Revelation 3:13-19 Who is it speaking to?

[Angel4Truth]

I would like to know what other conservative christians think about this passage and how they interpret it and who they believe its speaking to and why and how it applies to the church today- thank you

Revelation 3:13. "He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.'' '
14. "And to the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write, `These things says the Amen, the Faithful and True Witness, the Beginning of the creation of God:
15. "I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot. I could wish you were cold or hot.
16. "So then, because you are lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spew you out of My mouth.
17. "Because you say, `I am rich, have become wealthy, and have need of nothing' and do not know that you are wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked
18. "I counsel you to buy from Me gold refined in the fire, that you may be rich; and white garments, that you may be clothed, that the shame of your nakedness may not be revealed; and anoint your eyes with eye salve, that you may see.
19. "As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten. Therefore be zealous and repent.

[MrJim]

All of the letters are addressed to churches~only two (I think) didn't carry warnings. Christ is essentially telling the others to repent or face consequences. The nature of the consequences is subject to debate due to different interpretations.

[Koey]

We need to begin with an understanding of what kind of literature Revelation is. It is apocalyptic literature, a genre which we rarely see today, except perhaps in political cartoons. The apocalyptic genre used symbolism heavily. It was created in a time when it was dangerous to criticize the Emperor, and so such leaders were referred to in caricature. As to who was specifically referred to by the cartoons of Revelation has been lost to history. God knew this and so there is a more important message in the book than who "am da beast" or any other of the dozens of interpretations of the book.

The bottom line of the book is really rather obvious if we don't try to overinterpret the symbolism. There is a message in the REAL title of the book: The Revelation of Jesus Christ. It is a book revealing the king of the kingdom of heaven as final victor, not matter what trials and tribulations come our way. In short, Revelation is a book of encouragement to Christians in tribulation.

So, to the question, who is the church of Laodicea? Some have sought to interpret that as a chronological "last era" of the church, because of the hints that Jesus will come, is near, and is knocking at the door in that church. That MAY be a valid interpretation.

Others interpret this as 7 conditions that exist in the church at ANY time. That may also be a valid interpretation.

The only thing that is for sure, is the admonition that if we have ears (which I presume most of us do), then we ought to listen to the letters to ALL the churches. I can only then presume that we are to learn something from each of the 7 churches.

Canada, America, Europe, Australia, New Zealand may think they are rich and yet perhaps they are really wretched, pitiable, poor, blind, and naked. I would certainly say that could apply to any of our rich western countries today, at least in principle.

[MrJim]

We need to begin with an understanding of what kind of literature Revelation is. It is apocalyptic literature, a genre which we rarely see today, except perhaps in political cartoons. The apocalyptic genre used symbolism heavily. It was created in a time when it was dangerous to criticize the Emperor, and so such leaders were referred to in caricature. As to who was specifically referred to by the cartoons of Revelation has been lost to history. God knew this and so there is a more important message in the book than who "am da beast" or any other of the dozens of interpretations of the book.

The bottom line of the book is really rather obvious if we don't try to overinterpret the symbolism. There is a message in the REAL title of the book: The Revelation of Jesus Christ. It is a book revealing the king of the kingdom of heaven as final victor, not matter what trials and tribulations come our way. In short, Revelation is a book of encouragement to Christians in tribulation.

So, to the question, who is the church of Laodicea? Some have sought to interpret that as a chronological "last era" of the church, because of the hints that Jesus will come, is near, and is knocking at the door in that church. That MAY be a valid interpretation.

Others interpret this as 7 conditions that exist in the church at ANY time. That may also be a valid interpretation.

The only thing that is for sure, is the admonition that if we have ears (which I presume most of us do), then we ought to listen to the letters to ALL the churches. I can only then presume that we are to learn something from each of the 7 churches.

Canada, America, Europe, Australia, New Zealand may think they are rich and yet perhaps they are really wretched, pitiable, poor, blind, and naked. I would certainly say that could apply to any of our rich western countries today, at least in principle.

http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2008/02/funny-pictures-cat-scratches-post.jpg

[Abashag]

We need to begin with an understanding of what kind of literature Revelation is. It is apocalyptic literature, a genre which we rarely see today, except perhaps in political cartoons. The apocalyptic genre used symbolism heavily. It was created in a time when it was dangerous to criticize the Emperor, and so such leaders were referred to in caricature. As to who was specifically referred to by the cartoons of Revelation has been lost to history. God knew this and so there is a more important message in the book than who "am da beast" or any other of the dozens of interpretations of the book.

The bottom line of the book is really rather obvious if we don't try to overinterpret the symbolism. There is a message in the REAL title of the book: The Revelation of Jesus Christ. It is a book revealing the king of the kingdom of heaven as final victor, not matter what trials and tribulations come our way. In short, Revelation is a book of encouragement to Christians in tribulation.
I disagree with you on this, but oh well... :)

So, to the question, who is the church of Laodicea? Some have sought to interpret that as a chronological "last era" of the church, because of the hints that Jesus will come, is near, and is knocking at the door in that church. That MAY be a valid interpretation.

Others interpret this as 7 conditions that exist in the church at ANY time. That may also be a valid interpretation.

The only thing that is for sure, is the admonition that if we have ears (which I presume most of us do), then we ought to listen to the letters to ALL the churches. I can only then presume that we are to learn something from each of the 7 churches.

Canada, America, Europe, Australia, New Zealand may think they are rich and yet perhaps they are really wretched, pitiable, poor, blind, and naked. I would certainly say that could apply to any of our rich western countries today, at least in principle.
This I agree with :) I think that all of those interpretations of the seven letters work. After all, scripture often has more than one truth contained in it in a given verse :)

[Koey]

An excellent study resource on the book of Revelation

http://www.amazon.com/Revelation-Four-Views-Parallel-Commentary/dp/0840721285

[Maranatha27]

Laodicea, I agree that the meaning of the letter was to an actual church in Laodicea, is typical of the church period from 1925 to the present. and of the 7 churches mentioned all can be found in the world today. Agree of disagee I believe the book of Revelation is the last week in Daniels 70 week prophecy starting in 4:1 come up hither.....

[Simon_Templar]

The letter to the seven Churches were all written to seven literal, real churches that existed at that time. This is the first point that should be understood. The things that are written in them applied directly to those Churches at that time, and were pertinant to those Churches at that time.

This is just like Paul's epistles, to say the Corinthian Church, or to the Ephesian Chruch etc. They were all written to specific Churches and addressed things which were going on in those Churches at that time.

Now, with Paul's epistles, those letters also have broader application because the principles they declare, and the problems they address are problems that are common to all Churches at all times.
The same is true in revelation's letters to the seven Chruches. They contain problems that the whole Church faces, and has faced repeatedly through out history in different places.

God singled out those places to receive these messages because they were typical of what all Churches face, and problems that will come against the entire Church through out time.

As such, I believe, even the names of the Churches are symbolic, in that they teach us something about the problems and solutions that God presents.

For example. The name Laodicea means "the people judge" or "the people decide".

This is indicative of the fact that in this Church, the people had begun to decide for themselves what was right and wrong, what they would do and wouldn't do etc. They conformed their teaching and their faith to themselves rather than to Jesus Christ.

This is why they thought they were rich, and could see, but in God's eyes they were poor and blind. The "hot" and "cold" spoken of refers to usefullness to God. The city of Laodicea was famed for its natural springs. Some where hot and some were cold. The hot springs were supposed to have healing powers, while the cold springs were refreshing. The water that was brought into the city by Aquaduct, however, was tepid and warm and as such was unpalatable by comparison.

This reflects that people who make up their own gospel are useless to God and his kingdom. They accomplish nothing of value and so they are unpalatable to God.

At the end we see God saying, come and get your gold from me, and get your white robes from me, and get your eye salve from me.. this again is about the fact that the people were deciding their own truths, rather than going to God. He is telling them, give up your self made faith and come to me for the truth.

In each of these letters you'll notice that it begins with a description of Jesus. The description of Jesus that it gives relates directly to the problem described in the Church.

In this letter Jesus is said to be first "the Amen". This might seem confusing and we might have a tendancy to dismiss this as just some grand title.. but it does have important meaning.

The word "amen" means "so be it". It was used as a declaration of affirmation. In other words, when a person said Amen, they were affirming something that had just been said, declaring that it was true, and they agreed with it.

In Christian terms, the word Amen was used in worship services by the congregation as a statement that they agreed with what had been prayed, or taught, or sung etc. So if the pastor prayed a prayer, and everyone said "amen" everyone was included in agreement with what the pastor just prayed.

So when we see Jesus as the Amen, it means he is our agreement. This again speaks to the idea that the people were deciding truth for themselves. They were not agreeing with Christ.

The next statement about Jesus is that the is the faithful and true witness.. so he is our agreement, and we also have assurance here that what he tells us is faithful and true.. it is trust worthy, and it always comes to pass.. whatever is not in agreement with it, necessarily, thus is false.

lastly it tells us that he was the beginning of God's creation. This is a statement of authority. He is the first born of Creation, he has the position of authority over all creation. Thus we are bound to obey and to agree with him.

[dayhiker]

Seems to me in that they think they don't need anything then they are missing the who point of the gospel. Namely that Jesus is our rightousness and since we don't have righteousness then we need all of it from Jesus. We are naked without God's righeousness. Be are clothed when we accept Jesus' righteousness.

[salida]

These are actual churches that existed long ago and it applies for today. In otherwords, the Spirit is judging these churches - some love the Lord and some are just having "church" and have lost their first love which is Christ. Thus, are working in the flesh not the Spirit which is what counts.

[bill16652]

I agree that it is for today and for this time and was also relevant back then as well. The multi-layers is an exact description of scripture. I believe that this applies spiritually as well as materially. If we have what we need then many do not look to the source of what we have and forget about Him. There is coming a day that we can all see ZI believe when medicine and doctors will be priced out of most peoples range, when transportation and food may reach the same point, when any disruption in the supply chain coould create panic. We must rely on God as our source, our provider and if we dont we certainly wont when the times are like that. A soldier doesnt take training in na battle, he is already prepared and so it is with faith, we build it in the good times or we wont have it in the bad.

[Nadiine]

I agree that it is for today and for this time and was also relevant back then as well. The multi-layers is an exact description of scripture. I believe that this applies spiritually as well as materially. If we have what we need then many do not look to the source of what we have and forget about Him. There is coming a day that we can all see ZI believe when medicine and doctors will be priced out of most peoples range, when transportation and food may reach the same point, when any disruption in the supply chain coould create panic. We must rely on God as our source, our provider and if we dont we certainly wont when the times are like that. A soldier doesnt take training in na battle, he is already prepared and so it is with faith, we build it in the good times or we wont have it in the bad.
:amen:

I believe these were real churches thruout history and currently as John wrote Revelation. I also think that the same conditions they were found in (spiritually) are the same conditions all churches can be in or fall into if they aren't on gaurd or spiritually awake & alert.

The things I think are important about Revelation (or in the book) are that it's the ONLY book that God gives a warning in tampering with - we don't even see that in the all important gospels.
It's the only book that gives a blessing for reading it, and it's important in the beginning where John gives the outline of what's relayed in it - he was told to specifically write (in chronological order) what WAS, IS, and IS TO COME. (past present future).

But as to the passage of this OP, I'd say it's a rich church that values materialism as what matters over spiritual richness. So they could be spiritually starving and dead, but think they're well off becuz they have material wealth?

[Koey]

How do we find out what the experts who know Greek and historical context, etc. say on this topic? Some commentaries only give an opinion too, or a bias. The better quality commentaries actually contain sections of analysis, such as textual analysis, canonicity, literary criticism (read analysis), authorship, date, purpose, cultural and historic setting, genre, themes, translation problems, and so on.

Examples of better quality commentaries are Word Biblical Commentary and New International Commentary on the New Testament.

[JPPT1974]

God knows which churches
Truely worship Him and
Which don't as sometimes
People are in church only to be there
He knows peoples' hearts bear in mind.