50,000 Christians Considering Seceding from America...

[aeroz19]

A group called ChristianExodus, www.ChristianExodus.org, has a plan to move 50,000 Christians to SC and secede the state peacefully, declaring the state as a free, Christian republic. Why? They say that gay marriage was the last straw. Go to their site to read up on their plan and reasons for trying to enact it. I'd really like to know what everyone here thinks about this, especially my fellow Americans. Please, post.

I sent ChristianExodus an email. The email is below. You should email them, too. This is a very serious issue.

--------------------------------------------------

Hello, this is Adrienne Roberts. I'm a College student, age 19, from Washington state. This state is very liberal; I'm a Christian conservative, and yes, I am very, very disappointed by how far left things have gone, and how Godless people are. I long for the company of people like me. I long for just bumping into people and finding that they agree with my opinion on political and spiritual issues--instead of finding that they're living with someone unmarried, or that they're gay, or they do drugs or any other wickedness. I've even been considering moving to the south again. I originally come from Florida.

However, what ChristianExodus is planning on doing grieves me deeply. I am an American; I have patriotic pride, and to even think about letting go of America--the America that runs in my veins--is just too much. America is part of me; I am part of it. The connection will not be easily severed. It would take something as drastic and horrible as the takeover of communism, or a similar socialist takeover, or widespread Christian persecution, for me to feel the connection shaken at the roots.

There have been times that I have asked myself, "What now defines America?", or "What is the use anymore? Why keep fighting? What is there left to be proud of?" But every time I look around to answer that question, I find something or someone to satisfy it. Look at our troops. Look at our cops, our firefighters, volunteers. Look at our brave, noble people; the answer is in the people.

You see, it is not just having the right people in the right place in government positions, as you have stated on your site. We, as Christians, have failed our country. It is our fault. We have stopped living for God, and are living for ourselves. I am guilty of that very thing, and therefore share in the problems of this nation. I am guilty. You are guilty. All Christians are guilty for not being a witness to their neighbor and spreading God's Word. You see, if the nation were all Christian, we'd all be conservative and gay marriage, abortion, and other such problems would have never seen the light of day.

We have failed the atheist in not being an example.

We have failed the gay person by not being a witness and example.

We have failed our children by not teaching them about God's plan for sexuality.

We have failed God by turning our back on Him, and serving ourselves and our own selfish agendas. And therefore...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Romans 1:21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:

25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:

27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,

30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,

31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:

32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

My heart is heavy and grievous about all of this in America. We can clearly see where we have gone, and how we took the road that led us here.

We'll need a revolution to change the course we're on. We'll need a revolution to revive America.

Please, I beg you, do not follow through with your plan to secede from the rest of the nation. This is a very deep, serious issue, and I encourage you to pray more, study more, and meditate on it more, before making any decisions.

A Christian, conservative American patriot,
Adrienne Roberts

---------------------------------------------------

[II Paradox II]

I'd really like to know what everyone here thinks about this, especially my fellow Americans. Please, post. hmm... generally a bad idea (BTW - sorry if this sounds like a rant... but I can't see how this would help our mission as Christians):

1) At a social level, we as Christians are called to witness to and love the people around us... the sinful people around us. Nothing says "self-righteous hypocrites" more than a group of Christians desiring to secede because of their revulsion at the sins of others. The world will never reflect the values of God in it's entirety until God Himself comes down to rule it. Until then, we need to live among those who who may hate us, who may spit on us and who may even have it in for us. We need to think about how our actions look to those around us who do not believe in God. Every one of the worst suspicions about Christians that unbelievers have would be magnified if we ended up creating a theocracy in S. Carolina. Would we seal ourselves off from the sinners so we could have a nation for the righteous?

2) At a practical level, who are we kidding? You don't go seceding a southern state in the U.S. and expect it to be a "peaceful" thing. We fought a war over this once, I'm sure we'd do it again.

3) This would inevitably split the church even more as we supercede our spiritual bond with political borders. What about the many ethnic Christians who would be rightly suspicious of moving to S. Carolina to create a new Christian nation? If anything, this would just cause more splits as people divide within churches over this.

Ultimately, we are the ones who salt the earth with our lives and we cannot do that when we place ourselves above the sinners who reside here and create our own enclaves of like minded people. Our job is not to create an earthly kingdom that opposes the sinful people of the world, but a heavenly kingdom that transcends every earthly border.

ken

[Kas]

A group called ChristianExodus, www.ChristianExodus.org, has a plan to move 50,000 Christians to NC and secede the state peacefully, declaring the state as a free, Christian republic. Why? They say that gay marriage was the last straw. Go to their site to read up on their plan and reasons for trying to enact it. I'd really like to know what everyone here thinks about this, especially my fellow Americans. Please, post.

I sent ChristianExodus an email. The email is below. You should email them, too. This is a very serious issue.

--------------------------------------------------

Hello, this is Adrienne Roberts. I'm a College student, age 19, from Washington state. This state is very liberal; I'm a Christian conservative, and yes, I am very, very disappointed by how far left things have gone, and how Godless people are. I long for the company of people like me. I long for just bumping into people and finding that they agree with my opinion on political and spiritual issues--instead of finding that they're living with someone unmarried, or that they're gay, or they do drugs or any other wickedness. I've even been considering moving to the south again. I originally come from Florida.

However, what ChristianExodus is planning on doing grieves me deeply. I am an American; I have patriotic pride, and to even think about letting go of America--the America that runs in my veins--is just too much. America is part of me; I am part of it. The connection will not be easily severed. It would take something as drastic and horrible as the takeover of communism, or a similar socialist takeover, or widespread Christian persecution, for me to feel the connection shaken at the roots.

There have been times that I have asked myself, "What now defines America?", or "What is the use anymore? Why keep fighting? What is there left to be proud of?" But every time I look around to answer that question, I find something or someone to satisfy it. Look at our troops. Look at our cops, our firefighters, volunteers. Look at our brave, noble people; the answer is in the people.

You see, it is not just having the right people in the right place in government positions, as you have stated on your site. We, as Christians, have failed our country. It is our fault. We have stopped living for God, and are living for ourselves. I am guilty of that very thing, and therefore share in the problems of this nation. I am guilty. You are guilty. All Christians are guilty for not being a witness to their neighbor and spreading God's Word. You see, if the nation were all Christian, we'd all be conservative and gay marriage, abortion, and other such problems would have never seen the light of day.

We have failed the atheist in not being an example.

We have failed the gay person by not being a witness and example.

We have failed our children by not teaching them about God's plan for sexuality.

We have failed God by turning our back on Him, and serving ourselves and our own selfish agendas. And therefore...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Romans 1:21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:

25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:

27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,

30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,

31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:

32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

My heart is heavy and grievous about all of this in America. We can clearly see where we have gone, and how we took the road that led us here.

We'll need a revolution to change the course we're on. We'll need a revolution to revive America.

Please, I beg you, do not follow through with your plan to secede from the rest of the nation. This is a very deep, serious issue, and I encourage you to pray more, study more, and meditate on it more, before making any decisions.

A Christian, conservative American patriot,
Adrienne Roberts

---------------------------------------------------


i THINK THAT IT IS TRULY BEST IDEA, YOU START IT UP AND i WILL BE YOUR FIRST HOME BOUND IMMIGRANT!

[Dark_Lite]

It'll probably just be about as successful as the civil war south was in seceding, that is.. if they can actually somehow pull this off.

Too bad they're going against the commandment to witness. Instead they're hiding themselves.

And how exactly do they plan to do this anyway? Are they gonna elect a bunch of government officials or something?

Oh btw I think this is the stupidest idea I've heard in awhile.

[tigersnare]

Overkill.....we can't hide from the world.

If the first century Roman Christians could put up with thier society, I think we can deal with ours.

[Philip]

It'll probably just be about as successful as the civil war south was in seceding, that is.. if they can actually somehow pull this off.


It is more likely to go the way of the Conch Republic.

[Buccaneer]

Will it happen? no. If it does, i do not think it will be a bad thing.

[eldermike]

I am afraid they have a plan that will not work. I live in NC and 50,000 people could not change the name of a single street in most towns in NC. They have a math problem, most college towns here go up and down by almost that much on long weekends.

[BjBarnett]

HAHAHAHA LOL ROFL....

*notices that its serious*

oh umm.. no comment.

*walks away laughing* :)

[aeroz19]

Will it happen? no. If it does, i do not think it will be a bad thing.
It's difficult to guess what the result might be, but I am afraid persecution, torture, and war would be the end result. Someone--whether it be an individual, or a group--eventually manages to get their evil hands into the workings of the government and cause evil to spread, causing what I listed above. If that wouldn't happen, it would be perfect.

But the only perfect form of government will be the one that Jesus will establish when He returns to rule with a rod of iron. He will make everyone live for a thousand years, during His millenial reign, and will cause wars to cease, and famine and starvation will be no more. The earth will yield forth fruit to her fullest, and the world will be filled with His glory. There will finally be peace on the earth.

The fact that He will rule with a rod of iron would cause some on this forum to quickly conclude it will be a communist type of government, where whatever Jesus says goes, and if you don't obey, He'll kill you. Prime example of religious intollerance, you will think. However, this quick conclusion is reached by those who have already decided they don't like Christianity or Christians, for some reason.

I encourage those of you who might reach this quick conclusion to take a good look at the reasons you want to believe negative things about Christians and Christianity, and examine a little deeper whether or not your conclusions are justified.

Anyway, I take great comfort in knowing that He will rule with a rod of iron. It makes me feel protected. Jesus will not tolerate crime or evil deeds. He will take care of that business swiftly and effectively. Imagine, we'll be able to leave the doors unlocked at night and not worry. Kids will be able to go to schools without their parents worrying about kidnappings. And while they're at school, they'll be able to open up their Bible without being mocked or approached by faculty and told they couldn't read that, when they actually could. In fact, other children will join in instead of mock. At work, we won't have to endure discussions of the latest hangover some guy had, or someone sleeping around, or profanity. Instead, discussion will be on Godly things. People will not focus selfishly on themselves, but instead, on the work of the Lord.

Yet it seems like so long still to wait...

[ChrisB]

This is just the sort of whacky idea which gives Christianity a bad name. Best ignored I think.....................

[rwl]

Sounds like the Quebec vs. Canada thing.


;)

[didaskalos]

Why NC?
Make it Hawaii and I'm with you! :clap:

[LivingWorship]

I don't blame people for wanting to leave America, seems a hotbed of evil there. But I doubt it's much better anywhere else... society as a whole is Godless and it takes revival to turn that around. And revival only happens when people PRAY, FAST and carry the torch and evangelise like there's no tomorrow.

To secede from the US is ludicrous, they are so powerless they would have to GO TO WAR and their lack of power would show up even more on a war platform. I think that going to a holy war might be fine but I doubt this can be considered such... so I really think they are disobeying God if they seek to pursue this course of action.

Aeroz I applaud you for standing against them. While they would be well-intentioned they need to see that they would do more good (we all would) by witnessing and praying and simply trying to change America from within. 50000 Christians is a mighty army for God! They might not win any physical war but if they are close to the Lord and are serious about Christianity a group that size can do amazing things considering God's on their side!!! I pray your well-thought email provokes them to realise this.

[Col]

Too many freaks, not enough circuses.

[Knight]

Why NC?
Make it Hawaii and I'm with you! :clap:
Now this is an idea worth considering. :) :D

Seriously, this is one of the most hairbrained ideas to come out of Christianity in recent years. (And there have been a few.....)

I feel compelled to ask the leaders of this movement what this does to fulfil the great commission? What about Christ's high priestly prayer in John 17 where he says "I do not ask that you take them out of the world" (paraphrased)

If we, as Christians are upset with where our society is going then we need to get off our duffs on election day and hold our leaders accountable. We also need to be active in our society rather than living the monastic life sheltered within our Christian community.

[Dust and Ashes]

I hate to say this but most likely, if they do this, the end result will be that Christians as a whole will become targetted as a dangerous group that breeds insurgents and laws will be passed to regulate the "hatred and bigotry" taught from Christian pulpits and "tolerance" will be force taught...There might even be "reeducation facilities" to deprogram the poor victims of religious brainwashing. I mean Richard Dawkins has likened religion to a "software" like virus that infects the human brain and propogates through proselytization.

Methinks hard times are coming for the Body. :(

[Knight]

I wouldn't go that far.......

Likely, this will be laughed off as the ridiculous idea that it is.

It's extreemly doubtful that this will in any way be successful...

[Dust and Ashes]

I wouldn't go that far.......

Likely, this will be laughed off as the ridiculous idea that it is.

It's extreemly doubtful that this will in any way be successful...
Hopefully, it will be "nipped in the bud" before anything bad has a chance to happen. Regardless of how successful they are, I don't see how it can cause aught but harm to the image of Christianity. But then God has left me dumbfounded quite a few times by doing things that I had never thought of. I hope this is one of those times. ;)

[Lotar]

Oh btw I think this is the stupidest idea I've heard in awhile.
My sentiments exactly :D

[aeroz19]

I don't blame people for wanting to leave America, seems a hotbed of evil there. But I doubt it's much better anywhere else... society as a whole is Godless and it takes revival to turn that around. And revival only happens when people PRAY, FAST and carry the torch and evangelise like there's no tomorrow.

To secede from the US is ludicrous, they are so powerless they would have to GO TO WAR and their lack of power would show up even more on a war platform. I think that going to a holy war might be fine but I doubt this can be considered such... so I really think they are disobeying God if they seek to pursue this course of action.

Aeroz I applaud you for standing against them. While they would be well-intentioned they need to see that they would do more good (we all would) by witnessing and praying and simply trying to change America from within. 50000 Christians is a mighty army for God! They might not win any physical war but if they are close to the Lord and are serious about Christianity a group that size can do amazing things considering God's on their side!!! I pray your well-thought email provokes them to realise this.
Hey, there. Glad to see such a post as this. I completely agree with you.

By the way, you said it seemed like a hotbed of evil here in America. Is it that way in Australia too, or is it generally more moral over there? I'd like to know something about how things are over there, do tell. :)

[aeroz19]

Too many freaks, not enough circuses.
lol, yeah I guess, huh?

[aeroz19]

CORRECTION: It's not actually NC; it's SC. Sorry, everyone. :)

[aeroz19]

Now this is an idea worth considering. :) :D

Seriously, this is one of the most hairbrained ideas to come out of Christianity in recent years. (And there have been a few.....)

I feel compelled to ask the leaders of this movement what this does to fulfil the great commission? What about Christ's high priestly prayer in John 17 where he says "I do not ask that you take them out of the world" (paraphrased)

If we, as Christians are upset with where our society is going then we need to get off our duffs on election day and hold our leaders accountable. We also need to be active in our society rather than living the monastic life sheltered within our Christian community.
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMMMMMMMMMMMMMMEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEENNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[didaskalos]

CORRECTION: It's not actually NC; it's SC. Sorry, everyone. :)
Ahhh.... well, there you have it.
Say no more
say no more
nod nod
wink wink
say no more!

Been a resident of good ol' SC for almost 30 years.

Say no more!

[Celticflower]

It seems to me that seceding from America will not change anything in the long run. If these 50,000 Christians really want to make a difference they should start a grassroots organization to help elect conservative Christian officials to government. They should work for change from the inside, not run away and try to start over. That seems to me the cowards' way out, and Christians aren't supposed to be cowards.

Celtie

[LivingWorship]

Hey, there. Glad to see such a post as this. I completely agree with you.

By the way, you said it seemed like a hotbed of evil here in America. Is it that way in Australia too, or is it generally more moral over there? I'd like to know something about how things are over there, do tell. :)

Hi Aeroz! In my book, American government is so corrupt that we have just no idea! But I said then that society as a whole is godless... Australia may not be as bad from a government point of view, we do have religious freedom here (and it's real freedom! Too much? Other religions also get that freedom :mad:) and I do believe the church is stronger as a whole. However I also believe that many a Christian here have relaxed too long and are too caught up in the snare of the world. We are really not that much better IMO but on the church scene I suppose to the world we appear stronger (higher attendance, esp Pentecostal churches, flashy music etc).

There's a saying over here... "we're only about 10 years behind America"... whatever happens in the states in pretty much any field (but particualrly on the spiritual and moral front) happens here roughly a decade later. So while there is so much to be grateful to God and praise Him for, we should not get carried away and be satisfied that we think this is the best God can do... Tommy Tenney once said "If this is the best God can do... we're in trouble"... it's gotta be better than this!! Blessings y'all

[LynneClomina]

when i showed mom their website, she said that it was a stupid idea, becuase so many christians in one place would make them sitting ducks for violence.... she maybe right, but i dont think adding 50,000 to the poputlation there is a whole lot, is it??

[LynneClomina]

Hi Aeroz! In my book, American government is so corrupt that we have just no idea! But I said then that society as a whole is godless... Australia may not be as bad from a government point of view, we do have religious freedom here (and it's real freedom! Too much? Other religions also get that freedom :mad:) and I do believe the church is stronger as a whole.
huh, it's similar in canada - only other religions get MORE rights than christians. it's almost an "oh, anything but christianity!" attitude all the time. ppl of other "faiths" are considered "cultured", inspired, individualistic people, whereas christians are dunces. :sigh: the church as a whole in canada - i'm not sure. lukewarm, i think but i honestly have no idea what the church as a whole is like in any other country! :confused:

[JVD]

The libertarians are doing the same thing...only they are going to New Hampshire. They figure they only need 20,000 to take over that state. Here is their website

http://www.freestateproject.org/index.jsp

Maybe this is the answer. We will all move to different states depending on our religion or political point of view. I'll take Alaska, the greenies can have California, the mormons already have Utah, etc.

[BjBarnett]

50,000 would make a huge difference depending on what city or whatever they dropped in. For example I live in Middlesboro, Ky. The population is 12,000 for the city and 36,000 for the county. So if you put 50,000 people in my county they could easily win elections and such. But of course they would all be unemployeed :)

[9-iron]

If these 50,000 Christians really want to make a difference they should start a grassroots organization to help elect conservative Christian officials to government. They should work for change from the inside, not run away and try to start over.



It would be nice to see Christians operate with some common and practical sense. Instead we fly by the seat of our pants and base our decisions off emotions. Is it any wonder why the rest of the US sees us as extremist?

[LynneClomina]

50,000 would make a huge difference depending on what city or whatever they dropped in. For example I live in Middlesboro, Ky. The population is 12,000 for the city and 36,000 for the county. So if you put 50,000 people in my county they could easily win elections and such. But of course they would all be unemployeed :)
i think it said on the website that they would move into the state in general... i didnt get the impression it was into one county or city... :scratch: it would be sure stupid to move 50,000 people into a 12,000 town.

i would put :rolleyes: here, if he still existed! ;)

[BjBarnett]

i think it said on the website that they would move into the state in general... i didnt get the impression it was into one county or city... :scratch: it would be sure stupid to move 50,000 people into a 12,000 town.

i would put :rolleyes: here, if he still existed! ;)

yeah you have a point. if they spread out all over the target state than i totally agree they will have no affect.

[aeroz19]

huh, it's similar in canada - only other religions get MORE rights than christians. it's almost an "oh, anything but christianity!" attitude all the time. ppl of other "faiths" are considered "cultured", inspired, individualistic people, whereas christians are dunces. :sigh:
America is getting like that too. The liberals here say that all religions and beliefs and cultures are to be respected and valued...but not Christians. Christians are portrayed as narrow-minded bigots.

the church as a whole in canada - i'm not sure. lukewarm, i think but i honestly have no idea what the church as a whole is like in any other country! :confused:
The Church here in America is unmotivated for God, selfish, and luke-warm. But the Church is the people, and therefore, the people are the above--including me. :(

[Buccaneer]

Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.

Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.

Remember the words I spoke to you: 'No servant is greater than his master. 'If they persecuted me, they will persecute you also. If they obeyed my teaching, they will obey yours also.

Mark 8:34 And when he had called the people unto him with his disciples also, he said unto them, Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.
35 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel's, the same shall save it.

[Ebb]

South Carolina has always been full of a few hotheads, who are very reactionary in their way of thinking. Much to the embarassment to the rest of the South. They were still flying the flag of the Confederacy above their capitol up until a few years ago. But there are a lot of nice people there, too, who just put up with it. I understand Montana is much the same.

[horuhe00]

It is simple. If the US government takes this seriously, you'll see another Waco Texas, or another Ruby Ridge on CNN.

Good luck.

BTW, for decades, the american motto has been the "melting pot" of the world. That is to say, America has not held up it's belives and has just been "politicaly correct". A few generations later: here we are. Take many different breeds of dogs and leave them in a confined space for a few years... what you'll end up with are muts.

[violetstar]

That is a good idea , if we can find enough christian to move there.It is not the greatest state to live in,but if my family were willing I would move there.

[rainbowprism]

Um, excuse me...but I have to ask this question. Did Jesus, the Son of God, choose to only associate Himself with people of worthiness? No, He jumped into the muddy pit of humanity and looked straight into their eyes...prostitutes, tax collectors--it didn't matter. He had a heart for the least, the last, and the lost. To Him, all of us appeared less than pure than the other for we are all sinners. Jesus promised to spread His love to all, not the self-righteous chosen few. I don't see how making an exclusive Christian republic is at all "Christian" I don't see the Biblical precedent for such a thing at all...