Thread for believers. The Ark and the Visitation.

[ContraMundum]

Friends,

A lot of people fail to see the Divinity of Yeshua in the incarnation. When one compares the Tanakh to the NT, it is clear that God continues to show us midrashically through types and shadows His Divine plan for the salvation of the world.

I'm hoping to use this thread to help believers have fresh insights and strengthen their faith to follow in God's holy ways.

After the Philistines captured the Ark in battle against Israel, God smote them, and in fear they returned it to Israel (1 Sam 5:1-6:12). Years later, David went to get the Ark back from Kiriath Jearim where it had remained during the reign of Saul. After Uzzah son of Abinadab was struck dead when he touched the ark (2 Sam 6:6,7), David was terrified and said, "How can the ark of the Lord ever come to me?" He left the ark at the house of Obed-Edom for three months. The story tell us that David danced and leapt in front of the ark and the people shouted with joy, and we are told that the house of Obed-Edom, where the ark resided, was blessed by God and then afterward David took the ark to Jerusalem (2 Sam. 6:9–14).

Compare the details of that story with the Visitation of Mary to the house of Elizabeth and Zechariah.

"In those days Mary arose and went with haste into the hill country, to a city of Judah, and she entered the house of Zechariah and greeted Elizabeth. And when Elizabeth heard the greeting of Mary, the babe leaped in her womb; and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit and she exclaimed with a loud cry (Gk. ecstatic and strong joy), "Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb! And why is this granted me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me? For behold, when the voice of your greeting came to my ears, the babe in my womb leaped for joy. And blessed is she who believed that there would be a fulfillment of what was spoken to her from the Lord" (Luke 1:39–45).

and later: "And Mary remained with her about three months and returned to her home." Luke 1:56


Mary and the Ark both went to the same Judean hill country. Elizabeth's greeting to Mary is parallel to David's in the presence of the Ark. David and the people leapt and danced before the Ark, just as John the Baptist did whilst in Elizabeth's womb in the presence of the pregnant Mary. The Ark remained in the house of Obed-Edom for three months; Mary remained in the house of Elizabeth and Zechariah for three months.

Furthermore, The ark was brought back after three months to its rightful place in Jerusalem, the very presence and glory of God in the temple (2 Sam. 6:12; 1 Ki. 8:9–11). Likewise, Mary went back to her home after three months but eventually had to go to Jerusalem, where she, according to the Law, presented her Son Yeshua, God's shekinah presence in the flesh incarnate, at the Temple (Luke 1:56; 2:21–22).

A great way to see the Divinity of Yeshua in the story. Mary is the Ark of the New Covenant.

[Ivy]

That is an absolutely *amazing parallel.

This is kind of a new teaching for me, but quite fascinating.

[Tishri1]

wonderful parallel:clap:

[Lulav]

I've heard this before, this was a Catholic teaching, not sure if it was here or another forum .

[ContraMundum]

I've heard this before, this was a Catholic teaching, not sure if it was here or another forum .

The only reason the Catholics would have it is because we all as Christians have access to the truth in scripture. :)

[SisterKatie]

ContraMundum.

You are right.. the Arch of the Covenant as a forshadowing "symbol" of Mariam of Nazareth is part of the traditional belief of the Catholic Church.
The tradition is so old there... of course the parallel has been discovered and the wisdom of God celebrated. The Word of God is full of such doors that open up infront of the soul in God's own time and place... ;)

I too thought it made total sense to me since the first time I heard it.
Its full of deep wisdom and I am happy you share it with the brethren on this forum too :-)

Shalom and the peace of Yeshua be with you.

[Lulav]

It is a good analogy, the problem I have with it , is it is used in defense of worshiping Mary, and thus for other things I find heretical, such as she was sinless, her parents were sinless, she is in heaven, she can be prayed to to speak to her son for us, etc.

She was a chosen vessel, just as Elizabeth was, we are all chosen vessels to do G-ds will if we choose to.

I have also read about the comparison of what was stored within the ark, to Yeshua ( not Mary)

The tablets with the word of G-d ( Yeshua is the word of G-d)


The pot containing manna ( Yeshua is the bread of life and the bread that came down from heaven)

The rod of Aaron which budded with almonds and blossoms and leaves, that which was death, came to life ( again another picture of Yeshua, although I am not sure they used that, that is just what is in my head) , I think they said about it being the one chosen to be High Priest and Yeshua is called our High Priest.

[SisterKatie]

I can't imagine how sad it must be to meet a person who calls him/herself Christian yet worships Mary. That's so sad.
I am blessed to never have met one such a person among all the brothers and sisters I have met, but if you have, then I understand why you are disturbed at that and I hope you corrected that strayed lamb because there is only One who is worthy of our worship and that is The Lord.:)

[Tishri1]

this is great analogy I like what you added too Lulav....about aarons rod:thumbsup:

[ContraMundum]

People can read too much into it- but nonetheless, it is still a true picture of Christ. As Christians, we are called to worship Christ, as he is God the Son. This d'rash is further proof that the authors of the NT could see God pointing to Yeshua's Divinity, and that they intended to teach His Divinity.

We shouldn't throw the baby out with the bathwater. We approach scripture Christocentrically, but we must all remember Mariam as a proto-Christian, a godly saint who was like an Ark for Yeshua while she had Him in her womb. She raised Him from infancy, suckled Him, clothed Him, fed Him and cared for Him all His life as a mother should. He cared for her from the Cross and by the Cross He gave her salvation, and in Heaven she has recieved her crown as all true believers will.

But, I have absolutely no doubt that the authors of scripture saw all these things about Mary, but bid us to focus on the Son, and this lesson from scripture is to point to Him, and in particular to His Divinity.

Good work ladies! :thumbsup:

[ContraMundum]

I can't imagine how sad it must be to meet a person who calls him/herself Christian yet worships Mary. That's so sad.
I am blessed to never have met one such a person among all the brothers and sisters I have met, but if you have, then I understand why you are disturbed at that and I hope you corrected that strayed lamb because there is only One who is worthy of our worship and that is The Lord.:)

Good words.

[SisterKatie]

This is a good post brother.. and it peacefully sums up crucial points in Christianity to which all believers agree. Also Mariam needed the Salvation. The Catholic and Orthodox theology teaches this of course. And Yeshua was fully God and fully Man.

I like the way you write :thumbsup:

[ContraMundum]

This is a good post brother.. and it peacefully sums up crucial points in Christianity to which all believers agree. Also Mariam needed the Salvation. The Catholic and Orthodox theology teaches this of course. And Yeshua was fully God and fully Man.

I like the way you write :thumbsup:

Mange tak. :)

[Ivy]

Also Mariam needed the Salvation. The Catholic and Orthodox theology teaches this of course.
I like the way you write :thumbsup:

I've been studying some of this stuff only a short time, so it just occurred to me to ask........some of the reading I've been doing states that Mary/Miriam was conceived without sin and led a sinless life......so what confuses me is, if she was sinless, what would salvation have done for her?

[ContraMundum]

I've been studying some of this stuff only a short time, so it just occurred to me to ask........some of the reading I've been doing states that Mary/Miriam was conceived without sin and led a sinless life......so what confuses me is, if she was sinless, what would salvation have done for her?

Can can be saved from something before you do it, not just after it. Like a person who stops you from walking off a cliff- they just saved you! :)

ANother example: I got saved from heroin addiction. By God's grace I've never touched the stuff.

[Ivy]

Cool :-) I've been saved from heroin addiction too, lol.

[Lulav]

Contra saidFriends,

A lot of people fail to see the Divinity of Yeshua in the incarnation. When one compares the Tanakh to the NT, it is clear that God continues to show us midrashically through types and shadows His Divine plan for the salvation of the world.

I'm hoping to use this thread to help believers have fresh insights and strengthen their faith to follow in God's holy ways.

After the Philistines captured the Ark in battle against Israel, God smote them, and in fear they returned it to Israel (1 Sam 5:1-6:12). Years later, David went to get the Ark back from Kiriath Jearim where it had remained during the reign of Saul. After Uzzah son of Abinadab was struck dead when he touched the ark (2 Sam 6:6,7), David was terrified and said, "How can the ark of the Lord ever come to me?" He left the ark at the house of Obed-Edom for three months. The story tell us that David danced and leapt in front of the ark and the people shouted with joy, and we are told that the house of Obed-Edom, where the ark resided, was blessed by God and then afterward David took the ark to Jerusalem (2 Sam. 6:9–14).

Compare the details of that story with the Visitation of Mary to the house of Elizabeth and Zechariah.

"In those days Mary arose and went with haste into the hill country, to a city of Judah, and she entered the house of Zechariah and greeted Elizabeth. And when Elizabeth heard the greeting of Mary, the babe leaped in her womb; and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit and she exclaimed with a loud cry (Gk. ecstatic and strong joy), "Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb! And why is this granted me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me? For behold, when the voice of your greeting came to my ears, the babe in my womb leaped for joy. And blessed is she who believed that there would be a fulfillment of what was spoken to her from the Lord" (Luke 1:39–45).

and later: "And Mary remained with her about three months and returned to her home." Luke 1:56


Mary and the Ark both went to the same Judean hill country. Elizabeth's greeting to Mary is parallel to David's in the presence of the Ark. David and the people leapt and danced before the Ark, just as John the Baptist did whilst in Elizabeth's womb in the presence of the pregnant Mary. The Ark remained in the house of Obed-Edom for three months; Mary remained in the house of Elizabeth and Zechariah for three months.

Furthermore, The ark was brought back after three months to its rightful place in Jerusalem, the very presence and glory of God in the temple (2 Sam. 6:12; 1 Ki. 8:9–11). Likewise, Mary went back to her home after three months but eventually had to go to Jerusalem, where she, according to the Law, presented her Son Yeshua, God's shekinah presence in the flesh incarnate, at the Temple (Luke 1:56; 2:21–22).

A great way to see the Divinity of Yeshua in the story. Mary is the Ark of the New Covenant.

Contra, Like I said before, good analogy, but how does this show the divinity of Yeshua? I don't get that correlation.

[ContraMundum]

Contra said

Contra, Like I said before, good analogy, but how does this show the divinity of Yeshua? I don't get that correlation.

What or who was in the Ark?

[SisterKatie]

Mange tak. :)

Det var så lidt! :wave: Er du dansker ?
Gud velsigne dig ...

[ContraMundum]

Det var så lidt! :wave: Er du dansker ?
Gud velsigne dig ...

Nej.....jag är inte dansk, men jag har läst en lite dansk när jag här last svenska. Jag har en intresse om dansk historie och kultur ju. Tänkte jag att det skall bli rolig at skriv till dig i dansk. :thumbsup:

[SisterKatie]

Nej.....jag är inte dansk, men jag har läst en lite dansk när jag här last svenska. Jag har en intresse om dansk historie och kultur ju. Tänkte jag att det skall bli rolig at skriv till dig i dansk. :thumbsup:

You know Swedish? Or you live in Sweden? Why did you study Swedish?

[ContraMundum]

You know Swedish? Or you live in Sweden? Why did you study Swedish?

Nej nej, bor jag i Australien, och studerade jag svenska som en elektiv för min theologi grad. Läst jag också språker om Bibeln och latin. Har jag en intresse om kyrkohistorie och theologi om skandinavien. Jag veta inte varför. :cool: