodder" for the IDF simply by living in the rapidly decreasing area of Gaza that hasn't been destroyed. It's inappropriate to treat this situation where so many have been killed as a left/right issue.

Anti-Defamation League staff decry ‘dishonest’ campaign against Israel critics

ADL has only doubled down on initiatives defending Israel and the policies of the Israeli government amid criticism and staff resignations

www.theguardian.com

I do not respect the ADL. They deny the Armenian genocide because of pressure from Turkey for one thing. Secondly the leader is a staunch Jewish Zionist who has had his own staff resign over his policies and statements with regards to Muslims and the Gaza conflict. They have also led initiatives to censor freedom of speech on colleges and force businesses to do business with Israel.



That you hate a group designed to oppose police brutality against black people is telling. Regardless the Chicago BLM group pulled the post within the day and apologized, admitting it was an uninformed and idiotic thing to do. Do you think I don't look this stuff up? Do you bother to look things up?



This is patently absurd. Hitler and the nazi's considered his Arab allies to be racially inferior and shared only a mutual distaste for Jews. The Arabs in Europe were also sterilized, tortured and sent to camps along with Jews, gays, gypsies and the handicapped. Do you ever look things up or just believe what you hear as long as it feels right? What Hitler said was he felt Christianity was too timid compared to Islamic fighters and wished Germany to be like them in this one regard. That does not means he wanted to be a Muslim or make Germany a Muslim nation. I have very little respect for people who misrepresent the facts or can't be bothered to look them up and repeat falsehoods.



1. Hitler hated Catholicism, hated Atheism and didn't much care for denominational Christianity. He did not hate Christianity and supported the German Christian movement, a group of evangelical Christians who supported the nazi party. He admired Martin Luther (another vicious antisemite) and wanted the German Christian church to become the official church of Europe. You can debate that churches doctrines, I don't have a dog in that fight, but sit there and pretend the nazi's were not Christian nationalists. Google is a thing, look this stuff up sometime.

2. Do not try and tell me (or anyone) that you know their personal lived experience better then they do, or that they were wrong about events you were not present to observe. I lived a majority of my life in Ireland which is as Catholic as it gets outside Vatican City and I know the difference between them and evangelicals. As a matter of fact the Catholic church and the pope have specifically said Catholics should not try to convert Jews. There are plenty of Catholics on this forum, perhaps ask them.

The primary groups in Israel trying to convert Jews are the Jews for Jesus and the Messianic "Jews", both evangelical movements and certainly not Catholic. If you are anti-Catholic or just can't emotionally handle the antisemitism in your community, that's unfortunate but beyond my power or desire to try and rectify. To be clear I don't think all evangelical Christians are antisemites, but a lot are and denial of this fact doesn't help you.



I love how you completely ignored my point, so I'll ask again:

Why is it that you guys get to talk about context and draw distinctions when it comes to the doctrines in your own church, but Muslims aren't? Do you know what a double standard or hypocrisy is?

The ADL reports I linked are credible in their accounts of Pro Palestinian protests before the Israeli response reached severity. Their report on increased antisemitism is valid & evangelical Christians are a non factor. Lastly, I provided a link to their acknowledgement of the Armenian genocide.

I am not ignorant to bad Israeli policies like providing technical aid to Azerbaijani forces who in the last couple years have attacked the Armenians in Nagorno-Karabakh.

Nagorno-Karabakh conflict - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Despite Israel’s shortcomings, they do not have a premeditated plan of destruction of others like Hamas & Iran do towards them. Believing otherwise seems misguided, dangerous, or treacherous depending on awareness, inclinations etc.


For various reasons it seems like the interventionist elites in Washington DC have either tried to prop up Iran or Saudi Arabia as their clients in the Middle East. The current US administration is the same outfit that produced the Arab Spring disaster in 2011; the outcome would have inevitably made Iran dominant. The same protests emerged in Iran but fell short interestingly.

Trump did not trust Iran, with good reason, and reverted back to a more pro Saudi Arabia policy. The Saudi rulers regrettably showed savagery in the murder of conservative Islamic journalist Kheshoggi and the US demos used that as a rallying cry to undermine Trump’s pro Saudi, anti Iran policy. They believed negotiations with the likes of Iran was sound.

It seems like the current US political establishment is trying to crawl back to Saudi Arabia now:

Biden makes new push for historic Israeli-Saudi normalization deal - report - I24NEWS

Discussions with Saudi Arabia encompass a range of issues, including defense cooperation, nuclear power acquisition, and regional stability

www.i24news.tv

Side note taqiyya seems like it can be used for legitimate purposes but it can also be abused.

Taqiyya - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[JosephZ]

People to tend to associate Islam and Arab ethnicity as inseparable, forgetting many Arab Christians

People also tend to associate the Arab-Israeli conflict as being Arab Muslims vs. Jews, forgetting that Palestinian Christians, for the most part, are in solidarity with the Arab Muslims and have also played a direct role in the Palestinian struggle for a state.

 

[Jamdoc]

People also tend to associate the Arab-Israeli conflict as being Arab Muslims vs. Jews, forgetting that Palestinian Christians, for the most part, are in solidarity with the Arab Muslims and have also played a direct role in the Palestinian struggle for a state.

I sure hope they're not in solidarity with the Palestinian Muslims in electing Hamas as their leadership.

 

[JosephZ]

I sure hope they're not in solidarity with the Palestinian Muslims in electing Hamas as their leadership.

I'm sure there were many who voted for Hamas.

 

[Jamdoc]

I'm sure there were many who voted for Hamas.

Well that's not a good thing at all.

A Christian should not be aligning with an organization who's purpose is "killing Jews"
whether it be Nazi party, Hamas, Hezbollah, or Iran.

 

[JosephZ]

A Christian should not be aligning with an organization who's purpose is "killing Jews"
whether it be Nazi party, Hamas, Hezbollah, or Iran.

Unfortunately, many Arab Christians not only support terrorism against Israel; they also participate in it. Some of the militant groups involved in the Arab-Israeli conflict include Arab Christian members, and some of the leaders of these groups are Christians. I'll give some examples.

Nabil Abu Rudeineh is a Christian from Bethlehem and a member of the ruling Fatah Central Committee, is currently the Palestinian Authority’s deputy prime minister and spokesman for the Palestine Liberation Organization and its President Mahmoud Abbas. (The PLO renounced terrorism and is not considered to be terrorist group, however, it is an umbrella group which has terrorist groups under it)

Khalil al-Sakakini was a Christian Palestinian and one of the founding fathers of Arab nationalism applauded the Arab attacks on Jews during the Arab Revolt of1936-39. He once said, "If I hate the Zionist movement, it is because it is trying to build its independence on the rubble of other nations. Occupying Palestine is like occupying the heart of the Arab nation."

"The battle in Palestine is in full force... Victory is in the hands of God. If we live, we shall live with honor. If we die, we shall die with honor."

Sirhan Bishara Sirhan, a Christian born in Jerusalem who later became a Jordanian citizen after Jordan annexed the West Bank, killed Senator Robert F. Kennedy on June 5, 1968, because it coincided with the first anniversary of Israel’s stunning victory during the Six-Day War. Sirhan said in court that he hated Kennedy because he had supported Israel.

"My only connection with Robert Kennedy was his sole support of Israel and his deliberate attempt to send those 50 fighter jets to Israel to obviously do harm to the Palestinians."

Chris Bandak, a Christian Palestinian and former leader of the Al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades, was arrested at the Church of the Nativity after he killed at least two Israelis and seriously wounded a third in 2002. He received four life sentences. Hamas fought for his release as part of a prisoner exchange, and he was released in 2011.

Hilarion Capucci, a Syrian Catholic bishop, was arrested by the security forces of Israel for smuggling weapons into the West Bank for the Palestine Liberation Army and sentenced to 12 years in prison.

Ameer Makhoul a Christian Palestinian citizen of Israel, was arrested and jailed for spying on behalf of Hezbollah.

The Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine (DFLP) was founded by and is currently led by a Jordanian Christian, Nayif Hawatmeh. Membership of this terrorist group is made up of both Muslims and Christians. The DFLP's militant wing, the National Resistance Brigades, participated in the October 7th terrorist attack on Israel.

Today, we in the National Resistance Brigades (the forces of the martyr Omar Al-Qasim) are writing an unparalleled heroic epic in defense of our Palestinian people and their sanctities, which has revealed the fragility of the enemy’s security and defense system and its defeated army. We confirm that our fighters are still engaged in clashes alongside their comrades from all Palestinian factions. Violent violence occurred at a number of Zionist sites inside our territories occupied in 1948 as part of the heroic “Al-Aqsa Flood” operation. -- Abu Khaled, the military spokesman for the National Resistance Brigades, the military wing of the Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine

Other notable attacks:

16 February 2002: Two teenage Israelis were killed and 20 others were wounded when a Palestinian suicide bomber blew himself up outside a pizzeria in the Israeli West Bank settlement of Karnei Shomron.

13 November 1975: A bomb was detonated at an ice cream parlor in Jerusalem, killing seven teenagers and injuring 42 others.

14–15 May 1974: Members of the DFLP entered Netiv Meir Elementary School, taking hostages, mainly children, which ended in the murder of 25 hostages and six other civilians.

The Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine (PFLP) was founded by George Habash, a Christian. It's one of the most radical and militant Palestinian factions. Under the leadership of Habash this group carried out several deadly bombings in Israel and was responsible for multiple airplane hijackings in the 1970s.

Some other attacks include:

23 AUGUST 2019: A PFLP cell detonates an explosive device near an Israeli settlement, killing a 17-year-old girl and wounding her father and brother.

18 NOVEMBER 2014: Two PFLP-affiliated Palestinians attack Israeli worshippers in a synagogue in Jerusalem with guns, knives, and axes, killing five—including three Americans—and injuring 12.

1 NOVEMBER 2004: Eli Amer Alfar, a teenage Palestinian suicide bomber, struck an outdoor market in Tel Aviv, Israel, killing three people and wounding 32.

25 DECEMBER 2003: A suicide bomber, identified as 18-year old Palestinian Said Hanani, detonated a bomb in a bus in Tel Aviv, Israel. At least four people, including three women and one man, were killed and thirteen other people were injured.

17 OCTOBER 2001: Two PFLP gunmen assassinate Israeli Tourism Minister Rehavam Ze’evi in a hotel in Jerusalem in retaliation for an Israeli airstrike that killed then PFLP leader Abu Ali Mustafa.

30 MAY 1972: PFLP and Japanese Red Army faction gunmen murder two dozen passengers at Israel’s Ben-Gurion Airport International Airport.

According to START and the Global Terrorism Database, where much of the above information comes from, between 1970 and 2020, the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine and the Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine carried out more than 220 terrorist attacks targeting Israel and its interests.

 

[Jamdoc]

Unfortunately, many Arab Christians not only support terrorism against Israel; they also participate in it. Some of the militant groups involved in the Arab-Israeli conflict include Arab Christian members, and some of the leaders of these groups are Christians. I'll give some examples.

Nabil Abu Rudeineh is a Christian from Bethlehem and a member of the ruling Fatah Central Committee, is currently the Palestinian Authority’s deputy prime minister and spokesman for the Palestine Liberation Organization and its President Mahmoud Abbas. (The PLO renounced terrorism and is not considered to be terrorist group, however, it is an umbrella group which has terrorist groups under it)

Khalil al-Sakakini was a Christian Palestinian and one of the founding fathers of Arab nationalism applauded the Arab attacks on Jews during the Arab Revolt of1936-39. He once said, "If I hate the Zionist movement, it is because it is trying to build its independence on the rubble of other nations. Occupying Palestine is like occupying the heart of the Arab nation."

"The battle in Palestine is in full force... Victory is in the hands of God. If we live, we shall live with honor. If we die, we shall die with honor."

Sirhan Bishara Sirhan, a Christian born in Jerusalem who later became a Jordanian citizen after Jordan annexed the West Bank, killed Senator Robert F. Kennedy on June 5, 1968, because it coincided with the first anniversary of Israel’s stunning victory during the Six-Day War. Sirhan said in court that he hated Kennedy because he had supported Israel.

"My only connection with Robert Kennedy was his sole support of Israel and his deliberate attempt to send those 50 fighter jets to Israel to obviously do harm to the Palestinians."

Chris Bandak, a Christian Palestinian and former leader of the Al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades, was arrested at the Church of the Nativity after he killed at least two Israelis and seriously wounded a third in 2002. He received four life sentences. Hamas fought for his release as part of a prisoner exchange, and he was released in 2011.

Hilarion Capucci, a Syrian Catholic bishop, was arrested by the security forces of Israel for smuggling weapons into the West Bank for the Palestine Liberation Army and sentenced to 12 years in prison.

Ameer Makhoul a Christian Palestinian citizen of Israel, was arrested and jailed for spying on behalf of Hezbollah.

The Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine (DFLP) was founded by and is currently led by a Jordanian Christian, Nayif Hawatmeh. Membership of this terrorist group is made up of both Muslims and Christians. The DFLP's militant wing, the National Resistance Brigades, participated in the October 7th terrorist attack on Israel.

Today, we in the National Resistance Brigades (the forces of the martyr Omar Al-Qasim) are writing an unparalleled heroic epic in defense of our Palestinian people and their sanctities, which has revealed the fragility of the enemy’s security and defense system and its defeated army. We confirm that our fighters are still engaged in clashes alongside their comrades from all Palestinian factions. Violent violence occurred at a number of Zionist sites inside our territories occupied in 1948 as part of the heroic “Al-Aqsa Flood” operation. -- Abu Khaled, the military spokesman for the National Resistance Brigades, the military wing of the Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine

Other notable attacks:

16 February 2002: Two teenage Israelis were killed and 20 others were wounded when a Palestinian suicide bomber blew himself up outside a pizzeria in the Israeli West Bank settlement of Karnei Shomron.

13 November 1975: A bomb was detonated at an ice cream parlor in Jerusalem, killing seven teenagers and injuring 42 others.

14–15 May 1974: Members of the DFLP entered Netiv Meir Elementary School, taking hostages, mainly children, which ended in the murder of 25 hostages and six other civilians.

The Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine (PFLP) was founded by George Habash, a Christian. It's one of the most radical and militant Palestinian factions. Under the leadership of Habash this group carried out several deadly bombings in Israel and was responsible for multiple airplane hijackings in the 1970s.

Some other attacks include:

23 AUGUST 2019: A PFLP cell detonates an explosive device near an Israeli settlement, killing a 17-year-old girl and wounding her father and brother.

18 NOVEMBER 2014: Two PFLP-affiliated Palestinians attack Israeli worshippers in a synagogue in Jerusalem with guns, knives, and axes, killing five—including three Americans—and injuring 12.

1 NOVEMBER 2004: Eli Amer Alfar, a teenage Palestinian suicide bomber, struck an outdoor market in Tel Aviv, Israel, killing three people and wounding 32.

25 DECEMBER 2003: A suicide bomber, identified as 18-year old Palestinian Said Hanani, detonated a bomb in a bus in Tel Aviv, Israel. At least four people, including three women and one man, were killed and thirteen other people were injured.

17 OCTOBER 2001: Two PFLP gunmen assassinate Israeli Tourism Minister Rehavam Ze’evi in a hotel in Jerusalem in retaliation for an Israeli airstrike that killed then PFLP leader Abu Ali Mustafa.

30 MAY 1972: PFLP and Japanese Red Army faction gunmen murder two dozen passengers at Israel’s Ben-Gurion Airport International Airport.

According to START and the Global Terrorism Database, where much of the above information comes from, between 1970 and 2020, the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine and the Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine carried out more than 220 terrorist attacks targeting Israel and its interests.

a shame. I would think that the future redemption of Israel was clear in the bible but because of people allegorizing scripture and seeing the Church as replacing Israel rather than being grafted into the same tree as Israel is a part of (which is how Paul illustrates it), they get the idea that there is no future for Israel that they're forsaken.

But it's a dangerous thought process to go into, and Paul taught it right
Romans 11

17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert grafted in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;
18 Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee.
19 Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be grafted in.
20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:
21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.

If God can forsake the promises He made to Israel saying "that's old covenant, new covenant replaces the old, old has no value anymore"... then how can we trust Him not to forsake the promise of eternal life to us?
Not to say that Jews will be saved by the Old Covenant, rather salvation has always been grace, it's always been a part of the new covenant. The New Covenant promises are veiled in the Old Testament.
God made promises, God will keep them, and those promises aren't honored because of such exemplary performance on our part.. but because God's own name and character are on the line, is God faithful and true, or does God treacharously renege?

 

[Landon Caeli]

Unfortunately, many Arab Christians not only support terrorism against Israel; they also participate in it. Some of the militant groups involved in the Arab-Israeli conflict include Arab Christian members, and some of the leaders of these groups are Christians. I'll give some examples.

Nabil Abu Rudeineh is a Christian from Bethlehem and a member of the ruling Fatah Central Committee, is currently the Palestinian Authority’s deputy prime minister and spokesman for the Palestine Liberation Organization and its President Mahmoud Abbas. (The PLO renounced terrorism and is not considered to be terrorist group, however, it is an umbrella group which has terrorist groups under it)

Khalil al-Sakakini was a Christian Palestinian and one of the founding fathers of Arab nationalism applauded the Arab attacks on Jews during the Arab Revolt of1936-39. He once said, "If I hate the Zionist movement, it is because it is trying to build its independence on the rubble of other nations. Occupying Palestine is like occupying the heart of the Arab nation."

"The battle in Palestine is in full force... Victory is in the hands of God. If we live, we shall live with honor. If we die, we shall die with honor."

Sirhan Bishara Sirhan, a Christian born in Jerusalem who later became a Jordanian citizen after Jordan annexed the West Bank, killed Senator Robert F. Kennedy on June 5, 1968, because it coincided with the first anniversary of Israel’s stunning victory during the Six-Day War. Sirhan said in court that he hated Kennedy because he had supported Israel.

"My only connection with Robert Kennedy was his sole support of Israel and his deliberate attempt to send those 50 fighter jets to Israel to obviously do harm to the Palestinians."

Chris Bandak, a Christian Palestinian and former leader of the Al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades, was arrested at the Church of the Nativity after he killed at least two Israelis and seriously wounded a third in 2002. He received four life sentences. Hamas fought for his release as part of a prisoner exchange, and he was released in 2011.

Hilarion Capucci, a Syrian Catholic bishop, was arrested by the security forces of Israel for smuggling weapons into the West Bank for the Palestine Liberation Army and sentenced to 12 years in prison.

Ameer Makhoul a Christian Palestinian citizen of Israel, was arrested and jailed for spying on behalf of Hezbollah.

The Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine (DFLP) was founded by and is currently led by a Jordanian Christian, Nayif Hawatmeh. Membership of this terrorist group is made up of both Muslims and Christians. The DFLP's militant wing, the National Resistance Brigades, participated in the October 7th terrorist attack on Israel.

Today, we in the National Resistance Brigades (the forces of the martyr Omar Al-Qasim) are writing an unparalleled heroic epic in defense of our Palestinian people and their sanctities, which has revealed the fragility of the enemy’s security and defense system and its defeated army. We confirm that our fighters are still engaged in clashes alongside their comrades from all Palestinian factions. Violent violence occurred at a number of Zionist sites inside our territories occupied in 1948 as part of the heroic “Al-Aqsa Flood” operation. -- Abu Khaled, the military spokesman for the National Resistance Brigades, the military wing of the Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine

Other notable attacks:

16 February 2002: Two teenage Israelis were killed and 20 others were wounded when a Palestinian suicide bomber blew himself up outside a pizzeria in the Israeli West Bank settlement of Karnei Shomron.

13 November 1975: A bomb was detonated at an ice cream parlor in Jerusalem, killing seven teenagers and injuring 42 others.

14–15 May 1974: Members of the DFLP entered Netiv Meir Elementary School, taking hostages, mainly children, which ended in the murder of 25 hostages and six other civilians.

The Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine (PFLP) was founded by George Habash, a Christian. It's one of the most radical and militant Palestinian factions. Under the leadership of Habash this group carried out several deadly bombings in Israel and was responsible for multiple airplane hijackings in the 1970s.

Some other attacks include:

23 AUGUST 2019: A PFLP cell detonates an explosive device near an Israeli settlement, killing a 17-year-old girl and wounding her father and brother.

18 NOVEMBER 2014: Two PFLP-affiliated Palestinians attack Israeli worshippers in a synagogue in Jerusalem with guns, knives, and axes, killing five—including three Americans—and injuring 12.

1 NOVEMBER 2004: Eli Amer Alfar, a teenage Palestinian suicide bomber, struck an outdoor market in Tel Aviv, Israel, killing three people and wounding 32.

25 DECEMBER 2003: A suicide bomber, identified as 18-year old Palestinian Said Hanani, detonated a bomb in a bus in Tel Aviv, Israel. At least four people, including three women and one man, were killed and thirteen other people were injured.

17 OCTOBER 2001: Two PFLP gunmen assassinate Israeli Tourism Minister Rehavam Ze’evi in a hotel in Jerusalem in retaliation for an Israeli airstrike that killed then PFLP leader Abu Ali Mustafa.

30 MAY 1972: PFLP and Japanese Red Army faction gunmen murder two dozen passengers at Israel’s Ben-Gurion Airport International Airport.

According to START and the Global Terrorism Database, where much of the above information comes from, between 1970 and 2020, the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine and the Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine carried out more than 220 terrorist attacks targeting Israel and its interests.

They've been tainted by Islam. The same way the conquistadors were influenced by the Moors who conquered Spain.

Islam is harmful to Christianity. Like cancer is to an individual.

 

[Landon Caeli]

People to tend to associate Islam and Arab ethnicity as inseparable, forgetting many Arab Christians and the fact that Iran is not Arabs they're Persians, and the countries with the most Muslims... none of them are Arab (Pakistan, Indonesia, India, Bangladesh)

The spirit of Islam is unholy, and usually has a negative effect on the cultures and traditions of those most exposed to it. Not saying it's purely evil... But it's definitely not Holy. Not at all.

 

[Jamdoc]

The spirit of Islam is unholy, and usually has a negative effect on the cultures and traditions of those most exposed to it. Not saying it's purely evil... But it's definitely not Holy. Not at all.

I go further and do believe that Islam is at its core, evil, because I believe its author is the devil, made as a counterfeit religion, some of its key messages are reactionary to Christianity, that Jesus did not die, is not the Son of God, is not divine, no trinity, etc.
By John's definition it is Antichrist religion, perhaps THE Antichrist religion.

But it's the doctrines and holy books, not the believers, they're no more particularly evil than any of us evil sinners, Lord help us make forgiven sinners out of them is the best we can do.

 

[JosephZ]

They've been tainted by Islam. The same way the conquistadors were influenced by the Moors who conquered Spain.

There's no doubt that Islam has had an influence on Arab Christians, but it isn't an Islamist ideology that drives Arab Christians to join terrorist groups and commit acts of violence against Israel; it's the ideology of Palestinian nationalism and decades of injustice against Palestinians.

The ideology of Palestinian nationalism, which began in the early 1900s, originated from Arab nationalism, which is based on the strong cultural ties of the people rather than religion. Christians were at the forefront of Arab nationalism, and it was a Christian, Naguib Azoury, who predicted in 1905 that there would be a clash between Arab nationalism and Zionism, which wouldn't end until one of the two defeated the other. After WWII, Palestinian nationalism really started to take hold in Mandatory Palestine. During the 1948 Arab-Israeli war, it was a Christian, Constantin Zureiq, who was the first to coin the term "Nakba" to refer to the mass displacement of Palestinians. It's the forced displacement of Palestinians and the many injustices that followed and continue to this day that are the root cause of acts of terrorism being carried out against Israel; not religion.

 

[Valletta]

There's no doubt that Islam has had an influence on Arab Christians, but it isn't an Islamist ideology that drives Arab Christians to join terrorist groups and commit acts of violence against Israel; it's the ideology of Palestinian nationalism and decades of injustice against Palestinians.

The ideology of Palestinian nationalism, which began in the early 1900s, originated from Arab nationalism, which is based on the strong cultural ties of the people rather than religion. Christians were at the forefront of Arab nationalism, and it was a Christian, Naguib Azoury, who predicted in 1905 that there would be a clash between Arab nationalism and Zionism, which wouldn't end until one of the two defeated the other. After WWII, Palestinian nationalism really started to take hold in Mandatory Palestine. During the 1948 Arab-Israeli war, it was a Christian, Constantin Zureiq, who was the first to coin the term "Nakba" to refer to the mass displacement of Palestinians. It's the forced displacement of Palestinians and the many injustices that followed and continue to this day that are the root cause of acts of terrorism being carried out against Israel; not religion.

Those are merely excuses for savagery. They have lost their moral compass. There are many populations that consider themselves oppressed that would not dream of doing such things. Had they used the resources the world has showered upon them for bettering themselves instead of terrorism they would be living better than a lot of people in the world.

 

[Landon Caeli]

There's no doubt that Islam has had an influence on Arab Christians, but it isn't an Islamist ideology that drives Arab Christians to join terrorist groups and commit acts of violence against Israel; it's the ideology of Palestinian nationalism and decades of injustice against Palestinians.

The ideology of Palestinian nationalism, which began in the early 1900s, originated from Arab nationalism, which is based on the strong cultural ties of the people rather than religion. Christians were at the forefront of Arab nationalism, and it was a Christian, Naguib Azoury, who predicted in 1905 that there would be a clash between Arab nationalism and Zionism, which wouldn't end until one of the two defeated the other. After WWII, Palestinian nationalism really started to take hold in Mandatory Palestine. During the 1948 Arab-Israeli war, it was a Christian, Constantin Zureiq, who was the first to coin the term "Nakba" to refer to the mass displacement of Palestinians. It's the forced displacement of Palestinians and the many injustices that followed and continue to this day that are the root cause of acts of terrorism being carried out against Israel; not religion.

The violence were witnessing can't be sepersted from the religion though... Because it's through Islam, that the Iranians and much of the rest of the Muslim world assist with the killings. Why else would such a hardened regime such as Iran, who doesn't typically recognize human rights, side with non-Persians from a distant land?

I'm curious how you would explain that.

 

[JosephZ]

Those are merely excuses for savagery. They have lost their moral compass. There are many populations that consider themselves oppressed that would not dream of doing such things. Had they used the resources the world has showered upon them for bettering themselves instead of terrorism they would be living better than a lot of people in the world.

You may think it's just an excuse now, but that will likely change over the next several years. Israel's destruction of Gaza since October 7th has created a monster. Even if Hamas is eraticated tomorrow, Israel's outlook for a secure future is dim. There are countless traumatized children that are going to grow up with hatred in their hearts towards Israel for what they have done to them and their families. They have witnessed and experienced things that no human should ever have to, and they are never going to forget. The next generation of terrorists to emerge from this conflict will likely be unlike anything we have seen in the past because of the near total destruction of Gaza and the enormous number of casualties over the past six months.

Below are a few excerpts from a book written in 2005:

The fact is unmistakable and the message comes over loud and clear: a deep sense of injustice beyond the stage of profound frustration and despair stands at the heart of the issue. The Palestinian drive for freedom has been hampered by Israeli occupation atrocities.

The lack of normalcy of life can be seen on the streets torn up by army ‘chokepoints’; in the demolished homes; in the burnt and destroyed farmland; and on the faces of children whose childhood has been stripped away due to deprivation and hopelessness.

‘Every Palestinian, without exception, has felt the suffocating strangle of Israeli military control on Palestinian resistance and ‘suicide bombing’ their life’ (Baker 2001).

Arin Ahmed, a would-be bomber, During her conversation with the Israeli former minister of defence, Ben-Eliezer, she unequivocally states that her motive for considering a ‘body attack’ on Israelis was not military or religious in nature. Rather, it was exclusively personal: ‘I was in distress. I was depressed … You [Israelis] killed my friend. We were friends for a year and a half’ (Levy-Barzalai 2002).

The daily conditions of Palestinians living under occupation are bound to create immense anger, bitterness and hatred. The sights of Palestinian children being killed, women and children going hungry, a civilian population being brutalized (Aloni 2003)

The motive behind ‘suicide bombing’ is rooted in trauma: injury to a father or brother in the First Intifada, or the death of a friend or even a distant relation in the present upheavals. To clarify this, he states that ‘in every case of suicide bombing, there is a personal tragedy or a trauma’. More specifically, ‘the people doing the suicide bombing today are the children of the First Intifada and they have witnessed or suffered personal trauma in one form or another that is humiliating’ (Goldenberg 2002b)


Root Causes of Terrorism: Myths, Reality and Ways Forward 1st Edition
Tore Bjørgo

 

[Valletta]

You may think it's just an excuse now, but that will likely change over the next several years. Israel's destruction of Gaza since October 7th has created a monster. Even if Hamas is eraticated tomorrow, Israel's outlook for a secure future is dim. There are countless traumatized children that are going to grow up with hatred in their hearts towards Israel for what they have done to them and their families.

The educational system in Gaza promoted hatred of Jews, just like was done in Germany in the 1930s. The key will be to educate those children on how Hamas leaders, many of them who lived in wealth, were willing and eager to murder innocent Palestinians in order to promote jihad. They need to be taught the lengths Israel went to, as they just did with Iran, to avoid civilian casualties, and that they are alive because of it.

 

[JosephZ]

Why else would such a hardened regime such as Iran, who doesn't typically recognize human rights, side with non-Persians from a distant land?

Iran is unique because its regime adheres to an extremist sect of Shia Islam known as the Twelvers.

Twelvers believe that Jews stand in the way of the return of the 12th Iman, the last successor of Prophet Mohammad. According to the doctrine of the Twelvers, his reappearance will stop all wars and bring absolute peace, along with the establishment of true Islam and pure monotheism.

Iran will partner with any group or state that they believe will lead to the destruction of Israel. It's one of those "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" situations.


"The IRGC is one of the tools for paving the way for the emergence of the Imam of the Age [Mahdi] in the field of a regional and international awakening." Ali Saeedi, Representative of the Supreme Leader to the IRGC in 2012

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[JosephZ]

The educational system in Gaza promoted hatred of Jews, just like was done in Germany in the 1930s. The key will be to educate those children on how Hamas leaders, many of them who lived in wealth, were willing and eager to murder innocent Palestinians in order to promote jihad. They need to be taught the lengths Israel went to, as they just did with Iran, to avoid civilian casualties, and that they are alive because of it.

I was optimistic at the very beginning of the conflict, and I agree that deradicalization of the Palestinian youth would have gone a long way in preventing future violence against Israel, but I think it's far too late for that approach now. I don't think any amount of counseling or attempts at explaining why things happened the way they did can undo the amount of trauma the children in Gaza have experienced over the past six months and will continue to see into the foreseeable future. There are hundreds of thousands of children under the age of 12 in Gaza and even if deradicalization were to work on the majority of these children, there would still be tens of thousands who would be vulnerable to joining terrorist groups or would be willing to carry out acts of violence towards Israel in the future.

 

[Nithavela]

Threads like this are very good at reminding me why we don't have a lot of muslims on this site.