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k4c
27th April 2008, 10:11 AM
The New Covenant that God makes with His people through Jesus is that He will not remember our past sins and He will write His law on our hearts.

Hebrews 8:10-12 "For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel: After those days,'' says the Lord, "I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. "None of them shall teach his neighbor, and none his brother, saying, `Know the Lord,' for all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them. "For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more.''

How God writes His law on our hearts is through understanding His grace.

The grace of God tells us that God is not giving us what we deserve as sinners.

God's grace tells us that even while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

The arms of God are open through Jesus Christ to receive us into His family just as the father of the parodical did.

God is telling us, through the New Covenant, to come to Him just as we are.

He is telling us there is no condemnation in Christ for our past.

Once we accept the offer He now fills us with His love.

Romans 5:5 Now hope does not disappoint, because the love of God has been poured out in our hearts by the Holy Spirit who was given to us.

Its this love that writes the law of God on our hearts. In other words, we don't keep the law to be saved nor do we keep it to be acceptable to God for He has already accepted us in Christ.

We keep the law because we love God and have been empowered with a desire to do what pleases Him.

Hebrews 13:20-21 Now may the God of peace who brought up our Lord Jesus from the dead, that great Shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant, make you complete in every good work to do His will, working in you what is well pleasing in His sight, through Jesus Christ, to whom be glory forever and ever. Amen.

The power of a loving and grateful heart is the power behind all that we do for God and the fruit of God's saving work.

The law under the New Covenant is not a means to salvation nor a means to be made righteous because Christ is our righteousness and our salvation for all those who believe.

Romans 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

There are ceratin traits that will manifest within those who are being saved. Matthew 5 gives us a beautiful picture of the new character of those who God is saving.

Matthew 5:3-12 "Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Blessed are those who mourn, for they shall be comforted. Blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the earth. Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they shall be filled. Blessed are the merciful, for they shall obtain mercy. Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God. Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God. Blessed are those who are persecuted for righteousness' sake, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. "Blessed are you when they revile and persecute you, and say all kinds of evil against you falsely for My sake. "Rejoice and be exceedingly glad, for great is your reward in heaven, for so they persecuted the prophets who were before you.

When you hunger and thirst for righteousness you won't look for ways around righteousness, but rather, we will seek it and make it our life as one hungers and thirsts for it.

1 John 3:1-10 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not. Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure. Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin. Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him. Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

All this is all an inward work of God's saving power through a new birth, not an outward work of man to be made right with God.

With all this in mind, we have to understand that we can't make anyone keep the commandments for keeping the commandments is the fruit of a new birth and a love for God. To make someone keep the commandments before they have the relationship is like putting the cart before the horse. It just won't work...

Just thought I would share...

TrustAndObey
27th April 2008, 10:23 AM
I never thought I'd say it, but I can't control it....

AMEN K4C!!!!

Very well said my friend.

k4c
27th April 2008, 10:58 AM
I never thought I'd say it, but I can't control it....

AMEN K4C!!!!

Very well said my friend.

I am slowly coming to realize that the seventh day has been blessed and set apart by God even before sin was in the world and had nothing to do with the law on stone. In like manner marriage was blessed and set apart by God even before sin was in the world.

As time moved forward, laws had to be brought to light to govern these two creations of God because fallen man slowly began to forget God in their thoughts. Now we now that all life styles begin with the through first so the result of fallen man forgetting God in their thoughts manifest in how they were living.

The law on stone was given not because man was obedient, but rather, because man was disobedient. Keeping the law on stone cannot make a sinner right and was not meant to make a sinner right. It would be like getting a speeding ticket and telling the judge that you won't speed anymore. The judge will say, "That's fine but what about the ticket you have now?" Keeping the speed limit after you get the ticket does not make void the ticket you already have.

Since the fourth commandment was part of the law on stone and the law on stone was given because of disobedience tells me that they were not obeying it prior to it being written on stone. This also tells me that one can't be guilty of not obeying something that was not first made known to them prior.

So what does God say in the New Covenant?

I will remember your sins no more and I will write my law on your mind and heart.

The New Covenant is our chance for amnesty...

AMNESTY
1.a general pardon for offenses, esp. political offenses, against a government, often granted before any trial or conviction.

2.Law. an act of forgiveness for past offenses, esp. to a class of persons as a whole.

3.a forgetting or overlooking of any past offense.

4.to grant amnesty to; pardon.

TrustAndObey
27th April 2008, 11:07 AM
I disagree, but just a little...

Here's where I disagree...

The law written on stone wasn't "added" because of disobedience...breaking the law on stone WAS disobedience even before it was written.

Sin is transgression of the law, and the laws for atonement of sin were added as a result of the continued disobedience to God's will.

For righteousness, God's people had to shed blood when they disobeyed.

What MADE/MAKES a person a sinner has never changed.

Christ's death on the cross didn't make something holy, unholy. Just like it didn't make anything unholy, holy.

The only exception is the PEOPLE that accept the gift of His blood/sacrifice. We can be cleansed of ALL unrighteousness if we confess our sins. Then they are covered in His blood....atoned.

TrustAndObey
27th April 2008, 11:19 AM
I don't think I was very clear in that last post.

We are unholy people. Christ's death on the cross DID change that if we atone for sin through HIS righteousness.

But His death on the cross didn't make God's holy day unholy. It didn't make murder, an unholy thing, holy.

I hope that was clearer. :)

k4c
27th April 2008, 12:54 PM
I disagree, but just a little...

Here's where I disagree...

The law written on stone wasn't "added" because of disobedience...breaking the law on stone WAS disobedience even before it was written.

Sin is transgression of the law, and the laws for atonement of sin were added as a result of the continued disobedience to God's will.

For righteousness, God's people had to shed blood when they disobeyed.

What MADE/MAKES a person a sinner has never changed.

Christ's death on the cross didn't make something holy, unholy. Just like it didn't make anything unholy, holy.

The only exception is the PEOPLE that accept the gift of His blood/sacrifice. We can be cleansed of ALL unrighteousness if we confess our sins. Then they are covered in His blood....atoned.

We are both saying the same thing. The law on stone was added because of disobedience, also known as, transgression.

Galatians 3:19 What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions...

Breaking the law of God was being done before the law on stone was given or else why say it was given because of transgression?

Cain broke the law of God before the law was given at Mt.Sinai. The sin of adultery was punished before the law on stone was given.

If breaking the law on stone was sin prior to the law on stone then breaking the law on stone is sin after the law on stone. That's what I'm sayng...:thumbsup:

TrustAndObey
27th April 2008, 01:41 PM
So you think "added" as in put in plain sight for everybody to see, gotcha!

Yep, then we agree!

k4c
27th April 2008, 02:07 PM
So you think "added" as in put in plain sight for everybody to see, gotcha!

Yep, then we agree!

In plain sight is a much better way to put it...:preach:

TrustAndObey
27th April 2008, 03:24 PM
I like the music in this one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5yAV0M3C8s&feature=related

PROPHECYKID
28th April 2008, 05:55 PM
The New Covenant that God makes with His people through Jesus is that He will not remember our past sins and He will write His law on our hearts.

Hebrews 8:10-12 "For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel: After those days,'' says the Lord, "I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. "None of them shall teach his neighbor, and none his brother, saying, `Know the Lord,' for all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them. "For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more.''

How God writes His law on our hearts is through understanding His grace.

The grace of God tells us that God is not giving us what we deserve as sinners.

God's grace tells us that even while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

The arms of God are open through Jesus Christ to receive us into His family just as the father of the parodical did.

God is telling us, through the New Covenant, to come to Him just as we are.

He is telling us there is no condemnation in Christ for our past.

Once we accept the offer He now fills us with His love.

Romans 5:5 Now hope does not disappoint, because the love of God has been poured out in our hearts by the Holy Spirit who was given to us.

Its this love that writes the law of God on our hearts. In other words, we don't keep the law to be saved nor do we keep it to be acceptable to God for He has already accepted us in Christ.

We keep the law because we love God and have been empowered with a desire to do what pleases Him.

Hebrews 13:20-21 Now may the God of peace who brought up our Lord Jesus from the dead, that great Shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant, make you complete in every good work to do His will, working in you what is well pleasing in His sight, through Jesus Christ, to whom be glory forever and ever. Amen.

The power of a loving and grateful heart is the power behind all that we do for God and the fruit of God's saving work.

The law under the New Covenant is not a means to salvation nor a means to be made righteous because Christ is our righteousness and our salvation for all those who believe.

Romans 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

There are ceratin traits that will manifest within those who are being saved. Matthew 5 gives us a beautiful picture of the new character of those who God is saving.

Matthew 5:3-12 "Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Blessed are those who mourn, for they shall be comforted. Blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the earth. Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they shall be filled. Blessed are the merciful, for they shall obtain mercy. Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God. Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God. Blessed are those who are persecuted for righteousness' sake, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. "Blessed are you when they revile and persecute you, and say all kinds of evil against you falsely for My sake. "Rejoice and be exceedingly glad, for great is your reward in heaven, for so they persecuted the prophets who were before you.

When you hunger and thirst for righteousness you won't look for ways around righteousness, but rather, we will seek it and make it our life as one hungers and thirsts for it.

1 John 3:1-10 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not. Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure. Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin. Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him. Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

All this is all an inward work of God's saving power through a new birth, not an outward work of man to be made right with God.

With all this in mind, we have to understand that we can't make anyone keep the commandments for keeping the commandments is the fruit of a new birth and a love for God. To make someone keep the commandments before they have the relationship is like putting the cart before the horse. It just won't work...

Just thought I would share...


I never gave up on you because I knew that you would come around. You have always impressed me even when I did not agree with you. Its good to have you standing up for the Law. So can i give my input. Yes i will. I lean more toward the thought that the laws of atonement of sin was added because of transgression. But I do understand where you are coming from K4c thus i cannot say that you are wrong. What you said was right. In fact when I think of it both were added because of transgression. One to atone and one for a reminder.

So is it that we have to choose one or can't it be both.

reddogs
29th April 2008, 09:03 AM
I have moved this thread to the more appropriate Discussion and Debate (http://christianforums.com/f841-discussion-and-debate.html)
Sub-forum for discussion and debate.


Red
Seventh-Day Adventist Forum Moderator