Does Hebrews 4 teach a spiritual Sabbath?

[k4c]

Does Hebrews 4 teach us that the Sabbath is now a spiritual rest in Chrst rather than a literal day?

Hebrews 4:1-16 Therefore, since a promise remains of entering His rest, let us fear lest any of you seem to have come short of it. For indeed the gospel was preached to us as well as to them; but the word which they heard did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it. For we who have believed do enter that rest, as He has said: "So I swore in My wrath, they shall not enter My rest,'' although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. For He has spoken in a certain place of the seventh day in this way: "And God rested on the seventh day from all His works''; and again in this place: "They shall not enter My rest.'' Since therefore it remains that some must enter it, and those to whom it was first preached did not enter because of disobedience, again He designates a certain day, saying in David, "Today,'' after such a long time, as it has been said: "Today, if you will hear His voice, do not harden your hearts.'' For if Joshua had given them rest, then He would not afterward have spoken of another day. There remains therefore a rest for the people of God. For he who has entered His rest has himself also ceased from his works as God did from His. Let us therefore be diligent to enter that rest, lest anyone fall after the same example of disobedience. For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a decerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all things are naked and open to the eyes of Him to whom we must give account. Seeing then that we have a great High Priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession. For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin. Let us therefore come boldly to the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy and find grace to help in time of need.

[OntheDL]

Is that a question?

Hebrews 4
9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. 10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

[Pythons]

Yes, it means Christ provides us with the Rest that God swore in His wrath the majority would never enter.

The "literal day" will be at death for those who die in Christ and for those alive at the time of the second coming it will be directly after the General Judgment.

The seventh Day according, to Sacred Tradition is still in effect in God as there wasn't an evening and morning 'the 8th day'. Heaven is a perpetual Rest and as such there would be no observing of times and seasons, days, months or years.

I just realize this isn't the D/D section... Sorry, if I'm allowed here a mod can delete.

[icedragon101]

wasn't this written for jewish people, to show then that christ was the fullfillment and therefore superior to all of jewish culture and religion, and they had missed there Messiah?

[k4c]

wasn't this written for jewish people, to show then that christ was the fullfillment and therefore superior to all of jewish culture and religion, and they had missed there Messiah?

The New Testament teaches a spiritual rest we have in Christ and how He becomes our Sabbath. All the prophecies of Daniel and Revelation speak of the beast kingdom changing God's law and time. The beast did change the law and time of God, which it had no right to do, but there is another thing the beast did, which is more deceiving than the change of day and that is the blining of the eyes to the true purpose of the Sabbath, as well as, the gospel itself.

2 Corinthians 4:4 Whose minds the god of this age has blinded, who do not believe, lest the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine on them.

The Sabbath rest of the fourth commandment is not a rest as in a need to sleep or regain strength, but rather, a ceasing of labors. God rested on the seventh day not to regain strength, but rather as a completion of His labors, a finished work.

There is a new creation in which God made through Jesus. Jesus' life, death and resurrection has made another completed work in which God rested. Hebrews 4
tells us that we enter into this rest by way of belief. It's not a literal day, as the fourth commandment speaks of, but rather, it's a position that we enter into by way of belief and trust in the finished work of Christ.

When we enter into this completed work we cease from our labors of trying to be made righteous before God for Jesus is our righteousness. We now start listening and obeying God moment by moment for daily living as a new creature.

This new creation, in which we enter into, is a finished work. There is no need to strive to be made right with God. There is no need to keep any laws of the Old Covenant to be made acceptable to God for who can really keep anything to God's satisfaction? There is one who did and it was Jesus.

The whole book of Hebrews speaks of the superiority of Christ over all things portrayed in the Old Covenant.

When we enter into Christ we become a new creation the old man is done. There is nothing we can do to the old man to make it good or right before God. The only thing the old man can do and needs to do is die. This is how we keep the Old Covenant Sabbath. Jesus gives us this beautiful picture in how He spent His final Sabbath of the old in the grave as a picture of the old man.

When we come out of the grave at baptism we identify with Jesus. In this we enter into a new life where Christ becomes our life. His words living and abiding in us through faith is what brings about a life that will be eternal. In this the old man has no part and needs to cease from it's works. This is not easy for the old man to do. This is why Hebrews says we must labor to enter into this rest because it won't be easy. The old man will constantly and continually dig it's way out of the grave
to add to what God is doing or take credit for what God has done. This is why in Hebrews we find God warning us not to provoke Him as Israel did in the wilderness. Today if we hear His voice we need to cease from our labors and begin to trust and obey God. Trust Him that the work is finished in Christ and beleive that He will be there for us when we obey Him.

Just as circumcision is in the New Covenant, the Sabbath is also. It's an inward rest in the finished work of Christ who is so much more superior than all the Old Covenant works and laws.

So yes, there still remains this day to enter into, this rest for the people of God through the finished work of Jesus Christ.

The law for the New Covenant Christian are the words of Christ.

John 12:48 "He who rejects Me, and does not receive My words, has that which judges him the word that I have spoken will judge him in the last day.

Is it wrong to keep the literal Sabbath day? No it's not. But in doing so we can't demand others to do the same because in doing so we take away from the finished work of Christ as being our true Sabbath rest.

[TrustAndObey]

The word "rest" in Hebrews 4:9 is translated from sabbatismos. ;)

[k4c]

The word "rest" in Hebrews 4:9 is translated from sabbatismos. ;)

Can you expound a little more...

[TrustAndObey]

Can you expound a little more...

Sure, Hebrews 4:9 is the only verse in scripture that uses the word sabbatismos.

I asked for a study about this in the Bible study section because I feel this is very important.

There are no verses to compare this one to obviously, so the best we can do is compare the use of sabbatismos in other forms of Greek literature. In every instance that I've seen it used (again, in Greek literature from around the same time period), it is always referring to the seventh day weekly Sabbath.

If you think about it, that's the only way it would make sense anyway. It says to rest AS God rested. He rested on the seventh day.

Hebrews 4 goes back and forth between verses about the eternal rest of heaven and the seventh day Sabbath.

And notice it says "remaineth" a rest for the people of God. There remaineth therefore a sabbatismos to the people of God.

The rest of heaven is yet to come.

[TrustAndObey]

Hebrews 4:4 is a very important verse as well:

For he spake in a certain place of the seventh [day] on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.

It's apparent that Hebrews 4 isn't just talking about the eternal rest of heaven.

In fact, even though this isn't the debate section, I totally disagree that Hebrews 4 is telling us that Jesus is our physical rest (spiritual rest, absolutely). He did not become a DAY. That is clearly pointed out in Hebrews 4:8 which specifically mentions a day, and doesn't say Jesus IS that day.

It says for "IF" Jesus had given us another day, wouldn't He have told us? Day is translated from hemera which is a literal 24-hour period in time. Nowhere does it say He became a day.

[k4c]

Hebrews 4:4 is a very important verse as well:

For he spake in a certain place of the seventh [day] on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.

It's apparent that Hebrews 4 isn't just talking about the eternal rest of heaven.

In fact, even though this isn't the debate section, I totally disagree that Hebrews 4 is telling us that Jesus is our physical rest (spiritual rest, absolutely). He did not become a DAY. That is clearly pointed out in Hebrews 4:8 which specifically mentions a day, and doesn't say Jesus IS that day.

It says for "IF" Jesus had given us another day, wouldn't He have told us? Day is translated from hemera which is a literal 24-hour period in time. Nowhere does it say He became a day.

It's important to stay in context when trying to establish the meaning of words in any particular verse. This one word "sabbatismos" can also have another meaning based on the context of the entire thought process of the writer. In order to grasp the thought process of the wirter I will have to refer you to the following link. http://www.wcg.org/lit/law/sabbath/hebrews4.9.htm

[TrustAndObey]

It's important to stay in context when trying to establish the meaning of words in any particular verse. This one word "sabbatismos" can also have another meaning based on the context of the entire thought process of the writer. In order to grasp the thought process of the wirter I will have to refer you to the following link. http://www.wcg.org/lit/law/sabbath/hebrews4.9.htm

I'm always hesitant to click on external links after a bad experience I had (here on CF no less) that linked out to a pornographic website...however, I trust you and I tried to go to that site and it didn't go anywhere. Are you sure you typed it in correctly?

I'm not sure that a website can take me into the thought process of the writer however. It can take me into the thought process of one person's INTERPRETATION of the writer's throught process, but nothing else.

I'm perfectly capable of drawing conclusions from within scripture itself without anyone's personal commentary (no offense).

I do agree with what you said about us not judging each other about the Sabbath. I agree wholeheartedly as a matter of fact.

To me, it is just plain obvious fact that the Sabbath commandment relates to all Christians in this day and age, and I don't have to go looking for debates about it. Fact is, the debates come to us within our own forum.

Can you check the link and then I'll go check it out. If I feel that this person(s) misinterpreted what they're reading, I advice that we move this thread to the debate section. The main forum is for fellowship posts.

[TrustAndObey]

k4c, the truth is that you and I are doing a fine job of interpreting scripture without outside influences, so let's dive in to this ourselves and see what we come up with.

First, I'd like to ask you...does Hebrews 4 mention the seventh day at all? Or are you contending that it is only talking about spiritual rest and the eternal rest of heaven?

I just want to clear that up before we continue so I'll have a solid foundation to build from.

[TrustAndObey]

Hold on, it worked when I clicked on it this time, so I'll go check it out.

[TrustAndObey]

Oh yeah, I'm already totally disagreeing with this person. I'm only a few paragraphs in and seeing CLEAR error.

k4c, will you PM a mod and ask them to move this thread to the debate section?

[ricker]

The New Testament teaches a spiritual rest we have in Christ and how He becomes our Sabbath. All the prophecies of Daniel and Revelation speak of the beast kingdom changing God's law and time. The beast did change the law and time of God, which it had no right to do, but there is another thing the beast did, which is more deceiving than the change of day and that is the blining of the eyes to the true purpose of the Sabbath, as well as, the gospel itself.

2 Corinthians 4:4 Whose minds the god of this age has blinded, who do not believe, lest the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine on them.

The Sabbath rest of the fourth commandment is not a rest as in a need to sleep or regain strength, but rather, a ceasing of labors. God rested on the seventh day not to regain strength, but rather as a completion of His labors, a finished work.

There is a new creation in which God made through Jesus. Jesus' life, death and resurrection has made another completed work in which God rested. Hebrews 4
tells us that we enter into this rest by way of belief. It's not a literal day, as the fourth commandment speaks of, but rather, it's a position that we enter into by way of belief and trust in the finished work of Christ.

When we enter into this completed work we cease from our labors of trying to be made righteous before God for Jesus is our righteousness. We now start listening and obeying God moment by moment for daily living as a new creature.

This new creation, in which we enter into, is a finished work. There is no need to strive to be made right with God. There is no need to keep any laws of the Old Covenant to be made acceptable to God for who can really keep anything to God's satisfaction? There is one who did and it was Jesus.

The whole book of Hebrews speaks of the superiority of Christ over all things portrayed in the Old Covenant.

When we enter into Christ we become a new creation the old man is done. There is nothing we can do to the old man to make it good or right before God. The only thing the old man can do and needs to do is die. This is how we keep the Old Covenant Sabbath. Jesus gives us this beautiful picture in how He spent His final Sabbath of the old in the grave as a picture of the old man.

When we come out of the grave at baptism we identify with Jesus. In this we enter into a new life where Christ becomes our life. His words living and abiding in us through faith is what brings about a life that will be eternal. In this the old man has no part and needs to cease from it's works. This is not easy for the old man to do. This is why Hebrews says we must labor to enter into this rest because it won't be easy. The old man will constantly and continually dig it's way out of the grave
to add to what God is doing or take credit for what God has done. This is why in Hebrews we find God warning us not to provoke Him as Israel did in the wilderness. Today if we hear His voice we need to cease from our labors and begin to trust and obey God. Trust Him that the work is finished in Christ and beleive that He will be there for us when we obey Him.

Just as circumcision is in the New Covenant, the Sabbath is also. It's an inward rest in the finished work of Christ who is so much more superior than all the Old Covenant works and laws.

So yes, there still remains this day to enter into, this rest for the people of God through the finished work of Jesus Christ.

The law for the New Covenant Christian are the words of Christ.

John 12:48 "He who rejects Me, and does not receive My words, has that which judges him the word that I have spoken will judge him in the last day.

Is it wrong to keep the literal Sabbath day? No it's not. But in doing so we can't demand others to do the same because in doing so we take away from the finished work of Christ as being our true Sabbath rest.

:amen: Thank you k4c for these wonderful words. You have a great grasp of what Hebrews 4 means to Christians!
God Bless! Ricker

[reddogs]

I've moved the thread for more open discussion to the Discussion and Debate and a more appropriate forum.


Red
Seventh-Day Adventist Forum Moderator

[Cribstyl]

It's important to stay in context when trying to establish the meaning of words in any particular verse. This one word "sabbatismos" can also have another meaning based on the context of the entire thought process of the writer. In order to grasp the thought process of the wirter I will have to refer you to the following link. http://www.wcg.org/lit/law/sabbath/hebrews4.9.htm

K4c, :thumbsup: This is an excellent article and commentary about Heb 4.

My name is CRIBSTYL and I approve of this message.;)


As noted in the article, the context concerning God's Rest begins in Heb chapter 3.

Hbr 3:7 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/popup.pl?book=Hbr&chapter=3&verse=7&version=kjv#7) begins to teach about getting into God's rest "today" because Christ has made a way for believers to enter.

And..even after the COI entered the promised land, they did not enter God's rest.
This proves that "God's rest" and a "day of rest" unto God is not the same thing. The day of rest is a sign of God's rest that was fulfilled in Jesus.

This also proves that Moses words were accurate concerning when sabbath was given in Ex16 vs when God only rested in Gen 2:1-3.


(my comment are not to enflame my SDA friends who have this issue settled, but rather to cause you to reexamine your truths.
So, as you pray for my eyes to be opened,thank you...... I am praying for you too, in tongues :crossrc: )

In peace and love
CRIB

[Cribstyl]

In an objective look for where keeping the sabbath is taught to christian, there is no commandment given, nor is there a lesson we can point to. If so post in now.

The word "sabbath" or it's plural, does not come up in a search beyond what is listed here; click on any book to see each book's content.

Exd(12) (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/search/preSearch.cfm?Criteria=sabbath&t=KJV&cscs=Exd)Lev(12) (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/search/preSearch.cfm?Criteria=sabbath&t=KJV&cscs=Lev)Num(3) (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/search/preSearch.cfm?Criteria=sabbath&t=KJV&cscs=Num)Deu(3) (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/search/preSearch.cfm?Criteria=sabbath&t=KJV&cscs=Deu)2Ki(5) (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/search/preSearch.cfm?Criteria=sabbath&t=KJV&cscs=2Ki)1Ch(1) (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/search/preSearch.cfm?Criteria=sabbath&t=KJV&cscs=1Ch)2Ch(3) (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/search/preSearch.cfm?Criteria=sabbath&t=KJV&cscs=2Ch)Neh(9) (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/search/preSearch.cfm?Criteria=sabbath&t=KJV&cscs=Neh)Psa(1) (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/search/preSearch.cfm?Criteria=sabbath&t=KJV&cscs=Psa)Isa(4) (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/search/preSearch.cfm?Criteria=sabbath&t=KJV&cscs=Isa)Jer(4) (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/search/preSearch.cfm?Criteria=sabbath&t=KJV&cscs=Jer)Eze(3) (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/search/preSearch.cfm?Criteria=sabbath&t=KJV&cscs=Eze)Amo(1) (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/search/preSearch.cfm?Criteria=sabbath&t=KJV&cscs=Amo)Mat(9) (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/search/preSearch.cfm?Criteria=sabbath&t=KJV&cscs=Mat)Mar(10) (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/search/preSearch.cfm?Criteria=sabbath&t=KJV&cscs=Mar)Luk(17) (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/search/preSearch.cfm?Criteria=sabbath&t=KJV&cscs=Luk)Jhn(9) (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/search/preSearch.cfm?Criteria=sabbath&t=KJV&cscs=Jhn)Act(9) (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/search/preSearch.cfm?Criteria=sabbath&t=KJV&cscs=Act)Col(1) (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/search/preSearch.cfm?Criteria=sabbath&t=KJV&cscs=Col)

And in Paul letters this is what what is taught.

Col 2:16 (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Col&c=2&v=16&t=KJV#16) Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath [days]:


Hebrews 3 and 4 reveals that God's rest from the creation of the world has been offered but no man has entered until Christ.

Here are all the text concerning "rest" in Hebrew. We understand from this context that people have kept a day of rest ( as a sabbath) but have not entered God's rest.

God's rest cannot be defiled but text prove that the sabbath day was poluted from generation to generations.
Hbr 3:11 (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Hbr&c=3&v=11&t=KJV#11)So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.)

Hbr 3:18 (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Hbr&c=3&v=18&t=KJV#18)And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not?

Hbr 4:1 (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Hbr&c=4&v=1&t=KJV#1)Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left [us] of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.

Hbr 4:3 (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Hbr&c=4&v=3&t=KJV#3)For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
Hbr 4:4 (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Hbr&c=4&v=4&t=KJV#4)For he spake in a certain place of the seventh [day] on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.
Hbr 4:5 (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Hbr&c=4&v=5&t=KJV#5)And in this [place] again, If they shall enter into my rest.

Hbr 4:8 (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Hbr&c=4&v=8&t=KJV#8)For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.
Hbr 4:9 (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Hbr&c=4&v=9&t=KJV#9)There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.
Hbr 4:10 (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Hbr&c=4&v=10&t=KJV#10)For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God [did] from his.
Hbr 4:11 (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Hbr&c=4&v=11&t=KJV#11)Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.



The rest that remaineth for God's people is a place at the feet of Jesus and not a 24hr day.Mat 11:28 (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Mat&c=11&v=28&t=KJV#28)Come unto me, all [ye] that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

CRIB

[SoldierOfTheKing]

1. Is there any other place in the New Testament where the Sabbath is referred to as anything put a day set aside as holy to God?

2. Under this New Covenant "spiritual rest" what are we supposed to be resting from?

[Cribstyl]

1. Is there any other place in the New Testament where the Sabbath is referred to as anything put a day set aside as holy to God?


Trick question, because sabbath days were set aside to validated Jews within their teritores.
The animals, strangers and land were commanded to rest too. What we understand from text is, converts to Judaism kept the sabbath.

Yes, Jews keeping sabbath is evident in the NT, because God gave Moses a covenant for the COI.
Many Jewish ceromonies are written in the New Testament.
A fair question should be; "what is taught about sabbath to Gentiles who turn to Jesus Christ?"
You should prove that Gentiles are commanded to keep the sabbath. There are many command taught in the New Testament, but you know that Sabbath is not.

2. Under this New Covenant "spiritual rest" what are we supposed to be resting from?

everything, life, trails, pain, and sickness. "Rest" happens in believers when we trade our burdens for His. It is actually the gift of the Holy Spirit.


CRIB

[Byfaithalone1]

Does Hebrews 4 teach us that the Sabbath is now a spiritual rest in Chrst rather than a literal day?

Let's imagine for one moment that Hebrews 4 refers to a literal day. What would prevent us from concluding that the "rest" described in Hebrews 4 refers to the following:

"Speak to the sons of Israel, saying, 'In the seventh month on the first of the month you shall have a rest, a reminder by blowing of trumpets, a holy convocation. 'You shall not do any laborious work, but you shall present an offering by fire to the LORD" Lev. 23:24-25

"You shall not do any work on this same day, for it is a day of atonement, to make atonement on your behalf before the LORD your God. If there is any person who will not humble himself on this same day, he shall be cut off from his people. As for any person who does any work on this same day, that person I will destroy from among his people. You shall do no work at all. It is to be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwelling places. It is to be a sabbath of complete rest to you, and you shall humble your souls; on the ninth of the month at evening, from evening until evening you shall keep your sabbath." Lev. 23:28-32

"'On exactly the fifteenth day of the seventh month, when you have gathered in the crops of the land, you shall celebrate the feast of the LORD for seven days, with a rest on the first day and a rest on the eighth day." Lev. 23:39
Do you believe that Hebrews 4 is describing these days of rest???

BFA

[SoldierOfTheKing]

Trick question, because sabbath days were set aside to validated Jews within their teritores.
The animals, strangers and land were commanded to rest too. What we understand from text is, converts to Judaism kept the sabbath.

Yes, Jews keeping sabbath is evident in the NT, because God gave Moses a covenant for the COI.
Many Jewish ceromonies are written in the New Testament.
A fair question should be; "what is taught about sabbath to Gentiles who turn to Jesus Christ?"
You should prove that Gentiles are commanded to keep the sabbath. There are many command taught in the New Testament, but you know that Sabbath is not.



I'll take that as a no. :)


everything, life, trails, pain, and sickness.


Christians experience none of these?

[Cribstyl]

I'll take that as a no. :)

The answer is Yes, but God commanded only the COI to keep the sabbath as a day of rest. The Gentile nations had no prophets we can name that was sent from God.
Error comes into the equation when you ignor the true doctrines of God. He IS accepting the Gentile nations through faith in His Son by the sign of baptism and not by sabbath keeping (READ IT) Col 2:12 (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Col&c=2&v=12&t=KJV#12)-17.
Yes,The Sabbath is commanded in the law as a sign that He is the creator.
God calls the world through faith is Jesus and not by the work of the law . (READ IT) Gal 3:8 (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Gal&c=3&v=8&t=KJV#8)-14

A major facts to consider is that Jesus is also revealed as the creator. Thus faith is what He commands us to prove we believe.
How can you ignor that Christ has called 12 apostles to establish His church? Who should we listen to, Moses?



Jhn 3:16 (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Jhn&c=3&v=16&t=KJV#16)For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

J (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Jhn&c=5&v=26&t=KJV#26)hn 5:26 For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself;


Jhn 6:53 (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Jhn&c=6&v=53&t=KJV#53)Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.


Jhn 20:31 (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Jhn&c=20&v=31&t=KJV#31)But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.


1Jo 5:13 (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=1Jo&c=5&v=13&t=KJV#13)These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

The Jews who kepts the sabbath rejected and killed Jesus Christ.

Those who keep pushing the sabbath do it by misunderstanding how God calls the world to Himself. They reject what the true prophets said about God's new covenant by forcing you to keep the old. The Gospel of Jesus Christ is not a hidden or reasoned teaching. Truth is, it's taught nowherelse but in the NT. Eph3:5 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Eph&chapter=3&translation=nkjvp&x=7&y=10#)



Christians experience none of these?

Jesus Gives True Rest
(Luke 10:21 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Mat&chapter=11&translation=nkjvp&x=11&y=8#), 22 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Mat&chapter=11&translation=nkjvp&x=11&y=8#))
25 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Mat&chapter=11&translation=nkjvp&x=11&y=8#)At that time Jesus answered and said, "I thank You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that You have hidden these things from the wise and prudent and have revealed them to babes.
26 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Mat&chapter=11&translation=nkjvp&x=11&y=8#) Even so, Father, for so it seemed good in Your sight.
27 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Mat&chapter=11&translation=nkjvp&x=11&y=8#) All things have been delivered to Me by My Father, and no one knows the Son except the Father. Nor does anyone know the Father except the Son, and the one to whom the Son wills to reveal Him.
28 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Mat&chapter=11&translation=nkjvp&x=11&y=8#)Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
29 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Mat&chapter=11&translation=nkjvp&x=11&y=8#) Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls.
30 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Mat&chapter=11&translation=nkjvp&x=11&y=8#) For My yoke is easy and My burden is light."

In peace
CRIB

[Byfaithalone1]

1. Is there any other place in the New Testament where the Sabbath is referred to as anything put a day set aside as holy to God?

2. Under this New Covenant "spiritual rest" what are we supposed to be resting from?


Let's imagine for one moment that your conclusion is correct and Hebrews 4 refers to a literal day. What would prevent us from concluding that the "rest" described in Hebrews 4 refers to the following:

"Speak to the sons of Israel, saying, 'In the seventh month on the first of the month you shall have a rest, a reminder by blowing of trumpets, a holy convocation. 'You shall not do any laborious work, but you shall present an offering by fire to the LORD" Lev. 23:24-25


"You shall not do any work on this same day, for it is a day of atonement, to make atonement on your behalf before the LORD your God. If there is any person who will not humble himself on this same day, he shall be cut off from his people. As for any person who does any work on this same day, that person I will destroy from among his people. You shall do no work at all. It is to be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwelling places. It is to be a sabbath of complete rest to you, and you shall humble your souls; on the ninth of the month at evening, from evening until evening you shall keep your sabbath." Lev. 23:28-32


"'On exactly the fifteenth day of the seventh month, when you have gathered in the crops of the land, you shall celebrate the feast of the LORD for seven days, with a rest on the first day and a rest on the eighth day." Lev. 23:39

Do you believe that Hebrews 4 is describing these days of rest??? Why or why not?

BFA

[k4c]

The book of Hebrews is very clear in that it teaches us that the first covenant, which includes the Ten Commandments, is done away with in Christ.

Hebrews 8:13 In that He says, "A new covenant,'' He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.

Read Hebrews 9 and you will see that the Ten Commandments is part of the Old Covevant, it doesn't get any clearer.

Hebrews 9:1-3 Now in that first covenant between God and his people there were rules for worship and there was a sacred tent down here on earth. Inside this place of worship there were two rooms. The first one contained the golden candlestick and a table with special loaves of holy bread upon it; this part was called the Holy Place. Then there was a curtain and behind the curtain was a room called the Holy of Holies. In that room there were a golden incense-altar and the golden chest, called the ark of the covenant, completely covered on all sides with pure gold. Inside the ark were the tablets of stone with the Ten Commandments written on them, and a golden jar with some manna in it, and Aaron's wooden cane that budded.

Did you notice that the Ten Commandments are wrapped up in the Old Covenant?

The New Covenant is now founded on the words of Christ.

John 12:48 "He who rejects Me, and does not receive My words, has that which judges him the word that I have spoken will judge him in the last day.

And the sign of the New Covenant is no longer the seventh day Sabbath, but rather, it is the Lord's supper.

1 Corinthians 11:25 In the same manner He also took the cup after supper, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in My blood. This do, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of Me.''

Luke 22:19-20 And He took bread, gave thanks and broke it, and gave it to them, saying, "This is My body which is given for you; do this in remembrance of Me.'' Likewise He also took the cup after supper, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in My blood, which is shed for you.

[PROPHECYKID]

K4c I was in your position a few months ago. I went in general theology and was debating about the Sabbath and that passage in Hebrews came up. The poster was saying that we now rest in Christ ans that we rest from our work of attaining salvation by works. Of course i debated against that thought but i realized that the rest is actually not directly addressing the Sabbath but something else. That is when i decided to really take a deeper look. Let me try my best to show you what i have learnt.

That poster was wrong but many Adventist are also wrong about the meaning of this rest. To get the context of this rest we must go back to chapter 3.

Heb 3:7 Wherefore (as the Holy Ghost saith, Today if ye will hear his voice,
Heb 3:8 Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
Heb 3:9 When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years.
Heb 3:10 Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do always err in their heart; and they have not known my ways.
Heb 3:11 So I swore in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.)

Heb 3:15 While it is said, Today if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation.
Heb 3:16 For some, when they had heard, did provoke: howbeit not all that came out of Egypt by Moses.
Heb 3:17 But with whom was he grieved forty years? was it not with them that had sinned, whose carcasses fell in the wilderness?
Heb 3:18 And to whom swore he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not?
Heb 3:19 So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief.

This rest is not the Sabbath rest because God did not prevent them from keeping the Sabbath for 40 years. Let us see what this rest is speaking about.

Deu 3:18 And I commanded you at that time, saying, The LORD your God hath given you this land to possess it: ye shall pass over armed before your brethren the children of Israel, all that are meet for the war.
Deu 3:19 But your wives, and your little ones, and your cattle, (for I know that ye have much cattle,) shall abide in your cities which I have given you;
Deu 3:20 Until the LORD have given rest unto your brethren, as well as unto you, and until they also possess the land which the LORD your God hath given them beyond Jordan: and then shall ye return every man unto his possession, which I have given you.

Deu 12:8 Ye shall not do after all the things that we do here this day, every man whatsoever is right in his own eyes.
Deu 12:9 For ye are not as yet come to the rest and to the inheritance, which the LORD your God giveth you.
Deu 12:10 But when ye go over Jordan, and dwell in the land which the LORD your God giveth you to inherit, and when he giveth you rest from all your enemies round about, so that ye dwell in safety;

So this rest was referring to an actual rest and protection from their enemies in the promised land. Remember they did not enter because of Unbelief.

Num 14:6 And Joshua the son of Nun, and Caleb the son of Jephunneh, which were of them that searched the land, rent their clothes:
Num 14:7 And they spoke unto all the company of the children of Israel, saying, The land, which we passed through to search it, is an exceeding good land.
Num 14:10 But all the congregation bade stone them with stones. And the glory of the LORD appeared in the tabernacle of the congregation before all the children of Israel.
Num 14:11 And the LORD said unto Moses, How long will this people provoke me? and how long will it be ere they believe me, for all the signs which I have showed among them?
Num 14:33 And your children shall wander in the wilderness forty years, and bear your whoredoms, until your carcasses be wasted in the wilderness.
Num 14:34 After the number of the days in which ye searched the land, even forty days, each day for a year, shall ye bear your iniquities, even forty years, and ye shall know my breach of promise.

The children of Israel did not enter the promise land because of unbelief. They did not enter the rest because of Unbelief. Joshau and Caleb was offering them an opportunity for rest by their testimony but they did not believe. Joshau had to lead them to that rest after the forty years was finished.

Jos 1:1 Now after the death of Moses the servant of the LORD it came to pass, that the LORD spoke unto Joshua the son of Nun, Moses' minister, saying,
Jos 1:2 Moses my servant is dead; now therefore arise, go over this Jordan, thou, and all this people, unto the land which I do give to them, even to the children of Israel.
Jos 1:3 Every place that the sole of your foot shall tread upon, that have I given unto you, as I said unto Moses.
Jos 1:10 Then Joshua commanded the officers of the people, saying,
Jos 1:11 Pass through the host, and command the people, saying, Prepare you victuals; for within three days ye shall pass over this Jordan, to go in to possess the land, which the LORD your God giveth you to possess it.

If Joshau had given them rest (meaning if the people had listened to him the first time), then we would have not afterward have to command them to enter into that rest another time.

Many people say that the rest is "Today" because chapter 4 does say that today harden not your heart. But if that is true then the rest was "today" in David's day because Hebrews was only quoting psalms.

Heb 4:7 Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, Today, after so long a time; as it is said, Today if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.
Psa 95:7 For he is our God; and we are the people of his pasture, and the sheep of his hand. Today if ye will hear his voice,
Psa 95:8 Harden not your heart, as in the provocation, and as in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
Psa 95:9 When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my work.
Psa 95:10 Forty years long was I grieved with this generation, and said, It is a people that do err in their heart, and they have not known my ways:
Psa 95:11 Unto whom I swore in my wrath that they should not enter into my rest.

So if the rest was referring to safety and protection in the promised land can't you see that there is another promised land that is awaiting us. If we don't believe we will not enter that land. We will never have to worry about spiritual or Physical enemies in that land. I must say however that verse 9 uses a word that questions everything that I just posted. TrustandObey made mention of the word Sabbatismos which literally means a Sabbath rest. We must try to see how it all fits together.

Many people also say that the rest of Hebrews replaces the Sabbath rest. My question is, Did the Israelited keep the Sabbath after entering into that rest? Of course. That rest does not replace the Im not exactly finished but i will stop here and give way to comments.

[PROPHECYKID]

The Old covenant was referring to the earthly Sanctuary services in the main. Because the 10 commandments was in the ark of the covenant it does not mean that it is done away with. That is because the ark of the covenant is in heaven as stated in Revelation 11 and 15. God's 10 commandments are protected in heaven. God has written his law on the hearts of men in th new covenant. It is the same 10 commandments that were in the heart of Abraham. The same 10 commandments that the saints in Revelation 14 and 12 would keep. More is coming later. I have an exam right now so i have to go.

[Byfaithalone1]

The Old covenant was referring to the earthly Sanctuary services in the main.

Galatians 4:21-31 refers to the "covenant from Sinai" or the "covenant given at Sinai." What was given at Sinai?

2 Corinthians 3 refers to letters engraved in stone. They were fading and brought death. What laws were engraved in stone?

Romans 7:6-7 clearly refers to the law governing coveting. Would you consider "coveting" to be a ceremonial or a moral law?

Because the 10 commandments was in the ark of the covenant it does not mean that it is done away with.

The commandments were also in the book beside the ark. Note that several of the laws that many would consider to be "ceremonial laws" were, in fact, engraved in stone by God (see Exodus 34).

God's 10 commandments are protected in heaven.

Please cite confirmation from Scripture that some laws were fulfilled and that others remain. Matthew 5 confirms that not one jot or tittle shall pass until ALL are fulfilled. Your claim seems to contradict Scripture.

God has written his law on the hearts of men in th new covenant. It is the same 10 commandments that were in the heart of Abraham.

Please support this claim from Scripture. I do not believe that the Scriptures teach this and I prefer to base my understanding on what Scripture teaches.

BFA

[Cribstyl]

...............Many people also say that the rest of Hebrews replaces the Sabbath rest. My question is, Did the Israelited keep the Sabbath after entering into that rest? Of course. That rest does not replace the Im not exactly finished but i will stop here and give way to comments.

In reply to post
#26 (http://christianforums.com/showpost.php?p=44894741&postcount=26)

You're right to notice that, the rest is not about man keeping a 24 sabbath, but you fail to connect the how that "remaining rest" relates to God's rest from creation.



Hebrews 3and 4 is speaking about specifically about "God's rest" which is written in Gen 2:1-3.


"So I swore in My wrath,
'They shall not enter My rest,'"[fn1] (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Hbr&chapter=4&translation=nkjvp&x=10&y=8#_fnt_1)
although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

4 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Hbr&chapter=4&translation=nkjvp&x=10&y=8#) For He has spoken in a certain place of the seventh day in this way: "And God rested on the seventh day from all His works"; [fn2] (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Hbr&chapter=4&translation=nkjvp&x=10&y=8#_fnt_2)

5 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Hbr&chapter=4&translation=nkjvp&x=10&y=8#) and again in this place: "They shall not enter My rest." [fn3] (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Hbr&chapter=4&translation=nkjvp&x=10&y=8#_fnt_3)
6 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Hbr&chapter=4&translation=nkjvp&x=10&y=8#)Since therefore it remains that some must enter it, and those to whom it was first preached did not enter because of disobedience,
7 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Hbr&chapter=4&translation=nkjvp&x=10&y=8#) again He designates a certain day, saying in David, "Today," after such a long time, as it has been said:



This is a puzzle to those who believe that man entered God's rest at creation and God's rest is 24hr break rather that "a cease", an end of creating all things.





God's rest is a spiritual place that those washed in the blood can enter, it's at the feet of Jesus. It is at Mt.Zion a spiritual place where believers can enter by faith.

CRIB

[PROPHECYKID]

In reply to post
#26 (http://christianforums.com/showpost.php?p=44894741&postcount=26)

You're right to notice that, the rest is not about man keeping a 24 sabbath, but you fail to connect the how that "remaining rest" relates to God's rest from creation.



Hebrews 3and 4 is speaking about specifically about "God's rest" which is written in Gen 2:1-3.


"So I swore in My wrath,
'They shall not enter My rest,'"[fn1] (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Hbr&chapter=4&translation=nkjvp&x=10&y=8#_fnt_1)
although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

4 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Hbr&chapter=4&translation=nkjvp&x=10&y=8#) For He has spoken in a certain place of the seventh day in this way: "And God rested on the seventh day from all His works"; [fn2] (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Hbr&chapter=4&translation=nkjvp&x=10&y=8#_fnt_2)

5 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Hbr&chapter=4&translation=nkjvp&x=10&y=8#) and again in this place: "They shall not enter My rest." [fn3] (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Hbr&chapter=4&translation=nkjvp&x=10&y=8#_fnt_3)
6 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Hbr&chapter=4&translation=nkjvp&x=10&y=8#)Since therefore it remains that some must enter it, and those to whom it was first preached did not enter because of disobedience,
7 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/tools/printer-friendly.pl?book=Hbr&chapter=4&translation=nkjvp&x=10&y=8#) again He designates a certain day, saying in David, "Today," after such a long time, as it has been said:



This is a puzzle to those who believe that man entered God's rest at creation and God's rest is 24hr break rather that "a cease", an end of creating all things.





God's rest is a spiritual place that those washed in the blood can enter, it's at the feet of Jesus. It is at Mt.Zion a spiritual place where believers can enter by faith.

CRIB
I have not failed to realize that. The passage gives evidence of the reassurance that the Sabbath remains. My point is that the rest spoken of is not speaking of the Sabbath in the immediate context. There is evidence however that a few references are made to the actual Sabbath.

[PROPHECYKID]

The Old covenant was referring to the earthly Sanctuary services in the main. Because the 10 commandments was in the ark of the covenant it does not mean that it is done away with. That is because the ark of the covenant is in heaven as stated in Revelation 11 and 15. God's 10 commandments are protected in heaven. God has written his law on the hearts of men in th new covenant. It is the same 10 commandments that were in the heart of Abraham. The same 10 commandments that the saints in Revelation 14 and 12 would keep. More is coming later. I have an exam right now so i have to go.
Let me apologize for this post. I was in a hurry and i didn't really make a good response.

[Cribstyl]

I have not failed to realize that. The passage gives evidence of the reassurance that the Sabbath remains. My point is that the rest spoken of is not speaking of the Sabbath in the immediate context. There is evidence however that a few references are made to the actual Sabbath.

Well, post any text that mentions anything about a weekly sabbath in Hebrews 3 or 4, but until then entering God rest is the subject and Christian can enter after Jesus rested from His work.

Take your time, I'll be waiting.

CRIB

[SoldierOfTheKing]

The answer is Yes

If the answer is yes, there is another place in the Scriptures that sabbath refers to some something other than a day set aside as holy to God, (that was my question) then, pray tell what is it?

You should prove that Gentiles are commanded to keep the sabbath. There are many command taught in the New Testament, but you know that Sabbath is not.

It is in Hebrews 4. That's why non-Sabbatarians have to find another interpretation to explain it away. Sabbath, which everywhere else in Scripture refers to a holy day, has to mean something else here.

Let's imagine for one moment that your conclusion is correct and Hebrews 4 refers to a literal day. What would prevent us from concluding that the "rest" described in Hebrews 4 refers to the following:
"Speak to the sons of Israel, saying, 'In the seventh month on the first of the month you shall have a rest, a reminder by blowing of trumpets, a holy convocation. 'You shall not do any laborious work, but you shall present an offering by fire to the LORD" Lev. 23:24-25"You shall not do any work on this same day, for it is a day of atonement, to make atonement on your behalf before the LORD your God. If there is any person who will not humble himself on this same day, he shall be cut off from his people. As for any person who does any work on this same day, that person I will destroy from among his people. You shall do no work at all. It is to be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwelling places. It is to be a sabbath of complete rest to you, and you shall humble your souls; on the ninth of the month at evening, from evening until evening you shall keep your sabbath." Lev. 23:28-32"'On exactly the fifteenth day of the seventh month, when you have gathered in the crops of the land, you shall celebrate the feast of the LORD for seven days, with a rest on the first day and a rest on the eighth day." Lev. 23:39Do you believe that Hebrews 4 is describing these days of rest??? Why or why not?

That's a really good question. I've always thought of it as being a reference to the weekly Sabbath, since that is the Sabbath emphasized in the Fourth Commandment. As to whether the annual high Sabbaths could figure into this too, that is entirely possible, considering how they point to God's plan of redemption.

[k4c]

Everything under the Old Covenant has been made obsolete in Christ. The law on stone of the Old Covenant is a ministry of death and condemnation. Why is this? Because the law can never make anyone righteous before God and we know that righteousness is the main point of salvation.

In the New Covenant, Christ is our righteousness, which brings about a rest for the people of God. God is using the book of Hebrews to point this out. God brings us back to His rest on the seventh day of creation to help us understand the finished work we have in Christ. God is not pointing us back to the fourth commandment, but rather, He is pointing us back to the finished work of the seventh day.

Take a close and careful look at the context of Hebrews leading up to Hebrews 4 and notice how its all about the rest we have in Christ and the joy that this rest brings to us.

Hebrews 3:5-7 And Moses indeed was faithful in all His house as a servant, for a testimony of those things which would be spoken afterward, but Christ as a Son over His own house, whose house we are if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm to the end. Therefore, as the Holy Spirit says: "Today, if you will hear His voice,

Hebrews 3:12-19 Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God; but exhort one another daily, while it is called "Today,'' lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. For we have become partakers of Christ if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end, while it is said: "Today, if you will hear His voice, do not harden your hearts as in the rebellion.'' For who, having heard, rebelled? Indeed, was it not all who came out of Egypt, led by Moses? Now with whom was He angry forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose corpses fell in the wilderness? And to whom did He swear that they would not enter His rest, but to those who did not obey? So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief.

Hebrews 4:1-4 Therefore, since a promise remains of entering His rest, let us fear lest any of you seem to have come short of it. For indeed the gospel was preached to us as well as to them; but the word which they heard did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it. For we who have believed do enter that rest, as He has said: "So I swore in My wrath, they shall not enter My rest,'' although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. For He has spoken in a certain place of the seventh day in this way: "And God rested on the seventh day from all His works''

Hebrews 4:14-16 Seeing then that we have a great High Priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession. For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin. Let us therefore come boldly to the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy and find grace to help in time of need.

There is no mention of the fourth commandment in the entire context, but rather, a command to exhort daily. We find God pointing to the seventh day of creation as He uses it as a picture of what we have in Christ. God has used the seventh day rest of creation many times and for different reasons throughout Scripture to give us a picture of whatever the context is when He uses the seventh day as a picture.

In Christ, everything of the Old is done away with.

Hebrews 8:13 God speaks of these new promise, of this new covenant, as taking the place of the old one; for the old one is out of date now and has been put aside forever.

The words of Jesus abiding in the hearts and minds of God's people will produce a character of love for God and love for neighbor. How this love is manifested is not seen in keeping Ten Commandments, thought many of the commandments will be fulfilled in our lives, but it's much more than that.

In Christ the literal day of the fourth commandment does not even come into play because it's done away with as is everything else of the Old Covenant.

Our focus as a New Covenant believer are the words of Christ. Our example for the New Covenant believer is the life of Christ.

Many people will say that Jesus kept the Sabbath. This is true as far as it was His custom to enter into the synagogs on the Sabbath. But what did He teach while in the synagogs? He taught things that were against the law of the Sabbath regulations to reveal the true meaning of the Sabbath as not a literal day but a life of obedience to God and a ceasing from our own religious works. He pointed to the heart of life, which is love for God and love for people.

Many of the things Jesus did on the Sabbath were totally against the religious rules of Sabbath keeping. These were not man made rules, but rather, they were rules that governed the Sabbath of the fourth commandment. It even got to the point where Jesus came right out and said He is working on the Sabbath and so isn't His Father. He even goes on to say that His Father has been working from the beginning. Why is this? Because the rest of the seventh day of creation was a rest from the six days of creation, not a rest from working in His creation.

What God wants us to understand is that what He has done through Christ is a finished work and has been a finished work as part of His plan as the Lamb who was slain from the foundation of the world.

Nothing in the Old Covenant matters when were in Christ. Jesus becomes our righteousness and our payment for sin, not the keeping of anything found in the Old Covenant. In understanding and believing this there is rest. This is why we are called not to forsake the gathering together. Why is this? Because there is freedom in Christ and where there is freedom we can tend to neglect gathering together.

[RND]

But what did He teach while in the synagogs? He taught things that were against the law of the Sabbath regulations......

Just out of couriousity, do you think you could list some of these 'regulations' for us to digest?

Many of the things Jesus did on the Sabbath were totally against the religious rules of Sabbath keeping.

Who's rules?

These were not man made rules, but rather, they were rules that governed the Sabbath of the fourth commandment.

Would you mind listing some of them for us?

It even got to the point where Jesus came right out and said He is working on the Sabbath and so isn't His Father.

Is? Didn't all 'preists' work on the sabbath yet were held blameless?

He even goes on to say that His Father has been working from the beginning. Why is this? Because the rest of the seventh day of creation was a rest from the six days of creation, not a rest from working in His creation.

Dod God need the rest or was the rest a memorial to creation?

What God wants us to understand is that what He has done through Christ is a finished work and has been a finished work as part of His plan as the Lamb who was slain from the foundation of the world.

This is true. Should we still break the law?

Nothing in the Old Covenant matters when were in Christ. Jesus becomes our righteousness and our payment for sin, not the keeping of anything found in the Old Covenant.

Since grace abounds, should we sin?

In understanding and believing this there is rest. This is why we are called not to forsake the gathering together. Why is this? Because there is freedom in Christ and where there is freedom we can tend to neglect gathering together.

Where are we asked to keep another day besides the sabbath? In addition, if there is 'freedom in Christ' why would we not be 'free' to neglete assembling together? Where is the requirement found to 'assemble together?'

[Byfaithalone1]

That's a really good question. I've always thought of it as being a reference to the weekly Sabbath, since that is the Sabbath emphasized in the Fourth Commandment. As to whether the annual high Sabbaths could figure into this too, that is entirely possible, considering how they point to God's plan of redemption.

Do you believe that annual and monthly sabbaths have been fulfilled by the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ?

BFA

[Cribstyl]

If the answer is yes, there is another place in the Scriptures that sabbath refers to some something other than a day set aside as holy to God, (that was my question) then, pray tell what is it?
Well, when Christ said that "sabbath was made for man.....", his declaration is along the line that God allows man 1 in seven days to rest from labor, rather than the idea that God created man with built in purpose to keep the seventh day Holy.

Mar 2:27 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/popup.pl?book=Mar&chapter=2&verse=27&version=kjv#27)And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:


By Jesus saying "...not man for the sabbath," this implies that God did'nt give the sabbath as an imperitive mandate but rather as a gift and a blessing to man.

Truth is, the law made the sabbath a mandate with a death penalty for those under the law.





It is in Hebrews 4. That's why non-Sabbatarians have to find another interpretation to explain it away. Sabbath, which everywhere else in Scripture refers to a holy day, has to mean something else here.


Well, prove that Sabbath and God rest is the same. Those who dont misapply the Genesis facts are not puzzled when Jesus invites Christian into His rest.

Mat 11:28 (http://cf.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Mat&c=11&v=28&t=KJV#28)Come unto me, all [ye] that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
CRIB

[k4c]

Just out of couriousity, do you think you could list some of these 'regulations' for us to digest?



Who's rules?



Would you mind listing some of them for us?



Is? Didn't all 'preists' work on the sabbath yet were held blameless?



Dod God need the rest or was the rest a memorial to creation?



This is true. Should we still break the law?



Since grace abounds, should we sin?



Where are we asked to keep another day besides the sabbath? In addition, if there is 'freedom in Christ' why would we not be 'free' to neglete assembling together? Where is the requirement found to 'assemble together?'

There were many times Jesus taught and did things on the Sabbath that were a direct violation of the fourth commandment, for example. Jesus commanded a man to carry his bed on the Sabbath. This was a violation of the Sabbath and the Jews knew it.

John 5:8-13 Jesus said to him, "Arise, take up your pallet, and walk." And immediately the man became well, and took up his pallet and began to walk. Now it was the Sabbath on that day. Therefore the Jews were saying to him who was cured, "It is the Sabbath, and it is not permissible for you to carry your pallet." But he answered them, "He who made me well was the one who said to me, `Take up your pallet and walk.'" They asked him, "Who is the man who said to you, `Take up your pallet, and walk'?" But he who was healed did not know who it was; for Jesus had slipped away while there was a crowd in that place.

Jeremiah 17:21-22 `Thus says the Lord, "Take heed for yourselves, and do not carry any load on the sabbath day or bring anything in through the gates of Jerusalem. "And you shall not bring a load out of your houses on the sabbath day nor do any work, but keep the sabbath day holy, as I commanded your forefathers.

The Sabbath we keep as New Covenant Christians is the Sabbath of ceasing from our own labors to be made acceptable to God. If we fail to rest from our labors as we try to earn our way into the kingdom we will surely face God's wrath. So we as New Covevant Christians do keep the Sabbath, which is found in resting in the finished work of Christ, not in a literal day.

Sin for a New Covenant Christian is not found in violating the Ten Commandments, but rather, in disobeying the words of Christ.

John 12:48 "He who rejects Me, and does not receive My words, has that which judges him the word that I have spoken will judge him in the last day.

The words of Christ is the foundation of the New Covenant, which has made the Old Covenant obsolete.

The Father Himself commands us to listen to His Son.

Matthew 17:5 While he was still speaking, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them; and suddenly a voice came out of the cloud, saying, "This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. Hear Him!''

[RND]

There were many times Jesus taught and did things on the Sabbath that were a direct violation of the fourth commandment, for example. Jesus commanded a man to carry his bed on the Sabbath. This was a violation of the Sabbath and the Jews knew it.

Just curious, but could you find the 'exact' Biblical reference that shows conclusively that carring your bed on the sabbath was against the sabbath?


The Sabbath we keep as New Covenant Christians is the Sabbath of ceasing from our own labors to be made acceptable to God.

So which day is that?

If we fail to rest from our labors as we try to earn our way into the kingdom we will surely face God's wrath.

Is God the boogeyman?

So we as New Covevant Christians do keep the Sabbath, which is found in resting in the finished work of Christ, not in a literal day.

If you're resting how do you find time to pich up your own cross?

Sin for a New Covenant Christian is not found in violating the Ten Commandments, but rather, in disobeying the words of Christ.

Did Christ abolish the sabbath in some way?

The words of Christ is the foundation of the New Covenant, which has made the Old Covenant obsolete.

No more law?

The Father Himself commands us to listen to His Son.

Indeed.

Jhn 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

[k4c]

Just curious, but could you find the 'exact' Biblical reference that shows conclusively that carring your bed on the sabbath was against the sabbath?

So which day is that?

Is God the boogeyman?

If you're resting how do you find time to pich up your own cross?

Did Christ abolish the sabbath in some way?

No more law?

Indeed.

Jhn 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

I'm not sure how to qoute each question so I hope you can match up my answers with your questions.

1. It's not a literal day that we keep as a New Covenant believer, but rather, a postion of rest that we enter into by way of faith and trust in the finished work of Christ.

2. God is not the boogyman but He will not be marked. There will be a day coming inwhich the sheep and goats will be divided.

3. The fact that the old man has been crucified with Christ shows that you are in rest from your own works. In this, Christ is our life.

4. Christ did not abolish the Sabbath, but rather, He established the true Sabbath, which is spiritual.

5. There is a law for New Covenant believers. It's a law of a much higher standard. It's the law of Christ.

Galatians 6:2 Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ.

1 Corinthians 9:21 To those who are without law, as without law (not being without law toward God, but under law toward Christ), that I might win those who are without law;

That's right, if you love Christ, keep His commandments.

The New Covenant is based on a living relationship with Jesus Christ as we abide in His words of life. It's not a dead relationship with stone, but rather, a living relationship moment by moment living through the inward convictions of the Spirit of Christ in us in daily living.

John 10:27-28 "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. "And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand.

This goes way beyond the law on stone, which brings death and condemnation.

The botton line for the New Covanant believer is this.

1 John 3:23-24 And this is His commandment: that we should believe on the name of His Son Jesus Christ and love one another, as He gave us commandment. Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

[PROPHECYKID]

k4c. Can you answer this question for me. Lets back track to Hebrews and let me ask.
1. What was the rest that God prevented the nation is Israel to enter into?
2. Did they eventually enter into that rest?
3. Do we have a similar rest to ento into?

[PROPHECYKID]

And also can you give me your thoughts on my post #26. What did you disagree or agree with?

[k4c]

And also can you give me your thoughts on my post #26. What did you disagree or agree with?

As you read the Old Testament you will find many of the things God had Israel experience have a spiritual meaning in the New Testament, for example. As you read the Old Testament you will find a story of two sons being born through Abraham, one was through Hagar and one was through Sarai. This whole experience has a spiritual application in the New Testament.

Galatians 4:21-26 Tell me, you who desire to be under the law, do you not hear the law? For it is written that Abraham had two sons: the one by a bondwoman, the other by a freewoman. But he who was of the bondwoman was born according to the flesh, and he of the freewoman through promise, which things are symbolic. For these are the two covenants: the one from Mount Sinai which gives birth to bondage, which is Hagar for this Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia, and corresponds to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children but the Jerusalem above is free, which is the mother of us all.

We find this kind of spiritual insight all throughout the New Testament as God brings spiritual meanings to the things of the old. Egypt itself and the coming out of Egypt has a spiritual meaning in the New Testament. The Promise Land in the Old Testament has a spiritual meaning in the New Testament. Just about everything we read in the Old Testament has a spiritual application in the New Testament. Even the law itself is spiritual.

Romans 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual, but I am carnal, sold under sin.

In other words, when something is spiritual we have to understand it as it applies to the inward man. This is the whole idea of the New Covenant.

John 4:23-24 "But the hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for the Father is seeking such to worship Him. "God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth.'

1 Corinthians 2:13 These things we also speak, not in words which man's wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

Colossians 1:9 For this reason we also, since the day we heard it, do not cease to pray for you, and to ask that you may be filled with the knowledge of His will in all wisdom and spiritual understanding;

2 Corinthians 3:6 Who also made us sufficient as ministers of a new covenant; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

The Sabbath of the Old Covenant is of stone and brings death and condemnation.

2 Corinthians 3:7-9 But if the ministry of death, written and engraved on stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of the glory of his countenance, which glory was passing away, how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious? For if the ministry of condemnation had glory, the ministry of righteousness exceeds much more in glory.

The Sabbath of the New Covenant is spiritual as it applies to the inward man.

Romans 7:22 For I delight in the law of God according to the inward man.

These things of the New Covenant have to be spiritually decerned. If we try to understand the New Covenant with an Old Covenant mindset it will continue to bring death.

Romans 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.

Life and peace come from understanding spiritually the things of the New Covenant.

1 Corinthians 2:14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

The Roman Catholic Church is a perfect example of interpreting things of the New Covenant with a carnal or natural mindset as they turn Jesus into a cookie and tell people they become righteous when they eat it.

This is no different than telling people to keep a literal rest on the seventh day by ceasing from all labor to be acceptable to God or to receive life. What propfit does Christ become to us in doing so?

John 6:63 "It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.

The New Covenant is not founded on anything of the Old, but rather, the words of Christ. For it is His words that will judge the New Covenant believer in the end, not anything of the Old.

John 12:48 "He who rejects Me, and does not receive My words, has that which judges him the word that I have spoken will judge him in the last day.

[PROPHECYKID]

As you read the Old Testament you will find many of the things God had Israel experience have a spiritual meaning in the New Testament, for example. As you read the Old Testament you will find a story of two sons being born through Abraham, one was through Hagar and one was through Sarai. This whole experience has a spiritual application in the New Testament.

Galatians 4:21-26 Tell me, you who desire to be under the law, do you not hear the law? For it is written that Abraham had two sons: the one by a bondwoman, the other by a freewoman. But he who was of the bondwoman was born according to the flesh, and he of the freewoman through promise, which things are symbolic. For these are the two covenants: the one from Mount Sinai which gives birth to bondage, which is Hagar for this Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia, and corresponds to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children but the Jerusalem above is free, which is the mother of us all.

We find this kind of spiritual insight all throughout the New Testament as God brings spiritual meanings to the things of the old. Egypt itself and the coming out of Egypt has a spiritual meaning in the New Testament. The Promise Land in the Old Testament has a spiritual meaning in the New Testament. Just about everything we read in the Old Testament has a spiritual application in the New Testament. Even the law itself is spiritual.

Romans 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual, but I am carnal, sold under sin.

In other words, when something is spiritual we have to understand it as it applies to the inward man. This is the whole idea of the New Covenant.

John 4:23-24 "But the hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for the Father is seeking such to worship Him. "God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth.'

1 Corinthians 2:13 These things we also speak, not in words which man's wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

Colossians 1:9 For this reason we also, since the day we heard it, do not cease to pray for you, and to ask that you may be filled with the knowledge of His will in all wisdom and spiritual understanding;

2 Corinthians 3:6 Who also made us sufficient as ministers of a new covenant; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

The Sabbath of the Old Covenant is of stone and brings death and condemnation.

2 Corinthians 3:7-9 But if the ministry of death, written and engraved on stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of the glory of his countenance, which glory was passing away, how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious? For if the ministry of condemnation had glory, the ministry of righteousness exceeds much more in glory.

The Sabbath of the New Covenant is spiritual as it applies to the inward man.

Romans 7:22 For I delight in the law of God according to the inward man.

These things of the New Covenant have to be spiritually decerned. If we try to understand the New Covenant with an Old Covenant mindset it will continue to bring death.

Romans 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.

Life and peace come from understanding spiritually the things of the New Covenant.

1 Corinthians 2:14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

The Roman Catholic Church is a perfect example of interpreting things of the New Covenant with a carnal or natural mindset as they turn Jesus into a cookie and tell people they become righteous when they eat it.

This is no different than telling people to keep a literal rest on the seventh day by ceasing from all labor to be acceptable to God or to receive life. What propfit does Christ become to us in doing so?

John 6:63 "It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.

The New Covenant is not founded on anything of the Old, but rather, the words of Christ. For it is His words that will judge the New Covenant believer in the end, not anything of the Old.

John 12:48 "He who rejects Me, and does not receive My words, has that which judges him the word that I have spoken will judge him in the last day.
You probably didn't understand my request. Did you read my post #26. If you did can you tell me your comments.

[PROPHECYKID]

k4c. Can you answer this question for me. Lets back track to Hebrews and let me ask.
1. What was the rest that God prevented the nation is Israel to enter into?
2. Did they eventually enter into that rest?
3. Do we have a similar rest to ento into?
Can you please answer these question K4c. The reason I am asking is because you must be able to answer these question to understand the passage.

[PROPHECYKID]

Lets resume.