Whatsoever you do to the least of My brethren, that you do unto Me.

[MariaRegina]

These words of Christ are very clear.

We will be judged by Christ on how we treat our brothers.

What is your opinion about sarcasm or the use of the rollyeyed smilie :rolleyes:?

Do you think this is appropriate of Christians?

[Victorian Rose]

I think sarcasm is always a sin. It is hurtful to whoever it touches and that makes it a sin. It isn't loving. I am not always perfect in not using sarcasm but, I am getting much better. I used to be the sarcasm Queen. I really don't like the rollyeyed smiley because it is rude and used to show rudeness. I never use it and I think we could do without it.

[Andyman_1970]

We will be judged by Christ on how we treat our brothers.

Do you think this is appropriate of Christians?

I think for the believer the central issue if that verse is that there is a connection between how we treat others and how we see God. With this verse, when a Christian is disrespectful to another person (believer or not) ultimatly that Christian that is disrepectful is being disrespectful to God Himself.

Unfortunatly I have seen this far too often in churches without anyone even batting an eye.

[Kelly]

It can be. If it is used in an attempt to one up someone else. Joking among friends, where everyone knows (and feels) that it's just in fun...that's different.

A good example of the Christian use of sarcasm is the term 'friend'. Like "Look here, friend"... I've never heard a fellow christian call a stranger friend that didn't actually mean jerk.

[HumbleMan]

I believe that sarcasm is a sin, as it is usually said in mocking or belittling tone. If you can't speak to someone in a decent manner, or out of love, do not say anything that would cause you or someone else to stumble.

[EdmundBlackadderTheThird]

It all depends, my friends and I say things that to others might be insults but are said in fun and are not meant or taken as insults. Using the :rolleyes: in that context wouldn't be sinful in my opinion, neither would it be sinful to use use in the context of making the mood lighter in one of your own posts. I think that sarcasm used in an insulting manner is likely sin, but using sarcasm in a joking manner amongst friends is no more a sin than satire is a sin. It all depends on context really.

[MariaRegina]

It all depends, my friends and I say things that to others might be insults but are said in fun and are not meant or taken as insults. Using the :rolleyes: in that context wouldn't be sinful in my opinion, neither would it be sinful to use use in the context of making the mood lighter in one of your own posts. I think that sarcasm used in an insulting manner is likely sin, but using sarcasm in a joking manner amongst friends is no more a sin than satire is a sin. It all depends on context really.

I agree with Rainbow Rose's post. You all are giving great answers.

However, flesh99, could you please give a specific example of non-sinful sarcastic behavior?

I don't think a sarcastic word was ever uttered from Christ's lips, isn't this true?

[J.A.I]

I am sarcastic a LOT.. and I DO mean a lot.. with friends and family (especially my mommy; she and I love our special humor :D hehehe). I call my coworkers 'buddy' but I don't mean it as jerk.. It's just humor. I am a sarcastic person. That isn't sin.

If the intent in your heart is evil, then that's what makes it sin.

I am with Flesh and Kelly on this one.

[MariaRegina]

It can be. If it is used in an attempt to one up someone else. Joking among friends, where everyone knows (and feels) that it's just in fun...that's different.

A good example of the Christian use of sarcasm is the term 'friend'. Like "Look here, friend"... I've never heard a fellow christian call a stranger friend that didn't actually mean jerk.

Isn't this being double tongued? Isn't that a sin?

[EdmundBlackadderTheThird]

I agree with Rainbow Rose's post. You all are giving great answers.

However, flesh99, could you please give a specific example of non-sinful sarcastic behavior?

I don't think a sarcastic word was ever uttered from Christ's lips, isn't this true?

Anything that is not meant to hurt or belittle anyone. For instance when I tell my brother "Yeah, ...right, that's your story and you're stickin' to it". He knows it's a joke, I know it's a joke, and no-one is harmed.

Your last sentence is one of the worst strawmen you can throw out. Jesus also never drove a car, never used a computer, never called anyone on the phone, etc and so on ad nauseum. It is completely a strawman and honestly not worth responding to except to identify it as such.

[MariaRegina]

Anything that is not meant to hurt or belittle anyone. For instance when I tell my brother "Yeah, ...right, that's your story and you're stickin' to it". He knows it's a joke, I know it's a joke, and no-one is harmed.

Your last sentence is one of the worst strawmen you can throw out. Jesus also never drove a car, never used a computer, never called anyone on the phone, etc and so on ad nauseum. It is completely a strawman and honestly not worth responding to except to identify it as such.

I took logic and the question I asked isn't considered a strawman argument. It's an interrogative sentence, not a declarative assertion. Only declarative statements can be written or used as strawmen.

I asked an honest question:

Brood of Vipers
White washed sepulchres
Beam in your own eye

All these quotes from Christ - are they metaphors or is He using sarcasm?

Your move.

[EdmundBlackadderTheThird]

My move is to point out that you have crossed the line into debate, and ask that you respect the rules of this forum. I have stated my position and it will not change. Please cease debating.

[MariaRegina]

Dear Flesh99

According to your definition of a fundamentalist in the permanent rules for this forum, I qualify as a fundamentalist, as there was nothing in your statement that would exclude me. That is why I posted this poll and the questions.

I believe in the Holy Bible and in the unchanging Apostolic faith that was delivered once for all peoples in all times.

[EdmundBlackadderTheThird]

ok accepted ;)

[MariaRegina]

ok accepted ;)

Thanks, brother ;)

[mpshiel]

Interesting. Job uses sarcasm in Job 12:1 (though you sort of have to read up to it to realize how biting the sacasm is) - Yet God said Job was sinless.

As to the Jesus, I think there is a difference between a metaphor and sarcasm. If I say, "our positions are like apples and oranges" is it not sarcasm. If I said, "fighting you is like a buick taking on an ant." I think you could read some negativity there. I think Jesus was drawing out some personality issues about people or humans in general. "White Washed Sepulichure" - a metaphor comparing the obession over displaying outward purity regardless of what actually lies within (or it could be a metaphor on God's point of view as he sees both the inside and outside simultanously).

[Kelly]

Isn't this being double tongued? Isn't that a sin?
Yes, I should have re-arranged my post. THe use of 'friend' that I've heard is an example of bad (sinful) sarcasm

[Paula]

I think J.A.I. summed it up quite nicely when he said, "If the intent in your heart is evil, then that's what makes it sin."

The word sarcasm is from the Greek sarkasmos, meaning to tear flesh, bite the lips in rage, sneer, Note that Webster's has two definitions for sarcasm:

1 : a sharp and often satirical or ironic utterance designed to cut or give pain

2 a : a mode of satirical wit depending for its effect on bitter, caustic, and often ironic language that is usually directed against an individual b : the use or language of sarcasm

The second definition of satirical wit, especially when we use ironic language, is a lot different than cutting or biting rage, so I guess as long as we don't cut or give pain to someone, it wouldn't be sin.

synonyms for sarcastic: SATIRIC (http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionary&va=satiric), IRONIC (http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionary&va=ironic), SARDONIC (http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionary&va=sardonic+):
SATIRIC (http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionary&va=satiric+)implies that the intent of the ridiculing is censure and reprobation <a satiric look at contemporary sexual mores>. IRONIC (http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionary&va=ironic+)implies an attempt to be amusing or provocative by saying usually the opposite of what is meant <made the ironic observation that the government could always be trusted>. SARDONIC (http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionary&va=sardonic+)implies scorn, mockery, or derision that is manifested by either verbal or facial expression <surveyed the scene with a sardonic smile>.

[MariaRegina]

I think J.A.I. summed it up quite nicely when he said, "If the intent in your heart is evil, then that's what makes it sin."

The word sarcasm is from the Greek sarkasmos, meaning to tear flesh, bite the lips in rage, sneer, Note that Webster's has two definitions for sarcasm:

1 : a sharp and often satirical or ironic utterance designed to cut or give pain

2 a : a mode of satirical wit depending for its effect on bitter, caustic, and often ironic language that is usually directed against an individual b : the use or language of sarcasm

The second definition of satirical wit, especially when we use ironic language, is a lot different than cutting or biting rage, so I guess as long as we don't cut or give pain to someone, it wouldn't be sin.


Aren't satire and irony used as literary devices?

Sarcasm is mainly used in speech where we can use vocal inflections to deliver a sword to the heart of our listener. Indeed, since it is designed to cut or give pain, I cannot see the use of sarcasm except as sinful.

[BarbB]

I haven't used the rolleyes smilie in a while, but I am still sinfully addicted to the scratch smilie. I have zero defense. And I can be sarcastic, usually defensively, but that is still no excuse. :cry:

[J.A.I]

Aren't satire and irony used as literary devices?

Sarcasm is mainly used in speech where we can use vocal inflections to deliver a sword to the heart of our listener. Indeed, since it is designed to cut or give pain, I cannot see the use of sarcasm except as sinful.

I disagree. And when the poll was made, there was no choice for people who feel the way I and others do.

Sarcasm is not always sinful.

That's like saying sex is always a sin. It's a sin when it's USED wrongly, but when used in a proper context, it's not.

[MariaRegina]

Sarcasm is not the same as sex.

Sex was created by God; therefore it is good and is to be used for the procreation of our species.

Read 1 Cor 13:4-7

Love is patient and kind; it is not jealous or conceited or proud; love is not ill-mannered or selfish or irritable; love does not keep a record of wrongs; love is not happy with evil, but is happy with the truth. Love never gives up; and it's faith, hope, and patience never fail.

Doesn't sarcasm violate St. Paul's definition of love in 1 Cor. 13?

[J.A.I]

I didn't say sarcasm was the same as sex.

I said that is LIKE saying sex is always a sin.

Some things are not sin depending on the way they are used.

Drinking is not a sin. Getting drunk IS.
Sex is not a sin. Sex outside of marriage IS.
Sarcasm is not a sin. Used with the wrong intent, it IS.

If I am joking around w/my mom or so on, and we're being sarcastic, it isn't sin. And there ARE instances in the Bible where God is a bit sarcastic.

If I am being sarcastic w/someone with the intent of hurting them in some way, that is sin.

[Ceris]

Before I finally matured (and grew closer to God) about three years ago, I started to use sarcasm a lot. In fact I was using it to the point that my family was starting to get hurt. While I do not think all sarcasm is a sin (as Jai said, it has to do with the intent of the heart), one must be very careful when using it, because it can to lead to hurt, even when we do not mean to. There is a reason sarcasm originally meant "to cut flesh".

[J.A.I]

So Ceris, I see you finally decided to grace us with your presence. :|

^ Sarcasm, but Ceris knows I am joking, therefore = not sin! :)

[mpshiel]

So people really believe that if I come home and my parents say:

"We need you to clean out the septic tank."
and I say,
(sarcasm) "Yes, that sounds delightful."

Then I have sinned?

[BarbB]

So people really believe that if I come home and my parents say:

"We need you to clean out the septic tank."
and I say,
(sarcasm) "Yes, that sounds delightful."

Then I have sinned?

Nope. Peeuw! (I have no idea how that is spelled!) :D

[Paula]

Aren't satire and irony used as literary devices?Yes. Sarcasm (like irony, satire, parody, caricature, or any other literary device), can be (but is not always) bitter and hurtful. These devices are also frequently used by comedians and political satirists. As several others have already pointed out, sarcasm can also be playful, like when you walk into your office late and a co-worker lampoons you with, "How nice of you to join us this morning!" It's just a mild jab meant to tease, but I wouldn't take it so seriously as to call it sinful.

Irony is actually saying the opposite of what you really mean. It can be just as bad, or sometimes worse, than sarcasm. An example of irony as used in the Bible is the inscription which Pilate had placed above Jesus on the cross, calling him "King of the Jews." This is the worst example of irony I can think of, and of course, it was used to blaspheme and mock.

Sarcasm is mainly used in speech where we can use vocal inflections to deliver a sword to the heart of our listener. Indeed, since it is designed to cut or give pain, I cannot see the use of sarcasm except as sinful.Here I'd have to disagree. I didn't vote in your poll because of there was no choice that sarcasm can sometimes (but not always) be sinful.

[Wilfred of Ivanhoe]

These words of Christ are very clear.

We will be judged by Christ on how we treat our brothers.

What is your opinion about sarcasm or the use of the rollyeyed smilie :rolleyes:?

Do you think this is appropriate of Christians?

I would have added another option. Sarcasm is okay when dealing with the self-righteous or those who blatently disregard the clear teachings of the Bible.

[MariaRegina]

I would have added another option. Sarcasm is okay when dealing with the self-righteous or those who blatently disregard the clear teachings of the Bible.

That is my question. Isn't sarcasm a violation of 1 Cor. 13?

Isn't it self-righteous to use sarcasm against those who blatently disregard the clear teachings of the Bible?

[Wilfred of Ivanhoe]

That is my question. Isn't sarcasm a violation of 1 Cor. 13?

Isn't it self-righteous to use sarcasm against those who blatently disregard the clear teachings of the Bible?

Please understand that I have not come to a conclusion on this issue. Therefore, until I do, I refrain from using sarcasm, but am gentle with those who blatently twist and disregard direct commandments of scripture.

I know that Jesus was pretty blunt with the self-righteous of his times. Some would say, "But that was Jesus, the son of God, and you are not the son of God." However, I would respond, "But aren't we suppost to be Christ-like?" As I've said before, Christ was gentle to the sinner who was penitent in regards to his sin. However, Christ was quite harsh to those who held the truth in unrighteousness. Isn't that being Christ-Like?

As to paganism, I quickly suggest that people look at the manner in which Elijah humiliated the 400 prophets of Baal.

[J.A.I]

To me, God has used sarcasm. Remember the story about the quails ? How the people kept complaining about eating all that manna ?

Numbers 11:18-20 GW
18 Tell the people to get ready for tomorrow. They must be set apart as holy. Then they will eat meat. I, the LORD, heard them crying and saying, 'If only we had meat to eat! We were better off in Egypt!' So I will give them meat.
19 They won't eat it just for one or two days, or five, or ten, or twenty days,
20 but for a whole month, until it comes out of their ears and they're sick of it. This is because they rejected the LORD who is here among them and cried in front of him, asking, 'Why did we ever leave Egypt?'"

God's sense of humor and no-nonsense shine right there. It was pretty much like, "Ok you want this ? Alright, here you go. You think you want that quail ? I'll give you quail alright! Until it comes out of your ears!"

[Ceris]

Yeah, but that doesn't seem like sarcasm to me......

[J.A.I]

Ceris, don't you debate with me!!! You... you... you... COOL SMILEYHEAD!

[Ceris]

To go off track for 1 post: this is what Jai was referring to.

Edit:added the actual msn smiley as well.

[J.A.I]

Don't share!!! That's OUR secret!!!!!!!! :mad:

Just kidding :P

But you gotta show the msn smiley tooooo

[Jenna]

I dunno, I would be very hesitant about saying that using sarcasm is a sin. I mean, when I read some of the things that Jesus says to the pharisees and even his own apostles at times, it looks a lot like sarcasm to me. So, since we know that Jesus was without sin, I'd say from what I've observed that sarcasm itself isn't sinful. I would say that it can be used in a sinful way though.

[praying]

These words of Christ are very clear.

We will be judged by Christ on how we treat our brothers.

What is your opinion about sarcasm or the use of the rollyeyed smilie :rolleyes:?

Do you think this is appropriate of Christians?

I at times have issues with sarcasm more in real ife than here. I don't know that it is a sin but it does make for ill feelings at times. The roll eyes smiley, sometimes I am so tempted to use it but I don't, I think it should be done away with, I find it totally disrespectful. I would rather someone just be sarcastic with me.

[sad astronaut]

Anything that is not meant to hurt or belittle anyone. For instance when I tell my brother "Yeah, ...right, that's your story and you're stickin' to it". He knows it's a joke, I know it's a joke, and no-one is harmed.


I agree. I don't think there is anything wrong with me saying to myself or anyone else, "Oh yes, I loooovvveee doing yardwork."