Revelation 20:12

[Radiata]

I'm sure that everyone has seen this verse before, and furthermore I'm sure that this has already been talked about. But I just want the answer. The verse in question is as follows.....

11Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. Earth and sky fled from his presence, and there was no place for them. 12And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books. 13The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done. 14Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death. 15If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

How do you interpret this? There is nothing that we do that determines if we are saved or not. It is all God's doing, and not the work of ourselves. What is the meaning of this passage?

[Tofferer]

I'm sure that everyone has seen this verse before, and furthermore I'm sure that this has already been talked about. But I just want the answer. The verse in question is as follows.....

11Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. Earth and sky fled from his presence, and there was no place for them. 12And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books. 13The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done. 14Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death. 15If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.



How do you interpret this? There is nothing that we do that determines if we are saved or not. It is all God's doing, and not the work of ourselves. What is the meaning of this passage?
I don't think this has anything directly to do with salvation. I think that this is merely to show us who are saved how truly sinful we are. For the unsaved, it will be to show them how desperately they needed Jesus.

[DaRev]

There is nothing that we do that determines if we are saved or not.

Nothing we do determines if we are saved. That is God's work. But our works do indeed determine if we are not saved. God does not damn anyone to hell. We do that ourselves.

[Lupinus]

Wat he said.

I look at it as we can not save ourselves, but we sure can damn ourselves.

[Edial]

... How do you interpret this? There is nothing that we do that determines if we are saved or not. It is all God's doing, and not the work of ourselves. What is the meaning of this passage?

If one does perfect works, one would go to heaven.
That was the conversation Jesus had with the Rich Young Man.
However, in our world the default condition of a man is that "all have sinned" ... except Christ, of course.

This passage is for the ones that have rejected Christ.
How do we know this?
A verse in this text states that there is also a Book of Life. And if a name of a person is not found in that Book, one would be thrown into the Burning Lake that is also identified elsewhere as Gehenna (all the "gnashing teeth" verses).

What is the purpose of the books then if all that are judged by them would go to the same place?
Isn't it redundant to go through the whole process of looking at one's life just to be thrown intp the Lake?

On this earth the court system is set up in a way that all the transgressions need to be objectively proven.
The evidence is collected, the case is made and so forth.

These books will contains each individual's "works", or his/her life.
It will be objectively looked at.

It will be proven that the works a person did throughout his life are sinful.

No man could do good works out of our own personal holiness. Each time we do good, it always has a motive that is selfish.
For example, let's say the biggest charity one could imagine is helping the destitute.
What is so selfish about that?!! some might ask.

The selfish part in helping the destitute is that we are satisfying our sense of pity. However, if we do not feel pity, we usually do not help the destitute.

Everything a person does whether good or bad he does it in order to satisfy some of his or her own feelings.

But we are told to help the destitute! Isn't it good?
Of course it is. But it cannot save us, since we always have alterior motives for doing that - selfishness.
It is not a perfect good.

We do not KNOW what holiness is. We sense it, we try imitating it, we could even taste it, but we do not KNOW it.
The good that we do are these very "filthy rags" that Isaiah mentions.

A perfect holiness, however is a perfect justice that is based on perfect love.
It is a part of a nature, which is divine.
That is why a saved person partakes in a divine nature that Peter is talking about.

Now, let's get back to the text.

In all reality, people whose lives will be judged according to these books are the ones that intensely, soberly and purposefully rejected Christ while alive or dead in the Hades (or Sheol), a place where people go now when they die.

The books will be more of a record of iniquities that a person committed in his life.
A criminal record.

Thanks, :)
Ed

[BigNorsk]

Rev 20:12-15 ESV And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Then another book was opened, which is the book of life. And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, according to what they had done. (13) And the sea gave up the dead who were in it, Death and Hades gave up the dead who were in them, and they were judged, each one of them, according to what they had done. (14) Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. (15) And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.


The thing to keep in mind here is that first there are books opened, and then the book of life. Well we know exactly what happens concerning the book of life, if your name is not there, it is into the lake of fire with you. The names were writtent there before God created the universe. It has nothing to do with your deeds.

That brings us back to the books and the judgement concerning them. We see references where the people in heaven will be rewarded based on their works, we also see that it appears there is a difference in punishments for those condemned.

1Co 3:6-8 ESV I planted, Apollos watered, but God gave the growth. (7) So neither he who plants nor he who waters is anything, but only God who gives the growth. (8) He who plants and he who waters are one, and each will receive his wages according to his labor.

Luk 12:48 ESV But the one who did not know, and did what deserved a beating, will receive a light beating. Everyone to whom much was given, of him much will be required, and from him to whom they entrusted much, they will demand the more.


So salvation is one thing, and is dependant on your name in the book of life. Rewards or punishments another, and those would seem to depend on what you have done.

Marv