Sex Education - new STD stats - what is to blame?

[Nadiine]

Recent CDC stats came out for teen STD's that were very alarming -
1 in 4 teens had an STD.

In a Fox news debate, one woman blamed a lack of proper sex education for the epidemic.

Is it really a lack of proper sex education or is it a problem of sin that is the source of this problem?

Either way, how far should sex education go in what they teach certain ages?

[BustedFlat]

Until they stress purity until marriage and then monogamy after that then those numbers will continue to go up. There is a reason the Lord wrote:
Exd 20:14 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/popup.pl?book=Exd&chapter=20&verse=14&version=kjv#14)¶Thou shalt not commit adultery.

Sin always has a price.

[Simon_Templar]

Recent CDC stats came out for teen STD's that were very alarming -
1 in 4 teens had an STD.

In a Fox news debate, one woman blamed a lack of proper sex education for the epidemic.

Is it really a lack of proper sex education or is it a problem of sin that is the source of this problem?

Either way, how far should sex education go in what they teach certain ages?
The woman's attitude is typical of liberalism, they push an idea that causes all sorts of problems, then they blame the problems on not having accepted their idea enough!

The irony here is that pretty much the only Kids in the country who aren't subjected to sex education programs are the kids of some conservative evangelicals who pull their kids out of the classes. I'm willing to bet that the incidence of STD's among that group is considerably lower than it is in most of the others.

you might think that the abject failure of a given idea, such as compulsory sex education for young kids in school, would lead people to reject the idea and move on to something else.. but you'd be wrong. The fact that the idea is a complete failure REALLY means we aren't doing it enough!

[mont974x4]

Recent CDC stats came out for teen STD's that were very alarming -
1 in 4 teens had an STD.

In a Fox news debate, one woman blamed a lack of proper sex education for the epidemic.

Is it really a lack of proper sex education or is it a problem of sin that is the source of this problem?

Either way, how far should sex education go in what they teach certain ages?
Hey, sis!


You hit it on the head with the sin issue. Unwed mothers and STD's are a result of sin and nothing else...sin on the part of the young people engaging in the acts and parents not teaching/leading their kids.



Personally, I am against sex ed in schools. There's enough stuff I have unteach my kids that they learn in public schools, TV, etc.

[IamRedeemed]

Absolutely and without hesitation, I vote that SIN is the source of this problem. :thumbsup:


Recent CDC stats came out for teen STD's that were very alarming -
1 in 4 teens had an STD.

In a Fox news debate, one woman blamed a lack of proper sex education for the epidemic.

Is it really a lack of proper sex education or is it a problem of sin that is the source of this problem?

Either way, how far should sex education go in what they teach certain ages?

[IamRedeemed]

You got that right! :thumbsup:


Hey, sis!

You hit it on the head with the sin issue. Unwed mothers and STD's are a result of sin and nothing else...sin on the part of the young people engaging in the acts and parents not teaching/leading their kids.

Personally, I am against sex ed in schools. There's enough stuff I have unteach my kids that they learn in public schools, TV, etc.

[Cabal]

Obviously sin is the issue here.

But how is it then, that abstinence-only sex-ed programs haven't alleviated the problem?

[mont974x4]

Obviously sin is the issue here.

But how is it then, that abstinence-only sex-ed programs haven't alleviated the problem?
simple, because people are rebelious and sinful.

I may know it's against the law to speed, but that doesn't mean my heavy foot doesn't get the better of me at times.

I may know that fornication is wrong, but it doesn't mean that I didn't have self control issues in my younger years.

[Cabal]

So, maybe there isn't enough ABC sex ed? Would reduce the STD's, anyway.

If that's all you're after (reducing STDs) then it's that simple. If you want to reduce premarital sex, then that's a much bigger kettle of fish.

[mont974x4]

So, maybe there isn't enough ABC sex ed? Would reduce the STD's, anyway.

If that's all you're after (reducing STDs) then it's that simple. If you want to reduce premarital sex, then that's a much bigger kettle of fish.
How about we just encourage parents to do their job instead of relying on the world to do it?


SexEd in schools really doesn't do any good, and it certainly doesn't approach the issue in a God-fearing manner.

[Cabal]

How about we just encourage parents to do their job instead of relying on the world to do it?


SexEd in schools really doesn't do any good, and it certainly doesn't approach the issue in a God-fearing manner.

Fine by me, but don't most parents also usually object when the state tries to intervene in their family lives, cf. spanking?

[mont974x4]

Fine by me, but don't most parents also usually object when the state tries to intervene in their family lives, cf. spanking?
Being a libertarian I am opposed to most forms of government influence in private lives.


The government makes a poor substitute for parents.

[Cabal]

Being a libertarian I am opposed to most forms of government influence in private lives.


The government makes a poor substitute for parents.

Ah I see. Again I agree - although I do think the mess has been generated by the "leave it up to the parents" method in the first place.

Jesus to the rescue, I guess!

[mont974x4]

Christ is the only answer.

[Simon_Templar]

Obviously sin is the issue here.

But how is it then, that abstinence-only sex-ed programs haven't alleviated the problem?
Well, the truth is that abstinence only policies are like trying to close the barn door when all the animals have already run out.

Abstinence is based on morality, and the fact is sexual morality in our country is largely gone. In fact morality in general is pretty tenuous.
Further, society all around sends completely mixed messages.. you have parents and some social activists and some governments trying to promote abstinence while the rest of society, from movies, to TV, to the media, to the liberal politcal machine basically portraying sexual morals as laughably archaic and just a bunch of repressed people who are trying to repress everyone else as well.

I strongly suspect that no matter what sex education is put in place it will have little effect.

Especially when you consider the broken down statistics. Its a tough issue to talk about without sounding racist because the statistics show a clear divide on along racial lines, with African Americans having by far the highest rate of STD's (nearly 50%), Caucasians were around 20% and Asians were the lowest.

Obviously there must be a reason for this, and I would personally guess that it is probably due to the predominant culture and cultural values in each of those groups.

Asian demographics tend to have very strong family structures, and respect and responsability are heavily stressed in their cultural background.

The African-American community, on the other hand has statistically been shown to have the highest rate of broken families, and the social prejudices they have faced have often fostered and promoted an attitude of not respecting others and not taking responsability.

I don't think that has anything to do with race in a genetic sense at all. It has to do with the culture that has developed around their community. Obviously the impact of suffering prolonged social prejudice and descrimination is the biggest external impact.

However, a lot also has to do with how the community has chosen to respond to that pressure.

It may be that the family structure has never fully recovered from its degredation during slavery, but it doesn't seem that the same level of problems has existed through out the history of black america. If that is the case, it would suggest that more recent changes of attitude or outlook had a greater impact on the current situation.

I think this reflects the fact that the root of the problem is a breakdown of social restraints such as family structure and values such as taking responsability for yourself and for others as well, respecting others etc.
I strongly doubt that a few hours of sex ed aren't going to do much to counteract that.

[pastortimothy]

As a former public health/epidemiology specialist in the military, I have a rather interesting perspective on this very topic. Of course, most of the people I dealt with were 18-25, but, when I was shoreside I did work with teenagers who came through the hospital. I did quite a bit of STD counseling and contact investigation. Any STD you can think of, and I've probably seen it in real life.
There was no more difficult a converstion than to notify someone that they were HIV positive. Here you go...here is your imminent death, handed to you. Oh, and by the way, you need to notify your wife.
There really wasn't any group of people that cornered the market on STDs. I saw lots of "happily married " Christians with Gonnorhea and Chlamydia and not all of them were younger or dumber.
The enemy doesn't care who you are, what you know or how pious you've convinced others you are. Each one of us is capable of falling. The enemy knows that you make your own choices, regardless of the input or information you've been given. He tempts and tests. He makes it his business to know what is hardest for your flesh to refuse. That is his way. We, on the other hand, simply choose to sin or not to sin.
Seldom do we escape the natural earthly consequences of our actions; nor should we, necessarily. Yet, the worst of sinners is welcome at the foot of the Cross and if there is genuine contrition; he is white as snow...period.
Yes, the problem is sin. But we must not discount the power of our cognitive processes. I'm not saying that let's promote sin in schools. I am saying, that in my experience, training people on the medical perils of risky sexual behavior did give some of them pause. Unfortunately, not all of them chose wisely. And for some, the lesson cost them their families and carreers.

For me and my sons, I do not see anything wrong with educating them about what can kill them. I do so with great respect for scripture, but I do it. To me, the most important aspect of this dilemma, isn't if I give them the information itself, but rather if I've given the proper Biblical tools for them to mitigate the effects of the temptation that will eventually come.

People fail...Jesus doesn't. It's an important distinction to make.

[prophecystudent]

Obviously sin is the issue here.

But how is it then, that abstinence-only sex-ed programs haven't alleviated the problem?

If all the young people were enrolled in abstinence only programs and the STD rate was at 25% I would agree with you that is is not working.

Having said that, I am willing to go out on a limb here, and say that the STD rate among young people who practice abstinence is at zero.

It is not what is presented in the classes that causes the problem, it is more what is not presented.

Example, our daughter came home from her high school class in an absolute rage. It turns out that she had just been forced to watch a movie in her high school english class that taught several ways to shop lift.

We asked if that was all that was shown, and the answer was yes. We followed up with the school and were told that the film was mandatory, but the teachers WERE FORBIDDEN TO STATE THAT SHOPLIFTING WAS ILLEGAL!

The teachers were not allowed to "moralize" about the films.

Same thing applies to sex ed. They teach all the mechanics but not any of the controls or bad effects.

Besides, lest we forget, young people have a tendency to believe they are immortal, that accidents (and pregnancies and STDs) only happen to someone else.

There is no stigma attached to getting pregnant at age 15, or aborting the baby.

Back before dirt, there was a stigma attached to such things and those things were condemned by society at large. Today they are celebrated as the new liberated life style.

Yes, without doubt, sin is behind the rise in STDs. But that sin is made infinitely easier because of the liberal attitudes of our media, courts and general population.

Fred

[prophecystudent]

So, maybe there isn't enough ABC sex ed? Would reduce the STD's, anyway.

If that's all you're after (reducing STDs) then it's that simple. If you want to reduce premarital sex, then that's a much bigger kettle of fish.

Perhaps you can tell us the simple way to reduce/eliminate STDs.

Perhaps you mean to hand out condoms in school starting at age 9? That may reduce STDs, but do not count on it. Condoms are freely available in thousands of places, Granted some of them you have to buy, but they are there. They just are not used.

Maybe write another law that says something to the effect that unless you are trying to have a baby, you are required to use a condom?

There was a short story some years ago that, as I recall, was called, "Welcome to the monkey house".

I recommned it be read because it addresses the issue of sexual behaviour.

Fred

[prophecystudent]

Ah I see. Again I agree - although I do think the mess has been generated by the "leave it up to the parents" method in the first place.

Jesus to the rescue, I guess!

The problem was/is caused by parents who refuse to accept their responsibilities for children, along with their capitulation to the "system" for raising those kids.

The parents should be righteously outraged by the fraud that is going on in our schools.

We spend more money on education in this country than practically any other country in the world. What do we see for results? I can speak from personal experience. I taught at the college level, in a school of business, third and fourth year students. Some of those students were in their final semester.

I was incredulous at the number of them who had major problems writing, or speaking, a coherent sentence. Some of them did not know how to calculate a normal numeric average.

Recently , I heard that the drop out rate in high schools approaches 75 percent.

Yes, the parents are responsible. They do nothing but make sorry excuses and blame the system. It is their tax money that is being wasted on these failing institutions and they still do nothing. Their children come out brainwashed and functionally illiterate, and they still do nothing.

From these standpoints I agree the parents are responsible.

In my view it is symptomatic of what is rapidly becoming a dysfunctional society. But then, on the bright side, all this has been predicted in the bible and it will get more severe as we approach the end times.

Fred

[Nadiine]

Ah I see. Again I agree - although I do think the mess has been generated by the "leave it up to the parents" method in the first place.

Jesus to the rescue, I guess!
I think we're finding out that the parents today are just as immature and screwed up as the kids they're raising...

I'm starting to wonder if the govt. isn't a better parent for a certain percentage of kids anymore

:sigh: :help:

[Nadiine]

The problem was/is caused by parents who refuse to accept their responsibilities for children, along with their capitulation to the "system" for raising those kids.

The parents should be righteously outraged by the fraud that is going on in our schools.

We spend more money on education in this country than practically any other country in the world. What do we see for results? I can speak from personal experience. I taught at the college level, in a school of business, third and fourth year students. Some of those students were in their final semester.

I was incredulous at the number of them who had major problems writing, or speaking, a coherent sentence. Some of them did not know how to calculate a normal numeric average.

Recently , I heard that the drop out rate in high schools approaches 75 percent.

Yes, the parents are responsible. They do nothing but make sorry excuses and blame the system. It is their tax money that is being wasted on these failing institutions and they still do nothing. Their children come out brainwashed and functionally illiterate, and they still do nothing.

From these standpoints I agree the parents are responsible.

In my view it is symptomatic of what is rapidly becoming a dysfunctional society. But then, on the bright side, all this has been predicted in the bible and it will get more severe as we approach the end times.

Fred
Hi Fred,
honestly, I don't believe it's the school's fault that kids are 'braindead'... the kids don't value school, they don't want to go, it's a friendship club where they hang out & meet each other & pick up dates & text message buddies....
they don't CARE to learn, and they don't bother.
I disagree that it's the education system/they aren't being taught.
They don't learn becuz they don't care and they don't apply themselves anymore.

This was the case for me when I went to school - I was stupid when I graduated... not becuz I didn't get an education, but becuz I cheated my way thru tests, was busy hunting boys to mess around with, hanging out w/ friends and not applying myself to homework.

I think kids today need a revelation on how important education is - until then, they won't care to apply themselves to learn.

[pastortimothy]

I think kids today need a revelation on how important education is - until then, they won't care to apply themselves to learn.


Very good point. There is little doubt that, as a culture, our youth value the priviledge of an education progressively much less than previous generations. And while this subject is, arguably, very complex; I feel that there are a few contrubutory factors that resonate significantly.

There is an ever growing cultural texture that has risen to prominence, unchallenged, within our homes and our public institutions. This texture doesn't carry a specific name, per se. Yet, it permeates all of our choices and it filters the way our young people see society and their various places in it. It is a dynamic that proffers the following ideology:

"I am responsible for your feelings and you are responsible for my behavior"

This is a viewpoint that will bear terrible fruit and, in fact, already has. It promotes the notion that our actions are the fault of those who influence us; teachers, parents, pastors, governments, TV news anchors and so on. It allows us to escape causality and to continue our behavior without consequence. We simply have to point the finger and say "It's their fault". Additionally, this concept has also created a general atmosphere of paranoia with regard to how we feel about various things. We walk around on social egg shells, not wanting to offend anyone. This has become the hallmark of Generation X and Generation Y: "I am offended and you must make amends"

Personal responsibility? Accountability? Delaying gratification? These are just conceptual uncertainties in today's atmosphere of societal entropy.

I say let it start with me. I am responsible. I am the one to act. I teach my sons to accept the natural consequences they have earned. I neither coddle them nor diminish the eventuallity of cause and effect. Yet, in a big-picture sense, it is difficult to affect change in a generation that is obsessed with not upsetting their children and being buddies with them, at all costs.

Yes, it starts with parents.

[prophecystudent]

Hi Fred,
honestly, I don't believe it's the school's fault that kids are 'braindead'... the kids don't value school, they don't want to go, it's a friendship club where they hang out & meet each other & pick up dates & text message buddies....
they don't CARE to learn, and they don't bother.
I disagree that it's the education system/they aren't being taught.
They don't learn becuz they don't care and they don't apply themselves anymore.

This was the case for me when I went to school - I was stupid when I graduated... not becuz I didn't get an education, but becuz I cheated my way thru tests, was busy hunting boys to mess around with, hanging out w/ friends and not applying myself to homework.

I think kids today need a revelation on how important education is - until then, they won't care to apply themselves to learn.

I respect your view, but respectfully disagree. Attitudes can be changed by good teachers. Sure kids cheat on tests. The first semester I taught at that college 35 percent of them cheated on the first graded project. I reminded them that the course syllabus contained the policy, and punishment, for cheating. Returned all papers and had them re-done.

Second pass only 3 cheated and received failing grades for the course.

The second semester only two cheated and received failing grades. Cheating stopped. Spelling and grammar were graded as well as other aspects of their education. It all counted and it all paid off. They learned a lot. Another thing I learned about teaching is that it is a lot of work if you do it right. I typically had from 120 to 130 students in my classes. I had 5 graded projects (written and or software oriented) as well as 3 exams. I graded every one of them, handed them back and reviewed them with the class. That is work.

I saw other professors there that did none of what I was doing. It was too much work.

I tutored in a local high school here and discovered that grading papers was too much work. My two grand sons went to public high school here. The teacher handed out homework assignments, but did not grade them, she simply put a checkmark in her grade book that the work had been handed in. Too much work to use the assignments as a real learning tool.

If the teachers (read education system) sets the bar of learning high, the kids learn more. All of them. If they lower the bar because it might hurt some kid's ego to get a bad grade then we get what we have today. Incompetent school systems that do nothing but bore our kids and turn out illiterates.

Fred

[JCFantasy23]

Obviously sin is the issue here.

But how is it then, that abstinence-only sex-ed programs haven't alleviated the problem?

I think the sex-ed system teaching that is ludicrous in this country. You may wish for your children to wait till marriage, but on the chance many won't, we need to teach our children to be well-armed in sex matters and preventing STDs/pregnancy. Just telling them to not have sex clearly hasn't worked for a long time. With some, sure, but for many (many, many, MANY) that just isn't the case.

[MaidforHim]

Recent CDC stats came out for teen STD's that were very alarming -
1 in 4 teens had an STD.

In a Fox news debate, one woman blamed a lack of proper sex education for the epidemic.

Is it really a lack of proper sex education or is it a problem of sin that is the source of this problem?

Either way, how far should sex education go in what they teach certain ages?

So many people in the world think of God's laws or direction as His attempt to deprive them from something fun or that feels good. They fail to understand that each and every direction God gives us is for our benefit.

God tells us to do things that are good for us spiritually, emotionally, psychologically and physically.

Likewise...

Likewise God tells us Not to do things that are harmful for us spiritually, emotionaly, psychologically, and physically.

I believe God has told us not to have sex outside of marriage for several reasons. The most obvious would be that it is displeasing to Him. But how often we ever stop to think about the fact that He is protecting us for harm? Believers might consider this fact from time to time depending on where they are at in their walk with Christ, but the scoffer or yet to be saved may not realize that this Godly instruction is for their benefit.... Given out of love.

Knowing that God's laws are a form of protection is something I believe requires faith. You can't alway see the harm a sin might cause, you have to believe God has your best interests at heart. For a believer doing what is pleasing to God and avoiding what displeases Him is often enough, but when you see the actual harm come to those who ignore Him it's a strong reminder of just how much he does love us and that there are a lot of dangers that aren't necessarily visible from the outside of a sinful behavior or act.

I think the sins that cause physical harm should be even easier for people to recognize, but it sure seems like they don't see it for what it is. The fact that sins like sex before marriage can also cause emotional and spiritual harm in addition to physical consequences should make it even more obvious that God is our great protector and His Word really is a sign of His love for us.

[Nurbz]

Abstinence-only programs don't work for teens. Humans become sexually mature anywhere from 10-14 years old, and historicly thats when people got married, around the time of a girls first menstration, but with childhood extended, and curiosity, you just cannot control nature 100% And historicly, puritanical laws supressed any healthy exploration (just look at the victorian era devices poor boys had to wear to keep them from masturbating)



Abstainence only programs do not give sufficiant education on how diseases are transmitted and in many cases lied about effectiveness of condoms. These programs made girls more likely to engage in anal and oral sex than those who had normal sex education, and because they didn't have proper STD education, they didn't realize you get diseases through those methods.

Its noble to aim for marraige only, and should be taught BY THE PARENTS while they get biological education from the school, but we have to be realistic as well.. they harder you try to repress kids, the more likely they'll jump head first into something bad.

I should know, I went to a religious highschool and judging by the pregnancies, rampant oral and anal sex going on between students who hated themselves as much as they liked what there doing, thanks to the principle and teachers. When you have kids who are doing what nature tells them they need to do but also hate themselves because of strict religious rules taught by people who scare kids with the negatives, you're going to have some severely screwed up adults.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4176/is_20080104/ai_n21189834

[JCFantasy23]

You said it better than I could have Nurbz. I agree with you, abstainence can be taught by the parents but the schools need to be realistic, many kids just aren't going to follow that for many reasons. They need to be well armed for sex in case they go in. It's sad that I learned many facts from movies and books rather than the school system. Learning from friends doesn't help as they all have weird ideas that may or may not prove true. I once believed in Junior High school from a friend that you couldn't get pregnant unless you had sex at least twice lol. And my mother? She knew less about sexual terms than I did when we discussed it when I was older. She didn't even know what the term bestiality meant.

[Cabal]

Yeah, while I fully encourage Christian parents to encourage abstinence, I don't think that should be the only line of defence.

For many kids the message they get is:

"Can't have sex. But if you do, you can't use condoms. PSYCH!"

[johngugie]

1 thing is to blame: stupidity. how dumb can kids be today? STD info floods the net, schools, and tv. you have to be blind not to know about stds. if they get em, it's their fault and God's punishment to for their stupidity.

[Madcap Mo]

1 thing is to blame: stupidity. how dumb can kids be today? STD info floods the net, schools, and tv. you have to be blind not to know about stds. if they get em, it's their fault and God's punishment to for their stupidity.
Beat me to it pal sin in haste repent at leisure.
I don't really see how Sexual education can help in the matter any more then it has. Once the School has done it's part in teaching kids on how it happens it should be up to the parents to teach them the morality regarding it and their own common sense.

[LivingWordUnity]

The woman's attitude is typical of liberalism, they push an idea that causes all sorts of problems, then they blame the problems on not having accepted their idea enough!

The irony here is that pretty much the only Kids in the country who aren't subjected to sex education programs are the kids of some conservative evangelicals who pull their kids out of the classes. I'm willing to bet that the incidence of STD's among that group is considerably lower than it is in most of the others.

you might think that the abject failure of a given idea, such as compulsory sex education for young kids in school, would lead people to reject the idea and move on to something else.. but you'd be wrong. The fact that the idea is a complete failure REALLY means we aren't doing it enough!It's like the liberals are saying, "keep beating your head against a wall and eventually it will cure your headache."
.

[Nadiine]

It's like the liberals are saying, "keep beating your head against a wall and eventually it will cure your headache."

Basically yes.

When people keep doing the very things that cause the problems... hello. lol

It's like that saying goes, "the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different outcome".
Govt. could do itself a favor and get a clue about that concept.

What really bothers me is that liberals are SO bent on "freedoms" as long as they don't "HARM" others... most of what they do harms themselves & others, quite drastically - yet they ignore harm if it has enough pleasure attached to it.

They just cherry pick out the drastic ones & ignore the other liberties they indulge in which are dangerous and harmful in many ways; even ways they cannot see.

Definitely you can use a skin care product thinking it's wonderful and works well for your skin - then 2 years later you see all kinds of warnings by doctors on some of the ingredients they later learn are dangerous....
You WERE harming yourself by using that product you just didn't realize it while using it. The same goes for alot of "harmless sins" people chronically live in like fornication, watching porn, etc. it seems harmless becuz you're enjoying it & it's pleasurable - so it seems "good".... what you don't see is how the baggage w/ multiple partners has stacked up, or how those images are altering your sexuality & preferences, that you're addicted to relationships, sex or porn & they're warping your character and emotional state, nevermind your spirit that you can't see!

The issue becomes the definition of Harm - liberals wont' define harm correctly (ie. God's way); even when they see the harm, they just blame it on something else so they can continue living in rebellion.

God's principles state that living in these sins produces pain and consequence - yet they'de like to claim that you can live in sin without pain & consequence, any consequence they just try to set new laws to condone & fix it (ie. abortion, ie. creating medical diagnosis for sinful behaviour. 'addiction genes' instead of sin of doing drugs & getting drunk - that's a long list)

[WuAgent]

yeah i think sin is the issue not so much because having sex in a marriage will totally guard you from getting STDs. i mean, if a guy has sex with 20 women and they're all clean he's not gonna catch anything.

but if people are saving themselves for marriage then thats means they are having sex with less partners which makes it inevitable that the number of those infected will decrease.

parenting is dead in this society. everyone wants to be a mommy or a daddy but no one wants to be a parent.