Islamic Terrorism ~ The real reason? [Archive]

SonWorshipper

7th October 2003, 03:17 PM

I had this post all typed up and my PC just shut down and restarted for no reason :rolleyes: Hmmmmm.

Anyway, I have been contemplating this for awhile and have come to some preliminary conclusions and would like your input to what you think of this.

What is the main purpose of Islam? We know that Muhammad was not the last prophet, but Yeshua was ( one of many things He was and is), so why the "need" for this? Confusion is one I can think of as well as perhaps jealousy on the part of the Ishmaelites? Wanting to have their own prophet?, but I think that this was inspired from the depths of Sheol, for their is one G-d and there is another who wants to be him and will try anything to lead others astray.

But what is the purpose of the terrorism? The suicidal bombings? I think many get caught up in the obvious and overlook the undercurrent, the base root and reasoning if you will, of this.

I believe that it has to do with witnessing.

( Perhaps Yafet can shed some Rabbinic thought on the witness?)

It was important if not certainly pertinent that any that were to be of the twelve were EYE witnesses to the beginning and the end of Yeshua's ministry on earth. For not by one man's word should something be believed, but by two, as well as an eye witness was the most powerful to attest to anything that there is. So here you have eyewitnesses to the ministry, the crucifixion and resurrection of Yeshua to testy to the world of what happened. Now these men believed what they were taught, what they heard and saw with their own eyes and in believing this with their whole hearts and minds attested to it on the pain of death, and many went to their graves in a very tortuous manner for these beliefs. So a case can be built for the heathen that their witness was true because they died for it.

I found this on Christian Persecution:

Christian Persecution: Many of the Early Disciples Died for their Faith
Christian persecution was a dramatic part of early church history. For anyone who holds that the life, death and resurrection of Jesus Christ was a man-made hoax conspired by a group of disciples should check out the legacy of martyrdom. Eleven of the 12 apostles, and many of the other early disciples, died for their adherence to this story. This is dramatic, since they all witnessed the alleged events of Jesus and still went to their deaths defending their faith. Why is this dramatic, when many throughout history have died martyred deaths for a religious belief? Because people don’t die for a lie. Look at human nature throughout history. No conspiracy can be maintained when life or liberty is at stake. Dying for a belief is one thing, but numerous eye-witnesses dying for a known lie is quite another.

But do you see what I see? That people don't die for a lie. So with that in mind where does that leave Islam?

Achichem

7th October 2003, 04:36 PM

But do you see what I see? That people don't die for a lie. So with that in mind where does that leave Islam?
Warning, this is a right out of my head thought on the matter.

You make a good point!
But I do not see it that way!(I want to)

I believe what they said is no one defends on a lie, if one is lying and knows its a lie,
so if you confount a lair himself,and you threaten their life they will offten submit.

So I take it you are talking about Mohamed and his jihad. But in that case Islam was expanding not defending!

No one was stopping Islam from existing ,it seems to me that Mohammad and his followers made one offer, Submit, Pay or Die! That is not defending that is attacking!

That actually gives me the opposite opinion: that things forced are mostly a lie!

To adress your other ponit, about islamic terrorism, thay are defending an
Illusion no matter how you look at it or they are just following their role-modal and attacking.

AnthonyForChrist

7th October 2003, 05:46 PM

I always thought the conflicts between the religion of the Arabs and that of the Jews had to do something with Abraham and his sons Yitschaak and Ishmael. Perhaps a jealously thing that lasted even into our own era? So, this whole conflict seems to be a fighting between brothers...but a tad more intense, eh?

Henaynei

7th October 2003, 10:17 PM

Just because someone *says* "no one dies for a lie" doesn't make it so.

Perhaps no one dies for what he *believes* is a lie. Muslims don't believe Islam is a lie.

The word Islam means "submission" and the goal of Islam is to bring the world into submission to -llah.

Some of the more assimilated and moderate "reform or conservative" Muslims (especially in the US) will tell you Islam means the Muslim submitting to -llah and the Qoran - and I agree that that is *one* facet - but it is not the whole picture or even the big picture.

The motivator for jihad is the fatwah that the entire world must be brought into submission to -llah. Did you know that dying while furthering this "holy" quest is the ONLY guaranteed path to eternal life for a Muslim?? all other paths are only "maybe - gee I hope so" paths to afterlife glory for them. That is why the mothers send their children out as terrorist bombers - what mother would not want guaranteed eternal life for their child?

If you are one who sees the Muslim/Arab issue as strictly or primarily a "sibling rivalry" issue between Israel and the Arabs then you have:
1) bought the spin and propaganda the Muslim world has been feeding the press for 40+ years
2) you have not been watching the news around the world for there are literally dozens of wars going on right now - is places like Burma, Pakistan, India, Afghanistan, the Philippines, Thailand and many other places where there ARE NO JEWS and the Muslims are using terrorism and brutality to blackmail the governments and peoples into governing their way. The vast majority of wars around the world right now are Muslims fighting to impose their religious decrees upon local citizenry.

The main reason things are as they are in Iraq is that the religiously powerful DON'T WANT democracy because Islamic law can not be predominant in a democratic society.

ILJ

7th October 2003, 11:55 PM

Shalom all,
Good post brother Son Worshipper,
In reading Ezekiel 38 it is talking about Gog, when we read Ezekiel 38:17 Thus saith the Lord God; Art thou he of whom I have spoken in old time by my servants the prophets of Israel, which prophesied in those days many years that I would bring thee against them?

First, Gog is not mentioned by name until Ezek. so we have to believe it is possibly a title for satan/antichrist that is spoken of by the prophets of old etc...and read the nations throughout Ezekiel, who are referred to.Psalm 83 as well.They are all Muslim.Some argue that Ethiopia is not. But actually from my understanding the term in Hebrew is Cush, and in the Old Testament generally to the south of Egypt in what we know Sudan.Sudan is of one of the most fundamentalist Islamic states.The Ethiopia of today is ancient Abyssinia.The ancient Ethiopia is in fact Sudan.So look who is with Gog, and ultimatley defeated.(see Psalm 83, Ezek,26(5) (3),ezek 26-30, Joel chapter 2,Isaiah 22 22:7-10,Isaiah 14, Isaiah 30:30-31, Micah 5,Isaiah 31(31:4).
There are many, many verses, and it is quite alot of material, so I will leave it here for now.Soon I will give a more specific version of some of views of those verses.If that's that's alright with the brothers and sisters here.I n a few weeks I will have a link for some very interesting views on this subject.

Shalom to all
In Him
ILJ

Lotuspetal_uk

16th October 2003, 03:53 AM

What is the main purpose of Islam? We know that Muhammad was not the last prophet, but Yeshua was ( one of many things He was and is), so why the "need" for this? Confusion is one I can think of as well as perhaps jealousy on the part of the Ishmaelites? Wanting to have their own prophet?, but I think that this was inspired from the depths of Sheol, for their is one G-d and there is another who wants to be him and will try anything to lead others astray.

Hi SW,

Excellent post! I wish I was online when this was still freshly posted but having come back from vacation I thought I'd offer my own personal thoughts on this.

I personally feel that the purpose of it lies in our End Times. I was reading one of my husband's articles (he's a Muslim) on the Islamic version of the End Times. To summarise, it speaks of a time when the Muslims will be at their military peak, and they make an alliance with "a New Rome". The ultimate aim is that they destroy all Jews and Christians not alligned with them. When I considered the trials spoken of in Zech 14, Matt 24, Revelations etc... and you consider that in Islam their End Times seem a little too different to what Christ and the prophets before Him spoke about, I thought "which group could passionately carry out the tribulations spoken of and yet truly believe that what they are doing is just?"

What I read in my husband's collections disturb me because on the face of it (and certainly if one does not study the Bible), it does make one think that perhaps Muhammed was the final prophet, but.... when cross-referenced with the Word a whole different picture arises. On the one hand they write about respect for the other two faiths (Judaism and Christianity) and on the other they write about not trusting a Jew or Christian. :(

I pray that those in Islam who sincerely seek the Lord will be brought to Him but alas those driven by hate will merely be used as tools to bring about Messiah's return.

Just a little of my thoughts on this topic...

God bless

Dominus Fidelis

16th October 2003, 04:21 AM

The difference between Islamic martyrs and early Christian martyrs is that the apostles died for what they SAW, not what they just believed.

Key point.

ILJ

20th October 2003, 12:46 AM

One should note that some of the Muslims end time beliefs is that Yeshua will come back and brake the cross (destroy Christianity.) kill a pig, marry have children, die and be buried beside Muhammad!!!

One Muslim apologist writes: "We believe that Jesus peace be upon him will come down to earth toward the end of the world time to fight the army of Satan which will be mostly from the Jews and the decieved from the Christians.The army of Satan will be lead by a person who will claim to be Jesus Christ himself.The Muslims will call him the Dajjal or the Deceiver.The real Jesus army will fight the Dajjal's army and defeat him.The empire of Israel will fall, and the religion of Islam will prevail.The signs that will reveal to us the coming of Jesus(pbuh) are when the Jews do mischief, see Noble verses 5:64 from the Noble Qu'ran for more details." http://www.answering-christianity.com/que5.htm

Sahih Muslim, in documenting Islam's prophet Muhammad in book 40 Number 6985 confirms: Allah's apostle (pbuh) said: The last hour will not come unless the Muslims will fight against the Jews and the Muslims would kill them until the Jews would hide themselves behind a stone or a tree and a stone or tree would say: Muslim, or the servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me come and kill him; but the tree Gharqad would not say, for it is the tree of the Jews (Narrated by Abu Hurayah)
So Islam offers another "Final Solution" if you will in order to do Allah's will on earth.How could Allah then be the same God who in the Bible states things totally opposite?
It seems they are setting up for a massive deception and will follow one claiming to be Yeshua, but is against the Jews and Christians.

Shalom all
ILJ

simchat_torah

20th October 2003, 02:55 AM

hmmm... P4I, what aspect of "witness" were you wanting sources on? "two or more" for a witness? the qualifications of a 'witness'? What it means to 'witness' in a spiritual sense?

please clarify.

Shalom achoti!
yafet.

SonWorshipper

20th October 2003, 02:27 PM

Darling Simchat, you were up again way too late last night. :hug:

I ( Not P4I) was wanting to hear the Rabbinic "ruling" on witnesses, where in the eye witnessing of an event or action is required before the Beit Din.
What I was seeing was that HaSatan has practically destroyed those eyewitness accounts and their deaths because of what they attested to by invoking the followers of Islam to "die for their cause and their god". True, as Defens0rFidei said it is a key point about seeing and believing, but many miss that. I have seen others say that the Muslims believe their faith to be true and Muhhamud the last prophet by those that become martyrs for the "faith". When viewed by an unbeliever it doesn''t look any different than the Apostles dying for what they saw and attested to and what they believed, by living and seeing it.

I was hoping that you could add a little from Midrash maybe on attestation? After you get some much needed sleep that is!;) :hug:

SonWorshipper

20th October 2003, 02:58 PM

WOW the L-rd is sure blessing me today! Praise Him! I was looking up some scriptures in Ezk and Isa and jsut turned to the books not the pages I wanted yet because I had two bibles side by side and I looked down at the one opened to Isaiah and saw this (I also shared this in another thread as well I will be in another, the L-rd is TOV! ) :clap:

Just came across this while looking up something else, the L-rd is good, and overwhelming me very much today!

Isaiah 44

6 Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.

7 And who, as I, shall call, and shall declare it, and set it in order for me, since I appointed the ancient people? and the things that are coming, and shall come, let them shew unto them.

8 Fear ye not, neither be afraid; have I not announced unto thee of old, and declared it? And ye are My witnesses. Is there a God beside Me? Yea, there is no Rock; I know not any.

The L-rd here points out who HE picked to be HIS witnesses of who HE IS, of OLD time, and it was not the decendants of Ishmael! The witnesses of who not only who He is but also Moshiach! Notice the "AND" in verse 61.I also find the mention of Rock, besides it's traditional meaning to maybe reference the "Dome of the Rock" or the rock from which the so called last prophet ascended from? :scratch: Hmmmmmm.:)

Whoa! I am blown away by this! Halleluyah!!!!!:bow:

SonWorshipper

20th October 2003, 03:06 PM

LastMaxim

20th October 2003, 04:20 PM

...I was reading one of my husband's articles (he's a Muslim) ...
...apologies...this is off topic ;)...I was just thinking this must be an interesting household indeed...:eek: a Baptist and a Muslim :scratch:...wow, the conversations that must be had :cool: ...now back to your 'regularly scheduled programing' :D...

Lotuspetal_uk

21st October 2003, 04:20 AM

Lotus Petal, I would like to thank you for what you posted it sure helps to bring more understanding to this subject. My heart grieves for those children of Abraham that are being decieved and are not wanting to live in the tents of their younger brother. They are using the flesh tradition of first born rights but the l-rd uses the second born in spiritural matters.

Isaac over Ishmael
Jacob over Esau
Joseph over all his older brothers
and of course Yeshua the second Adam

The redemption comes through the second it seems.
SW, you are so welcome - I just wanted to also thank you for starting this thread. This has been something I have pondered about for quite a long time (but never had the guts to create a post).

In reference to your post immediately prior to the one I quoted, I read Gal 4:29 this morning while scanning another thread on CF and my heart began to 'burn' (no I don't suffer from heartburn :) ). I read your prior post refering to the Rock etc and it brought me back to Gal 4:29 which says:

"At that time the son born in the ordinary way persecuted the son born by the power of the Spirit. IT IS THE SAME NOW."

This is indeed very thought provoking :scratch:

God bless

Lotuspetal_uk

21st October 2003, 04:30 AM

...apologies...this is off topic ...I was just thinking this must be an interesting household indeed... a Baptist and a Muslim ...wow, the conversations that must be had ...now back to your 'regularly scheduled programing' ...
:D :D

Through the Grace of God, most days it's very interesting but it takes daily prayer on my part to keep the household harmonious. Though we use to have some real 'hum-dingers' of debates when I was newly saved. ^_^

But in a way, it's amazing where and how the Lord places you when I consider all the resources I have to hand in order to understand the religion a little and why some of its followers do what they do.

God bless

SonWorshipper

21st October 2003, 12:28 PM

SW, you are so welcome - I just wanted to also thank you for starting this thread. This has been something I have pondered about for quite a long time (but never had the guts to create a post).

In reference to your post immediately prior to the one I quoted, I read Gal 4:29 this morning while scanning another thread on CF and my heart began to 'burn' (no I don't suffer from heartburn :) ). I read your prior post refering to the Rock etc and it brought me back to Gal 4:29 which says:

"At that time the son born in the ordinary way persecuted the son born by the power of the Spirit. IT IS THE SAME NOW."

This is indeed very thought provoking :scratch:

God blessWhoa! I never read it like that before. For those of you that are reading this and don't have access to a bible I am posting the whole part of the chapter, it is indeed very enlightening!

Galatians 4
22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.
23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of thefreewoman was by promise.
24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.
25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.
26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.
27 For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband.
28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.
29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now. ( ISHMAEL?)
30 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.
31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.

Could verse 27 be in reference to the widows of the martyr-bombers? who are left with many children, for they are left desolate.

I am happy to bring this out for discussion LP, I believe that the L-rd brings these things to mind and urges me to post them at His timing. This is a great discussion indeed and even more so with you joining in, again I thank you! :hug:

SonWorshipper

21st October 2003, 12:36 PM

simchat_torah

22nd October 2003, 05:13 AM

Darling Simchat, you were up again way too late last night

story of my life.

Rabbinic "ruling" on witnesses, where in the eye witnessing of an event or action is required before the Beit Din.

ok, will do.

-yafet.

SonWorshipper

22nd October 2003, 09:43 AM

Tsk Tsk, even later this morning? Your time that is about 3-4 Am? Do you have insomnia? You are getting as bad as I used to be. I used to watch the sun come up. :rolleyes:

Try some Chamomile tea, it really does work! :)

SonWorshipper

22nd October 2003, 09:47 AM

I was sharing this thread with my husband last night when he got home and read all of Galatians 4 to him and you know what, I got the biggest urge to send this part over to Ariel Sharon:

25 For this Hagar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.

30 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.

What do you think, should I?;)

LastMaxim

22nd October 2003, 10:24 AM

What do you think, should I?;)

...yes(?) ;)...

blessed2

22nd October 2003, 08:41 PM

A man I know is from yemen an muslam. So, I looked into it briefly trying to make sense of his beliefs. In so dicovered that A) the common muslin was not allowed to own a koran....only the religious leader of the time thus not only a secret document but muslams relied solely on what they were told...during times of war or invasion...the text ( original) would be burned to keep it from the hands of the enemy so later would have to be rewritten from memory...this happened many times therefore completely unreliable as to what the original text may have said at all!
B) a preacher (jesse duplantis) once asked a muslim....the G-d you worship was the G-d of Abraham? He awswered "yes" Jesse asked: "then why did you change G-ds? The G-d of Abraham was not called -llah" The muslam responded "I don't know."
Just some interesting points.

blessed2

22nd October 2003, 08:46 PM

Too, the koran contradics itself horribly.
From stating that G-d niether begets nor is begotten....to stating the He has so many son and like 3 daughters!?

Lotuspetal_uk

24th October 2003, 03:57 AM

LP, I just thought of something you might be interested in, my Rabbi spoke of this awhile ago, we not only interceed for the children of Jacob but also the children of Ishmael for they too are the seed of Abraham. When he was speaking of Ishmael he showed us something that he had heard while reading or speaking his name.

Yi---Shma ----el Do you see it? in the middle of his name ( that the L-rd himself named him when he found Hagar in the desert when she had runaway ) Has the Hebrew word Shema in it. It means the L-rd hears, if only they would turn to the true L-rd he would hear them.
Amen.

Another thought struck me about this topic. When I study the Tanakh (OT) I notice a trend with the Lord whereby if He is displeased with the sinful acts of His children He would sometimes rise up a hostile nation against them in the hope that they would return to Him. I wonder about how Islam was historically and how the Ottaman (sp.) Empire came to power around the time when the 'church' deviated from the New Covenant and was an Institution more than a 'grafted in branch'. When I see much of the similarities in the practices of Muslims and the practices of Jews, together with their reverance of Yeshua (even though they do not understand yet who He is), it makes me wonder whether part of their purpose is a wake-up call to the 'institutionalised' church and what is currently going on is not what the Lord had intended.

And just as I am getting into this my little one is demanding my attention :rolleyes: :)

I'll see if I can explain more later.

God bless

SonWorshipper

24th October 2003, 01:16 PM

I look forward to it. :)

LastMaxim

24th October 2003, 01:41 PM

...As do I :D...

Lotuspetal_uk

27th October 2003, 06:26 AM

When I see much of the similarities in the practices of Muslims and the practices of Jews, together with their reverance of Yeshua (even though they do not understand yet who He is), it makes me wonder whether part of their purpose is a wake-up call to the 'institutionalised' church and what is currently going on is not what the Lord had intended.
I wanted to further explain this last part of my paragraph (I think I have about 15 mins since she's quietly playing at the moment).

Whenever we consider in the Tanakh the instances where the children of Israel were persecuted by enemies, it was generally because they were disobediant to the Lord's commandments. But also the trend is that when the children of God turned back to Him, not only did He defeat their enemies but He also delivered them (Isaiah 37 as one example). My thoughts about this extended to looking at more 'recent' history - for example the History of the Ethiopian Kingdom. Around 346 AD this Kingdom's Christianity had a strong sense of identity with the Jewish heritage of Christianity and the Orthodox church. But the conduct of the kings which followed through the centuries meant that eventually deviation away from the Word reached to the degree that one of their kings tried to almost place himself as a god to be worshipped, amongst other things. Put simply, the more they deviated away from the Word the more their enemies took a stronghold. The most intimidating enemy during this time period was - yep Islam. I wish I had the opportuntiy to read more into their history but I do also wonder about the Byzantine Empire and the fall of Constantinople (sp.?) and what was going on there when Islam was able to take a foothold in what is now Turkey. And also the Muslim invasion of Yugoslavia and Spain.

On another point, because of the apparent (but not quite) similarity with Islam and Judaism, those who are looking for a practice more closely related to the Early followers of Christ get deceived into following Islam. There's another thread on CF which asked whether Islam was a form of Christianity or Judaism and imo I felt it was more a loose branch from Judaism - but obviously not quite :) From what I've read of their laws, it seems like they received 'third party' information about Moses' Law (perhaps from Jewish merchants passing through Arabia) and then filled in the gaps (e.g like the fact that they do not eat pork but they feel shrimps are okay). Thus it seems like nowadays as we see more of a 'pick-and-choosey' form of Christianity where anything seems to go, we also see that islam is the fastest growing religion in the world.

Which brings me back to the interesting islamic prophecy that when they reach their most military might, they are instructed to hunt down and kill every Jew and non-complying Christian.

*hears baby angrily yelling in the background* Looks like my time limit is up, but I just wanted to share my thoughts on this.

God bless and let me know what you guys think :wave:

SonWorshipper

27th October 2003, 11:20 AM

Hi Lotus! :wave: thank you for taking one of your few resting spells from motherhood to share all that with us. It has made me think of another thread here in this forum about Sh'aul , the Apostle, Paul, and what his job as an apostle really was. It brings to mind also the false prophet mentioned in Revelation ( if Muhammud isn't a false prophet then I don't know who is, but has anyone else considered him as such? ).

From what I have read in the Koran it seems as though enough of the "old and new" hebrew scritptures were throw in to give a historical and geneological ( of sorts) background to muhammuds claims of the "vision" from G-d that he had. However we are told in the last word from the L-rd ( the book of Revelation) that there would be a false prophet in the days to come, not one more of the prophets of G-d but one who would pretend to be.

ILJ

27th October 2003, 07:15 PM

Shalom all,
Here's a link to a very interesting article/book on the subject.
http://www.abrahamic-faith.com/Books/Gog.pdf

InHim
ILJ

Lotuspetal_uk

28th October 2003, 05:49 AM

Lotuspetal_uk

28th October 2003, 05:51 AM

Shalom all,
Here's a link to a very interesting article/book on the subject.
http://www.abrahamic-faith.com/Books/Gog.pdf

InHim
ILJ
Hi ILJ

Thanks I'll take a look at that (the title of the document is very interesting!)

God bless

SonWorshipper

28th October 2003, 12:02 PM

Lotus, have you ever been to this site? http://www.answering-islam.org/index.html

Have you ever heard of Dr. Ergun Caner? He is an Ex- suni Muslim, son of the "Muazain" the one who calls to prayer from the Miniret, and was also trained in the protocals of Jihad, and was saved in 1982 and is now a professor of theology. Unveiling Islam is the book he has written, have you read it?

You can listen to him right on your PC if you have realplayer by going here http://www.levitt.com/ and page down about a third of the page to where it says Featured Programs and click on one of these ( it may work from clicking on them here, but I'm not sure)

ZL-675 — Dr. Ergun Caner: An Arab-Christian, Part 1 (http://www.levitt.tv/media/links/ZLV-675.ram)
ZL-676 — Dr. Ergun Caner: An Arab-Christian, Part 2 (http://www.levitt.tv/media/links/ZLV-676.ram)

SonWorshipper

28th October 2003, 12:05 PM

Ok, I got the links to work from this forum so you should be able to as well. These are TV tapings of the conversation he had with Zola Levitt.

LastMaxim

28th October 2003, 02:11 PM

Thanks for the links SW. Much appreciated. I'll pay attention to these broadcasts as time permits (but do let us know if there is ever any more along these lines please :)) This kinda topic is always interesting, and I noticed that they discussed the topic of the same God in the middle of the program. Here is a thread from another forum, that got turned around to 'become' a thread on the 'God of Abraham' (like this never happens here, right? :D). This is off-topic, so please keep your posts regarding this one to a minimum: NBT-Mercs Hyper-Pulse Generator :: View topic - Scientology religion or cult? (http://www.netbattletech.com/hpguplink/viewtopic.php?t=6952&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0)

God Bless,
LastMaxim

SonWorshipper

28th October 2003, 03:25 PM

No , never :rolleyes: :D

Lotuspetal_uk

28th October 2003, 06:24 PM

Thanks for the links SW (I'm just waiting for a real player update to download so that I can hear the broadcast).

Yes, I've been to the 'answering-islam' website - it's an excellent site and I've acquired a lot of information from them. I've had to create sub-folders to hold all the apologetics information to counter the misinformation taught to muslims :) I just need the Lord to work on my husband (if that is the Lord's will for him).

I may perhaps feel a little more comfortable listening to it while he is at work and so I pray that I can still access it tomorrow morning.

LastMaxim

28th October 2003, 06:48 PM

...you'll love these, then...he gives a seemingly wonderfully candid view of Islam vs. Christianity...I'd love to hear more from the guest speaker...very cool...

SonWorshipper

28th October 2003, 06:59 PM

You are very welcome Lotus, very happy to share this with you ,Yes, he is a very sweet soul, a very kind hearted man, but also very learned and his background makes him highly qualified on that which he speaks of, but it is always in love, and that is what I liked about him immediately. Now if we could multiply him by a couple hundred million there would definatly be peace in the Middle East! :)

SonWorshipper

28th October 2003, 07:02 PM

Please let me know tomorrow what you think, the realplayer has video as well as audio. After listening to him you might just want to listen to him when your husbands around as well ;)

LastMaxim

28th October 2003, 07:13 PM

Thanks for the links SW (I'm just waiting for a real player update to download so that I can hear the broadcast)...
...is why some of us have cable :D...5 minutes later, or less :cool:...sorry, couldn't resist :sorry:...

SonWorshipper

28th October 2003, 08:55 PM

Show off! :D

ILJ

29th October 2003, 03:12 AM

Shalom all,
SW, Walid has several articles/books on Answering Islam, and the link to Abrahamic faith, will be on AI, too, I think.The Abrahamic-faith.com/ site is run by a Messianic, and I believe Walid is a Christian Zionist!
Lotus, I pray all is well with you, and yours.:) How have you been?
Let me know if the link works to the AF forum, it requires acrobat reader etc...Also make sure to look at the right of the page at the AF site.There is a good interview with Walid, by Rabbi Tovia Singer.I am not sure if that is the first interview or not.If it is, here is the link to the Oct. 17th one.
http://www.toviasingershow.com/RadioArchives.aspx

I agree SW, there are alot of wonderful people on AI's site I think the AF one will be pretty similar.

Shalom all
In Him
ILJ

Lotuspetal_uk

29th October 2003, 05:36 AM

...is why some of us have cable :D...5 minutes later, or less :cool:...sorry, couldn't resist :sorry:...
Ooooooooo cheeky! :D No, you see I have broadband but I have a PC as old as the earth :)

Lotuspetal_uk

29th October 2003, 05:46 AM

Please let me know tomorrow what you think, the realplayer has video as well as audio. After listening to him you might just want to listen to him when your husbands around as well ;)This is an excellent broadcast!! :cool: I'm listening to it right now and praying that my baby stays patient enough for me to get through the first one. I just heard him saying that now that he's a Christian he would consider the phrase 'Allah & God are the same' as blasphemous. :)

Without going into too much detail concerning what it's like with my husband (and derail this topic since the broadcasts are very pertinent to your topic), the Lord has not yet opened his eyes to the Truth. He has a great dislike for anything Christian/Jewish and so would dismiss these broadcasts as a Jewish attempt to deceive the masses :sigh:

Lotuspetal_uk

29th October 2003, 05:55 AM

ILJ

31st October 2003, 05:08 AM

Shalom Lotus,
Let me know when you've had a chance to look at it.

YbiY
ILJ

Lotuspetal_uk

7th November 2003, 11:09 AM

Shalom Lotus,
Let me know when you've had a chance to look at it.

YbiY
ILJShalom ILJ,

Hope you and yours are well.

Well, praise the L-rd I have finally had an afternoon where I was able to listen to the Tovia Singer show. :clap:

I'd be inclined to agree with Walid as opposed to Shaykh Yassir Fazaga based on the literature my husband has at home. If my memory serves me correctly even my husband is critical of the Orange County Islamic Foundation because of what he calls their attempts to 'sugar-coat' Islam. Alas this interview confirmed that. And, as the broadcaster quite rightly pointed out, Mr Fazaga was unable to promote his religion but instead wanted to criticise Judaism. In our debates at home this is what my husband always does. I know from debates online that this is the case too.

The fact is we know that converts from Islam have to go into hiding when they accept Messiah as L-rd. I've even read the Shari'ah which speaks of executing the apostate and it goes further on to explain what they would class as an 'apostate'. I have also met a lady in the UK who begged me to hide her phone number from my husband for fear that somehow he would pass it on to other Muslims who would track her down and kill her. Her fear was a genuine fear and not some group misinterpreting ancient holy works as Mr Fazaga seemed to imply in his debate.

But I digress....

What did you think of the broadcasts?

Now while I still have some minutes before she wakes up I will try to read the pdf document you'd posted earlier on :D

The L-rd bless you