Is faith absolutely necessary in order to receive from God?

[Jimbeaux]

I’m curious as to what you believe. Do you believe God answers prayer apart from faith?

Can you support your belief scripturally?




If the first step in an argument is wrong everything that follows is wrong.
~C.S. Lewis, The Problem of Pain

[GreatistheLord]

Lazarus - He can't have had too much. But I think that God is gracious when we don't have faith, but it is not a prayer of faith, but a prayer to God according to His mercy and grace. Praying with unbelief, I dont believe, God will answer.

I know that when I have no faith, and feel completely flat, if I tried to prayer a prayer of faith, it would be unanswered, so instead I just tell God that I ask for His mercy and that He would answer just because He loves me.

[Elijah2]

The Good Confession

“But you, O man of God, flee these things and pursue righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, gentleness. Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, to which you were also called and have confessed the good confession in the presence of many witnesses. I urge you in the sight of God who gives life to all things, and before Christ Jesus who witnessed the good confession before Pontius Pilate, that you keep this commandment without spot, blameless until our Lord Jesus Christ’s appearing, which He will manifest in His own time, He who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings and Lord of lords, who alone has immortality, dwelling in unapproachable light, whom no man has seen or can see, to whom be honour and everlasting power. Amen.” (1 Tim.6: 11-16)

Sad as it is, some churches see faith as materialism. Faith comes from righteousness, godliness, and the Fruit of the Spirit, a spirit-controlled life. So when we pursue the Fruit of the Spirit and godliness, then we can be sure of “eternal life”.

We can be saved, but if we have no fruitfulness of life and give a “good confession” of our life, then rewards will be ours, but only if we continue in His Word and in HIM.

We see so many empty religious arguments, and we can see much of this on these forums. Our faith comes from being faithful to our Lord Jesus Christ in all our ways, and as in the case of these verses, we are told to remain faithful to HIM, and to focus upon His return. As HIS return is the motive behind us living a Godly life!

If we expect rewards for our faithfulness, then we are looking at this in a materialistic way.

[FoundInGrace]

I'm of two minds about it (because God can and does do what He likes) but I'm getting more convinced as I go along that God responds to faith.

Heb 11:6
But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.


To pray to God in the first place takes an element of faith that there is even a God to pray to, so all prayers to God have faith in there somewhere.

[victoryword]

Perhaps we should qualify the question: Are we referring to living human beings or dead people? You see, some will bring up Lazarus as an of someone who did not need faith to receive. I suppose a dead person needs none. But if we are referring to the living, it usually requires some amount of faith:

If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him. But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed. For let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the Lord (James 1:5-7)

And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive. (Mat. 21:22)

So I suppose that we can say that the normal procedure for receiving from God is to believe Him. It only makes sense since anything else makes Him out to be a liar (1 John 5:10). Why would anyone want to bless someone who calls him a liar?

Someone quoted Hebrews 11:6. Good passage as well.

[dkbwarrior]

I’m curious as to what you believe. Do you believe God answers prayer apart from faith?

Can you support your belief scripturally?


No.


6But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed. 7For let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the Lord.
-James 1:6-7

However, there is a caveat. One can sometimes excercise ones faith in behalf of another, it doesn't always require the faith of the individual receiving, just their consent, either actively or even passively.

For instance, we can pray for others that their eyes be opened, for labourers to be sent to the harvest, for the sanctification of our loved ones who may not have yet reached the age of accountability, we can pray for anothers healing, etc.

And, there is another way that God meets needs, and that is through the gifts of the Spirit. These are as the Spirit wills and have nothing to do neccesarily with the faith of the individual receiving, as well as little to do with their doctrinal stances.

That is why many people are healed who don't have faith for healing. Because they get into a place where the Spirit is moving and can sometimes receive when the gifts are operating.

This is also why the gifts come and go however. If God always healed everyone by the gifts, then no one would learn to use the faith He gives them for healing.

Same reason why it is hard for the rich to enter the kingdom of heaven. Because they have no reason to use the faith that God gave them for meeting their needs, when all their needs are already met.

I have often had this conversation with people who have spent their years working and saving for retirement. They finally have a good little nest egg to retire on, and don't have to believe God at all. Very difficult in that situation to believe God to meet your needs.

Peace...

[Moriah_Conquering_Wind]

I’m curious as to what you believe. Do you believe God answers prayer apart from faith?

Can you support your belief scripturally?
Would have to dig & research to support it scripturally, but Moriah can readily testify from firsthand experience that God frequently answers its prayers even when it has absolutely no faith whatsoever at the time of praying.

Our state of mind does not dictate Who God will be at any given moment. He makes the sun to shine upon the evil and the good alike, and sends rain upon the just and the unjust. He bes fair and impartial -- which "feels unfair" to us sometimes because we would like to see those WE consider "good" get blessed and those WE consider "bad" to be punished and set straight. (And yes, sometimes He does chastise people, but always for HIS reasons and THEIR ultimate benefit, not to exercise our fleshly pique against them by proxy).

As others have said before, God bes a GOOD God, ALL the time. :thumbsup:

[Tamara224]

That is why many people are healed who don't have faith for healing. Because they get into a place where the Spirit is moving and can sometimes receive when the gifts are operating.

Kind of like an angel troubling the waters, huh?

[Moriah_Conquering_Wind]

God frequently answers its prayers even when it has absolutely no faith whatsoever at the time of praying.
Or should it say instead, perhaps, no FEELING of faith? Because it might very well have faith shoved down in there somewhere but simply be utterly incapable of feeling it or accessing it at the moment. Its feelings and entire sense of itself and its state of mind at that moment may be total doubt and despair. But faith does not come from Moriah nor any creature-in-flesh. Origin: Faith bes the gift of God, not of works, lest ANY should boast. Avenue: Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God. Therefore "whether you have faith or not" becomes something of a recursive question begging itself, because by this understanding, we must obviously at times "take it on faith" that yes, God has faithfully given us faith. NOT because we FEEL it, or FEEL we have it, but because His word plainly says so and states that we do. :P

Now daimonizomai has to laugh. :D Bes that not just like God, to make faith itself a matter of faith, wrapping it in itself recursively precisely SO we cannot trace or nail its origin anywhere but in/from HIM and that even for proper apprehension of the fact of it we must rely utterly upon Him? ^_^ Abba, Moriah just adores watching how You work!! You bes so incredibly clever!!! ^_^

[Moriah_Conquering_Wind]

One can sometimes excercise ones faith in behalf of another, it doesn't always require the faith of the individual receiving, just their consent, either actively or even passively.

For instance, we can pray for others that their eyes be opened, for labourers to be sent to the harvest, for the sanctification of our loved ones who may not have yet reached the age of accountability, we can pray for anothers healing, etc.

And, there is another way that God meets needs, and that is through the gifts of the Spirit. These are as the Spirit wills and have nothing to do neccesarily with the faith of the individual receiving, as well as little to do with their doctrinal stances.

That is why many people are healed who don't have faith for healing. Because they get into a place where the Spirit is moving and can sometimes receive when the gifts are operating.

This bes very good news indeed for those feeling weak in faith, as well as great encouragement to join ourselves with the BODY, with OTHER believers who can be moved by God's precious Spirit in love toward us and pity on our afflictions to pray for us. The prayers of the faithful for each of us in our individual struggles bes like those who held up Moses' arms in battle when he grew too weary to hold them up himself. Only with his arms raised did the battle turn in Israel's favor -- a great lesson resides here! -- and only with the help of OTHERS raising THEIR arms to hold up HIS when HE grew faint and weary could he keep his arms up at ALL times. Without that support, his arms would have HAD to come down, which would mean the battle would turn AGAINST Israel for that time till he regained strength -- and by then the losses and casualties could have been heavy indeed.

What an awesome lesson for us today to be knit together in unity of the Spirit and love for one another in Christ. We NEED each other. We NEED each other's gifts, talents, connection with Him and discernment to help hold up our own, and in turn, each one of us bes like a Moses whose arms must remain held up for the battle to turn in the favor of the WHOLE church, the WHOLE Body of Christ, the WHOLE of the "spiritual" Israel of God. :thumbsup: Every single one of us great or small has an impact on the whole, and in turn each member of the whole has a sacred obligation to every other member thereof in our individual obligation to the whole Body. God holds us together not only within ourselves but with one another in Him!! :bow:

This is also why the gifts come and go however. If God always healed everyone by the gifts, then no one would learn to use the faith He gives them for healing.WOW, thank you for this DKB, you have really given some strong food for thought here. At the very least this offers a plausible explanation for why we do not always readily see the Gifts manifest and strong among us. Yes. We must have times of not seeing if we bes intended to learn to walk truly by faith and not by sight. When we simply get whatever we wish all the time we become lazy, complacent, and unable to be touched by the pain and suffering of others -- which alone will make us useless in God's work, IMO.

Thanks for your post, Moriah found blessing in it.

[Hortysir]

Pray, and BELEIVE that you have received, and it will be given...

[JimfromOhio]

Subscribing :)

[map4]

Or should it say instead, perhaps, no FEELING of faith? Because it might very well have faith shoved down in there somewhere but simply be utterly incapable of feeling it or accessing it at the moment. Its feelings and entire sense of itself and its state of mind at that moment may be total doubt and despair. But faith does not come from Moriah nor any creature-in-flesh. Origin: Faith bes the gift of God, not of works, lest ANY should boast. Avenue: Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God. Therefore "whether you have faith or not" becomes something of a recursive question begging itself, because by this understanding, we must obviously at times "take it on faith" that yes, God has faithfully given us faith. NOT because we FEEL it, or FEEL we have it, but because His word plainly says so and states that we do. :P

Now daimonizomai has to laugh. :D Bes that not just like God, to make faith itself a matter of faith, wrapping it in itself recursively precisely SO we cannot trace or nail its origin anywhere but in/from HIM and that even for proper apprehension of the fact of it we must rely utterly upon Him? ^_^ Abba, Moriah just adores watching how You work!! You bes so incredibly clever!!! ^_^


Yes, Moriah...and the fact that you even ask/pray to begin with shows that the faith is there...even if it's teeny tiny...even if you can't feel it.
Praise God...He is good!

[Moriah_Conquering_Wind]

He must really love daimonizomai because He makes it want Him in spite of Satan.
That means He givesy faith yeah?
It really does like HIM (Jesus) better (Please God make Them be quiet PLEASE)

[Elijah2]

Faith also trusts our Lord Jesus Christ (Psa. 118:8).

Be blessed in Jesus' Name.