Sub forum Specific Rules discussion thread.....

[Tishri1]

http://foru.ms/t5989131http://www3.christianforums.com/images/icons/icon1.gif POLL: 1.4.1 Debate Subforum Rules

1.4.1 Debate Subforum Rules
A separate debate area can be used for those who wish to challenge out beliefs. Those who wish to challenge our beliefs must abide by these rules.


1.)Each debate thread will have only one subject which is posted in the OP.
2.)Subject for debate will be in the heading. Eg. dead vs living dead
3.)Any related debateable subjects, which are a topic by themselves, will be moved to new debate thread.
4.)All challenges must be presented as an alternative view to consider.
5.)No name calling.
6.)No denial of the life of Yeshua on earth
7.)No insulting insinuations regarding our intelligence.
8.)No replacement theology
9.)No supersessionism
10.)No hell or damnation for our choices in faith.
11.)No proclamations of other faiths' superiority
12.)No anti-jew remarks [also known as antisemitic]
13.)No misojudaism remarks [any overt hostility towards Judaism is defined as misojudaic.]
14.)No socks are allowed to debate or post
15.)Three warnings and you are banned by the moderators.
Ok we've done this before mishpachah :wave:start discussing some absolutes for this subforum and the ones that get the most airtime we will add to the wiki and sticky... I will leave this thread open for 7 days then close it so hurry up with your discussion already lol:thumbsup:

how about just this one rule till we get set up so others can start using this place right away

Post with Love and Respect http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/flagady15/smilies/smiliegrouphugani.gif

and keep the noise downhttp://www.terranuts.com/forums/images/smilies/nanaparty.gif

[Tishri1]

Some Ideas I recall already brought up and thrown around were

1. Closing the subforum for the Sabbath.

Not sure how to do that but lets discuss it ok?

2. Naturally moving all 1.4 congregational rule threads into this area to avoid deleting them(unless they are flaming or baiting as there is a big difference between debate and flame):wave:

3. Relaxing the FSRs for this place

We need to be specific on which rules we will NOT relax up here

...........what do you guys think so far?

[ChazakEmunah]

Personally, I think we should leave theological debates wide open, but defer people to GT if they want to debate politics. Topics such as Israel, Zionism, etc.... should be left to GT.

My 2 cents...

[Ivy]

I'd say my usual Be Respectful, No Personal Attacks.

In addition, no anti-Jewish white supremacy stuff, no holocaust denial stuff, no "Jewish conspiracy" hoaxes.

Other than that........Play Ball! ;)

[A_Pioneer]

You're GREAT Tishri1! Put her in the cloning machine, should be many of her. So much to do, so little time.

Shalom Alechem

[Tishri1]

Today was a FUN day, I wish more days I could get so much accomplished that brings JOY for a change

[A_Pioneer]

Today was a FUN day, I wish more days I could get so much accomplished that brings JOY for a changePerforming just like a Throbred!

Good work lady! Take a break, it'll do you good.

Baruch Ha’ba B’Shem Adonai
Blessed is he who comes in the name of the LORD! [Ps 118:26 NKJV]

[Tishri1]

ok tomorrow is shabbat and I will enjoy it all very much:swoon:^_^:wave:

[Jim47]

Ahem ;)

How are we coming on developing debate forum rules :)

I got nothing to use Ya know :)

[Ivy]

Ivy thinks that none of these should be allowed on Debate Subform:

http://www.lysator.liu.se/nanny/clubs/socks/sock.jpg

I don't mind discussing things with honest people, but phantoms, I mind! If you think I'm getting a bee in my bonnet.....er, my sock ;) .....wait, I don't have one :D .....uh, a bee in my bonnet about socks, you're right.:tutu: :mad:

[Ivy]

http://www1.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/2241742/2/istockphoto_2241742_stinky_sock.jpg

[Jim47]

Ok, then, I propose that all accounts that have been proven to be socks recieve a forum specific ban from the Messianic forum.

[ChazakEmunah]

Ok, then, I propose that all accounts that have been proven to be socks recieve a forum specific ban from the Messianic forum.
I didn't think I would have time to say anything tonight, but I have to say that I agree wholeheartedly with this proposal...

All in favor?

[Ivy]

I second. I'm in favor. (Let's have some goshdarn honesty around here, for Pete's sake! :) )

[visionary]

Amen....

All socks raise your hands

[Ivy]

Amen....

All socks raise your hands


^_^ ^_^ ^_^ c'mon now don't be shy

[Tishri1]

I like this as well for all MJ but I think we need a poll in the main forum, will someone elae do the honors

also if it doesnt fly in the main forum it can still fly in the :thumbsup:subforums

[Jim47]

I like this as well for all MJ but I think we need a poll in the main forum, will someone elae do the honors

also if it doesnt fly in the main forum it can still fly in the :thumbsup:subforums


I will start a discussion thread with a few proposed rules, I say proposed because its the members of MJ who will have to approve any and all rules, but that help het the ball rolling heh? ;)

[Tishri1]

thanks you Jim, how are you today swamped still? I hope its getting better:hug::hug::hug:

[Jim47]

Well, its slowed down a tine bit, but I've already posted in about 20 reports and I've only been off work for 2 hours, so, Yeah, pretty busy. :)

[Wags]

"Just say NO to socks!"

[HadassahSukkot]

I'm pretty much in agreement with what I've seen here...

[visionary]

1.4.1 Debate Subforum Rules
A separate debate area can be used for those who wish to challenge out beliefs. Those who wish to challenge our beliefs must abide by these rules.


1.)Each debate thread will have only one subject which is posted in the OP.
2.)Subject for debate will be in the heading. Eg. dead vs living dead
3.)Any related debateable subjects, which are a topic by themselves, will be moved to new debate thread.
4.)All challenges must be presented as an alternative view to consider.
5.)No name calling.
6.)No denial of the life of Yeshua on earth
7.)No insulting insinuations regarding our intelligence.
8.)No replacement theology
9.)No supersessionism
10.)No hell or damnation for our choices in faith.
11.)No proclamations of other faiths' superiority
12.)No anti-jew or anti-judaism remarks are better known as antisemitic remarks....
13.)No misojudaism remarks [any overt hostility towards Judaism is defined as misojudaic.]
14.)No socks are allowed to debate or post[/QUOTE] like this better?
15.) Three warnings and you are banned permanently

[GerTzedek]

ooops, double post

[GerTzedek]

1.4.1 Debate Subforum Rules
A separate debate area can be used for those who wish to challenge out beliefs. Those who wish to challenge our beliefs must abide by these rules.


1.)Each debate thread will have only one subject which is posted in the OP.
2.)Subject for debate will be in the heading. Eg. dead vs living dead
3.)Any related debateable subjects, which are a topic by themselves, will be moved to new debate thread.
4.)All challenges must be presented as an alternative view to consider.
5.)No name calling.
6.)No denial of the life of Yeshua on earth
7.)No insulting insinuations regarding our intelligence.
8.)No replacement theology
9.)No supersessionism
10.)No hell or damnation for our choices in faith.
11.)No proclamations of other faiths' superiority
12.)No anti-jew or anti-judaism remarks are better known as antisemitic remarks....
13.)No misojudaism remarks [any overt hostility towards Judaism is defined as misojudaic.]
14.)No socks are allowed to debate or post like this better?
15.) Three warnings and you are banned permanently


I totally support you in this, visionary!!! I only want to nitpick a little wording, fine tune it. But it's GREAT.

Supersessionism/Replacement theology are the same thing, and should be listed on the same line. However, can we also specify Two House as a subcategory? For example: No Replacement Theology/Supersessionism or Two House

I have been taught by my Rabbi that there is a difference between anti-Semitism and anti-Judaism, although both are awful. Anti-Semitism is the idea that there is something wrong or "less than" about the Jewish PEOPLE. Anti-Judaism is the idea that there is something inherantly wrong with Judaism, aka Jews keeping their covenant. IOW, the more or less the definition you gave for misojudaism...


I'm not worried about those who come in saying "well, Arabs are semites too..." yada yada. Words mean how we use them. No one uses the word anti-Semitic to refer to race hatred of Arabs.

So let's list the anti-jew stuff like this; people, covenant, land:

No Anti-Semitism -- posts which indicate that there is something wrong or less than regarding the Jewish People.
No Anti-Judiasm/Misojudaism -- posts which indicate a wrongness of Jews observing their covenant and/or and basic hatred of Judaism in past or present forms.
No Anti-Zionism -- posts which argue that Eretz Israel is not given by G-d to the Jews, and/or Israel has no right to exist as a Jewish state.


I also think Anti-Judaism/Misojudaism and Supersessionism/Replacement Theology should be ADDED to the naughty list of the main MJ forum, and all subforums.


Regarding socks: because occasionally people change their names for understandable reasons, at least one warning is a good idea, just to make sure if we err it is on the compassionate side. But three warnings is WAY too much.

[HadassahSukkot]

I think if we stick with something similar to our old rules of moderation, three warnings and what was it.. two.. three infractions?

But as far as FSBs, it was 3 warnings methinks..

One was "verbal" (not on record) and two that went on their profile and record upstairs..

Plenty gracious but not too lenient.. That way someone may not know they were treading on the rules and were warned... and then once they did they had two strikes...

[Tishri1]

Can some one rewrite these and please use gracious definitions for the words in there so there is no mistaking

I dont agree with taking out the 2 house posters, as I have received many concerned PMs that 2 house is not always replacement theology and that to lable ALL 2 house is actually to broad when only a small minority within 2 house are really replacement folks, I think we should change that to replacement theology only as it covers 2 house minorities who are on the fringe and leaves the ones who feel grafted in to Isreal not replacing Israel:thumbsup:

also I need working definition for Supersessionism in here

remember folks if you forbid it all, there wont be any good debate in here

try to eliminate the worst, but leave some room for honest lively discussion ok? this is suppose to be a bit freer than downstairs

I would focus more on attitude than on subject matter at this point, find the fewest subjects that are intolerable and cause the most flames but leave those that are generally not gonna be a big deal I would even suggest making ALL subjects ok to discuss as long as they are doing all the other things Vis mentioned like not saying this or that is the only view but making it apparent in the words of the post that this is just one opinion and giving proof when asked as well, that would be a good rule

Provide documentation or proof when you state something is a fact or a truth, and say IMO when it is not clearly a fact or the truth, and be clear when it is one or the other:thumbsup:

[Bananna]

Well let them speak their mind as long as they don't infer we are going to hell iron sharpens iron. I think Debate forum is for that kind of discussion.

It has always been the fine line caused by the attitude of pride and prejudice that has been the problem not the differing views. I pulled up my thread on proper conduct in debate before and I can go fishing for it again I suppose.

Replacement theology makes God out to fail to keep his promises to Israel as does some of the dispensational teaching… but people have all kinds of twists on stuff and differing definitions that have to be pinned down. We need to have a sticky thread on voted for definition.

Sorry
I’m no help am I. Truth is I like reading the debate; I still don’t have a handle on the ideas being argued. Just would prefer more polite discussions.

[Bananna]

1.4.1 Debate Subforum Rules
A separate debate area can be used for those who wish to challenge out beliefs. Those who wish to challenge our beliefs must abide by these rules.
well first off lets change the typo of 'out' to 'our'

1.)Each debate thread will have only one subject which is posted in the OP.
2.)Subject for debate will be in the heading. Eg. dead vs living dead
3.)Any related debateable subjects, which are a topic by themselves, will be moved to new debate thread.
4.)All challenges must be presented as an alternative view to consider.
5.)No name calling.
6.)No denial of the life of Yeshua on earth
7.)No insulting insinuations regarding our intelligence.
8.)No replacement theology
This means that we will not tolerate the preaching and teaching of the gentile church replacing the natural born children of Abraham as God's people. We are grafted into Israel and Israel is the root stock without which we all would die
9.)No supersessionism
please define or post verses
10.)No hell or damnation for our choices in faith.
This means that you have no right to judge anothers servant Verse?
11.)No proclamations of other faiths' superiority
Think of others better than yourself verse
12.)No anti-jew or anti-judaism remarks are better known as antisemitic remarks....
It is rude to claim a child God chose is going to hell because you believe they have denied Messiah - verse on who are you to judge another man's servant.
13.)No misojudaism remarks [any overt hostility towards Judaism is defined as misojudaic.]
14.)No socks are allowed to debate or post
This means in MJ you must come with the same log-on every time. If you forgot make sure to edit your post to sign your original log-on or the secondary posts will be deleted with out warning or saving
15.) Three warnings and you are banned permanently
Please take heed from those kind enough to warn you by PM. This will save you having strikes against you unecessarily.

[Bananna]

I would like the part about our moderators removing sock posts without warning because they cannot reveal socks they actually know. On the other hand I can see that some people might forget which alter ego they are using and post accidently so I think they should allow them to correct it so their don't have posts removed.

[visionary]

1.4.1 The main forum and all subforums will not tolerate any of the following:

1.4.1.1 Unacceptable behavior:
Name calling
Sock accounts
Insulting insinuations regarding our intelligence
Questioning of our salvation

1.4.1.2 Unacceptable views -- these may not be raised as topics or advoacted in any form:
Denial of the life of Yeshua on earth
Replacement theology/Supersessionism. Supersessionism varieties include:
The view that G-d has divorced Israel.
The view that the Covenant between G-d and Israel is cancelled or no longer in effect.
The view that Israel is no longer G-d's chosen People.
The view that the Church is now Israel.
The view that the Church is now PART of Israel.
The view the the "remnant" (messianic Jews) have replaced Israel
The view that "New Israel" is for any reason an appropriate title for the Church.
Two House theology
Remarks which challenge the integrity of the Jewish people, irrevecable covenant, and G-d given land:
No Anti-Semitism -- posts which indicate that there is something wrong or less than regarding the Jewish People.
No Anti-Judiasm/Misojudaism -- posts which indicate a wrongness of Jews observing their covenant and/or and basic hatred of Judaism in past or present forms.
No Anti-Zionism -- posts which argue that Eretz Israel is not given by G-d to the Jews, and/or Israel has no right to exist as a Jewish state.

1.4.1.3 Section 1.2 regarding the proclamations of other faiths' superiority or disparagement of gentile churches will be applied to the main forum and all sub-forums.

1.5 Sub-forum specific rules: All subforums will include the rules as stated in section 1.4.1 Specific sub-forum have additional rules as follows:

1.5.1 Debate sub-forum rules:
Each debate thread will have only one subject which is posted in the OP.
Subject for debate will be in the heading. Eg. dead vs living dead
Any related debateable subjects, which are a topic by themselves, will be moved to new debate thread.
All challenges must be presented as an alternative view to consider.

1.5.2 The Orthodox Messianic Jewish Fellowship sub-forum creates a safe haven for those who follow halakha.
Not allowed:
Threads questioning the rightness or value of following halakha will not be allowed in this forum, but will be transfered to the debate forum.
Those who make statements against the rightness or value of following halakha in the midst of a thread will be asked to edit or delete their posts.
Allowed:
Threads and posts asking why we would wish to follow halakha are permitted.
Threads and posts regarding what might be halakhically proper are permitted.How do we want it worded?

[Bananna]

Why this one???

"The view that the Church is now PART of Israel."

Am I missing the difference between being grafted in and being part of Israel?

Bananna

[visionary]

maybe it should be worded... gentiles grafted into Israel ... making it clear something that, since all the discussion, still is as clear as mud and worthy of more discussion.

[Henaynei]

the Church is part of the commonwealth of Israel, not Israel.... in the same way India was part of the commonwelath of Briton, but not Briton... :)

[visionary]

"commonwealth of Israel" therefore is the acceptable term?

[Baruch41]

According to the new rules, there is no FSR any more.

http://christianforums.com/t6377770&page=2


ANNOUNCEMENT:
Forum Specific Rules will no longer be used
Originally published by AngelDove97, CF Policy Manager




Dear Staff & Members,As many of you know by now, our new owner, LeeD, has announced changes that he and Staff will be making over the next few weeks. We hope this will be a time of peaceful change, as we have just spent a few months that were rather hectic. I’m glad many of us decided to stay for the sake of the friendships and discussions that take place at Christian Forums/christianforums.com.I would like to make Staff and Members aware that we will discontinue having and developing “Forum Specific Rules”, aka FSRs for ALL forums here at the site. It has been decided by LeeD that this site will have a set of general rules only.However, each forum is allowed to take the FSR’s that they have in place and develop them to become guidelines for that forum. This means that a member will not necessarily receive an infraction (infraction system is still being discussed I believe) for violating a guideline, but may be asked to have the post deleted, edited, or moved to a different and more appropriate forum. Staff will be moderating based on the set of General Rules that the site will have.Staff and members should be encouraged to spend the next few days developing guidelines for the forums where they participate or moderate in. Remember, these are NOT rules, but can describe what topics should be discussed and in what fashion.Another reminder from LeeD: “Congregational Forums wishing to remain safe havens may choose to limit debate to members of their own denomination, insist that all posts conform to their creed etc.” The Ecumenical Staff Team and the members who participate in these areas should work together to come up with said guidelines for the sake of that forum having peace and stability. As of right now, ONLY Congregational forums have this right.Should you have any questions regarding this announcement, please feel free to contact a Staff member and we will do our best to supply an answer.~Angeldove97Policy ChiefPS ~ An example of a guideline would be, "Do not post triggers" in a Recovery forum. Should somebody post a trigger, perhaps it should be labeled as one, deleted, edited, etc. If you have a question on a guideline, please speak to the Staff who cover that area.Reviewed by mnphysicist and Constance.**Updates will be added to this Announcement should any clarifications are needed. I am waiting to hear back from mnphysicist, Constance, and/or Lee about Gender and Age Restrictions. Please be patient!

Quote:

Update from mnphysicist:


They are currently covered in the site wide rules, either by direct application ie age or gender, or by inference, singles, married, childfree, teen etc. FSR's never applied in those areas.Quote:Age and or gender restrictions are to be respected.This would also apply to singles, married, childfree, mco etc.Thus, no need for fsrs. *This relates to how some forums have gender and age restrictions.*


Mods, how can you interprete this? Why we still have sub FSR when FSR are gone? Tks. Consider most MJ are conservative, I must note that I am in no attention to make trouble for anybody, but this is my sincere question we as MJ are facing. If you consider my question not proper pls discuss with me before give me an infraction as the CF warning rules clearly stated. Your respect & kindness toward a MJ member is highly appriciated. Shalom.

[visionary]

We do have or need to determine our own unique MJ forum rulings which are still in play. In a sense we are keeping what we have and working on improving them.

[HephzibahBenJudah]

maybe it should be worded... gentiles grafted into Israel ... making it clear something that, since all the discussion, still is as clear as mud and worthy of more discussion.
gentiles grafted into Israel...sounds ok for some but it also makes it sound like "Gentiles" are less than Messianic or less than Christian...why can't we all just say Gods' people. He is one God and He is looking for One united people.