Lutheran Worship (The New Craberry Book)

[RevCowboy]

I didn't do a thorough check, but there doesn't seem to be any threads about the new Worship book.

I was wondering if anyone had any experience with it and what their thoughts about the book are. I used it all last year at the seminary and at my internship congregation. Its not perfect, but I think its definitely an upgrade from the green book.

[RegularGuy]

First...I think "cranberry" is a stupid description of the book's color. The only reason we don't call it "red" is because old farts like me remember the Service Book and Hymnal being called the "red" book.

Frankly, I think the color is properly "Babylonian Harlot Scarlet."

I like the fact that we now have all the Psalms and the Small Catechism in the ELW. I also like the 3 year lectionary prayers, and some of the other prayers.

And, it's a good collection of hymns...BUT...
except for the first two settings of Communion, the services are hard to use. There's too many of 'em!

I THINK that settings 3-10 would work best in congregations that have either projection screens or user-friendly bulletins.

Oh...I do not like projection screens in churches. But...that's me. I'm such a luddite, I even remember the "red" book.

[DailyBlessings]

I won't lie to ya: I really miss "God Himself is Present". But for the most part, I appreciate the new hymnal a great deal, and have encouraged its adoption by those who have sought my advice on the matter. The inclusion of the whole psalmody and the non-inclusion of the Athanasian creed are both positive decisions in my opinion, and the selection of hymns is wonderfully even-handed, not too skewed toward the old or the new.

The multicultural influence is a good thing, though I hope ethnicity-specific hymnal addendums will still be published (a largely Spanish-speaking or Korean congregation obviously still could not use the ELW as their priamry resource). But, I will be happy if the use of more foreign-language hymns leads to greater community between congregations of diverse backgrounds. There is much diversity in the ELCA these days, and I encourage any effort to make more Lutherans aware of their neighbors in the faith.

[RegularGuy]

You know the riddle:

Q: How many Lutherans does it take to change a light bulb?

A: CHANGE!!!???!!! :eek:

I think a lot of congregations will have trouble adapting to the ELW.

[DailyBlessings]

You know the riddle:

Q: How many Lutherans does it take to change a light bulb?

A: CHANGE!!!???!!! :eek:

I think a lot of congregations will have trouble adapting to the ELW.
I thought there would be more trouble than there has been, actually. The number of congregations that are using the ELW is growing rapidly, a sign to me that they did a good job of considering the needs and values of more traditional congregations. I do know a few churches that insist on keeping the green hymnal though, my upcoming teaching parish included. I'm not clear on why actually, as I haven't talked to anyone about it yet. It isn't because it is too new I don't think, because they currently use "This Far by Faith" regularly, and it was put out not very long ago. I'll have to remember to ask the pastor sometime. It may be that she herself objects to some of the new service settings, as I know she is a bit rigorous when it comes to exegesis and ritual.

[JoeCatch]

I must admit, I cannot stand "thankful hearts and voices raise." Actually, I don't mind one bit that this alternate wording for "thank the Lord and sing his praise" is included. I understand the push for inclusive language and the move away from describing God in exclusively male terms. Nevertheless, I just must not be as sensitive to the need for inclusive language as others, because I didn't see the need to do away with the old version entirely. "Send us with your promises" is by no means improper, but it conjures up completely different imagery from "he recalls his promises." Considering that the worship committee saw fit to include several musical settings for the new, inclusive version, it would have been nice to have at least one setting of the old one.

But I'm not going to disparage the entire project over that one quibble that I have with it. Overall I think it's well done and mostly an improvement over LBW. I agree with DailyBlessings that the inclusion of a more diverse musical tradition and the entire psalmody are commendable. I wouldn't have minded seeing the Athanasian Creed included, although the church I attend never uses it in the service, wisely as far as I'm concerned. Then again I suppose those who do want to use it can stick it in the bulletin.

No worship resource will ever be perfect, and every congregation I've ever attended has supplemented their hymnal to some degree with bulletin inserts and the like. It's inevitable that the same will continue to be done even now that ELW has been introduced, and none of its shortcomings is insurmountable by that well-established practice. On the whole, I like ELW just fine.

[RegularGuy]

I thought there would be more trouble than there has been, actually. The number of congregations that are using the ELW is growing rapidly, a sign to me that they did a good job of considering the needs and values of more traditional congregations. I do know a few churches that insist on keeping the green hymnal though, my upcoming teaching parish included. I'm not clear on why actually, as I haven't talked to anyone about it yet. It isn't because it is too new I don't think, because they currently use "This Far by Faith" regularly, and it was put out not very long ago. I'll have to remember to ask the pastor sometime. It may be that she herself objects to some of the new service settings, as I know she is a bit rigorous when it comes to exegesis and ritual.
I didn't say they'd have trouble adopting it...just adapting to it. My congregation, which is a small, traditional, country church, has had the ELW for about 6 months. We're still learning to use it.

[DailyBlessings]

Ah yeah, that's true. Luckily, the old settings are included, so it's not everything new at once. Joe, I've been getting used to the gender-inclusive language too. It's sad in some ways, good in others. Here at seminary much of the language is consciously gender-neutral, and I'm constantly forgetting about that and being surprised by it...

[RevCowboy]

First...I think "cranberry" is a stupid description of the book's color. The only reason we don't call it "red" is because old farts like me remember the Service Book and Hymnal being called the "red" book.

Frankly, I think the color is properly "Babylonian Harlot Scarlet."

I THINK that settings 3-10 would work best in congregations that have either projection screens or user-friendly bulletins.

Oh...I do not like projection screens in churches. But...that's me. I'm such a luddite, I even remember the "red" book.

Not only can we not call it the Red Book in Canada, we can't call it the ELW either. The Evangelical Lutheran Women is been the ELCIC's women's organization for a long time, and they really did not appreciate that the hymnal was called the ELW (I secretly call it the ELW because its easier). So we have to call it the Worship Book or WB in the bulletin.

As far as user friendly bulletins, everything in the ELW is accessible online. So it actually is pretty easy to make good bulletins if you don't mind using a ton of paper.

You know the riddle:

Q: How many Lutherans does it take to change a light bulb?

A: CHANGE!!!???!!! :eek:

I think a lot of congregations will have trouble adapting to the ELW.

The other version I have heard it:

Q: How many Lutheran does it take to change a light bulb?
A: My Grandfather bought that lightbulb for this church and if its good enough for him, may he rest in peace, its good enough for the rest of us!


As far as the different settings go, some are good some are bad. One sounds like a Broadway musical on the sampler CD, but when I sat down and tried on my guitar it wasn't half bad. The Spanish one is little cheesy when those whitebread folks sing it on the CD but I am glad its there. While most may not notice, my favourite thing about the book is the 10 Eucharistic prayer options. I just really like Eucharistic prayers being a liturgy nerd and all...

Regarding the inclusive language, I am mostly indifferent, but pleased that we aren't using God as a noun and pronoun meaning we have to say it fifteen time in one sentence. But so many of the cranky old conservatives have complained about the inclusive language just for the sake of complaining that I pretend to be really excited about it when I talk to them.

[UberLutheran]

Overall, I think ELW is a vast improvement over LBW.

There was a lot in the LBW I really didn't like: the hymn arrangements were nearly unplayable except by very good professional musicians (who has a span of a twelfth?) and many of the older hymns could be effectively sung only by a very well-trained choir -- and let's face it, most churches do not have very well-trained choirs.

I find the new settings of the liturgy very interesting and our congregation loves setting one! There is a much broader and more inclusive set of hymns included in ELW, but don't throw WOV away since some of the WOV Christmas hymns didn't make it in to ELW.

Adding the Short Catechism is a nice touch.

All in all, I think ELW could be remembered as one of the great hymnals, much like the Episcopal Hymnals of 1940 and 1982.

[RegularGuy]

All in all, I think ELW could be remembered as one of the great hymnals, much like the Episcopal Hymnals of 1940 and 1982.


Or the Old Common Service Book? Truly the Common Service Book was a great achievment in American Lutheran worship books.

Has anyone seen the new worship resource that Gracia Grindahl had a hand in? The service in it is essentially an updating of the old Common Service.

Though I love some of that old service, this is truly a step backward. I don't think that we as Lutherans can afford to live in the past.

[UberLutheran]

Or the Old Common Service Book? Truly the Common Service Book was a great achievment in American Lutheran worship books.

Has anyone seen the new worship resource that Gracia Grindahl had a hand in? The service in it is essentially an updating of the old Common Service.

Though I love some of that old service, this is truly a step backward. I don't think that we as Lutherans can afford to live in the past.


Which makes me think of a joke.

Q. How many Lutherans does it take to change a light bulb?
A. Change???

[Melethiel]

Eh, it's not as horrid as the rumors had it. I do think 10 settings is a bit much, and some of the settings are rather cheesy or too liberal for my liking. The selection of hymns is pretty good. Including the entire Psalmody was nice. However, when comparing the ELW (which my church just changed to - and we STILL can't use one of the more traditional settings, much to my chagrin) and the LSB (new LCMS hymnal, which I ordered for my personal library), I much prefer the LSB.

UberLutheran - that's what organs are for. Given that the span of the twelfth is usually between the bass and tenor, that's quite easily handled when playing hymns on the organ. :P

[Edial]

First...
Frankly, I think the color is properly "Babylonian Harlot Scarlet." ...
I think this proper rendering of the color might not go well with some of the ELCA congregations. :)

[Willy]

It's a good book. It probably tries to do too much--too many liturgies without the full liturgy printed. They left things out (offertory prayers, offertory) that would have been helpful to have included. The pages are too thin, meaning that it takes people too long to move from one section to another. But there's a good breadth of songs. And some of the more rhythm-driven liturgies I appreciate.

[KagomeShuko]

All in all, I think ELW could be remembered as one of the great hymnals, much like the Episcopal Hymnals of 1940 and 1982.


The Episcopal hymnal of 1982? Eurgh . . .

I much prefer their Celebration Hymnal.

I mean, yes, 1982 has some good stuff, but just TRY to like the tune they use for "God of Grace and God of Glory," and you'll see . . . and there are some others . . . just eurgh . . .

[doulos_tou_kuriou]

I was really excited about the ELW. I was happy to see such a diverse and vast hymnal that incorparated as much as it did. Being involved in two different congregations which are diverse in their nature, I have really appreciated the vastness of this hymnal.

That said, I think I am a bit more cynical than most here seem to be. I am not altogether against changes in language to be more inclusive, but I do think the hymnal went too far. SOme of the work of the psalms specifically for instance. I also think that it is not always beneficial to reword things like liturgy, prayers, and classic, oft repeated hymns every fifteen years or so. For someone like myself who prefers to have such things memorized, this can be difficult. I do not think that that is all that welcoming to people who have not been in church for some years when everything has to be changed and they cannot even recite the Lord's Prayer with everyone.
I also do not think this hymnal is ideal for every congregation. It has worked wondrously for the ones I have been a part of partially because we are so diverse a hymnal. But I wonder how less diverse congregations feel. Yes it finally includes Asian hymns for example, but if your congregation is all Asian, this hymnal is still not necessarily ideal. I think it is still focused on an english speaking, primarily european community but it recognizes that they are not the only people of the ELCA. But for an hispanic congregation how fully helpful is this hymnal?
And call me a Lutheran but I dreaded the loss of some great hymns that just couldn't make the cut.
This sounds really nasty I know. But not many people were addressing some real criticisms of this hymnal fully I felt. Over all I still love the hymnal. I really love for example the healing and lament sections of this hymnal. Overall ELW has gone a long way, just as its predecessors had before it. Although I think the next hymnal will be able to address some of the "radicalness" (if I can call it that) of the hymnal and grow off of its success.
When I was at Valpo we had both the ELW and LSB (Lutheran Service Book)-the new hymnal of the LCMS-now the combo of the two was a really amazing duo for worship!
Pax