How do we identify a Progressive?

[reddogs]

I think the weakness of our TRAD/PROG sub-forums is obvious immeadiately as that there is no way to identify who is what, does anyone have suggestions?

[NightEternal]

Why not start yet ANOTHER poll and ask people to vote where they feel they stand? You could have three categories: Traditional, Progressive, and for those who don't know who they identify with, Moderate. The Moderates can frequent either subforum.

You will then have a resource that can be referred to and added to as new people arrive here.

I would do it, but I don't know how to start a poll. :scratch:

[reddogs]

Why not start yet ANOTHER poll and ask people to vote where they feel they stand? You could have three categories: Traditional, Progressive, and for those who don't know who they identify with, Moderate. The Moderates can frequent either subforum.

You will then have a resource that can be referred to and added to as new people arrive here.

I would do it, but I don't know how to start a poll. :scratch:

Not a bad idea, but then we have another label to deal with. I'd rather that we all wear our Adventist icon and be 'Adventist' with no labels and work on the issues that seperate and either come to a agreement or agree to disagree and set it aside till we get more understanding. I believe that we will be shown all things at the end, and that is not far off.....

[icedragon101]

Night

good idea,

there needs to be more catagories. Do you really think that people like T&O and DJ conkling are not going to answer Moderate? according to them they are moderate.

I don't want them in a progressive sub fourm

[RC_NewProtestants]

Actually the reason my idea of main forum with no debate and debate forum and a traditional forum is based upon the idea that Progressives don't really need their own forum. The reason is because in real life we have to deal with the traditionals far more then we have to deal with other progressives. The progressive does not have to feel like this is how it is and there can be no discussion. That is what the traditionals do and so it makes sense for them to have their own forum where they can feel at home with no challenges. The Progressive acknowledges the reality of challenges and the reality of diverse opinions.

I realize Night desires a progressive forum to have a safe place to write free from attacks but the attacks are the part that is the problem not the place where they occur. Personally I don't expect to even use the Progressive forum as anything I post I want either opinions or thoughts on the material. So that means that there is going to be a strong possibility of debate. Anything of a more trivial nature like growing tomatoes would fit into the main SDA forum under the label of fellowship

Maybe I am not seeing the possibilities of the progressive forum, but I am open to suggestions.

[icedragon101]

RC. I have to disagree. Last week when I was trolling for votes. I kept running into it. The Progressives were asking for a place to call home. There are more out there and they want a place to gather free from attack, free to fellowship. I heard this over and over and over again.

[StormyOne]

I did not ask for a "safe" place.... As RC pointed out, I have no problem talking to, debating with someone who does not share my views. Consequently its not necessary for me to have a place where all that takes place is discussion among progressives. Part of the fun in discussions is talking to people who differ in opinion.

When these sub-forums were set up, the progressive side was under-utilized, because we don't mind discussing issues in the main area....

My vote is that we don't need a separate place....

How do you identify a progressive is the question? I don't know, by how much the traditionals are upset by their presence? lol

[NightEternal]

I agree with Ice.

RC, there are how many TSDA's who have put you on ignore? Not to mention how many more who are going to do so in the near future? And from this you expect to gain constructive dialogue? :doh:

I already know of two to three who have me on ignore. I have never put anyone on ignore and I will never do so.

No, they don't want to interact, they want nothing to do with our insights and views. I admit it shows a complete lack of maturity and apalling rudeness on thier part to ignore all those they disagree with, but that is the way it is. I don't need a 70 pound ton of bricks to fall on my head to realize my questions are neither wanted nor appreciated.

Especially with topics concerning EGW, I would prefer just Progressive insight. The TSDA apologists really have nothing to say on matters of her inspiration and authority that I want to hear. If I wanted that kind of feedback, I would just contact the EGW Estate. I certainly do not want input from radical, ultra-conservative individuals like YourNeighbor, a full-blown legalist and hate-monger if I ever encountered one.

The reason I have not been using this subforum in the past is because the way things are now, it is pointless. Anyone can just come in here and throw in thier interjections. Thus, I felt I might as well just start my controversial thread topic in the main forum, which I did. You all saw how that ended up. I was labeled just short of Satan himself by Woob and others. No thanks, I do not need that sort of headache anymore.

If there was some strict rules as to who can come in here and engage the issues, I would use this place much more often. As it is now, forget it. The rule is there, but it is not being enforced nor respected.

[StormyOne]

I agree with Ice.

RC, there are how many TSDA's who have put you on ignore? Not to mention how many more who are going to do so in the near future? And from this you expect to gain constructive dialogue? :doh:

I already know of two to three who have me on ignore. I have never put anyone on ignore and I will never do so.

No, they don't want to interact, they want nothing to do with our insights and views. I admit it shows a complete lack of maturity and apalling rudeness on thier part to ignore all those they disagree with, but that is the way it is. I don't need a 70 pound ton of bricks to fall on my head to realize my questions are neither wanted nor appreciated.

Especially with topics concerning EGW, I would prefer just Progressive insight. The TSDA apologists really have nothing to say on matters of her inspiration and authority that I want to hear. If I wanted that kind of feedback, I would just contact the EGW Estate. I certainly do not want input from radical, ultra-conservative individuals like YourNeighbor, a full-blown legalist and hate-monger if I ever encountered one.

The reason I have not been using this subforum in the past is because the way things are now, it is pointless. Anyone can just come in here and throw in thier interjections. Thus, I felt I might as well just start my controversial thread topic in the main forum, which I did. You all saw how that ended up. I was labeled just short of Satan himself by Woob and others. No thanks, I do not need that sort of headache anymore.

If there was some strict rules as to who can come in here and engage the issues, I would use this place much more often. As it is now, forget it. The rule is there, but it is not being enforced nor respected.
well we have all been painted with that brush..... you would think we are the spawn of Satan himself.... as for putting people on ignore, I am with you, I have never done that, will never do that.... I am not one to put my head in the sand and pretend all is well..... especially when it isn't....

[NightEternal]

Ice, I understand your concerns, but I think you underestimate how reasonable Trust can be. I would have no problems with her being in here, as long as she behaved herself. I know she would, in fact. If the topics made her uncomfortable, she would just leave, I'm sure.

As for Conklin, he probably would not desire to frequent this place very often anyhow.

Even the mods are wondering how much longer you and Conklin can keep up your war with each other. :D

[icedragon101]

Night that is not what I am talking about. you seem to be talking about intense theological discussion that is easy. there are those who only want fellowship and feel they cannot fellowship. Because they will be attacked if they have the hint of theological disagreement.

Stormy, I appreciate you voice, but you were not the only one I contacted, I have contacted over 220 SDA on this forum during the course of the voting last week.

If you had not noticed we are getting more traffic. that is largely do to the people I contacted.

[StormyOne]

Night that is not what I am talking about. you seem to be talking about intense theological discussion that is easy. there are those who only want fellowship and feel they cannot fellowship. Because they will be attacked if they have the hint of theological disagreement.

Stormy, I appreciate you voice, but you were not the only one I contacted, I have contacted over 220 SDA on this forum during the course of the voting last week.

If you had not noticed we are getting more traffic. that is largely do to the people I contacted.
I shared my view... as for what people want eventually the majority will decide I am sure...

[icedragon101]

thanks for the great attitude stormy

[RC_NewProtestants]

My point is not that we should not have a progressive sub-forum that is already voted and accepted. Utilzation is still a question that time will tell. But right now we should be talking about rules. And I don't see the need to bar anyone from the progressive sub-forum. That I think is the way a traditional wants to be but it does not seem to me to be the way a progressive should act.

[reddogs]

My point is not that we should not have a progressive sub-forum that is already voted and accepted. Utilzation is still a question that time will tell. But right now we should be talking about rules. And I don't see the need to bar anyone from the progressive sub-forum. That I think is the way a traditional wants to be but it does not seem to me to be the way a progressive should act.

Amen,

Hopefull all will see segragation is wrong, just like Martin Luther King Jr. tried to teach many years ago..........

[IntoTheCrimsonSky]

I think the weakness of our TRAD/PROG sub-forums is obvious immeadiately as that there is no way to identify who is what, does anyone have suggestions?

Why not start yet ANOTHER poll and ask people to vote where they feel they stand? You could have three categories: Traditional, Progressive, and for those who don't know who they identify with, Moderate. The Moderates can frequent either subforum.

You will then have a resource that can be referred to and added to as new people arrive here.

I would do it, but I don't know how to start a poll. :scratch:

Okay, I know I've called myself Traditional many a time, so I hope I'm not overstepping something to post here? :confused:

I completely agree that these things need to be better defined. And, I also like the idea of "moderates" being able to post in either, as long as it can be done in a civil manner.

To be honest, I don't think I fully fit into either because I'm such a newbie to Christianity. :sorry: There are still some issues within the 28 beliefs that I don't even know enough about to make an educated discission about at this point. Regardless, though..I'd never think any less of someone if they believed differently..because we are all on our own journey with God and I cannot judge the status of another person's journey by my own.

I have never ignored another person. Well, except a few in the past from other sites who were just plain..hm..negative towards me. Even then I feel bad, because you are closing a door and locking it, between you and another of God's children.

Anyway, if my opinion counts..I don't like the division either, but if we're going to have it I'd like to see a moderate option for those of us who don't fit in perfectly in either side. :)

Blessings and Love,
Sarah

[NightEternal]

Crimson, you're always welcome here. :hug:

[IntoTheCrimsonSky]

Crimson, you're always welcome here. :hug:

Aw! Thanks Night! ^_^ :hug:

[StormyOne]

I don't think its necessary to attempt to identify who is what. Just because those who consider themselves traditional and want to define people with labels doesn't mean we have to.... why can't we just interact in this area without all the garbage and baggage that exists in the other areas? Can we just stick to one rule against flaming and then discuss whatever we wish to our hearts content?

[sentipente]

I don't think its necessary to attempt to identify who is what. Just because those who consider themselves traditional and want to define people with labels doesn't mean we have to.... why can't we just interact in this area without all the garbage and baggage that exists in the other areas? Can we just stick to one rule against flaming and then discuss whatever we wish to our hearts content?
I don't see why we would want to do otherwise. We know the Trads will not come here because they can't stand the pressure. Anyone else who comes here has the necessary mental fortutude.

[IntoTheCrimsonSky]

I don't see why we would want to do otherwise. We know the Trads will not come here because they can't stand the pressure. Anyone else who comes here has the necessary mental fortutude.
Careful there with the grouping of all Traditionals to be like that. ;) Even though I doubt you meant it to sound as judgemental as it did, the wording can come off wrong.

Aren't we all the same in the eyes of God? :)

That's what's so sad about all of this in the first place. Yes, sometimes people just want to share or discuss without opposing feelings being involved (such as in debate). Thusly it causes problems when people have such strongly opposing beliefs. This in itself is okay, to have a "Safe area" to go when you want that kind of interaction. However, it gets negative when it becomes a sectioning off of people and judgemental attitude.

I think people should be able to respect eachother and love eachother enough to not be aprehensive or allow friction to be present when those with different views decide to speak with eachother. :)

Just my two cents.

[Sophia7]

How do you identify a progressive is the question? I don't know, by how much the traditionals are upset by their presence? lol

:D

[Sophia7]

RC. I have to disagree. Last week when I was trolling for votes. I kept running into it. The Progressives were asking for a place to call home. There are more out there and they want a place to gather free from attack, free to fellowship. I heard this over and over and over again.

Then why won't more of them come and participate in the rule-making process now that they can have some influence in reshaping the SDA forum and sub-forums?

[Sophia7]

Even the mods are wondering how much longer you and Conklin can keep up your war with each other. :D

:D

[Sophia7]

My point is not that we should not have a progressive sub-forum that is already voted and accepted. Utilzation is still a question that time will tell. But right now we should be talking about rules. And I don't see the need to bar anyone from the progressive sub-forum. That I think is the way a traditional wants to be but it does not seem to me to be the way a progressive should act.

I agree.

Amen,

Hopefull all will see segragation is wrong, just like Martin Luther King Jr. tried to teach many years ago..........

And for once I agree with Red. :D

[Sophia7]

To be honest, I don't think I fully fit into either because I'm such a newbie to Christianity. :sorry: There are still some issues within the 28 beliefs that I don't even know enough about to make an educated discission about at this point. Regardless, though..I'd never think any less of someone if they believed differently..because we are all on our own journey with God and I cannot judge the status of another person's journey by my own. . . .

Anyway, if my opinion counts..I don't like the division either, but if we're going to have it I'd like to see a moderate option for those of us who don't fit in perfectly in either side. :)

Blessings and Love,
Sarah

This is one reason that I am in favor of opening up the PSDA sub-forum to everyone. There are some who don't know where they fit. I used to be one of them. Do we have to label everyone? I don't think the hardcore TSDAs will want to post here much anyway, even if it is open.

[Sophia7]

I don't think its necessary to attempt to identify who is what. Just because those who consider themselves traditional and want to define people with labels doesn't mean we have to.... why can't we just interact in this area without all the garbage and baggage that exists in the other areas? Can we just stick to one rule against flaming and then discuss whatever we wish to our hearts content?

I don't see why we would want to do otherwise. We know the Trads will not come here because they can't stand the pressure. Anyone else who comes here has the necessary mental fortutude.

Exactly.

[IntoTheCrimsonSky]

This is one reason that I am in favor of opening up the PSDA sub-forum to everyone. There are some who don't know where they fit. I used to be one of them. Do we have to label everyone? I don't think the hardcore TSDAs will want to post here much anyway, even if it is open.
That's very true. I also know that since I'm "on the fence" so-to-speak, I'd just be posting certain topics on the different subforums depending on the type of input I'm looking for. If I want input on a subject from more of an official/traditional standpoint, or wish to discuss with people of that kind of belief..I will go there. If I'm looking to see people's opinions about subjects that go beyond that, I'd simply go here. :)