Genesis 29

[Kris10leigh]

Here I have a question about Laban, Rebekah's father. It seems here that there is a lot of trickery involved! I know that Laban did not honor his agreement with Jacob. He agreed to allow Jacob to marry Rebakah for 7 years of servitude and then tricked him to marrying his other daughter. But does that then make it ok for him to trick Laban out of livestock and his household idols? And why did Rebekah want the household idols anyway? Is not yet known that God is a jealous God and idols were not to be worshipped? It does precede Moses so perhaps this is true.

Also, I am assuming that Jacob was tricked into marrying and then consummating the marriage with the wrong daughter because he was either drunk or because she was veiled. Does that sound right?

And when does monogamy enter the text of the bible?

Loaded questions I know. :blush: I'm enjoying reading the OT with a bit of the innocence of a child, I'm afraid. I know many of the old stories as they have been orally taught to me, but I've never actually sat down to read them for myself. It's shameful how much the Christian churches tend to shy away from these stories.

[Lulav]

Here I have a question about Laban, Rebekah's father. It seems here that there is a lot of trickery involved! I know that Laban did not honor his agreement with Jacob. He agreed to allow Jacob to marry Rebakah for 7 years of servitude and then tricked him to marrying his other daughter. But does that then make it ok for him to trick Laban out of livestock and his household idols? And why did Rebekah want the household idols anyway? Is not yet known that God is a jealous God and idols were not to be worshipped? It does precede Moses so perhaps this is true.

Also, I am assuming that Jacob was tricked into marrying and then consummating the marriage with the wrong daughter because he was either drunk or because she was veiled. Does that sound right?

And when does monogamy enter the text of the bible?

Loaded questions I know. :blush: I'm enjoying reading the OT with a bit of the innocence of a child, I'm afraid. I know many of the old stories as they have been orally taught to me, but I've never actually sat down to read them for myself. It's shameful how much the Christian churches tend to shy away from these stories.He really did not trick him , it was the common law of the land that you marry off the eldest first. Jacob should have known that, if he truly wanted Rachel ( and Laban was Rebekahs brother, not father) he should have stayed around and helped find a husband for Leah first. But he did get whom he wanted, but paid a dear price.

As far as the sheep, Jacob obtained these honestly through G-d, but the over abundance made Laban greedy. That is why Jacob fled. The household gods were handed down to the eldest son, and were like a deed, showing who inherited everything. By Rachel taking these, she was in turn saying something like, Jacob should be the one to inherit because he worked very hard for her father while her brothers were lazy. Remember Rachel did not know the G-d of Jacob, this was a common thing were she lived.

Yes, he was quite liquored up, she was veiled during the ceremony, then hid away until he was brought to her, most likely in a darkened tent by then because it would be nightfall.

[Kris10leigh]

Quick reply...I got the names wrong! Oops! I knew that! Rachel, not Rebekah.

[Lulav]

Yes, it is easy to do with the Patriarchs and Matriarchs! :)

[Kris10leigh]

So the fact that they were still practicing idol worship was not a big deal at that point, right?

I have another loaded question. Today we would not say "The God of Abraham" because "God" is sufficient to mean the one and only. But within the Bible, doesn't the phrase "The God of Abraham" infer that there are other gods in existence to differentiate from? Or am I just messing with semantics? I think this is simply a way of saying, "not those Roman gods you all believe in, but the God Abraham worships." Is there a better way of looking at it?

I've always wondered why it says "The God of Abraham" instead of "The one true God" or something like that.

[jgonz]

So the fact that they were still practicing idol worship was not a big deal at that point, right?

Of course it was a big deal~ but Rachel didn't know it yet.... and she ended up paying for it with her life.

But within the Bible, doesn't the phrase "The God of Abraham" infer that there are other gods in existence to differentiate from?
People "believed" in other gods, but that didn't make them real... But people knew that the G-d of Abraham was something special... Plus "the G-d of Abraham" had no name that anyone knew of~ thus they'd identify Him as Abraham's G-d. (At least that's the way I've understood it. ;))

[visionary]

Some of these same laws are still in force in those countries ...even today.

[HadassahSukkot]

I've always come to understand when the Patriarchs/Matriarchs refer to G-d impersonally like that, that they believe for the sake of their father and family what they have been told about G-d, but have not yet personally experienced Him and taken Him as their own G-d... You kind of notice a change of heart after a certain point when G-d is referred to more personally.

[debi b]

So the fact that they were still practicing idol worship was not a big deal at that point, right?

Genesis 31:19 And Laban went to shear his sheep; and Rachel had stolen the family idols that were her father's.


There are several Hebrew words that are translated as idols and variations thereof. The word used in this verse for "family idols" is teraphim. This is not the last time this word is used and one needs to follow that concept to get the pictures :)

[visionary]

Family idols were held to be the power of the family's life.

[debi b]

I appreciate Kimchi's comment:

"Teraphim were not objects of idolatous worship, but images by the contemplation of which men could capture some experience of the supernatural."

If you look at it this way, it lends to explain why you continue to see them throughout scripture. It also lends some meaning then to the corrections given about them. Did the people understand that it was not pleasing - I would answer no. I think the continued use demonstrates that the poeple did think it was a good thing.

Even something that was originally commanded by Adonai as a good thing, can become something that He Himself later commands be torn down because of what people do. Such is the case with the bronze serpent. This was commanded by Adonai to be constructed (Numbers 21:8-9). Then we fast forward 700 plus years (and that fact is important) and we see it is destroyed by Hezekiah (2 Kings 18:4-5) not because of what Adonai intended, but because of what people did.

Typically what we get in the text is Adonai's point of view. We generally don't take into account that the man on the street during the same time frame in question often has a different point of view. Somehow we think they knew they were wrong. I suspect this is often not the case....

[visionary]

"Teraphim were not objects of idolatous worship, but images by the contemplation of which men could capture some experience of the supernatural." That's what makes them all the more dangerous.... that the image of the beast could talk thus giving them an experience of the supernatural.

[debi b]

I don't want to harp on it, but I have often wondered if Christmas trees should be compared to an ashera....

Do you get where I am going?

There are other things that fall into this category as well. We are convinced they honor Him and perhaps they are more like the teraphim than we think.

[Kris10leigh]

I don't want to harp on it, but I have often wondered if Christmas trees should be compared to an ashera....

Do you get where I am going?

There are other things that fall into this category as well. We are convinced they honor Him and perhaps they are more like the teraphim than we think.

Ashera...? Does that mean "idols"? I do not think so. One, it isn't made in the image of God or man. Two, we don't worship the Christmas tree. Really it's just a place to hang ornaments on. Some Christians have tried to make the Christmas tree rich with Christian symbolism. For instance, the evergreen represents Jesus' unending love for us. But to me...it's just a tree taking up space in my house.

Interesting thought though. I'm sure opinion will differ from mine.

[debi b]

An Ashera is a type of idol if you will. And you made my point for me. They would not have thought they were worshipping the teraphim either ;)

[Kris10leigh]

Aha. That makes sense. :thumbsup: