Offical Poll for Offical Name

[GlowingFirefly]

Okay let's try a new thread and see how this poll goes. ;)

These are the top 3 results of the last poll. Vote here, and on May 25 that afternoon, the winning name will be chosen.

Sorry about the problem with the last poll. :doh:

[JVAC]

Nvts "Lift High the Cross" didn't make it. oh well... :)

-James

[Music4Hym777]

"Castle Wittenberg: A mighty Lutheran Fortress" is my Vote

[JVAC]

Just remembering the original intent of this forum for a minute, I don't think it is ethical for us to monopolize the name without giving some credit to the moravians, our forerunners and alies here at CF. We must include them somehow in the names, after all this forum is theirs too.

-James

[GlowingFirefly]

Call me stupid but what exactly IS a Moravian?

[JVAC]

Moravians are Hussites! (acts like that explained it all)

Moravians were followers of Jan Huss who lived in Bohemia, and who voiced some of Luther's concerns in the 1400's, about one hundred years before Luther. This led him straight to the stake where he was burned and, some would say, martyred by the Church of Rome. Afterwards the Church of Rome persecuted the Bohemian/Moravian church ruthlessly, and almost stamped them out.

Luther always advocated that the church should fix the abuses and welcome the Moravians back. To this day, I think they are greatly neglected in reformation history taught to today's lutherans and reformed congregants alike. However, they fully accepted the Augsburg Confession shortly after it was published and retain it today. The ELCA entered into full communion with them, if I am not mistaken, first.

-James

[GlowingFirefly]

Thanks James!

Well guys, it's the 25th, and as you can see, the winning name is:

Theologia Crucis - Confessional Lutherans

Now, before I send this off to Erwin to be changed, should we add in something about Moravians? If so, what are your ideas?

[Lotar]

I think just having Moravian's mentioned in the description is fine. There's only one or two on the entire board.


Darn, I wanted Table Talk... have to start thinking of a subforum for the name ;)

[GlowingFirefly]

Hehe. :D

Anyone else want to share their comment before I send this to Erwin?

[ChiRho]

As a Lutheran, I confess Cross Theology!

Pax Christi,

ChiRho

[JVAC]

I think you need to pm hunterjon.

-James

[GlowingFirefly]

Me James?

If so, why?

[JVAC]

He is the only Moravian I know of on CF. You can get his opinion.

-James

[ChiRho]

I am not sure why the Moravian Church is included in the Lutheran thread anyway. Shouldnt they have their own?

Pax Christi,

ChiRho

[GlowingFirefly]

I'm not real sure ChiRho. I thought they believed and did most of what Lutherans believe.

I'm still working on getting the name changed. Erwin has been real busy with the server so it might be a little bit. :)

[JVAC]

I am not sure why the Moravian Church is included in the Lutheran thread anyway. Shouldnt they have their own?
Because of three reasons:

1. The Confess the Three Ecumenical Creeds and Augsburg Confession to be true interpretations of Scripture.

2. They are in full communion with the ELCA.

3. Dr. Martin Luther always urged the Church to reach out and embrace the Moravians and welcome them.

-James

[ChiRho]

Because of three reasons:

1. The Confess the Three Ecumenical Creeds and Augsburg Confession to be true interpretations of Scripture.

2. They are in full communion with the ELCA.

3. Dr. Martin Luther always urged the Church to reach out and embrace the Moravians and welcome them.

-James

1. They do? There must be some dissention...somewhere...or they would be called Lutheran, right?

2. Price of tea in China?

3. Voicing an opinion that they should be entitled to their own thread or supporting our thread to be Lutheran does not stand in opposition of this. Bearing in mind the integrity of the Moravian Church, I would think, that they would want a thread that rightly proclaimed their beliefs. Certainly all are welcomed to come and share dialogue within the Lutheran thread, but all are not welcomed to claim Lutheran beliefs, if in fact, they are not Lutheran.

Pax Christi,

ChiRho

[JVAC]

Chi....

Moravians are our brothers, closer to us than any other denomination. They stood for the same principles as Lutherans did only they did so one hundred years earlier, before the printing press was popular. Our persecuted brethren are small in number and little attention is payed to them, it does not surprise me that people here no little about them.

Now on the topic of this anti-ecumenicism of the LCMS, I do not think that this is the time or the place. Whether the LCMS likes it or not they have an equal part in this Forum and as ELCA, I am glad of that. I am glad that we welcome our Moravian brothers here as Christ most undoubtedly would do. I am glad we can have fellowship together, as Christ most undoubtedly would have fellowshiped. This anti-ecumenicism gets really old and even still when you are talking about Moravians not belonging CF has put them. Next it will be ELCA, that you say we don't belong. If the fundamentals aren't grounds for unity in fellowship than what is?

-James

[ChiRho]

Chi....

Moravians are our brothers, closer to us than any other denomination. They stood for the same principles as Lutherans did only they did so one hundred years earlier, before the printing press was popular. Our persecuted brethren are small in number and little attention is payed to them, it does not surprise me that people here no little about them.

Now on the topic of this anti-ecumenicism of the LCMS, I do not think that this is the time or the place. Whether the LCMS likes it or not they have an equal part in this Forum and as ELCA, I am glad of that. I am glad that we welcome our Moravian brothers here as Christ most undoubtedly would do. I am glad we can have fellowship together, as Christ most undoubtedly would have fellowshiped. This anti-ecumenicism gets really old and even still when you are talking about Moravians not belonging CF has put them. Next it will be ELCA, that you say we don't belong. If the fundamentals aren't grounds for unity in fellowship than what is?

-James

James,

I am afraid, friend, that you have once again misunderstood my words. First of all, the LCMS is not anti-ecumenical, we just demand that ecumenicity be ecumenicity and not some poor imitation. Ecumenicity should rightly be pursued by all Christians. I am sorry if the correct definition of Ecumenicity gets tiring and frustrating...but equally frustrating, is enduring this constant, persistant, tenacious pursuit of unity, when it totally disregards truth, and pure doctrine. In essence, it is a fake agreement and totally worthless. Regardless of what Lutheran acronym you belong to (LCMS, WELS, ELCA, etc) if one, personally, does not agree that the Lutheran Confessions are the absolute and only true interpretation of Holy Scripture...then one is not Lutheran.

I understand the following analogy suffers a bit, but...

I may claim to be Republican, but if I hold strong to the positions and beliefs of the Libertarian Party, I am only Republican by name and therefore, in reality, not a real Republican.

If the fundamentals aren't grounds for unity in fellowship than what is?

And what are those fundamental points of the Moravian Church? Please direct me to a source to find these.

Pax Christi,

ChiRho

[JVAC]

The three creeds and Augsburg Confession, you can start there.

Honestly, if you are quite opposed to Moravians being here, it will be a very small step to saying ELCA shouldn't be here. The Moravians and ELCA are a lot closer than the LCMS I fear.

-James

[ChiRho]

Also, I was not rejecting the Moravians...just requesting a proper place for them to proclaim what they believe.

[JVAC]

Also, I was not rejecting the Moravians...just requesting a proper place for them to proclaim what they believe.
There is no more suitable a location than among their Lutheran brothers, who share fellowship of table and pulpit as well as the four most important confessions of the faith.

-James

[ChiRho]

The three creeds and Augsburg Confession, you can start there.

Honestly, if you are quite opposed to Moravians being here, it will be a very small step to saying ELCA shouldn't be here. The Moravians and ELCA are a lot closer than the LCMS I fear.

-James

As I do trust what you say...do you have a source written by the Moravians that back up your position? It would be nice to see their church doctrine. I found a website, but much of it seemed vague, almost to the point of allowing many interpretations of what they actually believe.

If you are Lutheran, you should be able to call this thread your home. If you are a Christian, then you are always welcome to post here, just not able to claim this thread as your own. Are you Lutheran?

The fact that you claim more similarity with a non-Lutheran church is quite disturbing...dont you think?

Pax Christi,

ChiRho

[ChiRho]

There is no more suitable a location than among their Lutheran brothers, who share fellowship of table and pulpit as well as the four most important confessions of the faith.

-James



SPUCATUM TAURI!!!

[JVAC]

As I do trust what you say...do you have a source written by the Moravians that back up your position? It would be nice to see their church doctrine. I found a website, but much of it seemed vague, almost to the point of allowing many interpretations of what they actually believe.

If you are Lutheran, you should be able to call this thread your home. If you are a Christian, then you are always welcome to post here, just not able to claim this thread as your own. Are you Lutheran?

The fact that you claim more similarity with a non-Lutheran church is quite disturbing...dont you think?

Pax Christi,

ChiRho
Actually all I know about Moravians is what I have read about from Luther's writings, and a brief history Jan Huss, and his movement. The only thing I can tell you is do a google search on "Moravians", "Jan Huss", "Hussites", "Bohemean Christians", etc.

According to the intent of this forum, if you are ELCA, LCMS, WELS or Moravian you should be able to call this forum home, read the Description!

Am I Lutheran? I am a catholic Christian who believes the teachings of the Church through 1054 and believes that the Book of Concord is a great interpreation of the Faith and should be highly regarded. I believe the Holy Scriptures is the inerrant Word of God. I believe the Augsburg Confession is the most true Confession of the true Christian church. You tell me....(I have a feeling your answer will say I am not though)

I claim more similarity with the Moravians because they like us ELCA wish to repair the schisms of the Church. They like us want to heal the body of Christ. They like us fully appreciate the Holy Sacrament of the Altar, and wish that solace to transend entrenched denominational lines.

-James

[JVAC]

SPUCATUM TAURI!!!
Say what?

-James

[JVAC]

SPUCATUM TAURI!!!
Ohhhhh, a roundabout way of filling this dialogue with the nasties. I see. I should have seen that, Taurus- bull Spucatum had me going a bit, can't see the paralel.

Well, sir, that is your opinion. I guess with a response like that dialogue can't continue, unless we wish to continue to talk about the differences rather than throw obscenities.

-James

[clayrichard]

www.moravians.com/ (http://www.moravians.com/)

[ChiRho]

Ohhhhh, a roundabout way of filling this dialogue with the nasties. I see. I should have seen that, Taurus- bull Spucatum had me going a bit, can't see the paralel.

Well, sir, that is your opinion. I guess with a response like that dialogue can't continue, unless we wish to continue to talk about the differences rather than throw obscenities.

-James

dialogue began...when? You offered something and I returned with an equal, but shortened reponse.

Pax Christi,

ChiRho

[JVAC]

dialogue began...when? You offered something and I returned with an equal, but shortened reponse.

Pax Christi,

ChiRho
That is my point, if we can't both have mutual respect, then we can't really have a fruitful dialogue. Your regarding my post as ******** is not what is considered 'respectful' even if it were ******** and yet we find it wasn't because the ELCA is infact in full communion with the Moravian Church. This means that something I said, which is factual and supports my end of the argument was attacked not with an equal or opposite answer but with an insult.

-James

[BronxBriar]

HABITARE FRATRES IN UNUM....well maybe one day.....I keep praying.

[Victrixa]

Hi my Lutheran friends,

That's a nice name you have there for the Lutheran forums! I like it! :)



Caroline

[JMRE5150]

Unstuck thread...no reason to keep as a sticky since the name has been chosen and adjusted.


Great poll gang! Thanks for your ideas and votes!


Robb