Question

[mjterry87]

I have been thinking about this for a while, and have actully done a lot of reasearch in the bible for it. Where does it say (in the B'rit Hadasha) that you should not follow the 613 laws given to Moses by G-D, that you should not celebrate the Jewish holidays which G-D commands us to celebrate, and not to eat unpure food, plus live unholy? Because Christians dont follow any of it. I mean it just amazes me ever since I discovered MJ how Christians ignore the word of G-D and Yeshua! If you read Matthew 5:17 it say that Yeshua did not come to make the commandments of the profets irrielevent, but to fufil them.
Right?


:confused: :confused:

[ShirChadash]

:) Here are some articles you might be interested in (don't let the titles fool ya by the way!;)):

http://www.betemunah.org/watchman/reasons.html

http://www.yashanet.com/library/under9.htm
http://www.yashanet.com/library/under1.htm

http://www.familybible.org/FAQ/Torah.htm


(HTH) Hope that helps!

[debi b]

I sure do appreciate your observation! It is difficult to discuss with people that understand scripture that way (ie western perspective). They need a new dictionary ;)

[ShirChadash]

I have been thinking about this for a while, and have actully done a lot of reasearch in the bible for it. Where does it say (in the B'rit Hadasha) that you should not follow the 613 laws given to Moses by G-D, that you should not celebrate the Jewish holidays which G-D commands us to celebrate, and not to eat unpure food, plus live unholy? Because Christians dont follow any of it. I mean it just amazes me ever since I discovered MJ how Christians ignore the word of G-D and Yeshua! If you read Matthew 5:17 it say that Yeshua did not come to make the commandments of the profets irrielevent, but to fufil them.
Right?


:confused: :confused: I wanted to mention, too... if you read everything Yeshua said -- over and over, He addresses the "Law" of G-d. Over and over and over in the Gospels, what He speaks on, what He endorses, what He tells His followers (who were NOT all Jews, but also gentiles) is Torah. I found it amazing -- set aside the preconceptions that made me read His words and "hear them" in a gentilized, western manner.... and suddenly I realized most people follow a skewed view of Paul's teachings (thinking Paul is anti-Torah, G-d's Law) rather than focus on what Yeshua (and even Paul) Himself actually said.

[debi b]

2 Peter 3:15-16
This is just as our beloved brother Paul wrote to you with the wisdom God gave him-- speaking of these things in all of his letters. Some of his comments are hard to understand, and those who are ignorant and unstable have twisted his letters around to mean something quite different from what he meant, just as they do the other parts of Scripture--and the result is disaster for them.

Even when Paul was alive to defend himself against those who misunderstood him it didn't seem to matter very much.

[visionary]

Rabbi Paul was well learned in Torah and with the baptism of the Holy Spirit saw depths that would make it hard to understand for those just coming out of darkness. For those living in the light, they will glean more and more of the brilliance in the light shining on the Torah that Paul was alluding to in some of His writings. For the simple new in faith, gentiles hearing the Word of Truth, he was going over the basics while knowing that the more mature in faith especially those of the Jewish background would also be reading what he had written, he made sure that there was spiritual meat for them also, without wanting to lose either.

May we all be blessed with his writtings, and may we also see them in the light of the Torah and the Holy Spirit.

[rooster]

Rabbi Paul was well learned in Torah and with the baptism of the Holy Spirit saw depths that would make it hard to understand for those just coming out of darkness. For those living in the light, they will glean more and more of the brilliance in the light shining on the Torah that Paul was alluding to in some of His writings. For the simple new in faith, gentiles hearing the Word of Truth, he was going over the basics while knowing that the more mature in faith especially those of the Jewish background would also be reading what he had written, he made sure that there was spiritual meat for them also, without wanting to lose either.

May we all be blessed with his writtings, and may we also see them in the light of the Torah and the Holy Spirit.

Reads like a good preface for the Letters of Paul

[blessed2]

Because Christians dont follow any of it. I mean it just amazes me ever since I discovered MJ how Christians ignore the word of G-D and Yeshua! If you read Matthew 5:17 it say that Yeshua did not come to make the commandments of the profets irrielevent, but to fufil them.
your phrase "since I discovered MJ, speaks volumes.
Many of us here have dicovered or been lead here from the "christian" denom's from which we were raised, searching for the true roots of our faith and in longing for a MORE, DEEPER, CLOSER,TRUE.... relationship with our G-d. We are shocked and amazed at the level of mis-information and mistruth in what we were taught to believe.
However, it is in finding the mass of others here from the same background that brings us hope. Hope for those who in the heart do so love the L-rd and genuinely wish to serve Him but are misguided may find the way also. We should pray for them to be lead as we were.

[mjterry87]

your phrase "since I discovered MJ, speaks volumes.
Many of us here have dicovered or been lead here from the "christian" denom's from which we were raised, searching for the true roots of our faith and in longing for a MORE, DEEPER, CLOSER,TRUE.... relationship with our G-d. We are shocked and amazed at the level of mis-information and mistruth in what we were taught to believe.
However, it is in finding the mass of others here from the same background that brings us hope. Hope for those who in the heart do so love the L-rd and genuinely wish to serve Him but are misguided may find the way also. We should pray for them to be lead as we were.


That is the most truth I have heard all day! LOL :D You know, I have also wondered how G-D could have led it to go so far?

[ShirChadash]

I've wondered that too... I suppose we all wonder that when we come to a place where the build-up of false doctrine we have been fed all our lives starts to fall away in the washing of the Word, in the light of the Jewish Messiah....

Once I learned more about the incredible degree to which G-d's Chosen People have always been hated, throughout their entire existence -- hated with a mind-boggling passion, everywhere -- it occured to me then that perhaps this separation of faith in HaShem away from Judaism had to happen for a (long) time, until finally we are coming to a place now where many people simply do not automatically view our Jewish brethren through hate-colored glasses, and can begin to realistically examine the truth of Messiah as a JEW, and the truth of G-d's Word and the faith that He handed down -- being called... Messianic JUDAISM. I think that faith in HaShem and faith in a Jewish Messiah just might have always been resisted, for so very long since Yeshua died, had it continued to be intimately connected with practicing Judaism. :(

I'm almost afraid to post this, certain someone will take offense, blast me, or some other negative reaction will ensue... but I sadly think that we non-Jews have such a history of despising the Jew and anything we perceive to be Jewish, (anything that IS Jewish) that perhaps... it did have to happen this way to some degree... :sigh:

and how thankful I am to live now, to have been born in a family that really doesn't hold to stereotypes. When I was young, my best friend was a girl who had been adopted. I was Catholic. She was Jewish. She begged and begged for her family to allow her to attend church with me, she believed in "Jesus". At the tender age of eleven, already I encouraged her to embrace "Jesus" (I didn't know to call Him Yeshua :D ), and not to embrace "church", but expressed to her that she could believe... as a Jew. I forgot all about this until just now. Anyway...

My .02, chi-ching. Anyone blasts me, beware 'cuz I might blast back LOL ;).

*Zemmy goes searching for her fruit of the Spirit*
:)