Methodism and Eastern Orthodoxy

[Brushstroke]

I've read that many of John Wesley's ideas and teachings actually come from the fathers of the Eastern Church, and that our two churches actually have quite a bit in common regarding doctrine. Could someone give me some insight into this?

Thanks. :)

~Phil~

[MoeSzyslak]

Having spent several years in the EO, this should be my moment to shine. But alas, I don't have a clue. I'm newer to Methodism and haven't really had a chance to delve into Wesley's works.

Wesley, himself, was a Anglican priest. I would guess first and foremost his teachings we're influenced by that. But as I'm sure your aware the Anglican church, part of the western church, was in communion with the EO for the first 800 to 1400 years of Christinaity (date depends on where you lived.) So Wesleys beliefs we're definately influenced by historic christianity, of which the EO was obviously part of. I personally feel that Anglican beliefs, and henceforth Wesley beliefs we're probably closer to the EOs then the Roman Catholics. They question many of the same things about the Roman Church, like purgatory and papal primacy, that the EO does. Matter of fact you can find writings in the OCA where it is suggested their people attend a Anglican church if a Orthodox church is not available. So the EO at least at one time felt the anglican church was probably the closest in belief. And that is the church that nutured Wesley.

Wesley himself did have contact to the EO church through a Greek orthodox bishop by the name of Erasmus of Arcadia. Erasmus was said to have ordain several pastors for the newly formed Methodist church and possibly to have raised Wesley to the rank of Bishop.(story that can not be proved or disproved so there is no point in wasting too much time or virtual ink on it.)

So Wesleys beliefs, largely framed by the Anglican beliefs, rejected items such as papal primacy and purgatory.

I think the one interesting items that I have been discovering is a point where Wesley seemed to part ways with the Anglican beliefs and adopted a Eastern view point. The folks here will call it the Holiness movement. To me it seems to be the equivalent of the eastern Theosis. So when the Roman church was condemning the hesychastes monks on Mt Athos for heresy for their belief in Theosis. Wesley down the road a few hundred years later seemed to grab the idea and opened it up in the West. For me so far, this seems to be the item where Wesley took a eastern turn.

Sorry I can't be of more help...

[cristianna]

I learn something new everyday here! Very interesting Moe.

[fuerein]

Phil, I'm former Nazarene so not Methodist but still closely related. I'd say some of the closest simularities would be the concept of Wesley's sanctification/Christian perfection and Orthodoxy's theosis. They aren't entirely the same but the basic concept of the Christian working toward perfection are commonly shared. Mind you I'm no Wesley scholar so I don't know his writings first hand though.

If you are really interested, St. Tikhon's Press (I believe), publishes two books that were the result of dialog between Wesleyan (I believe they were specifically Methodist) Theologians and Orthodox Theologians.

EDIT: Opps, sorry I just looked them up. It is St. Vladimir's Seminary Press. My bad.

If anyone is interested, I keep meaning to purchase them myself, just haven't yet:
http://www.svspress.com/product_info.php?products_id=3317

http://www.svspress.com/product_info.php?products_id=2766

[Brushstroke]

Having spent several years in the EO, this should be my moment to shine. But alas, I don't have a clue. I'm newer to Methodism and haven't really had a chance to delve into Wesley's works.

Wesley, himself, was a Anglican priest. I would guess first and foremost his teachings we're influenced by that. But as I'm sure your aware the Anglican church, part of the western church, was in communion with the EO for the first 800 to 1400 years of Christinaity (date depends on where you lived.) So Wesleys beliefs we're definately influenced by historic christianity, of which the EO was obviously part of. I personally feel that Anglican beliefs, and henceforth Wesley beliefs we're probably closer to the EOs then the Roman Catholics. They question many of the same things about the Roman Church, like purgatory and papal primacy, that the EO does. Matter of fact you can find writings in the OCA where it is suggested their people attend a Anglican church if a Orthodox church is not available. So the EO at least at one time felt the anglican church was probably the closest in belief. And that is the church that nutured Wesley.

Wesley himself did have contact to the EO church through a Greek orthodox bishop by the name of Erasmus of Arcadia. Erasmus was said to have ordain several pastors for the newly formed Methodist church and possibly to have raised Wesley to the rank of Bishop.(story that can not be proved or disproved so there is no point in wasting too much time or virtual ink on it.)

So Wesleys beliefs, largely framed by the Anglican beliefs, rejected items such as papal primacy and purgatory.

I think the one interesting items that I have been discovering is a point where Wesley seemed to part ways with the Anglican beliefs and adopted a Eastern view point. The folks here will call it the Holiness movement. To me it seems to be the equivalent of the eastern Theosis. So when the Roman church was condemning the hesychastes monks on Mt Athos for heresy for their belief in Theosis. Wesley down the road a few hundred years later seemed to grab the idea and opened it up in the West. For me so far, this seems to be the item where Wesley took a eastern turn.

Sorry I can't be of more help...
Yes, the traditional Anglican Church and us have much in common. In fact I believe there was a meeting of our bishops and theirs in England, and we basically agreed that we are essentially the same in theology.

[Speculative]

I learn something new everyday here! Very interesting Moe.I agree. Other than their shared problems with Rome, I had no idea and was very interested to see if there was a connection. Good stuff.

[GraceSeeker]

Moe, I'm a lifelong Methodist and didn't know anything about the EO connection. Thanks for expanding my horizons a bit.

[Jadis40]

This thread has been interesting. I've often found myself thinking that if I was to ever leave the UMC, I'd seriously consider becoming Eastern Orthodox.

Someone mentioned theosis, I found these links that give some detail on it:

http://wesley.nnu.edu/wesleyan_theology/theojrnl/31-35/31-2-4.htm

http://wesley.nnu.edu/wesleyan_theology/theojrnl/26-30/26-3.htm

[Knightwolflord]

I doubt highly that Methodism is rooted in Eastern Orthodoxy.

There are too many doctrinal differences that MANY Methodists would disagree with.

Just my 2 cents. :D

[contriteheart]

Sorry, decided to remove this post and the following two for reasons of my own.

[contriteheart]

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[contriteheart]

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[MoeSzyslak]

I doubt highly that Methodism is rooted in Eastern Orthodoxy.


That certainly wasn't the intent of my post. I apologize if it came out that way.