Zecharia 8:28 - What is this verse about?

[theguitardood]

(Sorry. That should say 8:23 in the title)

Zech. 8:23
This is what the LORD Almighty says: "In those days ten men from all languages and nations will take firm hold of one Jewish man by the hem of his robe and say, 'Let us go with you, because we have heard that God is with you.' "

I opened my bible to this verse yesterday and at first I thought it was a prophecy about the disciples of Yeshua, but the fact that they were men of other nations and not Jewish men (as the disciples were) and there were only ten of them led me to believe it is a prophecy about the nations returning the Jewish people to the land. Is this correct? What is the significance of the number ten? If this has already taken place, does it line up with the historical events of the previous century and the restoration of Israel?

Shalom

[Steve Petersen]

Ten is the minimum number of adult males needed for a congregation. The sages based this number on the episode in which Abraham bartered God down to 10 righteous men in Sodom/Gomorah. God agreed that if He found 10, he would spare the cities.

'Those days' refers to the times mentioned in the prior verses. From the context it appears to be the Messianic Era, som say 1000 years long.

[français]

Well, we know that during the Messianic Era, all Jews will know the Torah without even having to study it (Jeremiah 31:33) We also know that the whole world will worship the G-d of Israel (Isaiah 2:17). And, we also know that many nations will seek the Moshiach(Isaiah 11:10.)

So, the Jews are going to know the Torah without studying it, since it will be stamped on their hearts, the whole world will know the G-d of Israel, nations will repent for their wrong doings to Israel (Isaiah 52:11), and that many nations will seek the Moshiach.

Clearly, the Jews will be in a very grate state, and will be very happy (just as Isaiah 51:11 says.) so clearly, people will look towards the Jews for guidance!

When Jesus came, obviously such did not happen. But, I will leave it up to you to decide if he is moshiach or not. You might interpret things differently.

[Steve Petersen]

When Jesus came, obviously such did not happen. But, I will leave it up to you to decide if he is moshiach or not. You might interpret things differently.

Moshiach, not moshiach! What's it matter to an atheist? :confused:

Odd why such people waste their time on lost causes like us, isn't it?:scratch:

Maybe they are trying to enlighten us!:idea:

[français]

Moshiach, not moshiach! What's it matter to an atheist?:scratch:

Odd why such people waste their time on lost causes like us, isn't it?:confused:

Maybe they are trying to enlighten us!:idea:

Just because I am not a hebrew christian or a jew does not mean that I can not voice an opinion.

And it is not a waste of time. Holding a view that jesus is not the Moshiach if we use the TaNaCH is a view. How is it a waste of time?

[Steve Petersen]

Just because I am not a hebrew christian or a jew does not mean that I can not voice an opinion.

And it is not a waste of time. Holding a view that jesus is not the Moshiach if we use the TaNaCH is a view. How is it a waste of time?

http://foru.ms/t5846752-mj-wiki-welcome-all-to-mj-sign-in-and-read-about-our-fsrs-forum-specific-rules.html

[GerTzedek]

(Sorry. That should say 8:23 in the title)

Zech. 8:23
This is what the LORD Almighty says: "In those days ten men from all languages and nations will take firm hold of one Jewish man by the hem of his robe and say, 'Let us go with you, because we have heard that God is with you.' "

I opened my bible to this verse yesterday and at first I thought it was a prophecy about the disciples of Yeshua, but the fact that they were men of other nations and not Jewish men (as the disciples were) and there were only ten of them led me to believe it is a prophecy about the nations returning the Jewish people to the land. Is this correct? What is the significance of the number ten? If this has already taken place, does it line up with the historical events of the previous century and the restoration of Israel?

Shalom
I don't think this prophecy is about Yeshua. However, it amazes me that you would discount it merely because the 12 desciples were Jews. It is the nature of this sort of speech to be figurative, not literal. "Taking the hem" would not have to be read literally/historically, but simply as a metaphorical way of saying they follow him.

[Henaynei]

Just because I am not a hebrew christian or a jew does not mean that I can not voice an opinion.

And it is not a waste of time. Holding a view that jesus is not the Moshiach if we use the TaNaCH is a view. How is it a waste of time?according to our Forum Specific Rules (as cited by Steve) this part of the discussion is only permitted in http://foru.ms/clear.gifMessianic Debate Subforum (http://foru.ms/f807-messianic-debate-subforum.html).

If you'd like to continue and pursue this train of discussion/debate please take it to that forum :) There are plenty of good folks who will be only too happy to accommodate you there :D

[français]

Wow, I was not even starting a debate..

I don't know why people are so scared to hear others views.

Well, I will have a great time in the debate section. :)

[GerTzedek]

Wow, I was not even starting a debate..Sure you were. Your words were specifically designed to be inflammatory. Do you think we are so stupid we can't spot blatant trolling? I for one will not respond to you in debate. You have earned yourself a ticked to Iggyville. Enjoy your stay.

[français]

Sure you were. Your words were specifically designed to be inflammatory. Do you think we are so stupid we can't spot blatant trolling? I for one will not respond to you in debate. You have earned yourself a ticked to Iggyville. Enjoy your stay.

Maybe you should reread what I said.. I said that jesus did not fulfill that verse. And he didn't. Show me where in this world people are grabbing on to jews asking them for guidance because of Moshiach. I was stating the obvious.

But I was also quick to add that one can interpret things differently, and it was up for them to decide. So please.. Don't take what I said out of context.

I said that jesus did not fulfill those prophecies. But i also said that one can interpret it differently.

I am an atheist and really do not care if jesus fulfilled them or not. So why would i start an argument?

oh well, if you are so insecure that you have to ignore someone, so be it.

[theguitardood]

Wow. Didn't foresee this happening.

Maybe a mod should close this for cleanup.

[Steve Petersen]

When Jesus came, obviously such did not happen. But, I will leave it up to you to decide if he is moshiach or not.

Maybe you should reread what I said.. I said that jesus did not fulfill that verse. And he didn't. Show me where in this world people are grabbing on to jews asking them for guidance because of Moshiach. I was stating the obvious.

The Messianic Era is in the future.

I am an atheist and really do not care if jesus fulfilled them or not.

Why post then? Trolling for a fight?

[fritz300]

It means that people will begin to reconize a man who knows YHVH in these last days. The Word Jew is a bad translation in my opinion... you could say Judean, but still, it refers to us, all the Israelites scattered among the nations from the 12 tribes as the sand of the sea...

Those who understand their identity and walk in Spirit and Truth and follow the Lamb wherever He goes... people will recognize these in these last days and follow them, for they know truly know their Mighty One, YHVH, and will not be shaken.. just as the scripture says.

Regards,
fritz

[GerTzedek]

Jew is not a bad translation. A Judean is simply the old word for what today is called a Jew. No one says Judean anymore, just like no one says Israelite.

[GerTzedek]

bump

[visionary]

Maybe you should reread what I said.. I said that jesus did not fulfill that verse. And he didn't. Show me where in this world people are grabbing on to jews asking them for guidance because of Moshiach. I was stating the obvious.

But I was also quick to add that one can interpret things differently, and it was up for them to decide. So please.. Don't take what I said out of context.

I said that jesus did not fulfill those prophecies. But i also said that one can interpret it differently.

I am an atheist and really do not care if jesus fulfilled them or not. So why would i start an argument?

oh well, if you are so insecure that you have to ignore someone, so be it.I can see both applications, that Yeshua is the one that all nations grab ahold of His hem, and that it will come to pass that all eyes will turn to the one true God, the Holy One of Israel and the nation will be the priest of all nations as they were meant to be and then they will be able to shine the truth forth just like Yeshua and all will grab on to their hem.
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