Can somebody explain this creed/prayer please?

[chuck50954]

Hello everybody. I visited an ELCA church yesterday. Everything was quite as expected, until the affirmation prayer just before communion. Here it is in its entirety:

"In the beginning was the circle. God made the world round, floated a sun to shine light around our days and hung a moon and many stars to brighten each night. All creatures had their place in the circle of life. All seasons came round in their appointed times. All creation danced in a circle of joy.

"In the beginning was the tapestry. Jesus, the great weaver, wove together a rich and diverse fabric. All colors, all sizes and shapes went into the needlework. Cultures and traditions were woven in like gold and silver threads. Each variation contributed to a strong and beautiful whole.

"In the beginning was music. The Holy Spirit conducts a glorious sound using the songs of the birds, the music of the mountains and streams, the harmony of the woods, the chorus of frogs and crickets and the trumpets of praise and drums of glory from the depths of humanity. The orchestra needs all of us to make a great melody of praise.

"From the beginning to now, God uses all of us to create joy and beauty, hope and compassion. Amen."

I do not know what to make of this prayer. I tried looking it up online--it came from somewhere--but I can't trace its origins. So what do you all know about it and think about it? I adore any respectful opinions so please don't be shy.

God bless you in Jesus' name. --Chuck

[IowaLutheran]

That's a new one to me. I'm somewhat traditional in worship preference, so I'm not a big fan of using that type of prayer in the liturgy. The imagery is nice and poetic, but not suitable as a part of the Eucharistic prayers IMHO.

[RegularGuy]

It's new to me. I'd ask the pastor about the source of the prayer. I find it theologically weak. It says a lot about the work of the Trinity in creation and about the "siblinghood of humanity." It has rather too high a view of humanity for my taste and lacks any sense of soteriology.

Blech!

You say it is a "Prayer of Affirmation" did it substitute for the Creed? I really dislike modern credal statements that say something other than the historic ecumenical symbols: the Apostles', Nicene and Athanasian Creeds.

I remember attending a modern worship service some years ago where the "creed" included a statement to the effect of "I believe in earthworms and butterflies." While I do happen to believe in earthworms and butterflies, I don't see how confession of that belief adds to the experience of worship.

[chuck50954]

I probably will have to ask the pastor, since I can't find any info anywhere else, including online. Somebody said that it's in the new prayerbook--is that true? The church I attended doesn't have any newer ones.

Yes, this prayer did substitute for the Creed. I think it smacks of nature-worship myself, and it sorta changes the role of Christ from Savior to weaver. Creation is a "circle," which sounds witch-crafty to me.

Maybe it should be renamed "Gaia Creed."

Thanks for your replies. --Chuck

[IowaLutheran]

While I haven't read the new red hymnal front-to-back, I highly doubt that this creed is in the new hymnal.

[RegularGuy]

I probably will have to ask the pastor, since I can't find any info anywhere else, including online. Somebody said that it's in the new prayerbook--is that true? The church I attended doesn't have any newer ones.

Yes, this prayer did substitute for the Creed. I think it smacks of nature-worship myself, and it sorta changes the role of Christ from Savior to weaver. Creation is a "circle," which sounds witch-crafty to me.

Maybe it should be renamed "Gaia Creed."

Thanks for your replies. --Chuck
I'm not a gambler. I have moral objections to gambling. But, I'd bet $100.00 that it is not from the new ELW.

Chances are pretty good that it came from some subscription service.

One of the local ELCA churches uses stuff like this a lot.

Blech!

[DailyBlessings]

Hello everybody. I visited an ELCA church yesterday. Everything was quite as expected, until the affirmation prayer just before communion. Here it is in its entirety:

"In the beginning was the circle. God made the world round, floated a sun to shine light around our days and hung a moon and many stars to brighten each night. All creatures had their place in the circle of life. All seasons came round in their appointed times. All creation danced in a circle of joy.

"In the beginning was the tapestry. Jesus, the great weaver, wove together a rich and diverse fabric. All colors, all sizes and shapes went into the needlework. Cultures and traditions were woven in like gold and silver threads. Each variation contributed to a strong and beautiful whole.

"In the beginning was music. The Holy Spirit conducts a glorious sound using the songs of the birds, the music of the mountains and streams, the harmony of the woods, the chorus of frogs and crickets and the trumpets of praise and drums of glory from the depths of humanity. The orchestra needs all of us to make a great melody of praise.

"From the beginning to now, God uses all of us to create joy and beauty, hope and compassion. Amen."

I do not know what to make of this prayer. I tried looking it up online--it came from somewhere--but I can't trace its origins. So what do you all know about it and think about it? I adore any respectful opinions so please don't be shy.

God bless you in Jesus' name. --ChuckWell, creeds can be doxological as well as doctrinal- I don't agree with everything in the Athanasian creed for instance, but I never minded reciting it, because finding perfect doctrine in a human document is not the point, but rather the faith that moves a body to say a creed together in the first place.

Some liberal ECLA churches like to borrow creeds that are used by mission churches in other parts of the world, and this one has that general sound to me: some missionary synthesis of Christianity with local cosmology. (And no, it is not in the ELW or This Far by Faith.)

[rockytrails]

Before any thing was their was God
and then God created . read Genesis
this poem says something else .

the poem to say it as a mid western Lutheran would.

the poem is not worth
a single stinkin cow patty in a whole pile of fresh manure.

One ELCA church may have used that poem but that does not mean every ELCA church
rejects what Luther taught about God and his creation.

just as one ELCA member may be a practicing homosexual but that does not mean every elca member agrees with that sinful life .

Gods blessings

[chuck50954]

Yes, it was immediately clear to me when I saw this creed-thing in church, that it wasn't scriptural, as it blatantly re-writes Genesis to posit another creation story. And it also diminishes God's role in creation, making the Creation seem as if it were something that existed outside God Himself, that He merely participates in.

The pastor had 2 services that day, the one in which I encountered this simarillion creed, and a second one later, that was much more biblically sound, on healing. The pastor sent me an email a couple days later, to which I replied, giving him my testimony of Jesus, which has a lot to do with healing. He never replied to my email.

[doulos_tou_kuriou]

While I hate to say it, it sounds like another shining example of when the ELCA embaresses itself. Or moreover, when churches within the ELCA embaress the rest of it.
This sounds like an interesting reflection on God and creation (although I am not sure I would call it an accurate or biblically sound one).
This is the cost of congregational freedom. Take it as you will. One of a handful of examples it seems in which I almost wish we were more structured/strict like the LCMS...almost.
I'm just happy to be Lutheran...Happy Reformation day all!
Peace be with you.

[UberLutheran]

Hello everybody. I visited an ELCA church yesterday. Everything was quite as expected, until the affirmation prayer just before communion. Here it is in its entirety:

"In the beginning was the circle. God made the world round, floated a sun to shine light around our days and hung a moon and many stars to brighten each night. All creatures had their place in the circle of life. All seasons came round in their appointed times. All creation danced in a circle of joy.

"In the beginning was the tapestry. Jesus, the great weaver, wove together a rich and diverse fabric. All colors, all sizes and shapes went into the needlework. Cultures and traditions were woven in like gold and silver threads. Each variation contributed to a strong and beautiful whole.

"In the beginning was music. The Holy Spirit conducts a glorious sound using the songs of the birds, the music of the mountains and streams, the harmony of the woods, the chorus of frogs and crickets and the trumpets of praise and drums of glory from the depths of humanity. The orchestra needs all of us to make a great melody of praise.

"From the beginning to now, God uses all of us to create joy and beauty, hope and compassion. Amen."

I do not know what to make of this prayer. I tried looking it up online--it came from somewhere--but I can't trace its origins. So what do you all know about it and think about it? I adore any respectful opinions so please don't be shy.

God bless you in Jesus' name. --Chuck

It reminds me of something one might hear at the Unity School of Christianity.

(I was music director at a Unity church for several years, which for me was "a bit" of a theological clash. When an opening came up in an ELCA church, I jumped at the chance!)

Then again, it might be a manifestation of the crystalline matrix thought transference transmissions from the group consciousness represented in the Pleiades.

Ommmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...

[RegularGuy]

Hi, Uber!

:wave: