Other Life Forms - Real Aliens?

[Nadiine]

I've heard a few Christians claiming that other life forms were created by God when He created "the worlds" (plural). That aliens are very real.

Any thoughts about this?
My personal opinion has always been that any 'aliens' (if something exists) are actually from the demonic realms above.

[desmalia]

Well I'm a sci-fi geek, so I love stories about aliens.
But I'm not inclined to believe there is intelligent life "out there". Now I am not going to say that it's just because the Bible doesn't mention them. That's right up there with the whole "Bible doesn't mention cats, so they must not be real, etc." nonsense. However, when we look at the whole of Scripture and God's purpose for the universe and mankind, it doesn't seem to fit that he also created other civilizations on distant planets. Is it impossible? Well no, certainly not impossible for God! But I think highly unlikely as it just doesn't seem to fit with His plan for this existence.

[Cris413]

Does this mean that the planet as we know it was NOT created by a space ship of alien engineers sent here by God to give life to a lifeless planet?

Sorry...I just couldn't let that one go...:blush:

I will probably remember that comment...until my brain officially turns to mush...:sorry:

[Artificial Intelligence]

Actually, ST:TNG cannon proclaims that mankind was seeded by alien races, that we along with the Vulcans, Romulans, Cardasians, Kingons etc… were planted here by a single alien race that left clues of its origin (S:6 E:20 “The Chase”)


Oh wait, someone said “sci-fi geek” LOL
B5 is better though…

“Aliens” are Nephilim imo, the ones we know of in our modern times, the ones that were once giants as Goliath was but now maybe looking different for our modern times. There are no “Aliens“ like in sci-fi story themes. Yes, God is capable of creating them, but He simply didn’t. He could have, it would not have been evil to do so or anything like that, and not evil to make sci-fi stories about - in a what-if sense, and apart from teaching such lies like evolution, but in reality Aliens just don’t fit. Problem being that the fall of Adam effected all creation, and ‘all creation groans‘, thus “aliens” would have been effected for the fall of life on another planet (us), and not knowing why etc, nor having a way to atone for it. Or in turn, we could be effected by some crazy alien world effecting all things in this realm of existence.

No, the universe isn’t one big waste of space, it all testifies to the glory of God, as we should.

[Nadiine]

Does this mean that the planet as we know it was NOT created by a space ship of alien engineers sent here by God to give life to a lifeless planet?

Sorry...I just couldn't let that one go...:blush:

I will probably remember that comment...until my brain officially turns to mush...:sorry:
:P :P

Well I'm a sci-fi geek, so I love stories about aliens.
But I'm not inclined to believe there is intelligent life "out there". Now I am not going to say that it's just because the Bible doesn't mention them. That's right up there with the whole "Bible doesn't mention cats, so they must not be real, etc." nonsense. However, when we look at the whole of Scripture and God's purpose for the universe and mankind, it doesn't seem to fit that he also created other civilizations on distant planets. Is it impossible? Well no, certainly not impossible for God! But I think highly unlikely as it just doesn't seem to fit with His plan for this existence.
I lean towards Sci Fi stuff too - lots of possibilities with it all.

I don't know why these Christians were saying that God's creation of "the worlds" would mean there are other living creations made in other galaxies.
I would think that if other living beings were involved in life as we know it, that the Bible would somehow tell us about them in some way.

Would they have a bible as well & have a moral code? I'd think they would have to...

I just thought this pastor sounded off the wall when he taught it. (he also taught there was no hell either....)

[desmalia]

Totally agree, you guys. LOL, I guess this isn't turning into much of a debate.

AI, that's so true about sci-fi shows. They are a lot of fun to watch, but it's unfortunate how many lies they try to pass off as "the norm" and also how often they portray Christians as crazy mindless religious fanatics.

I've heard so many people rave about B5 that I finally decided to see it. So far I've only seen the pilot and second episode. Looks promising...

[Artificial Intelligence]

I've heard so many people rave about B5 that I finally decided to see it. So far I've only seen the pilot and second episode. Looks promising...Captivating story, especially season 3-4 with the shadow wars. No direct assaults against Christian ideas, though it does have a bit of new-age type ideas as part of the story. There are a few points in the series where Christianity is mentioned and in a positive way. The series creator isn't Christian, but he doesn't make direct assaults against Christianity in his work. It's not created to re-engineer society either, you know much like ST tends to do by reflecting on issues of the day, mostly in the early series. Z'ha'dum probably being my favorite episode which concludes into season 4 premier with The Hour of the Wolf. My three favorite characters are probably Garibaldi, Londo and Sheridan. Couple other notable characters are G'Kar and then Galen the technomage.

[Artificial Intelligence]

Hey, anyone notice how the bad guys in Battlestar Galactica (new series) are monotheistic while the good guys are pantheistic? The bad guys use a lot of Christian symbolism, such as how they pray and such, quit a few direct and indirect nuances I have noticed in the series with the bad guys and their monotheism in comparison to Christianity. ummm and they are made out to be the bad guys…
The series is really well made, but bleh it eats me up at times about this, almost makes me want to root for the bad guys (the Cylons).

I think why a lot more people accept aliens is because it’s in popular entertainment now, and a good deal of it does make it out as though you are a fool if you don’t believe in aliens. Much like that movie Contact, one of the more blatant “you are a fool for not believing it” movies.

[Nadiine]

Totally agree, you guys. LOL, I guess this isn't turning into much of a debate.

AI, that's so true about sci-fi shows. They are a lot of fun to watch, but it's unfortunate how many lies they try to pass off as "the norm" and also how often they portray Christians as crazy mindless religious fanatics.

I've heard so many people rave about B5 that I finally decided to see it. So far I've only seen the pilot and second episode. Looks promising...
:wave: I wasn't really looking to have a disagreement type of debate on it in this section lol - I more wanted to understand what they were using to support it. Or some views on it, if it could be something God has done etc.

Since we don't have that here, let's talk about the Sci Fi Channel. LOL^_^
I don't watch any of those types of series shows on it, I watch the movies - like Cabin Fever with flesh eating disease. rofl:help: :tutu: :swoon:

[Artificial Intelligence]

Hah! I’m more of the opposite, I watch series and less TV movies. Right now I’m watching BSG, Enterprise, Jericho, SG:Atlantis, and ST: DS9... well I was watching DS9 on Spike but I think they just canceled it last week. I usually watch Firefly when that runs on sci-fi as a special. Occasionally catch a ST original now and then. I’m sorry, but made for TV movies on Sci-fi channel are… B-movie cheesy lol. The Dune mini-series was good. I’m looking forward to the Star Wars tv series coming up here soon :)

[Nadiine]

Hah! I’m more of the opposite, I watch series and less TV movies. Right now I’m watching BSG, Enterprise, Jericho, SG:Atlantis, and ST: DS9... well I was watching DS9 on Spike but I think they just canceled it last week. I usually watch Firefly when that runs on sci-fi as a special. Occasionally catch a ST original now and then. I’m sorry, but made for TV movies on Sci-fi channel are… B-movie cheesy lol. The Dune mini-series was good. I’m looking forward to the Star Wars tv series coming up here soon :)
oh there is no doubt that their made for tv flix on Sci Fi are B Movie CHEEZE...... :doh: :(
I don't watch those lol (if I do, I don't watch them for long or it's on becuz nothing else is on and I'm busy on the computer here not caring what's playing in the background).
Oh they're just BAD. lolol

But i'm not into any of the series things whatsoever; esp. on Sci Fi. The only series I watch is Dexter which CBS is playing reruns of Sunday nites.

[desmalia]

Captivating story, especially season 3-4 with the shadow wars. No direct assaults against Christian ideas, though it does have a bit of new-age type ideas as part of the story. There are a few points in the series where Christianity is mentioned and in a positive way. The series creator isn't Christian, but he doesn't make direct assaults against Christianity in his work. It's not created to re-engineer society either, you know much like ST tends to do by reflecting on issues of the day, mostly in the early series. Z'ha'dum probably being my favorite episode which concludes into season 4 premier with The Hour of the Wolf. My three favorite characters are probably Garibaldi, Londo and Sheridan. Couple other notable characters are G'Kar and then Galen the technomage.Cool, thanks for the overview. Looking forward to seeing more. :)

Hey, anyone notice how the bad guys in Battlestar Galactica (new series) are monotheistic while the good guys are pantheistic? The bad guys use a lot of Christian symbolism, such as how they pray and such, quit a few direct and indirect nuances I have noticed in the series with the bad guys and their monotheism in comparison to Christianity. ummm and they are made out to be the bad guys…
The series is really well made, but bleh it eats me up at times about this, almost makes me want to root for the bad guys (the Cylons). I've seen that show a few times and yes I agree, that's exactly what they're doing. It's also sooooooooooo soapy! It's interesting to see what they've done with the show since the original was created to somewhat represent Mormonism. It used to be the god-fearing vs. technology. Now it's the "evolved" vs. the crazy, evil mono-theists. I don't think I'll ever get into that show.

I think why a lot more people accept aliens is because it’s in popular entertainment now, and a good deal of it does make it out as though you are a fool if you don’t believe in aliens. Much like that movie Contact, one of the more blatant “you are a fool for not believing it” movies.Yep.

I wasn't really looking to have a disagreement type of debate on it in this section lol - I more wanted to understand what they were using to support it. Or some views on it, if it could be something God has done etc.

Since we don't have that here, let's talk about the Sci Fi Channel. LOL
I don't watch any of those types of series shows on it, I watch the movies - like Cabin Fever with flesh eating disease. rofl:help: :tutu: :swoon:Hehe, well that's one way to get me talkin... mention sci-fi shows! lol

I've watched most of the ST shows. TNG was probably my favourite of them, though as AI mentioned, there were quite a few new age ideas promoted there. Currently I'm catching up on a lot of SG-1 shows that I've missed over the years. I watch Atlantis occasionally too. I love sci-fi that has complicated story arcs and lots of dry humour. My favourite sci-fi show of all time (we'll see if B5 beats it, lol!), is Farscape. It was trashy at times, unfortunately, but the animitronic characters were absolutely incredible, and the stories were very unique compared to most sci-fi series. Where else can you find a slug-like alien that is arrogant and selfish, yet loyal, and farts helium? lol. I watched Smallville for the first few seasons, but then it got into witchcraft, so I stopped watching. Eventually it got away from that stuff and now I'm starting to catch it again now and then. Plus, my nephew had a little appearance in an ep earlier this season. That was fun to see! Lots of the big sci-fi shows film in BC, and it's fun to come across the taping now and then.

As for sci-fi movies... well I like some. I can't watch anything too freaky because I get nightmares really easily. :blush:

But I really enjoyed Signs. And the first MIB was lots of fun. There are lots of others I've enjoyed, though most aren't specifically alien movies. One to avoid at ALL costs is The Island. Wow, was that bad! lol

[BGMCFAR]

:wave: I wasn't really looking to have a disagreement type of debate on it in this section lol - I more wanted to understand what they were using to support it. Or some views on it, if it could be something God has done etc.

Since we don't have that here, let's talk about the Sci Fi Channel. LOL^_^
I don't watch any of those types of series shows on it, I watch the movies - like Cabin Fever with flesh eating disease. rofl:help: :tutu: :swoon:
HEy I believ that with God all things are possiable I believe there people on other planets not in our solar system Do I think they exist certainly and I believe they created in the image of God as we are and I think someday when I get to heaven I'm going to travel to these planets

[Artificial Intelligence]

HEy I believ that with God all things are possiable I believe there people on other planets not in our solar system Do I think they exist certainly and I believe they created in the image of God as we are and I think someday when I get to heaven I'm going to travel to these planetsUmmm then you can see the impact of sin from one man upon them ;)

Alien dude: And there I was walking through the garden…
BGMCFAR: uh-huh?
Alien dude: … just minding my own business..
BGMCFAR: Yeah, uh-huh?
Alien dude: and allll of the sudden BAM everything was corrupted! (see Romans 8:22)
BGMCFAR: Whaaaaa…?!
Alien dude: Yeah! Then my wife died! We didn’t even know what to make of her stillness or what to call it!
BGMCFAR: What? But everything dies…
Alien dude: No! everything was perfect! There was no death, then suddenly for some reason everything went haywire!
GGMCFAR: Well what did you do to cause that to happen?
Alien dude: That’s just it, we have no idea, it was just another day on my planet, nothing out of the ordinary… then BAM!

[GregorytheGood]

Interesting stuff! I like some sci-fi myself (mostly old school stuff like StarTrek TNG). Well, that pastor wasn't alone; there are other theologians throughout history who have held that there are an infinite number of inhabited worlds. One is Emmanuel Swedenborg, but he did believe in Hell in a sense (-not the same as the usual beliefs).
I took a course on the Book of Genesis and Genesis has some REALLY far out stuff in it. Actually there are two forms of God used in Genesis; one is Yaweh, and the other is Elohim. Elohim is actually PLURAL, referring to numerous gods, which is interesting. -But there is a passage about a time when gods came down and had relations with human women, producing a race of giants that walked the Earth. ...Like I said, pretty crazy!
To me, personally, it has always made sense that the universe is full of much more than the sum of everything we can imagine. Many scientists confirm that our planet and its sun are not anomallies in the milky way galaxy. -and there are countless other galaxies. To quote the movie "contact," if only one out of a billion stars like ours had planets, and only one out of a billion of those had a planet able to support life, then our galaxy alone would contain millions of inhabited planets. -or something like that.
anyhow, I haven't found any direct reference to life on other planets in the Bible, BUT Jesus does say some things that are extremely vague and could possibly be interpreted as suggesting it. Such as John 10:17, "For this reason the Father loves Me, because I lay down My life so that I may take it again" (it almost sounds as if He does this repeatedly) ...and John 10:16 just before it; "And I have other sheep which are not of this field: I will be their guide in the same way, and they will give ear to my voice, so there will be one flock and one keeper."
...So, in my opinion, it is certainly possible. However, we should probably focus on what's happening on this planet.
PEACE

[Artificial Intelligence]

@Greg
1 Peter 3:18 For Christ also suffered once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit

Only once, and then it was finished. Christ has that body for all eternity, none other.

As for the "other sheep", he was talking to the Jews. He was speaking to the Jews of the mystery that is the gentile Church to come, which was to be revealed as the other sheep. Not aliens...

If you want to find "the Church" in the gospels, you need to read the fifth gospel of the bible, which is the book of Acts. The book of Acts is the gospel written to the Church, the other four are gospels interactively given to the Jews. We benefit from them, but the context is being delivered to the Jew, first.

[GregorytheGood]

Well, you bring up a whole 'nother can of worms that is PAUL. As a student of Christian Origins and History Paul brings a whole lot of problems. Is Paul the "13th Apostle" or is Paul "the deciever," "the corruptor," and "the betrayer. These loving titles were all ascribed to Paul by significant Early Church communities prior to the 4th century. His theological view, and interpretation of the OT, doesn't seem to allign completely with that of Jesus, the Apostles, the Early Church, or even the Hebrew Prophets.
Now, I'm not saying that I think that this in necessarily what Jesus meant, and I thank you for pointing out the "once" verse, which I actually did not recall. I am just pointing out that in John, it seems to me, like a more cosmic, out there Jesus. Maybe that's why John isn't so popular.
Don't forget, there is also the matter of Jewish reincarnation which most Christians purposefully IGNORE, and the fact that Jesus calls himself Adam, and says that John the Baptist is, in fact, Elijah. Since we were on a sort of far out topic, I thought I'd bring this up.
Anyhow, if you look at what we can see of the galaxy, with its countless suns, and the universe ...it seems insane to assume that little earth is the only source of intelligent life. Let's not underestimate the grandiosity of the Universe, God's Creation.

[Artificial Intelligence]

Wow, I know exactly what you are talking about and it would take me five hours to write up a post to cover every point of it. I hope you really don’t take all that stuff to heart, because it is fully new-age, Gnostic, and Jewish mysticism all rolled up into one paragraph. That stuff will only lead you astray from any truth, and is all well defended from by standing on the record of scripture. As Chuck Smith says it, ‘one can come up with anything from the bible and generally be ok, but once one goes outside the bible to get their truth, that is where they get into real trouble.’.

[GregorytheGood]

To sum up, I think its very important to study what Jesus' interpretation of the Torah and the Prophets was. I actually wasn't referring to any non-canonical scriptures, although there are many very important texts that weren't canonized such as the Didache which aren't "gnostic" in any way.

[Artificial Intelligence]

Yes, the words of Jesus are important, but so are the words of Paul. You see, Paul wasn’t speaking on his own behalf, but wrote the things that God moved him to write. This is how the prophets operated as well. Nothing that is written by Paul or the Prophets conflict with what Jesus said, because it was Jesus that dictated to them what to write. So if you conduct your studies of the bible systematically, you will notice that all such passages flow together in unity with the same message and purpose. Such as ideas of reincarnation are out of step with what the bible teaches systematically, as many strange ideas that are built off of a single verse which often have no context to the passage and tend to be taken contrary to what the rest of scripture teaches.

[sthatting]

I've heard a few Christians claiming that other life forms were created by God when He created "the worlds" (plural). That aliens are very real.

Any thoughts about this?
My personal opinion has always been that any 'aliens' (if something exists) are actually from the demonic realms above.

Well, when I was real young, my brother and I were doing some star-gazing and found this hovering thingy emitting a light red light. My brother described it as some kind of disk like looking thing because as soon as I looked into the telescope to see, it had disappeared. It wasn't like a plane either. It went super fast... like sonic speed.

Ever since then, I've always believed we were not alone. This is somewhat relieving and yet somewhat spooky too.

[Artificial Intelligence]

Well I don’t believe we are alone either, there is God, the Angels, the demons and mankind. Not very alone. In fact, I believe these flying objects are described in the bible, they serve a use for those that have access to them. Certainly if God and the angels exist, which they do, then they can make things that are not necessarily used or created by man. There are even many things that eye has not seen nor entered into the heart of man, that one day I shall see and comprehend, and maybe even use. These flying objects are just something along those lines, but have been kept out of our reach since they are not intended for man to use, unless we make our own.

Here is one of the passages I’m referring to, heh I created the models and rendered it all for fun some time ago.
http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n159/l33tace/Ezekielwheel.jpg

[sthatting]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azjP1Aw6NBw&feature=related

[GregorytheGood]

I agree that the words of Paul are potentially important. Yet, there is question. Anyone can have "visions" of Jesus, and he WAS known as "the deciever," and "the corruptor." Also, John the Baptist called himself the last Prophet before the Final Judgement, so that raises some questions as to the validity of Paul.

I agree with you on reincarnation. Making something out of one or two verses that isn't intended is a real risk. I would never affirm that these verses preach any sort of reincarnation theology. It is simply that John the Baptist said that he was Elijah returned. -And that Jesus said this also. And there is a type of reincarnation (not like the hindu) that is confirmed and acknowledged in the Old Testament by Jewish religious authorities; it is where a spirit returns, such as the case with John the Baptist and Jesus, who says he is Adam. This does not promote, however, any general theory of reincarnation.

I was just trying to point out how, given these scriptural facts, a reading of John opens itself up more freely to various interpretations, as it is much more vague and ethereal in nature than the other Gospels.

[GregorytheGood]

Sthatting, that NASA UFO video is FASCINATING! Very Cool - where did you find it?

Thank you.

[GregorytheGood]

Although, my question is this: why do the "objects" never change direction or speed? This makes me think that it must be debris caught in magnification on camera. Also, the response of the crew and Houston seems very mundane and methodical -its not like they're saying "holy crap -what are those objects?" I wasn't sure, but I never saw any of the object going distinctly "behind" the tether. It seemed like they coul all have theoretically been in front of the tether.

Still, cool video!

[sthatting]

Although, my question is this: why do the "objects" never change direction or speed? This makes me think that it must be debris caught in magnification on camera. Also, the response of the crew and Houston seems very mundane and methodical -its not like they're saying "holy crap -what are those objects?" I wasn't sure, but I never saw any of the object going distinctly "behind" the tether. It seemed like they coul all have theoretically been in front of the tether.

Still, cool video!

Did you know that NASA tracks space debris? It wouldn't make much sense to ask what it is if they were already tracking it since it was so close to the Earth's atmosphere. And I'm sure when you've worked in NASA long enough, you've probably seen a LOT of strange things.

I found it on Youtube. I just searched "aliens." There are a lot of them there, but some of them use language that wouldn't be appropriate for CF. Happy hunting!

[Nadiine]

Well, you bring up a whole 'nother can of worms that is PAUL. As a student of Christian Origins and History Paul brings a whole lot of problems. Is Paul the "13th Apostle" or is Paul "the deciever," "the corruptor," and "the betrayer. These loving titles were all ascribed to Paul by significant Early Church communities prior to the 4th century. His theological view, and interpretation of the OT, doesn't seem to allign completely with that of Jesus, the Apostles, the Early Church, or even the Hebrew Prophets.
Now, I'm not saying that I think that this in necessarily what Jesus meant, and I thank you for pointing out the "once" verse, which I actually did not recall. I am just pointing out that in John, it seems to me, like a more cosmic, out there Jesus. Maybe that's why John isn't so popular.
Don't forget, there is also the matter of Jewish reincarnation which most Christians purposefully IGNORE, and the fact that Jesus calls himself Adam, and says that John the Baptist is, in fact, Elijah. Since we were on a sort of far out topic, I thought I'd bring this up.
Anyhow, if you look at what we can see of the galaxy, with its countless suns, and the universe ...it seems insane to assume that little earth is the only source of intelligent life. Let's not underestimate the grandiosity of the Universe, God's Creation.
Actually, without Paul, the NT would be a bigger problem! Namely, you'de be acting by works of the law instead of grace which Paul hammered home repeatedly - Paul brings the balance to James' teaching on faith without works is dead.
Paul is the central author of the NT who's teachings are CRUCIAL in teaching the changes due to Christ's sacrifice on the cross - and our standing with Him... take out Paul & you have very little to go on as far as important details on Christ.

Lastly, Peter, who walked with Christ in person, affirms Paul as an apostle sent by God. 2 Peter 3:15-16
...as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you,
16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

The minute you tamper with the canonization of Paul, the house of cards fall and you end up having to remove other NT authors/disciples who backed him as an authentic apostle of God which leaves you with even less of the NT as viable truth.

Paul is pivitol to the Bible and Christianity.

*Reincarnation*?
Jesus used Adam as a "type" (symbology for better understanding).
Adam brought sin to the whole world. In likeness, Christ brought salvation to the whole world thru His death and resurrection.
Adam brought DEATH - Christ brought LIFE.

God made salvation available to all thru 1 man, just as sin was brought to all thru 1 man (Adam) in contrast.

That is not literal reincarnation, it's a "type or symbolism" of the 2 actions brought thru 2 people which are in sharp contrast with one another.

[GregorytheGood]

The Gospels and the Book of James, (in addition to the Torah and the works of the latter Prophets,) STAND ALONE. Paul has some valuable ideas, insights, and theological viewpoints, but I would never base a belief structure off of his. My faith is within my heart and cannot be shaken with or without anything that is written on paper.
That's an interesting idea about the "type symbolism" and contrast.