How some Evangelical Leaders view the Middle East peace plans?

[Torah]

Evangelical Leaders Reiterate Call for Two-State Solution for Israel and Palestine


Over 80 educators and ministry heads affirm efforts to negotiate lasting peace, and warn of consequences of failure.
David Neff | posted 12/01/200705:45AM

This week the Bush State Department is devoting its full diplomatic efforts toward bringing a two-state resolution to the Israel-Palestine conflict. Over the past few months, they have put on a full-court press to gather a broad representation of Arab world leaders to join Israeli and Palestinian negotiators for a historic meeting in Annapolis, Maryland. Now, Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert and Palestinian National Authority President Mahmoud Abbas have agreed to a program of sustained and focused negotiations throughout 2008.

Related articles and links (http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2007/novemberweb-only/148-33.0.html#related#related)


With these cautious but hopeful beginnings, over 80 evangelical leaders have signed a statement indicating their belief "that the way forward is for the Israelis and Palestinians to negotiate a fair, two-state solution."
These leaders—including Christian college and seminary presidents, denominational heads, and other ministry leaders—pledge their "ongoing support for the security of Israel," and state that "unless the situation between Israel and Palestine improves quickly, the consequences will be devastating" for Israel. Palestinians with little economic opportunity "are increasingly sympathetic to radical solutions."
The full text of their statement and the list of signatories follow.
* * *

An Evangelical Statement on Israel/Palestine
As evangelical Christians committed to the full authority of the Scriptures, we feel compelled to make a statement together at this historic moment in the life of the Holy Land.
The Israeli-Palestinian conflict is near a momentous turning point. The strife has continued—sometimes simmering, sometimes exploding in terrible conflict—for decades.
In the context of our ongoing support for the security of Israel, we believe that unless the situation between Israel and Palestine improves quickly, the consequences will be devastating. Palestinians—especially the youth who have no economic opportunity—are increasingly sympathetic to radical solutions and terrorism. As a result, the threat to Israel's security is now greater.
Likewise, the threat to America's national security is greater. Because so many of the world's 1.3 billion Muslims see America through the prism of Israel-Palestine, the longer the current situation continues, the more likely it is that anti-American attitudes, policies, and terrorist activities will increase dramatically among Muslims worldwide.
As evangelical Christians, we believe our faith compels us to speak a word together at this crucial moment.
The Bible clearly teaches that God longs for justice and peace for all people. We believe that the principles about justice taught so powerfully by the Hebrew prophets apply to all nations, including the United States, Israel, and the Palestinians. Therefore we are compelled to work for a fair, negotiated solution for both Israelis and Palestinians. We resolve to work diligently for a secure, enduring peace and a flourishing economy for the democratic State of Israel. We also resolve to work for a viable permanent, democratic Palestinian State with a flourishing economy that offers economic opportunity to all its people. We believe that the way forward is for the Israelis and Palestinians to negotiate a fair, two-state solution.
We are encouraged that the Israeli and Palestinian governments have officially endorsed a two-state solution and that polls demonstrate that solid majorities in both Israel and Palestine embrace this path.
We call on all evangelicals, all Christians, and everyone of good will to join us to work and pray faithfully in the coming months for a just, lasting two-state solution in the Holy Land. We call on all involved governments to work diligently toward this goal. And we covenant to pray for the leaders of all the nations engaged in this effort, hoping for them the blessing of our Lord, who said, "Blessed are the peacemakers."
As we work and pray, we are strengthened by the truth that Christ will return some day to complete his victory over sin and injustice, and we are empowered by the knowledge that until He comes again, He summons us to support the things that promote peace and justice for everyone in the Holy Land.


To see the list of Evangelical Leaders;
http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2007/novemberweb-only/148-33.0.html (http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2007/novemberweb-only/148-33.0.html)



I strongly oppose these Evangelical Leaders!

PS

Send a letter to the Christianity Today .
David, Neff, Editor-in-Chief
Christianity Today


http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/help/contactus.html (http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/help/contactus.html)

[Henaynei]

did you mean to double post in here?
How some Evangelical Leaders view the Middle East peace plans? (http://christianforums.com/t6508413-how-some-evangelical-leaders-view-the-middle-east-peace-plans.html) was posted 4 minutes before this thread....

btw - thanks for posting this ...

[Henaynei]

I wonder if these are the same folks who signed the "apology" to the Muslims earlier?

Apology to Muslims... and other news... (http://christianforums.com/t6492635-apology-to-muslims-and-other-news.html)

[Dreamomto4]

Why? don't you believe that the Palestinians need a home? If they can sit down to a peaceable solution, that will mean an end to the senseless killing that has been going on forever. Stupid terrorists will still manage to screw it up, I'm sure, but let's keep the killing to a minimum.


Or are you thinking that if a Jewish State is established, Christ will return? Do you really think that God is bound by what these humans do in world politics?

Christ has already come. He will come again when God's timing is right, not just because Israel has a certain border.

Besides, He is not willing that any should be lost, so if He takes his time, that's good for me. Maybe then my uncle will still have time to change his mind.
Or, in the long term, perhaps I will have descendants that fall away, and they'll need the extra time to repent and return to God.

God's time is best, not mine.

Or do you have a completely different view on this? Maybe explaining Why you disagree will help some of us form intelligent responces to your blanket statement.

[visionary]

What can one say but how prophectic of them.

[Torah]

Why? don't you believe that the Palestinians need a home?

[1] They have a home, They have land, and look what they do with what they have.


If they can sit down to a peaceable solution, that will mean an end to the senseless killing that has been going on forever.

This is what most People do not and can not understand, Palestinians and Muslims do not want peace, and they want a land without Jews. This is what they call a “peaceable solution”. And to prove this they still will not acknowledge Israelis right to be there.

Stupid terrorists will still manage to screw it up, I'm sure, but let's keep the killing to a minimum.

When there was an election in the Palestine a year or two ago the people overwhelmingly voted in Hamas a known terrorist group.

Or are you thinking that if a Jewish State is established, Christ will return? Do you really think that God is bound by what these humans do in world politics?

Christ has already come. He will come again when God's timing is right, not just because Israel has a certain border.

Besides, He is not willing that any should be lost, so if He takes his time, that's good for me. Maybe then my uncle will still have time to change his mind.
Or, in the long term, perhaps I will have descendants that fall away, and they'll need the extra time to repent and return to God.

God's time is best, not mine.

Or do you have a completely different view on this? Maybe explaining Why you disagree will help some of us form intelligent responces to your blanket statement.
Believing that giving up land for peace will not and is not going to work. If the Palestinians would stop teaching & training from thereSchools and TV, there children to hate Jews, kill all Jews, and they have the right to all the land. Then life can go on with peace. But no, they teach hate, they teach a land without Jews. This you can not understand because you think you dealing with people that want peace. You can use the word peace in the same sentence, but is has two different meanings. The word peace to you and these Evangelical Leaders means we stop fight we both lay down our weapons and we live side by side.

The word Peace to the Palestinians means we Owen all the land and all Jews will live under our rule. {if there are any left)

This is why I make this “blanket statement”


...


Solution:
(1) Make the Palestinians stop spending money on weapons, rockets and bombs and spend there money on building up what they have.

(2) Work with Israel in clearing out Terrors groups.

(3) Stop teaching there children hate.

(4) Acknowledge Israel right to be there.

[visionary]

When you see.....Lu 21:20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. Religious armies are now gathering...
Political armies are now gathering...
Financial armies, will they be next...

[Dreamomto4]

Wow. I'm sorry . I mis-read your intent in the post. one of the negatives of these forums - Insert foot now.

I do believe in a Jewish State, I don't believe hate should be taught.
I'm going to stop now before I say something else stupid, though.

[RND]

When you see.....Religious armies are now gathering...
Political armies are now gathering...
Financial armies, will they be next...

Question.

Weren't Jesus' words here specifically related to the destruction of Jerusalem in 70AD?

[minister50]

Evangelical Leaders Reiterate Call for Two-State Solution for Israel and Palestine


Over 80 educators and ministry heads affirm efforts to negotiate lasting peace, and warn of consequences of failure.
David Neff | posted 12/01/200705:45AM

This week the Bush State Department is devoting its full diplomatic efforts toward bringing a two-state resolution to the Israel-Palestine conflict. Over the past few months, they have put on a full-court press to gather a broad representation of Arab world leaders to join Israeli and Palestinian negotiators for a historic meeting in Annapolis, Maryland. Now, Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert and Palestinian National Authority President Mahmoud Abbas have agreed to a program of sustained and focused negotiations throughout 2008.

Related articles and links (http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2007/novemberweb-only/148-33.0.html#related#related)


With these cautious but hopeful beginnings, over 80 evangelical leaders have signed a statement indicating their belief "that the way forward is for the Israelis and Palestinians to negotiate a fair, two-state solution."
These leaders—including Christian college and seminary presidents, denominational heads, and other ministry leaders—pledge their "ongoing support for the security of Israel," and state that "unless the situation between Israel and Palestine improves quickly, the consequences will be devastating" for Israel. Palestinians with little economic opportunity "are increasingly sympathetic to radical solutions."
The full text of their statement and the list of signatories follow.
* * *

An Evangelical Statement on Israel/Palestine
As evangelical Christians committed to the full authority of the Scriptures, we feel compelled to make a statement together at this historic moment in the life of the Holy Land.
The Israeli-Palestinian conflict is near a momentous turning point. The strife has continued—sometimes simmering, sometimes exploding in terrible conflict—for decades.
In the context of our ongoing support for the security of Israel, we believe that unless the situation between Israel and Palestine improves quickly, the consequences will be devastating. Palestinians—especially the youth who have no economic opportunity—are increasingly sympathetic to radical solutions and terrorism. As a result, the threat to Israel's security is now greater.
Likewise, the threat to America's national security is greater. Because so many of the world's 1.3 billion Muslims see America through the prism of Israel-Palestine, the longer the current situation continues, the more likely it is that anti-American attitudes, policies, and terrorist activities will increase dramatically among Muslims worldwide.
As evangelical Christians, we believe our faith compels us to speak a word together at this crucial moment.
The Bible clearly teaches that God longs for justice and peace for all people. We believe that the principles about justice taught so powerfully by the Hebrew prophets apply to all nations, including the United States, Israel, and the Palestinians. Therefore we are compelled to work for a fair, negotiated solution for both Israelis and Palestinians. We resolve to work diligently for a secure, enduring peace and a flourishing economy for the democratic State of Israel. We also resolve to work for a viable permanent, democratic Palestinian State with a flourishing economy that offers economic opportunity to all its people. We believe that the way forward is for the Israelis and Palestinians to negotiate a fair, two-state solution.
We are encouraged that the Israeli and Palestinian governments have officially endorsed a two-state solution and that polls demonstrate that solid majorities in both Israel and Palestine embrace this path.
We call on all evangelicals, all Christians, and everyone of good will to join us to work and pray faithfully in the coming months for a just, lasting two-state solution in the Holy Land. We call on all involved governments to work diligently toward this goal. And we covenant to pray for the leaders of all the nations engaged in this effort, hoping for them the blessing of our Lord, who said, "Blessed are the peacemakers."
As we work and pray, we are strengthened by the truth that Christ will return some day to complete his victory over sin and injustice, and we are empowered by the knowledge that until He comes again, He summons us to support the things that promote peace and justice for everyone in the Holy Land.


To see the list of Evangelical Leaders;
http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2007/novemberweb-only/148-33.0.html (http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2007/novemberweb-only/148-33.0.html)



I strongly oppose these Evangelical Leaders!

PS
Send a letter to the Christianity Today .
David, Neff, Editor-in-Chief
Christianity Today
http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/help/contactus.html (http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/help/contactus.html)



As Jesus said they do error not knowing the Scriptures.

[visionary]

You don't think history and the prophecies can repeat themselves?

[RND]

You don't think history and the prophecies can repeat themselves?

I'll take a stab at it and say that you're directing your question to me. I don't believe that 'history' per se will repeat itself in that I believe 'His Story' has already been told and thus the prophecies are simply the telling of 'His Story' before it happens.

Now, do I think specifically that the world as a whole will rise up against one particular secular nation named the STATE OF ISRAEL in these end-times?

No.

The modern, secular (non-theocratic) state of Israel today has nothing to do with end-times Bible prophecy. If it did I'd be a follower of the likes of the John Hagee's and Tim LaHaye's of the world.

Galatians 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

The end-time attack and war will be against those that align themselves with the teachings and ways of the Messiah, and that display His nature and character of Him, the Lord Jesus Christ.

Revelation 14:6 ¶ And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,

Revelation 14:7 Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.

Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here [are] they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

[ozell]

The Arabs won't be the problem when its time to give up Jerusalem, it will be the gentiles.

When the gentiles want Jerusalem they are coming for it.

they will twake it and trample it underfoot.


Rv 11:2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

[ozell]

The Israelites are the teachers of God's word

the evangelicals(gentiles) are the students

the student is trying to teach the teacher?

Rom3v1: What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?
2: Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.

Ex 19:6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.


Mt 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

and one wonders why things are out of order.

the gentiles are teaching the word and they are the students they are not the God's teacher.

[RND]

The Israelites are the teachers of God's word

the evangelicals(gentiles) are the students

the student is trying to teach the teacher?

Rom3v1: What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?
2: Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.

Ex 19:6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.


Mt 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

and one wonders why things are out of order.

the gentiles are teaching the word and they are the students they are not the God's teacher.

Matthew 21:43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.



Romans 2:29 But he [is] a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision [is that] of the heart, in the spirit, [and] not in the letter; whose praise [is] not of men, but of God.



Matthew 8:11 And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven.

Matthew 8:12 But the children of the kingdom (true Israelites) shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.



Rom 3:9 ¶ What then? are we better [than they]? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;

Rom 3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:

Rom 3:11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

[RND]

Romans 2:25 ¶ For circumcision verily profiteth, if thou keep the law: but if thou be a breaker of the law, thy circumcision is made uncircumcision.

Romans 2:26 Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision?

Romans 2:27 And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfil the law, judge thee, who by the letter and circumcision dost transgress the law?

Romans 2:28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither [is that] circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:

Romans 2:29 But he [is] a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision [is that] of the heart, in the spirit, [and] not in the letter; whose praise [is] not of men, but of God.


Romans 10:12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.

Galatians 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

Colossians 3:11 Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond [nor] free: but Christ [is] all, and in all.

If this message has offended anyone I apologize to you, but the Word of the Lord stands above our private interpretations.

[Bananna]

This thread is being reopened with the understanding that non members will not be teaching here. Non members may ask questions and directly defend posistion on the subject of Evangelical views of Israel only when directly challenged by members to do so.

This now in debate forum.

Non members are free to invite members to a debate on Paul's meanings of the scriptures in a New thread, with the understanding that dialoge will be non accusatory and polite.

Please do not derail Original Topic.

Thank you for your understanding.
Bananna

[Colabomb]

The Israelites are the teachers of God's word

the evangelicals(gentiles) are the students

the student is trying to teach the teacher?

Rom3v1: What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?
2: Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.

Ex 19:6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.


Mt 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

and one wonders why things are out of order.

the gentiles are teaching the word and they are the students they are not the God's teacher.

watch out were comin' for ya :doh:

(The racist paranoia of this place is getting overwhelming)

[visionary]

While the spirit of truth moves upon the individuals. God can still use the unbelievers to fulfill the prophecies in a larger picture to capture the people as the reality of his prophecies that God has his hand even in the politics of the nations. God is still waiting for his people to become white and ripe for the harvest.

[Henaynei]

watch out were comin' for ya :doh:

(The racist paranoia of this place is getting overwhelming)it is true.... we may be paranoid.... but just because we are does not mean we're wrong.... :sigh:

[Colabomb]

it is true.... we may be paranoid.... but just because we are does not mean we're wrong.... :sigh:

Kurt Cobain said something similar....

[Henaynei]

Kurt Cobain said something similar.... if so, Kurt Cobain was unoriginally quoting something that predated him by a generation ... poor fella ... but plagiarism does not invalidate the truth of the statement.