Creating a Humanzee

Landon Caeli said:

Wow. I'm stunned about that word being blurred. That's an actual technical term.

Lord help us.

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Lord help us realize that messing with Creation and humanity will lead us down a path of destruction.

Landon Caeli said:

I think you people have a hard time distinguishing between conversation and protection of the faith.

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We don't care to "play God" in a laboratory.

Landon Caeli said:

Thank you! Now we're getting somewhere. This is what I want to talk about.

Let it be known, that we mustn't use CF to further our own agendas, but rather, to have dialogue on tough topics.

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Well, the Catholics speak out against modifying creation. We are both Catholic ourselves.

Source: Prospects for Xenotransplantation - Scientific Aspects and Ethical Considerations
(61) We do well to specify that, while the encephalon is related to the personal identity of the subject insofar as it is the organ representing the "principal seat of psychological consciousness", and the "deposit" of existential memory, the gonads are likewise related, insofar as they are organs charged with gametogenesis (the production of gametes); they represent, in a manner of speaking, the "transmitter" - by means of procreation - of the subject's personal identity (genetic patrimony) to offspring. For this reason, while an hypothetical encephalon transplant can in no case be considered morally licit, neither can an eventual gonad transplant - if performed for the purpose of supplying the gametogenetic function - be morally acceptable. Different, however, is the case of a gonad transplant performed exclusively for hormonogenetic purposes (that is, to restore a sufficient hormonal function); once the integrity of the subject's personal identity has been ensured, and once the disassociation with procreation has been established, there would be no particular moral reservations. In this regard, see M.P. Faggioni, Il trapianto di gonadi. Storia e attualità, Med. Mor., 1998, 48, 15-46.

Landon Caeli said:

Exactly! But you asked a specific question. I explained my motivation for the topic.

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And thanks for your explanation. But you obviously want to talk about more than just Oliver.

Carrying on then, Zookeepers will tell you chimps don't make good pets. They are mean and nasty and wicked strong to boot. Humans don't make good pets, either.

I'm not seeing much call for half-human slave workers, either. There's not much a human can do without thinking that thinking humans aren't likely to figure out how to make a machine do better and faster, and at scale, soon enough.

So where do we go from here.

Landon Caeli said:

Scientifically speaking, creating a humanzee would be no different from how we've created Ligers and Mules. So why haven't we created a humanzee yet, knowing it's entirely possible and super easy?

Many say it's an issue of morality. But why would it be, considering a humanzee would be neither human, nor chimp. What would be a worst or best case scenario in this situation? Being the eternal optimist that I am, I envision a friendly pet-like companion, like a dog, but much smarter. It's not like it would be in a constant state of pain, like some kind of groaning Frankenstein - nature doesn’t allow animals to live in perpetual pain. Perhaps they could even be trained to do our work for us? Like picking fruit in the fields? Or factory work, or other jobs humans don't particularly like doing? For thousands of years we've been using horses in similar ways - I don't see how a humanzee would be any different.

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It is absolutely unethical.
There are no known "natural" or spontaneous mutants from Chimps and humans.
Mules are natural.
The status of "pet" "subhuman" "servant" "useful animal" applied to a creature with human genetics is exactly the arguments of the slavers.
Some actually believed the African slaves were 3/4 human or humanzees.
The Courts might have something to say about "human rights" and then instead of pets you might have wards.
And what nature of the beast? What if the combination was an entirely cunning and very vicious animal?
Better leave it alone.
I asked a biologist if the mating of chimps and humans was possible.
His answer was, "That is an Unethical Question."
It is unethical to even ask the question...according to scientist.

QvQ said:

It is absolutely unethical.
There are no known "natural" or spontaneous mutants from Chimps and humans.
Mules are natural.
The state of "pet" "subhuman" "servant" "useful animal" applied to a creature with human genetics is exactly the arguments of the slavers.
Some actually believed the African slaves were 3/4 human or humanzees.

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Agreed 100%. Seems that the original post is promoting slavery.

Landon Caeli said:

Many say it's an issue of morality. But why would it be, considering a humanzee would be neither human, nor chimp. What would be a worst or best case scenario in this situation? Being the eternal optimist that I am, I envision a friendly pet-like companion, like a dog, but much smarter. It's not like it would be in a constant state of pain, like some kind of groaning Frankenstein - nature doesn’t allow animals to live in perpetual pain. Perhaps they could even be trained to do our work for us? Like picking fruit in the fields? Or factory work, or other jobs humans don't particularly like doing? For thousands of years we've been using horses in similar ways - I don't see how a humanzee would be any different.

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Robots would be way more ethical.

Chimps aren't a good mix behaviourally-speaking. Chimps can get violent and can be very unpredictable and if they get violent, they are incredibly strong compared to humans. You don't put a chimp and a child or a baby together like you could with dogs or cats.

Dog-human hybrid or even cat-human hybrid is way better in terms of behavior and temperatment. Way cuter too.

But major ethical consideration would be at hand. If they will have the same rights as us, etc.

Landon Caeli said:

Excellent point! Your posts are getting better! Is it morally wrong for animals, like horses for example, to be enslaved by humans?

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The term "enslavement" is typically used to describe the forced and unpaid labor of human beings. While it is important to recognize that animals, such as horses, can be mistreated or exploited by humans, they do not have the same capacity for freedom and autonomy as humans. Therefore, comparing their treatment to slavery may not be entirely accurate or productive. A humanzee would be 50% human, so therefore it will be morally wrong to have humanzee slaves.

That being said, there are certainly ethical concerns surrounding the use of animals for human purposes, including work, entertainment, and food production. Many people believe that animals deserve certain moral considerations based on their ability to feel pain and suffer, among other factors.

In the case of horses specifically, some argue that using them for work or riding can be beneficial for both the animal and the human involved, providing exercise, companionship, and a sense of purpose. However, it is crucial that horses are treated with respect and care, given adequate rest, nutrition, and medical attention, and trained in a humane and positive manner. Unfortunately, this is not always the case, and many horses end up suffering from neglect, abuse, or overwork.

Landon Caeli said:

Would you view a humanzee as pure animal or part man?

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50% animal, 50% man. So yes, I would view a humanzee as part man. It's in the name, bro.

Analogy: vinegar = human, water = nonhuman

Say you mix 5% vinegar with water. What do you get? You still get vinegar.

Landon Caeli said:

Do you think it would have a soul?

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No one knows, but he/she might. In the end times, what is bad will be called good, and what is good will be called bad. The fact that there are people who support chimeras, transsexualism in the church, churches ordaining those who act on biblically immoral sins, and Big Oil defiling our Earth with fossil fuels and irresponsible lithium mining shows that the end might be near.

2 Timothy 4:3 (ESV): "For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions"​