I am now asserting myself as spitural head and priest of my family

[Lebesgue]

For years I was delinquent in this responsibility.

Since I became a Messianic and really had the desire for t'shuvah and really gave my heart to the L-rd I have been able to assert my resposnsiblity.

I didn't think it would be easy at first, my wife is an SDA Christian who has no desire to join me in the Messianic movement but she really respects my zeal for keeping the Torah and wanting to live a Jewish life and even is willing to learn things to make our home more Jewish.
She is respecting what I will do foodwise during Pesach and is even going to attend the seder with me that my synagogue is having.

And she even comes to me when she has questions about the Bible.

HaShem is really working in my family, praise Him.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

[Wags]

I have heard it estimated that up to 1/3 of SDA are Jewish. Before there was such a thing as modern day Messianic congregations - SDA was about the only Christian church you could attend that didn't require you to give up Shabbat or keeping Kosher.

Have either of you read the books by Samuel Bacchioci (sp?) on the Feasts. And are you aware of the Messianic SDA congregations? Might be that info would be helpful to yourself and your wife.

http://www.btvfl.org/
http://www.arielmessianiccongregation.com/
http://www.jewishheritage.net/

[Lebesgue]

I have heard it estimated that up to 1/3 of SDA are Jewish. Before there was such a thing as modern day Messianic congregations - SDA was about the only Christian church you could attend that didn't require you to give up Shabbat or keeping Kosher.

Have either of you read the books by Samuel Bacchioci (sp?) on the Feasts. And are you aware of the Messianic SDA congregations? Might be that info would be helpful to yourself and your wife.

http://www.btvfl.org/
http://www.arielmessianiccongregation.com/
http://www.jewishheritage.net/

and I'd NEVER go back:

1) They believe in a false "prophet" Ellen G. White. And were founded because of a misinterpretation of Daniel 8:13-14 when they originally set the date of October 22, 1844 for Y'shua to return. When He didn't they concocted a fairy tale about Y'shua moving from the Holy to the Most Holy place in Heaven to begin the Investigative Judgement.

2) They believe in an "Investigative Judgement" that began on October 22, 1844 where Y'shua is judging EVERYONE who EVER believed in Him to see if they are "safe to save". If a believer has even one sin on their record that they didn't ask for forgivness for even if they were ignorant of the sin, G-d will UNFORGIVE everything He had already forgiven.

3) One must perfect one's character to the point they have COMPLETELY STOPPED SINNING by the time they either die or Y'shua returns(whichever comes first) or they will NOT be saved.

4) During the Time of Trouble, Y'shua will NOT be there for His followers who are suffering, they must be perfect and sinless at that time and stand for themselves.

5) Keeping kashrut and Shabbat is not keeping the whole Torah. The SDAs don't keep the feasts, for example.

When I was an SDA and realised that I could NOT live up to the perfectionist standards I DESPAIRED for my salvation to the point that I believed it was IMPOSSIBLE for me to be saved and I nearly gave up on G-d and became an atheist. Baruch HaShem that He would NOT give up on me.

I NEVER had assurance of salvation as an SDA and suffered from insomnia worrying about what would happen if I died in my sleep and could not remember or know about a sin that I had committed that day to repent of it.

I suffered HORRIBLY spiritually as an SDA and there is NO WAY I would go back there under ANY circumstances even to a Messianic SDA congregation.

I go to a wonderful Messianic Synagogue that teaches the Gospel and grace and I have such peace and joy I WILL NOT give that up.

My wife and I are fine with the arrangement of me going to my synagogue and her going to her SDA church on Shabbat. After what I went through with the spiritual abuse I suffered from SDA doctrines I can't even stand to set foot in an SDA church.

Just want to explain where I am coming from. Hope it didn't sound too harsh.

G-d Bless.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

[Wags]

I wasn't meaning for you to be an SDA messianic - just that since your wife has no intentions of leaving the SDA church those resources might help her accept your messianic lifestyle choices when she realizes that there are SDA doing those things too. I know that Shabbat and Kosher aren't everything in Torah - but it is more than most Christian churches do.

Some of what you posted I've never seen or heard from any SDA - and I am very familiar with what they teach. 3) One must perfect one's character to the point they have COMPLETELY STOPPED SINNING by the time they either die or Y'shua returns(whichever comes first) or they will NOT be saved.

4) During the Time of Trouble, Y'shua will NOT be there for His followers who are suffering, they must be perfect and sinless at that time and stand for themselves.

Obviously you are an ex-SDA that has a lot of issues with the SDA church, so I'm sure for you it would be better to stay away.

[Lebesgue]

I wasn't meaning for you to be an SDA messianic - just that since your wife has no intentions of leaving the SDA church those resources might help her accept your messianic lifestyle choices when she realizes that there are SDA doing those things too. I know that Shabbat and Kosher aren't everything in Torah - but it is more than most Christian churches do.

Some of what you posted I've never seen or heard from any SDA - and I am very familiar with what they teach.

Obviously you are an ex-SDA that has a lot of issues with the SDA church, so I'm sure for you it would be better to stay away.

Thanks, Wags. Now that you have clarified I see what you mean. Sorry I misunderstood.

You are probably familiar with what the "mainstream" SDA churches teach and they play down the two things you mentioned. My wife is Indonesian and my entire 14 years I was SDA I went to either Indonesian or Filipino SDA churches which are VERY traditional and conservative and teach the "character perfection" thing.

Again, I hope I didn't sound harsh and I obviously misunderstood what you had said and I apologise for that. SDAism is a real "hot button" issue for me and you are correct I DO have issues with the SDA church and I stay away from it.

G-d Bless You.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

[Kris10leigh]

Lebesque, I am glad you misunderstood Wags. ;) I have been wanting to know a bit more about SDA but haven't actually ventured over there. I found your post very enlightening, thank you! I'm sorry for your personal struggle with it and very happy for you that God led you to where you are rather than giving up on Him completely.

I think it's wonderful the relationship you describe with your wife. We're in a similar boat, my husband and I. He's reading over my shoulder, so to speak, as I follow along this path. I think he is surprised to find that he is not able to find fault with any new information I find.

[MattyJames]

For years I was delinquent in this responsibility.

Since I became a Messianic and really had the desire for t'shuvah and really gave my heart to the L-rd I have been able to assert my resposnsiblity.

I didn't think it would be easy at first, my wife is an SDA Christian who has no desire to join me in the Messianic movement but she really respects my zeal for keeping the Torah and wanting to live a Jewish life and even is willing to learn things to make our home more Jewish.
She is respecting what I will do foodwise during Pesach and is even going to attend the seder with me that my synagogue is having.

And she even comes to me when she has questions about the Bible.

HaShem is really working in my family, praise Him.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

As a new fiance, I am begining to understand the pressures of being a preist and head of the house. When I read your testimony I was genuinely glad for you. The internal softening and submission that is happening would deffinatly be of a great blessing to your marriage. I am happy for you my friend and encourage you on your walk.

May the peace of God dwell in your heart, and may the love of God give you patience toward your beloved.

Grace be upon you,

Matty James

PS: I have also heard that the Books by Samuel Baciiochi (sp?) are a very good referance to point SDA's to - when dealing with subjects like the moedim and such. Wags advice is worth taking.

[Lebesgue]

As a new fiance, I am begining to understand the pressures of being a preist and head of the house. When I read your testimony I was genuinely glad for you. The internal softening and submission that is happening would deffinatly be of a great blessing to your marriage. I am happy for you my friend and encourage you on your walk.

May the peace of God dwell in your heart, and may the love of God give you patience toward your beloved.

Grace be upon you,

Matty James

PS: I have also heard that the Books by Samuel Baciiochi (sp?) are a very good referance to point SDA's to - when dealing with subjects like the moedim and such. Wags advice is worth taking.

Thanks for the kind words. Wags does have a good point about Dr. Bacchiocci's stuff, I don't have a problem with that, he is one of the more enlightened SDAs and his position on some things is at odds with the majority of SDAs. He seems to be more like a Messianic than an SDA on some things.

G-d Bless you.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

[Lebesgue]

Lebesque, I am glad you misunderstood Wags. ;) I have been wanting to know a bit more about SDA but haven't actually ventured over there. I found your post very enlightening, thank you! I'm sorry for your personal struggle with it and very happy for you that God led you to where you are rather than giving up on Him completely.

I think it's wonderful the relationship you describe with your wife. We're in a similar boat, my husband and I. He's reading over my shoulder, so to speak, as I follow along this path. I think he is surprised to find that he is not able to find fault with any new information I find.

Thanks, Kris!

I would say regarding the SDA thing, they are good people but their doctrine robs people of assurance of salvation. Their false prophet Ellen White teaches that one has to be completely sinless and have perfected their character in order to make it to heaven. They also belive that we have to prove ourselves to be "safe to save" to "unfallen beings on other world" so they will be assured G-d made the right decision to save us.(Excuse me, but IF they were unfallen, wouldn't they TRUST G-d 100% and that His decisions are PERFECT).

Not all SDA churches teach these kind of things. Some SDA churches in Southern Calfornia and Austraila ignore Ellen White and are quite liberal. But the "ethnic" churches in SoCal , which I spent 14 years in teach the harsh Ellen White stuff. I was 14 years in SDA churches in SoCal where most of the members were Indonesian or Filipino Immigrants(wonderful, kind, loving people and I am still friends with them today) and they beat one over the head with Ellen White. My dear wife even gets sick of the Ellen White stuff but stays out of not wanting to break her parents' hearts(an Indonesian cultural thing I admire and respect). These harsh doctrines got me to despair for my salvation to the point I was ready to give up on G-d when I discovered I couldn't be saved based on what Ellen White taught. G-d didn't give up on me!
Baruch HaShem!

My wife is FASCINATED by the stuff I am learning. I don't push it on her but she listens. She is even going to attend the seder for Pesach my synagogue is attending and is respecting the change in dietary habits I will be going through during Pesach.
And she comes to me with questions on the Bible as she sees me now as really knowing it(I am learning more than I ever did, and it is truly wonderful).

G-d Bless.

Shalom,


Lebesgue

[mac8]

This is reminding me why I never married - lol

The orthodox Jewish families I know most definitely share responsibility for decision making between the couple, and in practice the wife often runs virtually everything so her husband can learn as much as possible. There's no 'head of the household' in the way fundamentalist Christians understand it. The man has certain ritual duties to perform, but if he is less learned than his wife - as can easily happen now, his wife gives the lead in sedra and halacha at least, and sometimes she is the only one learning Talmud. Their marriages seem perfectly stable to me and I've known most of them twenty years or more.
Blessings

[Wags]

You can read a couple of Dr. Samuele Bacchiocchi's books on-line.

From Sabbath to Sunday (http://english.sdaglobal.org/dnl/bacchi/books/sab2sun.pdf) is a translation and an adaptation of his Italian doctoral dissertation, presented at and published by the Pontifical Gregorian University Press.
Sabbath under crossfire (http://english.sdaglobal.org/dnl/bacchi/books/crosfire.pdf)

You can read excerpts from his other books on his website. (http://www.biblicalperspectives.com/)

Here are links to the books about the Moedim:
God’s Festivals in Scripture and History. Volume I: The Spring Festivals (http://www.biblicalperspectives.com/books/festivals_1/)(A chapter on Passover is available at this link.)

God’s Festivals in Scripture and History. Volume 2: The Fall Festivals (http://www.biblicalperspectives.com/books/festivals_2/)

[Lebesgue]

You can read a couple of Dr. Samuele Bacchiocchi's books on-line.

From Sabbath to Sunday (http://english.sdaglobal.org/dnl/bacchi/books/sab2sun.pdf)is a translation and an adaptation of his Italian doctoral dissertation, presented at and published by the Pontifical Gregorian University Press.
Sabbath under crossfire (http://english.sdaglobal.org/dnl/bacchi/books/crosfire.pdf)

You can read excerpts from his other books on his website. (http://www.biblicalperspectives.com/)

Here are links to the books about the Moedim:
God’s Festivals in Scripture and History. Volume I: The Spring Festivals (http://www.biblicalperspectives.com/books/festivals_1/)(A chapter on Passover is available at this link.)

God’s Festivals in Scripture and History. Volume 2: The Fall Festivals (http://www.biblicalperspectives.com/books/festivals_2/)

Todah, Wags!

As I said I think Dr. Bacchiocci makes some good points. He is one of the more enlightened SDAs.

G-d Bless.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

[colslass]

You have no idea how much it gladdens my heart to hear that more and more men are beginning to 'step into their family heritage' and put on their 'priestly' mantle. In my family the balance is not quite right yet - yet he works hard and loves me greatly. Initially he did resist when I introduced Friday night Shabbat but not now - he actually commented that he missed the home baked bread one week when I was too ill to make it. Now that was joy to my ears and heart indeed.

[ElsanRandiMom]

It's wonderful to follow your heart, but just know that if you both end up in this knee deep that you are not the head of the home... you are the head of the wife. the home is hers. :)