Liberal Christianity and spiritual manifestations.

[AudioArtist]

Hi,

It's just a simple question: Are there any others here like me who have a liberal belief system in a lot of respects (in terms of creation, how literally one takes the Bible, Hell and judgement etc.) but also believe in the gifts of the spirit, demons, spirits and the supernatural generally?

I'm fairly torn, because normally those that believe in the gifts of the spirit today, demons, spiritual manifestations etc. are fundimentalist in terms of how they view the Bible and some other issues. Are there any liberals here who don't think demons, spirits, and modern day miracles are fairy tales but infact do occur? Am I anti-intellectual for believing in such phenomina, and therefore not a liberal Christian? Mind you, it's not *my* fault I experienced the Holy Spirit in a powerful way and saw a demon when I was three years old.;)

[Treasure the Questions]

I certainly believe in Holy Spirit, and many Christians I know with a fairly liberal theology do so too. I see Holy Spirit as sort of Essence of God/Jesus working in us and enabling us to be transformed into Jesus' likeness.

To me the fruit of the Spirit is God's character being developed in us by Holy spirit working in us.

I'm not sure about demons and spirits. I think often what is explained as demonic in the Bible was due to physical or mental illness. I certainly believe God is still capable of miracles, but am skeptical. Perhaps there are many small miracles occurring which we put down to coincidence.

[Toney]

Hi,

It's just a simple question: Are there any others here like me who have a liberal belief system in a lot of respects (in terms of creation, how literally one takes the Bible, Hell and judgement etc.) but also believe in the gifts of the spirit, demons, spirits and the supernatural generally?

I'm fairly torn, because normally those that believe in the gifts of the spirit today, demons, spiritual manifestations etc. are fundimentalist in terms of how they view the Bible and some other issues. Are there any liberals here who don't think demons, spirits, and modern day miracles are fairy tales but infact do occur? Am I anti-intellectual for believing in such phenomina, and therefore not a liberal Christian? Mind you, it's not *my* fault I experienced the Holy Spirit in a powerful way and saw a demon when I was three years old.;)

First, you can certainly trust the Spirit to lead you to truth but it may take a while as there are many lessons to learn along the narrow path.

Two of the most powerful sceens in Passion (to me) were those that featured Veronica and Simon of Cyrene. They represent what are termed works of mercy. When a person coverts (metanoia (http://www.stjosephdg.org/parish/about/metanoia.html)), the Holy Spirit puts a Veronica or a Simon, often more than one, in your spiritual path. You'll need them! Once a soul chooses God, His adversary has permission to test you and you will go to the desert!

Yes, I believe in angels. Consequently, I also believe in anti-angels or demons as you cannot have one without the other. Although I regard both metaphorically, they are realities inasmuch as we are permitted to discern them. You probably would enjoy reading Spiritual Exercises by Ignatius of Loyola, still the definitive work on the discernment of spirits. God bless you.

[Bizzlebin Imperatoris]

I believe in demons and spirits as recorded in the Bible. And, I see no scriptural evidence to indicate gifts have ceased.

[Reader Nilus]

An author, CS2x, that you should read is Morton Kelsey. He has some very excellent work on the subject.
Jeff the Finn

[McCravey]

I have encountered angels many times. I have had miracles (real ones) that I cannot explain. But the subject of demons is still unsure to me. I don't feel as if demons are as much a problem to me anymore.

You can become too focused on the demonic realm and assume you are in a battle which you are not in. It's like focusing on a game you're not supposed to play, and lose track of where you really are and who you really are.

I am much more concerned with people who come to me with unbridled prejudice, envy, hate, etc. They are the ones I am concerned with...how do I deal with them?

[Bizzlebin Imperatoris]

I have encountered angels many times. I have had miracles (real ones) that I cannot explain. But the subject of demons is still unsure to me. I don't feel as if demons are as much a problem to me anymore.

I am much more concerned with people who come to me with unbridled prejudice, envy, hate, etc. They are the ones I am concerned with...how do I deal with them?
1. Could you explain the "demons aren't a problem" a little more? That interests me.

2. Deal with them in others? Love. Deal with them in yourself? Love.

[McCravey]

Our flesh is the real problem. If there are demons (I'm not saying that there are or there aren't) they have their effect on us through our flesh. Once you become less fleshy or carnal minded (your mind changes) they lose their power over you. They can still effect others though and will inspire people to attack you and come against you. The people that do this don't really know why they hate you they just do.

You overcome these attacks through patience (be quiet and wait), prayer, and love. After overcoming, the people will change and act as if they don't even remember what they did to you. They probably don't. Remember Christ's words "Father forgive them, for they know not what they do"

[Mustaphile]

Sure! Why not. :D

I'm don't really concern myself too much about deciding whether something is specifically a demonic/spiritual influence very much. I tend to use it as a reminder of the reason why things in our current physical existence are always going to be flawed.

I read the part in the Bible about God getting the victory in the end, and Paul's statements about how nothing can stand between us and God if we have faith. Faith has a very close correlation to positive thinking, so I tend to think positively about the situation. They are there, they do influence, but in the end they are not really relevant to the final conclusion.

[Gwynne]

I believe strongly in the supernatural based on personal experience. However I think that conservative/fundamentalist Christians focus entirely too much on demonic power/activity, crediting every thing that goes wrong in their lives on the work of an evil spirit (I've actually met people like that.) I also think the gifts of the spirit are active, but not necessarily in the way that some people believe. For instance I have issue with what is often called "Speaking in Tongues" based on personal experience and careful Bible study. The only time I ever witnessed someone speak in tongues I got a feeling of absolute evil coming from them, and I walked away from it scared for that persons soul and for the souls of those around him.