What are the Differences between WELS, ELCA, and LCMS?

[Motor City Christian]

Hello there, I was interested in the differences between these three branches of Lutheranism. I am considering attending a Lutheran church during my search for a new church. I tend to be more conservative both politically and in my faith. However, I still want to know the major differences of all of them. Could anyone lay out the major differences? Thanks, and I would appreciate this thread to stay on track and not turn into debates.

[Caelum]

Well, I don't know the exact differences between LCMS and WELS. All I know is LCMS is supposedly *slightly* more liberal. ELCA is the "liberal synod". The allow women to become pastors, they also allow open communion(some LCMS churches do also, despite the fact that it's not supposed to be allowed), and they take a "neutral" - "more study needs to be done" stand concerning their views on certain human sexuality topics. As opposed to LCMS and WELS who openly condemn homosexuality, premarital sex, etc, etc...

Good luck on your journey :)

[ChiRho]

Not sure that this thread is needed. This has been covered over and over and over and over and over and over....you get the point!

Just scroll through the threads and find them.

Pax Christi,

ChiRho

[SPALATIN]

Well, I don't know the exact differences between LCMS and WELS. All I know is LCMS is supposedly *slightly* more liberal. ELCA is the "liberal synod". The allow women to become pastors, they also allow open communion(some LCMS churches do also, despite the fact that it's not supposed to be allowed), and they take a "neutral" - "more study needs to be done" stand concerning their views on certain human sexuality topics. As opposed to LCMS and WELS who openly condemn homosexuality, premarital sex, etc, etc...

Good luck on your journey :)
Actually the LCMS would most likely put activities like Homosexuality and/or Premarital Sex in perspective to what they are and that is sin. To call it anything less is not biblical. We don't condemn the person, but the sin itself.

As far as WELS I am not sure what the major differences are. I am new to this forum so this discussion would help me here.

[JMRE5150]

Not sure that this thread is needed. This has been covered over and over and over and over and over and over....you get the point!

Just scroll through the threads and find them.

Pax Christi,

ChiRho
I agree. Tons of threads here explaining the differences, and each time a debate ensues.

The good news about this thread is that you are interested in Martin Luther and his teachings/doctrines.

Robb

[JVAC]

Hello there, I was interested in the differences between these three branches of Lutheranism. I am considering attending a Lutheran church during my search for a new church. I tend to be more conservative both politically and in my faith. However, I still want to know the major differences of all of them. Could anyone lay out the major differences? Thanks, and I would appreciate this thread to stay on track and not turn into debates.
The biggest difference is the ELCA has more hammers :D .

But really, to find out more about the ELCA, www.elca.org (http://www.elca.org) will get you a lot of information. You might ask, what is the benefits of joining the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America? Well lets try this:

Rest for your soul
An awesome enthusiastic Church focused simultaneously on Vocation and Mission
The Gospel of Jesus Christ rightly taught
The Sacraments (yeah i'll get flak for this) are rightly administered.
Unity with 64 million LUtherans world wide as well as Moravians, Anglicans and others.
Super awesome people, with REAL ULTIMATE POWER. (sorry inside joke)
all this and much, much more.

(Here comes a shameless self promotion) Also feel free to visit my church website to get a gander at a typical ELCA church. www.bethelevlutheran.org (http://www.bethelevlutheran.org) :D

-James

[SPALATIN]

The biggest difference is the ELCA has more hammers :D .

But really, to find out more about the ELCA, www.elca.org (http://www.elca.org/) will get you a lot of information. You might ask, what is the benefits of joining the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America? Well lets try this:

Rest for your soul
An awesome enthusiastic Church focused simultaneously on Vocation and Mission
The Gospel of Jesus Christ rightly taught
The Sacraments (yeah i'll get flak for this) are rightly administered.
Unity with 64 million LUtherans world wide as well as Moravians, Anglicans and others.
Super awesome people, with REAL ULTIMATE POWER. (sorry inside joke)
all this and much, much more.

(Here comes a shameless self promotion) Also feel free to visit my church website to get a gander at a typical ELCA church. www.bethelevlutheran.org (http://www.bethelevlutheran.org/) :D

-James
UNITY? At what cost? Seems to me that the CCM with the ECUSA was all compromise on behalf of the ELCA and none from the ECUSA. Only a small handful of Seminary graduates have elected to be ordained without the Bishop present. Most of the Seminary graduates don't even use the Book of Concord and you have open communion with churches who don't believe in Real Presence.

I used to belong to an ELCA church and I will never again make that mistake.

Scott Strohkirch

[JMRE5150]

I used to belong to an ELCA church and I will never again make that mistake.

Scott Strohkirch
/MODHAT ON

While this may be your personal feelings about the ELCA, you are not permitted to "bash" another denom or sect within.
By claiming joining an ELCA church is a "mistake", you are in violation of Site Rule #2

Rule No. 2 - No "Trolling"

2) You will not post anything that disrupts the peace and harmony of this forum. This will include any new user with less than 50 posts starting a "discretional" topic - i.e. a topic not suitable for children. This will also include posts that put down Christianity in general or any posts considered as blasphemy by staff (this is a CHRISTIAN FORUMS site), or posts that put down another Christian group or denomination. This includes links to websites in profiles and signatures. This will include members entering inaccurate personal details in their profile in order to gain access to restricted forums. You will not post new threads for the sole purpose of soliciting requests for prophecies.

I will ask that we refrain from bashing of any type.

And you can 'debate" the differences between LCMS and ELCA in a formal debate forum, just not here. Stay on the topic of the original poster, and leave your personal feelings for another forum.

This goes for both the ELCA ad LCMS (Poor Recht may very well be the only WELS here).

Next time this thread shows signs of turning into a mudslinging event, I'll be forced to hand out warnings/suspensions/ip bans/etc.

/MODHAT OFF

[jay_swift]

No LCMS church has women pastors. Visit lcms.org (http://www.lcms.org/pages/internal.asp?NavID=2702) to see why. If you found one that does, it either means you were mistaken that she was a pastor or the church is going against LCMS teachings.

[Lotar]

Hello there, I was interested in the differences between these three branches of Lutheranism. I am considering attending a Lutheran church during my search for a new church. I tend to be more conservative both politically and in my faith. However, I still want to know the major differences of all of them. Could anyone lay out the major differences? Thanks, and I would appreciate this thread to stay on track and not turn into debates.ELCA is different from the LCMS and WELS in that they are a liberal/pietist denomination. They ordain women, have open communion, and do not strictly hold to the Lutheran confessions. These are probably the most apparent differences, but the real difference is in their method of interpretation of Scripture, which follows the Anglican/Methodist Scripture/Tradition/Reason and historical criticism model instead of the traditional Lutheran one.

The differences between LCMS and WELS aren't as large. LCMS allows it's members to pray with denominations they are not in communion with, pastors to serve as military chaplins, and women to vote on church decisions, and WELS does not.

Hopefully this fall, the current LCMS president will lose his position, and we will enter talks for entering communion with WELS once again.

[Lotar]

Just wanted to remind everyone of this ;) :

Thanks, and I would appreciate this thread to stay on track and not turn into debates.

[SPALATIN]

/MODHAT ON

While this may be your personal feelings about the ELCA, you are not permitted to "bash" another denom or sect within.
By claiming joining an ELCA church is a "mistake", you are in violation of Site Rule #2

Rule No. 2 - No "Trolling"

2) You will not post anything that disrupts the peace and harmony of this forum. This will include any new user with less than 50 posts starting a "discretional" topic - i.e. a topic not suitable for children. This will also include posts that put down Christianity in general or any posts considered as blasphemy by staff (this is a CHRISTIAN FORUMS site), or posts that put down another Christian group or denomination. This includes links to websites in profiles and signatures. This will include members entering inaccurate personal details in their profile in order to gain access to restricted forums. You will not post new threads for the sole purpose of soliciting requests for prophecies.

I will ask that we refrain from bashing of any type.

And you can 'debate" the differences between LCMS and ELCA in a formal debate forum, just not here. Stay on the topic of the original poster, and leave your personal feelings for another forum.

This goes for both the ELCA ad LCMS (Poor Recht may very well be the only WELS here).

Next time this thread shows signs of turning into a mudslinging event, I'll be forced to hand out warnings/suspensions/ip bans/etc.

/MODHAT OFF
So sorry for that. I Will stop if he stops claiming his ELCA has it all because no denomination does. The LCMS has it's problems too and I don't go saying that they are the Be all end all.

[Lotar]

James is just yanking your chain :D

[SPALATIN]

UNITY? At what cost? Seems to me that the CCM with the ECUSA was all compromise on behalf of the ELCA and none from the ECUSA. Only a small handful of Seminary graduates have elected to be ordained without the Bishop present. Most of the Seminary graduates don't even use the Book of Concord and you have open communion with churches who don't believe in Real Presence.

I used to belong to an ELCA church and I will never again make that mistake.

Scott Strohkirch
I didn't say that the ELCA was a mistake. I said that I would not make the mistake of joining another ELCA church. THere is a difference in the two sentences. There are some very fine believers in the ELCA and some of them are right here posting on this forum. And everything else in my post was a fact not bashing. So I am sorry that it sounded that way. I also extend my apologies to all the ELCA members here.

I will admit I have some issues with the ELCA leadership and not so much with the churches themselves.

Thank you

Scott Strohkirch

[JMRE5150]

ELCA is different from the LCMS and WELS in that they are a liberal/pietist denomination. They ordain women, have open communion, and do not strictly hold to the Lutheran confessions. These are probably the most apparent differences, but the real difference is in their method of interpretation of Scripture, which follows the Anglican/Methodist Scripture/Tradition/Reason and historical criticism model instead of the traditional Lutheran one.

The differences between LCMS and WELS aren't as large. LCMS allows it's members to pray with denominations they are not in communion with, pastors to serve as military chaplins, and women to vote on church decisions, and WELS does not.

Hopefully this fall, the current LCMS president will lose his position, and we will enter talks for entering communion with WELS once again.Lotar, fine example of staying on topic and answering the OP.

As for James, I can vouch that he was MOST DEFINITELY pulling your chain.
It appears that with 50 posts your fairly new here. Let me extend my hand of friendship to you, welcome you aboard properly, and mention that you will see that us daily posters in the Lutheran Forum are all buddies, even though we give the appearance that we argue between ourselves (Lotar, ChiRho, Recht, JVAC, Luther's Rose, Breetai, etc - forgive me if I missed anyone). We do sometimes argue doctrine between ELCA and LCMS, but we mean each other NO harm at all. And you can bet that we all kid around with each other daily.

Even though I am ELCA myself, you best believe I will personally take IMMEDIATE action if I believe an ELCA poster is trying to bash you or the LCMS. When I mod, I'm not partial or biased. But keep in mind that we have been posting here daily for a LONG time, and we talk to each other each day as friends. Usually if you see something that looks like a cheapshot, its usually just a friendly jab in the ribs from one of us teasing.

James is a very very kind man with wonderful intentions. I will promise you he meant no harm. Now try and relax, lighten up a bit and feel comfortable amongst friends. We may have our differences, but we are Lutherans nonetheless.

[SPALATIN]

Lotar, fine example of staying on topic and answering the OP.

As for James, I can vouch that he was MOST DEFINITELY pulling your chain.
It appears that with 50 posts your fairly new here. Let me extend my hand of friendship to you, welcome you aboard properly, and mention that you will see that us daily posters in the Lutheran Forum are all buddies, even though we give the appearance that we argue between ourselves (Lotar, ChiRho, Recht, JVAC, Luther's Rose, Breetai, etc - forgive me if I missed anyone). We do sometimes argue doctrine between ELCA and LCMS, but we mean each other NO harm at all. And you can bet that we all kid around with each other daily.

Even though I am ELCA myself, you best believe I will personally take IMMEDIATE action if I believe an ELCA poster is trying to bash you or the LCMS. When I mod, I'm not partial or biased. But keep in mind that we have been posting here daily for a LONG time, and we talk to each other each day as friends. Usually if you see something that looks like a cheapshot, its usually just a friendly jab in the ribs from one of us teasing.

James is a very very kind man with wonderful intentions. I will promise you he meant no harm. Now try and relax, lighten up a bit and feel comfortable amongst friends. We may have our differences, but we are Lutherans nonetheless.
Ok, I am just used to being on Yahoo groups and if you cross the line w/ the moderator you can have your membership cxld or just your post deleted. I will at the very least keep my jabs tongue in cheek.

[JVAC]

*Reads Thread*

hmmmmmmmm

*In best Steve Urkle voice, points at the Screen*

"Did I do that?"

Sorry, I was just was using the question to throw in a few shameless promotions :sorry: . I wasn't shooting for the "My church is better than your church" dealy. I guess it is hard to show my wierd and ironic sense of humour in typing, "There just is no emoticon to express the way I am feeling" (I got that quote from that Fat Comic Book Guy on "The Simpsons").

Sorry for any damage I caused, but I do think that you should check out (here comes another shameless self-promotion) www.bethelevlutheran.org (http://www.bethelevlutheran.org) :D :P (too much?)

-James

[JMRE5150]

Sorry for any damage I caused, but I do think that you should check out (here comes another shameless self-promotion) www.bethelevlutheran.org (http://www.bethelevlutheran.org/) :D :P (too much?)

-JamesNever too much brother. Everyone should be proud and try and promote their church and its beliefs if they truly believe it is right.

I for one never mock Lotar or Chi or any of my LCMS brothers for promoting their beloved LCMS church even though I am ELCA and feel differently.

Its just an innocent misunderstanding anyway. Our new brother will warm up to our gang in no time, I'm sure.

Robb

EDIT - Darn, I almost forgot:
www.godslovenewtown.org (http://www.godslovenewtown.org/)
:P

[Lotar]

I would mock me, because I deserve it sometimes :D


Which reminds me, where has Breetai been?

[Rechtgläubig]

Hopefully this fall, the current LCMS president will lose his position, and we will enter talks for entering communion with WELS once again.
:clap:

[Caelum]

No LCMS church has women pastors. Visit lcms.org (http://www.lcms.org/pages/internal.asp?NavID=2702) to see why. If you found one that does, it either means you were mistaken that she was a pastor or the church is going against LCMS teachings.

No one ever said that it did, I said some allow open-communion.

[JMRE5150]

Which reminds me, where has Breetai been?

Ya know, I was thinking that a few weeks ago, when it appeared he dropped off the face of the Earth, but after checking his post list, it does appear he posts about 3-7 posts each day. *shrugs*


BREETAI! Where are ya?!?!?!?

[Flipper]

The differences between LCMS and WELS aren't as large. LCMS allows it's members to pray with denominations they are not in communion with, pastors to serve as military chaplins, and women to vote on church decisions, and WELS does not.

Hopefully this fall, the current LCMS president will lose his position, and we will enter talks for entering communion with WELS once again.
Do you think that Women should not be allowed to vote on church decisions?

[JVAC]

CAELUM!!!!! Your avtar looks like this VBS craft we did last year!! That was awesome fun, how you doing dude? Which church are you going to now?

-James

[SPALATIN]

Do you think that Women should not be allowed to vote on church decisions?
Some would say that it invites rebellion to the church's political affairs. They use the same scripture in 1 Timothy 2 to bar women from being ministers.

I happen to agree that women should not be pastors, but am undecided about voting rights or what some call "sufferage."

:sigh: Scott

[Lotar]

Do you think that Women should not be allowed to vote on church decisions?
I haven't really given it much thought. I don't object to it.

[JMRE5150]

Folks, had to see this one coming...


I split this thread because frankly, as I warned...we split from the OP's topic into "Women as Pastors" discussion.

Please look for the new topic of Women Pastors June '04 to see where you may post on this subject.

All further posts in this thread MUST adhere to the OP's question.

Robb