Why go to church

[ctay]

Why Go To Church

A churchgoer wrote a letter to the editor of the newspaper and complained that it made no sense to go to church every Sunday. I've gone for 30 years now," he wrote, "and in that time I have heard something like 3,000 sermons. But for the life of me I can't remember a single one of them. So I think I'm wasting my time and the pastors are wasting theirs by giving sermons at all."

This started a real controversy in the "Letters to the Editor" column, much to the delight of the editor.

It went on for weeks until someone wrote this clincher: "I've been married for 30 years now. In that time my wife has cooked some 32,000 meals. But for the life of me, I cannot recall the entire menu for a single one of those meals. But I do know this: They all nourished me and gave me the strength I needed to do my work. If my wife had not given me those meals, I would be physically dead today. Likewise, if I had not gone to church for nourishment, I would be spiritually dead today!"

When you are DOWN to nothing . . . God is UP to something!

Faith sees the invisible, Believes the incredible and Receives the impossible!

Thank God for our physical and our spiritual nourishment!

Author Unknown

[FLANDIDLYANDERS]

Never go to Church. Be church. Listening to sermons rarely nourishes, it is in following Christ that life is lived.

[Count]

It went on for weeks until someone wrote this clincher: "I've been married for 30 years now. In that time my wife has cooked some 32,000 meals. But for the life of me, I cannot recall the entire menu for a single one of those meals. But I do know this: They all nourished me and gave me the strength I needed to do my work. If my wife had not given me those meals, I would be physically dead today. Likewise, if I had not gone to church for nourishment, I would be spiritually dead today!"



Nope! If his wife hadn't given him those meals, he would have learnt to cook and thus, he would be useful not only to himself, but to others, too. Now, he is a lazy man who accepts anything from his wife.

The same goes to the church goers. Without realizing they become so lazy spiritually and depended on the pastor, they think they would be dead without him.

The reality however is that we should only be depended on Christ who is our Food, and we have to learn how to cook that Food, but how can we learn when we do nothing but sit on a pew?

[faithpilgrim]

Amen, Count,

Aren't we told to work out our own salvation? Course that doesn't mean we can save our selves . but are to prove what is the good and acceptable will of God in our lives.

We follow Jesus not the wolves!

[FLANDIDLYANDERS]

Jesus left the flock to find the lost one. I'm outta here, call me a lost one, lost with Jesus.

[New_Wineskin]

Nope! If his wife hadn't given him those meals, he would have learnt to cook and thus, he would be useful not only to himself, but to others, too. Now, he is a lazy man who accepts anything from his wife.

The same goes to the church goers. Without realizing they become so lazy spiritually and depended on the pastor, they think they would be dead without him.

The reality however is that we should only be depended on Christ who is our Food, and we have to learn how to cook that Food, but how can we learn when we do nothing but sit on a pew?

Exactly .

However , I don't blame the goers . The doctrines are designed for this . They know of only this way to do it . Even those that do home groups look a lot like them . They may have more interaction but they still have a lot in common because they think that certain things are essential ... once a week , "bible" study , worship , and so on . It all looks a lot like what the Institutional groups do in their smaller groups .

[Count]

Exactly .

However , I don't blame the goers . The doctrines are designed for this . They know of only this way to do it . Even those that do home groups look a lot like them . They may have more interaction but they still have a lot in common because they think that certain things are essential ... once a week , "bible" study , worship , and so on . It all looks a lot like what the Institutional groups do in their smaller groups .

Yes, they are a small version of a big institutional/organized church.

[Frank1]

The commandment to forsake not the assembling goes a little farther than a few scriptures in the new testament that many choose to overlook because it is a "dispensation of grace."
Ananias and Saphira were struck down dead in this dispensation of grace for daring to lie to the Holy Ghost.
Many forget that when Jesus fulfilled all righteousness he was given a name above every name and that he was given ALL power in heaven and earth.
This means that while he can make all grace abound he has the right to curse those whom the scriptures call cursed children just as his Father had. He is to be feared and to lie to the Spirit by saying you love the Lord and forsaking the assembling is a good way to obtain spiritual death and damnation.
The attendance should bear witness to the faith and love for the Lord just as James said faith without works is dead.
Had Noah's wife, sons and their wives forsook the assembling they would have perished with the evil world.
Had Abraham's family forsook the assembling they would not have received the covenant of circumcision. That type and shadow of the circumcision of the heart through faith.
Had the children of Israel forsook the assembling at the mount they would not have heard the voice of God.
If Christians forsake the assembling in a church where the rightly divided word of truth is brought forth by the Spirit they will not hear the voice of God either.
That is just a few in which to forsake the assembling is a deadly and damnable mistake and in some cases rebellion.
God Almighty was to be feared. Now Jesus Christ is to be feared.
His word has declared he loves a just weight and an equal balance. His grace and his wrath. Our love and our fear of him. Nothing should be out of balance.
May God bless.
Frank

[New_Wineskin]

The commandment to forsake not the assembling goes a little farther than a few scriptures in the new testament that many choose to overlook because it is a "dispensation of grace."
Ananias and Saphira were struck down dead in this dispensation of grace for daring to lie to the Holy Ghost.
Many forget that when Jesus fulfilled all righteousness he was given a name above every name and that he was given ALL power in heaven and earth.
This means that while he can make all grace abound he has the right to curse those whom the scriptures call cursed children just as his Father had. He is to be feared and to lie to the Spirit by saying you love the Lord and forsaking the assembling is a good way to obtain spiritual death and damnation.
The attendance should bear witness to the faith and love for the Lord just as James said faith without works is dead.
Had Noah's wife, sons and their wives forsook the assembling they would have perished with the evil world.
Had Abraham's family forsook the assembling they would not have received the covenant of circumcision. That type and shadow of the circumcision of the heart through faith.
Had the children of Israel forsook the assembling at the mount they would not have heard the voice of God.
If Christians forsake the assembling in a church where the rightly divided word of truth is brought forth by the Spirit they will not hear the voice of God either.
That is just a few in which to forsake the assembling is a deadly and damnable mistake and in some cases rebellion.
God Almighty was to be feared. Now Jesus Christ is to be feared.
His word has declared he loves a just weight and an equal balance. His grace and his wrath. Our love and our fear of him. Nothing should be out of balance.
May God bless.
Frank


Well , it is good to see that someone outside the Catholic group admits that they consider that "going to 'church'" is required for salvation and that the observance of the Law obtains righteousness . I am so tired of people beating around the bush and only implying such things . :)

[ChristianMama84]

Exactly .

However , I don't blame the goers . The doctrines are designed for this . They know of only this way to do it . Even those that do home groups look a lot like them . They may have more interaction but they still have a lot in common because they think that certain things are essential ... once a week , "bible" study , worship , and so on . It all looks a lot like what the Institutional groups do in their smaller groups .
So, what should it look like?

[FLANDIDLYANDERS]

Like relationships. Family. Like how the World does it ;)

[New_Wineskin]

So, what should it look like?

As the thread title asks ... why even have an it ?

If the Lord leads you to have an it , He can guide you into what it looks like . :)

[New_Wineskin]

Like relationships. Family. Like how the World does it ;)

I am in for that . :)

[xThirst4Godx]

Nope! If his wife hadn't given him those meals, he would have learnt to cook and thus, he would be useful not only to himself, but to others, too. Now, he is a lazy man who accepts anything from his wife.

The same goes to the church goers. Without realizing they become so lazy spiritually and depended on the pastor, they think they would be dead without him.

The reality however is that we should only be depended on Christ who is our Food, and we have to learn how to cook that Food, but how can we learn when we do nothing but sit on a pew?
whoa! the point of church is not sermons, its fellowship with other christians who might need edification from YOU! I go to church to support my faith and friends. i dont want to debate, but church life is crucial to a believer

1 John 1:7 “But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.”

Each member of the church is like a part of a body (literally, we are the Body of Christ). If the thumb decides that the body is dragging it down or not necessary and runs off by itslef, two things happen:

1) the thumb dies after not having constant supply of blood
2) the body is crippled and left that much weaker.

Every Christian is crucial for the Body, and the Body for the Christian. We are to serve the church in love, not ignore it because we think it isnt necessary.

[xThirst4Godx]

Jesus left the flock to find the lost one. I'm outta here, call me a lost one, lost with Jesus.
he left to find him and bring him back to the flock!

[xThirst4Godx]

Like relationships. Family. Like how the World does it ;)
Oh Boy, Read John 17.16. we're aren't supposed to look like the world

[New_Wineskin]

Oh Boy, Read John 17.16. we're aren't supposed to look like the world

Well , you can't look any more like the world than having meetings that have chairs all facing in one direction like a lecture hall ; having meetings the same time and place and doing things in more or less the same order each time ; having human leaders ; needing money to pay for all of the overhead of the club ; and , having bylaws called "statements of faith" .

[ghs1994]

Church is for worship. Plain and simple. Fellowship, study, etc. is all part of that worship. Those who aren't faithful in going to church show their faith in Christ, whether it be a home church or a local assembly. We are commanded to come together to worship. If we forsake that, we have sinned and are proud, thinking we can do it on our own.

[FLANDIDLYANDERS]

he left to find him and bring him back to the flock!

All in good time. A period of desert-wandering is in order right now. Church has been "found" too long, we've forgotten how to find Christ in the lost and lonely and filthy.

Oh Boy, Read John 17.16. we're aren't supposed to look like the world

We are supposed to be in the World. I do not advocate looking like anything, rather I recognise that the World is not as without Christ as many would presume. Christ is right there and, I am finding, so is his Church. But rarely does his church consist of the christians. ;)

Maybe

[duanep]

Nope! If his wife hadn't given him those meals, he would have learnt to cook and thus, he would be useful not only to himself, but to others, too. Now, he is a lazy man who accepts anything from his wife.

The same goes to the church goers. Without realizing they become so lazy spiritually and depended on the pastor, they think they would be dead without him.

The reality however is that we should only be depended on Christ who is our Food, and we have to learn how to cook that Food, but how can we learn when we do nothing but sit on a pew?

Exactly!!
:clap:

[duanep]

whoa! the point of church is not sermons, its fellowship with other christians who might need edification from YOU! I go to church to support my faith and friends. i dont want to debate, but church life is crucial to a believer

1 John 1:7 “But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.”

Each member of the church is like a part of a body (literally, we are the Body of Christ). If the thumb decides that the body is dragging it down or not necessary and runs off by itslef, two things happen:

1) the thumb dies after not having constant supply of blood
2) the body is crippled and left that much weaker.

Every Christian is crucial for the Body, and the Body for the Christian. We are to serve the church in love, not ignore it because we think it isnt necessary.


Can you please tell me how being a part of the "rows of noses" (ppl sitting in pews) - helps anything or anyone?

[BBgrey]

We are formed by the community we live with. If we want to be like God, we need to share our lives with other people who want to be like God. We are formed to be like him when we meet together regularly through worship, scripture, confession, corporate prayer, preaching, and teaching. Those things really do transform us. If we stand alone, we cannot grow, and it will be easier for the enemy to overtake us. We cannot serve the world as the body of Christ all by ourselves.

But showing up to sit in one of the "rows of noses" at a church where worship is fake, scripture is bent to the pastor's soapbox topics, confession is non-existent, corporate prayer is just someone else's prayer, and preaching and teaching don't draw us in to the kingdom of God, doesn't really form us either.

Don't forget that God himself --the trinity -- is a community. One person cannot imitate God, only a community can. But God is alive and active. A dead, stagnant community can't imitate him either.

Find a living, loving, intimate body of believers to worship with and share your life with.

bbgrey

[Floatingaxe]

Can you please tell me how being a part of the "rows of noses" (ppl sitting in pews) - helps anything or anyone?


If that is how you've experienced church, then no wonder the attitude.

The Epistles were all written to churches. We are to meet together in local groups just like the early Christians did--for fellowship, for worship, for prayer, for encouragement, edification and learning.

Something wonderful happens when we meet together! We lend to and find strength in each other--just like family.

That is why God's Word tells us not to forsake it. Otherwise the foolishness and error that we fall into easily overtakes us and destroys our influence in the world.

[Floatingaxe]

Find a living, loving, intimate body of believers to worship with and share your life with.




http://pichostonline.com/u/070814/7238f03092.gif (http://pichostonline.com/)Amen, sis!

[FLANDIDLYANDERS]

Find a living, loving, intimate body of believers to worship with and share your life with.


Such as down yer local pub, club or street corner. Ever found Jesus where he said he'd be - in the world - and been delighted to church it right there and then, and build life right there and then?

[Floatingaxe]

Such as down yer local pub, club or street corner. Ever found Jesus where he said he'd be - in the world - and been delighted to church it right there and then, and build life right there and then?


He is only in the world in that He inhabits and empowers His people, and His creation. He's not in the world system or its people.

We bring Jesus to them, but He's not in them whatsoever. We, the Church, are sheep and they, the world system, are made up of goats! http://pichostonline.com/u/070814/338aa98f3d.jpg (http://pichostonline.com/)

[BBgrey]

Never go to Church. Be church. Listening to sermons rarely nourishes, it is in following Christ that life is lived.

Such as down yer local pub, club or street corner. Ever found Jesus where he said he'd be - in the world - and been delighted to church it right there and then, and build life right there and then?

I know what you mean. The local pub is one of the best places to practice confession and compassion, because people act like real people there. I'll gladly admit that it is a lot easier to act like Christ in a bar, where people are honest, than in church, where so many folks are hiding behind a facade because they're afraid of what people will think of who they really are.

I agree that we need to build our lives in the community we live in rather than entirely in the "church" life (investing all our evenings in church potlucks, bible studies, choir practices, etc.), but somehow we need to do this with other believers. In following Christ, we have to remember that even though he spent lots of time building relationships with unbelievers, his closest friends (believers) were never far away. He spent tons of time alone with them as well. I think it is really important to remember that Christ and his disciples traveled together to interact with the world.

Somehow we need to imitate that kind of missional community.

bbgrey

[duanep]

He is only in the world in that He inhabits and empowers His people, and His creation. He's not in the world system or its people.

We bring Jesus to them, but He's not in them whatsoever. We, the Church, are sheep and they, the world system, are made up of goats!

And how do you propose that "the church" is bringing Jesus "to them" by holding once-a-week meetings inside a structure (building) that "they" don't want to come to?

[Floatingaxe]

And how do you propose that "the church" is bringing Jesus "to them" by holding once-a-week meetings inside a structure (building) that "they" don't want to come to?


So, you don't know about evangelism or even lifestyle evangelism? You think that churches are the only place to find Christ? Church meetings are for the Church. Many unbelievers find their way there and find Jesus--great! But it is in the highways and bi-ways, in our daily lives outside of our "forever family" that Christians meet people and influence them for Christ. That is what we are commanded to do.

[Floatingaxe]

http://pichostonline.com/u/070815/6a7d6ce36d.jpg (http://pichostonline.com/)Double post! Sorry. Enjoy the pic!

[duanep]

So, you don't know about evangelism or even lifestyle evangelism? You think that churches are the only place to find Christ? Church meetings are for the Church. Many unbelievers find their way there and find Jesus--great! But it is in the highways and bi-ways, in our daily lives outside of our "forever family" that Christians meet people and influence them for Christ. That is what we are commanded to do.

I'd argue that "many" folks do NOT find their way there...

I grew up "in the church" and can attest that most folks there are already part of "the choir" and the new folks are primarily folks from other churches... .

[Floatingaxe]

I'd argue that "many" folks do NOT find their way there...

I grew up "in the church" and can attest that most folks there are already part of "the choir" and the new folks are primarily folks from other churches... .

Well, that is your experience, but that is not how it is supposed to be, and neither is that any reason to abandon belonging to a local body of believers. That is something the Lord tells us we must do--belong to a family of God, locally!

To deny yourself that important part of your Christian walk is disobedient, and also reeks of judgmentalism---the very sin that those who disassemble commit against those who obey God by assembling!

[xiancp]

I'm going the home church route now after spending my entire life in the institution - good riddance!

[FLANDIDLYANDERS]

It's on;ly judgementalism if your judgement is askew. Otherwise its simply making a judgement, which is good. ;)

[Floatingaxe]

.

[chaela]

Nope! If his wife hadn't given him those meals, he would have learnt to cook and thus, he would be useful not only to himself, but to others, too. Now, he is a lazy man who accepts anything from his wife.

The same goes to the church goers. Without realizing they become so lazy spiritually and depended on the pastor, they think they would be dead without him.

The reality however is that we should only be depended on Christ who is our Food, and we have to learn how to cook that Food, but how can we learn when we do nothing but sit on a pew?
Hmmm.... Good point!

[chaela]

The commandment to forsake not the assembling goes a little farther than a few scriptures in the new testament that many choose to overlook because it is a "dispensation of grace."
Ananias and Saphira were struck down dead in this dispensation of grace for daring to lie to the Holy Ghost.
Many forget that when Jesus fulfilled all righteousness he was given a name above every name and that he was given ALL power in heaven and earth.
This means that while he can make all grace abound he has the right to curse those whom the scriptures call cursed children just as his Father had. He is to be feared and to lie to the Spirit by saying you love the Lord and forsaking the assembling is a good way to obtain spiritual death and damnation.
The attendance should bear witness to the faith and love for the Lord just as James said faith without works is dead.
Had Noah's wife, sons and their wives forsook the assembling they would have perished with the evil world.
Had Abraham's family forsook the assembling they would not have received the covenant of circumcision. That type and shadow of the circumcision of the heart through faith.
Had the children of Israel forsook the assembling at the mount they would not have heard the voice of God.
If Christians forsake the assembling in a church where the rightly divided word of truth is brought forth by the Spirit they will not hear the voice of God either.
That is just a few in which to forsake the assembling is a deadly and damnable mistake and in some cases rebellion.
God Almighty was to be feared. Now Jesus Christ is to be feared.
His word has declared he loves a just weight and an equal balance. His grace and his wrath. Our love and our fear of him. Nothing should be out of balance.
May God bless.
FrankThere's a difference between assembling together with other Christians and "going to" church.

[Krystabelle]

Hmmm..

I can't say much, but the word "church" is not suppose to be a building. The church is an an assembly of Christians with one heart for God. Now Jesus came not to win churchgoers, but souls. But I think we're forgetting that God is personal, but never individual.

Finding God, growing with Him, your relationship between God and you will always involve just the two of you. But God will not want you to stay there. Because God knows that we can only grow in a "church", or a community of Christians.

Now as for the Church (building), it was built for Christians to please God. I know that you can probably listen to 2 sermons a day at home using your remote, but where's the part where you please God by worshiping Him? Let's imagine this scenario, would you rather have your children playing on their own or playing together with one another?

True, there are several churches out there that are corrupted, or probably filled with dishonest people. But let's face it, we're all sinners to start with, no matter where we are. But instead of accepting that fact, why not BE THE CHANGE? God doesn't want you to stay stagnant.

P/S.
According to Phillip Yancey, a theory I find quite true, individually we're like coals. When the coals are together with the fire, they burn red in the flame. But remove simply one coal and set aside, it quickly becomes cold and black. That is just how we are without a church, without passion. But put the black coal back to the group of other burning coals, it starts to become red again.

Adapted from:
(http://books.google.com.my/books?id=ac6dPHBkbtQC&pg=PA23&lpg=PA23&dq=philip+yancey++burning+coal+&source=web&ots=SBmdlkp_2z&sig=waXHe2Ep5G_KdG9yDYvBzelbDVg&hl=en#PPA23,M1)