(Poll) President 2008

[JustinHesychast]

So out of curiosity, I am wondering who y'all will vote for (as of now, according to current information, etc.) to be President of the United States of America for the 2008 Presidential Election. :) You don't have to explain unless you just want to, this is mostly just to satisfy my curiosity. :P

Ron Paul here. :D (if I could vote... I'll be about 6 months short of the right age. Bah.)

[Protoevangel]

I voted Ron Paul, but SpyridonOCA is beginning to turn my stomach on him.

[Nichole]

I voted Ron Paul, but SpyridonOCA is beginning to turn my stomach on him.
LOL...............^_^.................I can fully understand why!!!!! :P

[Sacrum Silentium]

Ron Paul.

[rusmeister]

You didn't have the option of voting for nobody.

I would exclude Hillary from the list on the grounds that

a) she is a woman*

and

b) she is from an existing oligarchy - in a nation of 300 million people, at least one fifth of which should be theoretically eligible to be president, you shouldn't have two people from the same family get the job. We have enough oligarchy as it is.

Not that it matters. Whoever is elected will have quite limited power to change anything and so business will largely go on as usual. Some country or other will be invaded, corruption on high levels will still be a fact, etc...

I like how it is put in "The Hichhiker's Guide to the Galaxy":



The President, in particular, is very much a figurehead - he wields no real power whatsoever. He is apparently chosen by the government, but the qualities he is required to display are not those of leadership but those of finely-judged outrage. For this reason the President is always a controversial choice, always an infuriating but fascinating character. His job is not to wield power but to draw attention away from it.
... Very very few people realise that the President and the Government have virtually no power at all, and of these few people only six know whence ultimate political power is wielded.


* This to say that women are too good for politics, not the other way around.

[JustinHesychast]

There were 2 or 3 others I left out, too, because the poll limit was 10. Sorry.

[Dorothea]

Thompson followed closely by Huckabee.

[Thekla]

Alfred E. Newman ?

[kamikat]

The Libertarian Party hasn't chosen their candidate yet, so I'm not sure.

[Hoankan]

My choice isn't up there. You forgot Mickey Mouse!

[Knowledge3]

It would be nice if someone could explain to me how this supposed "democracy and government" in North America works.

. . .

[Protoevangel]

The Libertarian Party hasn't chosen their candidate yet, so I'm not sure.
Which one(s) do you like the best?

[rusmeister]

It would be nice if someone could explain to me how this supposed "democracy and government" in North America works.

. . .
Hey, K3, they won't explain it to me - you might as well not hold your breath.

I just think political passions are something the Church will gradually cure us of if we let it. (For me this happened after the 2004 election; up to that time I had been a political animal.)

It's part of "the Christmas Culture" of the West; the focus on trying to turn this world into the Kingdom of God through our efforts. This is not to say that nothing should be done, but we, in general, seriously overestimate the importance of political action.

There is truth in the Evangelical hymn "This world is not my home, I'm just a-passin' through..."

[Bushmaster78FS]

:| Ron Paul is the most suitable candidate, just like he bashed Abraham Lincoln and his policies on live tv, he will denounce most of the corrupt examples of American history... :sick: :help:we won't be true Americans until we experience Ron Paul. :sigh:

[IgnatiusOfAntioch]

Alan Keyes

[nutroll]

I liked what rusmeister had to say. I'll be voting for Zaphod Beeblebrox.

[Silentchapel]

http://maxtoons.com/skeletor08.jpg
That would be SO cool!

[Khaleas]

I voted for Thompson.... for VP... :P
If my naturalization comes through in time I'm really going to have to think about things again... I've got issues with all the Republican candidates who remain... McCain leans across the aisle a bit too much, Romney I'm not sure how he'll look at Christianity in the end, Huckabee can go live with all his illegal immigrants, Guiliani looks very doubtful right now although I like him on a lot of issues, Ron Paul will probably be wearing one of those straight jackets like his supporters are by the time this campaign is over...

[Thekla]

I liked what rusmeister had to say. I'll be voting for Zaphod Beeblebrox.
I'll vote for him based on cool name, alone !

[Dorothea]

The Rep. debate was really good tonight...one of the best this election season. Romney was the best I've ever seen him this evening.

[Xpycoctomos]

I would have said Huckabee but I'm just being realistic. The only possible people on the ticket will be Barak, or Clinton and Romney, Giuliani or McCain. That's a pretty safe bet there. If Huckabee or Ron Paul won the nomination, unfortunately, Barak or Clinto would have their free ride to the White House. Ron Paul is a TERRIBLE orator (with SOME fantastic ideas) and people wouldn't really get his point. He is too easily taken off track in debates and befuddles his words (not in a dumb Bush way, but in a frustrated way). I also don't get the impression that he knows how to listen, nor does he care to do so. So, he would be quite iron-fisted... and get nothing done. Someone with his great ideas needs to also know how to work with others and compromise. Fortunately or not, this is not Russian politics. If you can't compromise, nothing happens.

[Xpycoctomos]

Hey, K3, they won't explain it to me - you might as well not hold your breath.

I just think political passions are something the Church will gradually cure us of if we let it. (For me this happened after the 2004 election; up to that time I had been a political animal.)

It's part of "the Christmas Culture" of the West; the focus on trying to turn this world into the Kingdom of God through our efforts. This is not to say that nothing should be done, but we, in general, seriously overestimate the importance of political action.

There is truth in the Evangelical hymn "This world is not my home, I'm just a-passin' through..."

That I agree with. It's comforting to realize that, in the end, it really doesn't matter. However, it does matter when this tax increase or that tax cut decided by a guy I elected played a direct role in my neighbors ability to buy a house. It matter that liberal judges were elected (in NY? I forget where) decades ago that allowed for barely a majority to pass Roe v Wade changing/reflecting (I beleive it's both) the American culture in a matter of 10 years. (Although it's important to point out that one of those judges stated in his campaign that he would not support abortion "rights" and he was the surprise vote that passed Roe v Wade... so in that way, yes the electorate was duped and power was taken out of the people's hands. But they still voted for the other 4 (or whatever number of judges) that came into office.

But it is true that in the presidential elections we are very disconnected from teh win or loss of any candidate. Much of that has to do with the electoral college, but a lot of that has to do with our penchant for preserving the power of States over the whole (Vermont, for example, should be utterly and totally insignificant in a national election... and I wouldn't feel bad about that... but they actual have much more power than they should, even if it's very minimal still). I would continue and say that it matters that because we elected Bush we elected a war that probably wouldn't have happened (this is made clear to anyone when it becomes obvious that this war was in the works under the New American Century for years before Bush even arrived to the scene) and it matters that because we elected Bush and not Gore or Kerry we have two less pro-choice adovocate Judges than we would have... or at least it could matter one day. However that's hard to argue when we have this screwy electoral system. I voted (reluctantly) for Bush both times... and neither time did my vote have ANYTHING to do with his going to the WhiteHouse since my state went Democrat both times. (However, I just want to send a disclaimer that I am NOT suggesting that Gore would have won had we not had the electoral system. Many people don't vote in the national elections who DO vote in local elections becasue they feel their vote won't count... so who knows who would have won if we had popular vote... no one).

I admit that for me, national elections are more fun than anything. My state will go to Hillary or Barak most likely and I surely won't vote for any of them. Therefore, my vote will have NOTHING to do with ANYTHING... at all. Because Vermont would cry otherwise. But, that's how the game is played.

However, local politics does matter a great deal. Anyone who doesn't realize this needs to wake up. I find for me the more localized the vote, the less fun although scarier the vote can be. Oftentimes who your Drain comissioner is can have MUCH more effect on your life than who your senator or president is. And the more localized an election, the more your one vote really does matter. We just had a nearby election in which the Sheriff was a dead tie. I don't know hwo they resolved it but although uncommon, not unheard of.

Anyway, I do think democracy matters and it happens int he US, but I agree that the less local it gets the less we have a hand in anything and (even if we did) the less it effects our immediate lives.

[Xpycoctomos]

Shoot, I missed that. What channel was that? Maybe they have it on their website.

I wish I could find whole clips on Youtube of these things. All I can ever find are snippets here and there.

[Protoevangel]

That I agree with. It's comforting to realize that, in the end, it really doesn't matter. However, it does matter when this tax increase or that tax cut decided by a guy I elected played a direct role in my neighbors ability to buy a house. It matter that liberal judges were elected (in NY? I forget where) decades ago that allowed for barely a majority to pass Roe v Wade changing/reflecting (I beleive it's both) the American culture in a matter of 10 years. (Although it's important to point out that one of those judges stated in his campaign that he would not support abortion "rights" and he was the surprise vote that passed Roe v Wade... so in that way, yes the electorate was duped and power was taken out of the people's hands. But they still voted for the other 4 (or whatever number of judges) that came into office.

But it is true that in the presidential elections we are very disconnected from teh win or loss of any candidate. Much of that has to do with the electoral college, but a lot of that has to do with our penchant for preserving the power of States over the whole (Vermont, for example, should be utterly and totally insignificant in a national election... and I wouldn't feel bad about that... but they actual have much more power than they should, even if it's very minimal still). I would continue and say that it matters that because we elected Bush we elected a war that probably wouldn't have happened (this is made clear to anyone when it becomes obvious that this war was in the works under the New American Century for years before Bush even arrived to the scene) and it matters that because we elected Bush and not Gore or Kerry we have two less pro-choice adovocate Judges than we would have... or at least it could matter one day. However that's hard to argue when we have this screwy electoral system. I voted (reluctantly) for Bush both times... and neither time did my vote have ANYTHING to do with his going to the WhiteHouse since my state went Democrat both times. (However, I just want to send a disclaimer that I am NOT suggesting that Gore would have won had we not had the electoral system. Many people don't vote in the national elections who DO vote in local elections becasue they feel their vote won't count... so who knows who would have won if we had popular vote... no one).

I admit that for me, national elections are more fun than anything. My state will go to Hillary or Barak most likely and I surely won't vote for any of them. Therefore, my vote will have NOTHING to do with ANYTHING... at all. Because Vermont would cry otherwise. But, that's how the game is played.

However, local politics does matter a great deal. Anyone who doesn't realize this needs to wake up. I find for me the more localized the vote, the less fun although scarier the vote can be. Oftentimes who your Drain comissioner is can have MUCH more effect on your life than who your senator or president is. And the more localized an election, the more your one vote really does matter. We just had a nearby election in which the Sheriff was a dead tie. I don't know hwo they resolved it but although uncommon, not unheard of.

Anyway, I do think democracy matters and it happens int he US, but I agree that the less local it gets the less we have a hand in anything and (even if we did) the less it effects our immediate lives.


It might be interesting to know which post you are replying to. :)

[Dorothea]

Shoot, I missed that. What channel was that? Maybe they have it on their website.

I wish I could find whole clips on Youtube of these things. All I can ever find are snippets here and there.
Here's a link to the entire debate online, Xpy. :) There's a box toward the bottom of the page that lists different video debates. Pick yesterday's to watch.

http://www.youdecide2008.com/2008/01/25/video-msnbc-republican-debate-from-florida-12408/

[Xpycoctomos]

Here's a link to the entire debate online, Xpy. :) There's a box toward the bottom of the page that lists different video debates. Pick yesterday's to watch.

http://www.youdecide2008.com/2008/01/25/video-msnbc-republican-debate-from-florida-12408/
Thank you!

[Xpycoctomos]

It might be interesting to know which post you are replying to. :)
Sorry Prot. Thanks for pointing that out. My comp here often doesn't "quick quote" even though i click the button. So I forget to check to see if it did. I clicked quick quote for this one too. We will see what it does....

Thanks again :)

xpy

[Xpycoctomos]

My quick quotes worked this time!

[Protoevangel]

Sorry Prot. Thanks for pointing that out. My comp here often doesn't "quick quote" even though i click the button. So I forget to check to see if it did. I clicked quick quote for this one too. We will see what it does....

Thanks again :)

xpy
No prob, Xpy.

Yea, I don't like the Quick Quote feature myself, I like to have what I am replying to right in front of me while I am typing, otherwise, I end up forgetting what I'm replying to. I always either use the Post Quotes, or (more often) copy-paste what I am quoting, and do it all manually (this last way is how I got used to doing it in PDA mode).

I always end up being the person who does things the hard way, though.

[SeraphimSarov]

The write-in option isn't up there.

[SpyridonOCA]

Right now, McCain is my number one choice. A year ago, when Obama and Hillary were already the Democratic frontrunners, I wrote in an op-ed piece that when appeals to race and gender are swept aside, McCain emerges as the more qualified candidate. I stand by that.

[Xpycoctomos]

The write-in option isn't up there.
great saint. I don't know why, I feel some sort of attraction to him.. Always have. Do I know you under some other name? You have a lot of posts so I can see you are not new... at least not to CF.

[SeraphimSarov]

great saint. I don't know why, I feel some sort of attraction to him.. Always have.

:crosseo:

Do I know you under some other name? You have a lot of posts so I can see you are not new... at least not to CF.

Not new to CF or new here. I was KjellBjarne before.

[Matrona]

I went for Thompson, because he was the best. Unfortunately, I live in the state that ended his campaign. :cry: Ron Paul makes me want to puke, and I didn't much care for anyone else.

Really, I want to see anybody but Hillary. I've been supporting Obama against her. I'm not a fan of him but I would really rather risk having him president than Hillary. If Hillary wins, I'm moving to Mexico.

[SpyridonOCA]

Really, I want to see anybody but Hillary. I've been supporting Obama against her. I'm not a fan of him but I would really rather risk having him president than Hillary. If Hillary wins, I'm moving to Mexico.

The polls show that McCain is the only Republican candidate who could beat Hillary Clinton.

http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1582130,00.html

If McCain can't stop Hillary Clinton, no one can

[Xpycoctomos]

The polls show that McCain is the only Republican candidate who could beat Hillary Clinton.

http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1582130,00.html

If McCain can't stop Hillary Clinton, no one can
Obama might ;)