Has Christianity failed?

[lakis]

Has Christianity failed ?

A quarter of the earth's population say they are Christians. Would Jesus Christ agree?

JESUS CHRIST was around 2,000 years ago in Bethlehem. He worked until he was 30 as a carpenter in Nazareth. Then for a further three and a half years, he travelled throughout the country, preaching and teaching in synagogues and public meetings, healing the sick and performing miracles. He did this at a time when his people - the Jews - were expecting a leader (the Messiah) to spearhead a revolution against the Roman Empire.
Jesus Christ's teaching was revolutionary, but it was not what people expected from the Messiah. He told his countrymen to be tolerant, patient and to avoid violence. He explained that their sins could be forgiven, but that they in turn must be willing to forgive others. He told them to hold other people in equal esteem and to show love even to their enemies.

It was a new approach, but hardly the manifesto for a popular liberation movement.
Nevertheless, this gentle, yet resolute man, with his message of peace, soon incurred the wrath of the religious authorities. They arrested him, tried him in court and demanded his execution. He was crucified by Roman soldiers.

Then, as almost every Christian believes, he was resurrected and ascended to heaven. Before the left, he instructed his handful of followers, who had remained loyal, to continue the work he had begun. 'Go therefore and make disciples of all nations' he told them, 'teaching them to observe all things I have commanded you' (Matthew 28:19-20, New King James throughout, except where noted).

This they did, and today over a quarter of mankind claim to be followers of Jesus Christ. Christianity is the largest and most geographically diverse of all religions. Christians can be found in every country. The humble carpenter from Galilee has become undoubtedly the most influential teacher in history. Yet some people think mankind would have been better off without him.

Mixed Blessings?

Certainly much good has been done in the name of Jesus Christ, but also much harm. Christ taught against violence, yet the armies of so-called Christian nations have slaughtered, raped and pillaged their way across the pages of history.

Jesus Christ told his disciples to expect persecution, and to 'bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you' (Matthew 5:44).

When persecuted, Christians are often seen at their best - unselfish and courageous. Hostile regimes, from Imperial Rome to modern times, in their efforts to stamp out Christianity seem only to strengthen it. It survives against seemingly impossible odds' to emerge stronger and more determined than ever.

However, once in power, so called Christians have often become persecutors. 'You are the light of the world,' said Christ to his disciples (Matthew 5:14). Yet nominally Christian nations and empires have, like other peoples, a grim record of suppressing, persecuting, torturing and martyring those who get in their way in the name of religion. The history of Europe and of the colonies of a number of European powers witness to this tragedy.
Jesus Christ preached unselfishness and generosity, yet sincere missionary efforts have often become the thin end of the wedge of greed and exploitation. 'Christian' colonisers have ruthlessly enslaved, decimated and even exterminated native populations.

Today, half of mankind in influenced by Christianity, through its culture if not actual belief. Much of Western culture endorses assertive, confident behaviour, and as such it has been the mainspring of Western civilisation. It is no coincidence that many industrial societies have been sustained by what has been called the 'Protestant work ethic.'

Many great advances in medicine, engineering and technology, which have transformed life on this planet, are also primarily a product of Western civilisation. However, these have been a mixed blessing too.

Living by the Sword

Christ prayed that his followers would remain united in peace and harmony. But today Christianity is fragmented. For example, in Northern Ireland, rival Christians plot against each other and in Lebanon, Christian militias stalk both Christian and non-Christian political enemies. Nations with an underlying Christian culture feature prominently in crime statistics; in divorce, in the abuse of children, wives and the elderly and in drug and alcohol addiction.

Christianity does not promote or endorse such things, of course, but mainstream Christianity has in some respects spawned a way of life in which these abuses flourish. As the Archbishop William Temple (1881 - 1944) once observed: 'Christianity is the most materialistic of all great religions.'

This, however, does not refer to all Christianity or the ideals of Christ. It has produced many great unselfish, compassionate men and women, whose examples show what Christianity could, and should be like. Also, of course, there is the simple sincerity of ordinary people around the world, whose commitment to Christ motivates them to service and prayer.

However, when viewed across the spectrum of history as well as geograpically, this religion that claims the name of Jesus Christ as its authority must be given mixed reviews. Certainly it is no worse than some, but has mainstream Christianity behaved better than those it has challenged, confronted and at times ruthlessly suppressed?

And unbiased outsider looking at the fruits of Christendom might be tempted to agree with the English poet, Richard Le Gallienne (1866 - 1947): 'Organised Christianity has probably done more to retard the ideals that were its founder's than any other agency in the world.'

What Went Wrong?

Surely this is not what Jesus Christ intended. Have his followers misunderstood their Master's intentions? Or is there something about the concept of Christianity that, like communism, just does not work? Is it merely another idea that sounds good in theory, but fails in practice? The answer to this question is important.

Christianity continues to grow. Many Christians are now launching 'a decade of evangelism.' In addition, as communism collapses (article was written in 1991) in Eastern Europe, religion has an unprecedented window of opportunity to fill a spiritual vacuum.

Will Christianity be a force for peace and stability? Will it soothe the long-suppressed passions and ancient quarrels that recent events have exposed? Will it help bring education, health and genuine spiritual enlightenment to the dark corners of the earth? Or will it provide as excuse for the cruel, the ruthless and the fanatical in politics and religion to oppress and persecute those who oppose them? That may seem farfetched and improbable now, but Christianity and politics is a well known potentially lethal mix. The record of history forces ut to pose these questions.

Unless Christianity is willing to learn the lessons from its own past, the future may yet prove to be another dark age.
So what did Jesus Christ expect his followers to do? What did he think would be the result of his commission to preach the gospel to all the world? Have his plans whatever they were, gone wrong? We need to compare what has happened with the things he said.



Jesus Christ 'has not been a failure yet; for nobody has ever been sane enough to try his way.'GEORGE BERNARD SHAW (1856-1950)


http://www.towards-success.com/amazingpicsofmiracles

[SymphonicaX]

Jesus has already won, it's just a matter of time when he comes and nobody knows when he will appear and judge the world.

[holderz]

Jesus has already won, it's just a matter of time when he comes and nobody knows when he will appear and judge the world.

it was all in the bag at the Cross! lol! as soon as Christ said "it is finished"

anyways,resurrection of the church (rapture) then the 7 year tribulation then the 2nd coming of Christ with his saints ( those who are In Christ) to clean up!
and start the 1000 years on the earth with Christ as head of state!
:)

[AdoptedSon2]

There are so many "assumptive" statements used as facts, the post is almost misleading. The United States of America is about the only country founded that cites God, scripture, and christian principals in it's founding writings. Even that being said, it obviously didn't make the USA a christian nation. There isn't such a thing.

I can say I am a liberal and a progressive, yet harbor deep convictions of conservatism and guide my actions by those conservative principals. Would I be a liberal because I said I was? I think not.

Therefore, anyone who follows evil and vanity cannot be of Christ's body. They are liars and deceitful and are not of the fruit of the Lord.

The ills of today are not the deserved fruits of the true believers. We are caught up in the unfolding of the war between higher powers than man. It is in my opinon, grossly unfair to question the true christian's responsibility for the evil done throughout time. We have not failed. Christ has not failed. Man has failed.

[SymphonicaX]

it was all in the bag at the Cross! lol! as soon as Christ said "it is finished"

anyways,resurrection of the church (rapture) then the 7 year tribulation then the 2nd coming of Christ with his saints ( those who are In Christ) to clean up!
and start the 1000 years on the earth with Christ as head of state!
:)



we agree on at least the first part and I think every Christian should agree about your first statement.

Now about revelation that's another story. But one thing is for sure, Christ will return!

[MShaney]

Christ taught against violence, yet the armies of so-called Christian nations and empires have, like other peoples, a grim record of suppressing, persecuting, torturing and martyring those who get in their way in the unfolding of the war between higher powers than man.

[New_Wineskin]

Christianity will neither fail nor succeed . The Lord will either fail or succeed .

[seekthetruth909]

Has Christianity failed ?

A quarter of the earth's population say they are Christians. Would Jesus Christ agree?

JESUS CHRIST was around 2,000 years ago in Bethlehem. He worked until he was 30 as a carpenter in Nazareth. Then for a further three and a half years, he travelled throughout the country, preaching and teaching in synagogues and public meetings, healing the sick and performing miracles. He did this at a time when his people - the Jews - were expecting a leader (the Messiah) to spearhead a revolution against the Roman Empire.
Jesus Christ's teaching was revolutionary, but it was not what people expected from the Messiah. He told his countrymen to be tolerant, patient and to avoid violence. He explained that their sins could be forgiven, but that they in turn must be willing to forgive others. He told them to hold other people in equal esteem and to show love even to their enemies.

It was a new approach, but hardly the manifesto for a popular liberation movement.
Nevertheless, this gentle, yet resolute man, with his message of peace, soon incurred the wrath of the religious authorities. They arrested him, tried him in court and demanded his execution. He was crucified by Roman soldiers.

Then, as almost every Christian believes, he was resurrected and ascended to heaven. Before the left, he instructed his handful of followers, who had remained loyal, to continue the work he had begun. 'Go therefore and make disciples of all nations' he told them, 'teaching them to observe all things I have commanded you' (Matthew 28:19-20, New King James throughout, except where noted).

This they did, and today over a quarter of mankind claim to be followers of Jesus Christ. Christianity is the largest and most geographically diverse of all religions. Christians can be found in every country. The humble carpenter from Galilee has become undoubtedly the most influential teacher in history. Yet some people think mankind would have been better off without him.

Mixed Blessings?

Certainly much good has been done in the name of Jesus Christ, but also much harm. Christ taught against violence, yet the armies of so-called Christian nations have slaughtered, raped and pillaged their way across the pages of history.

Jesus Christ told his disciples to expect persecution, and to 'bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you' (Matthew 5:44).

When persecuted, Christians are often seen at their best - unselfish and courageous. Hostile regimes, from Imperial Rome to modern times, in their efforts to stamp out Christianity seem only to strengthen it. It survives against seemingly impossible odds' to emerge stronger and more determined than ever.

However, once in power, so called Christians have often become persecutors. 'You are the light of the world,' said Christ to his disciples (Matthew 5:14). Yet nominally Christian nations and empires have, like other peoples, a grim record of suppressing, persecuting, torturing and martyring those who get in their way in the name of religion. The history of Europe and of the colonies of a number of European powers witness to this tragedy.
Jesus Christ preached unselfishness and generosity, yet sincere missionary efforts have often become the thin end of the wedge of greed and exploitation. 'Christian' colonisers have ruthlessly enslaved, decimated and even exterminated native populations.

Today, half of mankind in influenced by Christianity, through its culture if not actual belief. Much of Western culture endorses assertive, confident behaviour, and as such it has been the mainspring of Western civilisation. It is no coincidence that many industrial societies have been sustained by what has been called the 'Protestant work ethic.'

Many great advances in medicine, engineering and technology, which have transformed life on this planet, are also primarily a product of Western civilisation. However, these have been a mixed blessing too.

Living by the Sword

Christ prayed that his followers would remain united in peace and harmony. But today Christianity is fragmented. For example, in Northern Ireland, rival Christians plot against each other and in Lebanon, Christian militias stalk both Christian and non-Christian political enemies. Nations with an underlying Christian culture feature prominently in crime statistics; in divorce, in the abuse of children, wives and the elderly and in drug and alcohol addiction.

Christianity does not promote or endorse such things, of course, but mainstream Christianity has in some respects spawned a way of life in which these abuses flourish. As the Archbishop William Temple (1881 - 1944) once observed: 'Christianity is the most materialistic of all great religions.'

This, however, does not refer to all Christianity or the ideals of Christ. It has produced many great unselfish, compassionate men and women, whose examples show what Christianity could, and should be like. Also, of course, there is the simple sincerity of ordinary people around the world, whose commitment to Christ motivates them to service and prayer.

However, when viewed across the spectrum of history as well as geograpically, this religion that claims the name of Jesus Christ as its authority must be given mixed reviews. Certainly it is no worse than some, but has mainstream Christianity behaved better than those it has challenged, confronted and at times ruthlessly suppressed?

And unbiased outsider looking at the fruits of Christendom might be tempted to agree with the English poet, Richard Le Gallienne (1866 - 1947): 'Organised Christianity has probably done more to retard the ideals that were its founder's than any other agency in the world.'

What Went Wrong?

Surely this is not what Jesus Christ intended. Have his followers misunderstood their Master's intentions? Or is there something about the concept of Christianity that, like communism, just does not work? Is it merely another idea that sounds good in theory, but fails in practice? The answer to this question is important.

Christianity continues to grow. Many Christians are now launching 'a decade of evangelism.' In addition, as communism collapses (article was written in 1991) in Eastern Europe, religion has an unprecedented window of opportunity to fill a spiritual vacuum.

Will Christianity be a force for peace and stability? Will it soothe the long-suppressed passions and ancient quarrels that recent events have exposed? Will it help bring education, health and genuine spiritual enlightenment to the dark corners of the earth? Or will it provide as excuse for the cruel, the ruthless and the fanatical in politics and religion to oppress and persecute those who oppose them? That may seem farfetched and improbable now, but Christianity and politics is a well known potentially lethal mix. The record of history forces ut to pose these questions.

Unless Christianity is willing to learn the lessons from its own past, the future may yet prove to be another dark age.
So what did Jesus Christ expect his followers to do? What did he think would be the result of his commission to preach the gospel to all the world? Have his plans whatever they were, gone wrong? We need to compare what has happened with the things he said.



Jesus Christ 'has not been a failure yet; for nobody has ever been sane enough to try his way.'GEORGE BERNARD SHAW (1856-1950)

http://www.towards-success.com/amazingpicsofmiracles
Check out this book and reviews:http://www.amazon.com/Scandal-Evangelical-Conscience-Christians-Living/dp/0801065410/ref=sr_1_2/002-4483147-7358459?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1172961716&sr=1-2

[FreetoSmile]

Hypocrisy has always been Christianity's secret vice. Thankfully, the Lord is able to succeed where our religion fails.

[JimfromOhio]

Not failed but rather people's sin are too harden to acknowledge the conviction of the Holy Spirit to get saved. As long as sin keeps blinding people, fewer people will get saved.

[flyingsum0]

We've already won...we're saved :)

[Nadiine]

To ask if Christianity is failed, is to ask if God has failed.

[VCViking]

Has Christianity failed?



No

[lakis]

I think that it was never meant to succeed, during this current age (Gospel age), in the millenium that is a time still ahead is where its success will be.

[BereanTodd]

I think that it was never meant to succeed, during this current age (Gospel age), in the millenium that is a time still ahead is where its success will be.

Bingo!

Narrow is the road that leads to life and wide is the way that leads to destruction. The whole world will never be Christian in this age, that is for the age to come.

[Nadiine]

Bingo!

Narrow is the road that leads to life and wide is the way that leads to destruction. The whole world will never be Christian in this age, that is for the age to come.
Um, I disagree with your assumption that the Christian goal is to save EVERY SOUL - as if we're expecting to SAVE EVERYONE down here.
As mentioned, it's already known to us that it can't & wont' happen.

Christianity hasn't FAILED - it SUCCEEDS BY REACHING THOSE WHO WILL COME TO CHRIST. AND UNTIL NO MORE SOULS TURN TO GOD, WE HAVEN'T FAILED in our mission to preach the gospel as He commanded we do.

Did God ever tell us "succeeding is saving every soul?" NO.
In fact, when Jesus ascended, He hadn't even saved the entire gentile world in His own ministry - why would God expect us to succeed in accomplishing more than Christ Himself?

Sorry, this doesn't float w/ me at all. WE SUCCEED EVERY NEW DAY BY COMPLETING THE GOOD WORKS HE HAS PURPOSED FOR US TO DO UNTIL HIS RETURN...
by staying in His will, by abiding in Him, by seeking Him, by repenting, by showing His love & promoting His truth to others...

:amen: :wave:

[Cris413]

John 16:33 "These things I have spoken to you, that in Me you may have peace. In the world you will have tribulation; but be of good cheer, I have overcome the world." (NKJV)

I'm not sure it's a fair assuption to assess a thing as a success or failure until completion but the point seems to be moot as Jesus has proclaimed the victory. Which I believe. Praise His Holy Name!

[Latreia]

Um, I disagree with your assumption that the Christian goal is to save EVERY SOUL - as if we're expecting to SAVE EVERYONE down here.
As mentioned, it's already known to us that it can't & wont' happen.

Christianity hasn't FAILED - it SUCCEEDS BY REACHING THOSE WHO WILL COME TO CHRIST. AND UNTIL NO MORE SOULS TURN TO GOD, WE HAVEN'T FAILED in our mission to preach the gospel as He commanded we do.

Did God ever tell us "succeeding is saving every soul?" NO.
In fact, when Jesus ascended, He hadn't even saved the entire gentile world in His own ministry - why would God expect us to succeed in accomplishing more than Christ Himself?

Sorry, this doesn't float w/ me at all. WE SUCCEED EVERY NEW DAY BY COMPLETING THE GOOD WORKS HE HAS PURPOSED FOR US TO DO UNTIL HIS RETURN...
by staying in His will, by abiding in Him, by seeking Him, by repenting, by showing His love & promoting His truth to others...

:amen: :wave:



What I understand is that Jesus taught us the way, the path, to walk in the Light of Truth.

Christianity is more of a journey than a destination. There is no "goal" or "end" or "completetion"

It is the fate of human beings to fail, but also to be capable of success, however that is defined.

A Christian is not either a failure or a success. A Christian has accepted the method or faith with which to become the best possible that a human being can be.

Each of us has a duty to mankind to fulfill our potentials, intellectually, socially, spiritually. God has provided us with many, many signs and clues and visions to follow.

We do not expect to ever become perfect, to attain godly powers, to reach some kind of mythical end or finish at the goal.

God alone knows of all that we are capable, we never will. But we can make the choices that bring us closer to that ideal, and in providing the inspiration and sources for that ideal is how we can say that Christianity has been, is now, and ever shall be a success.

http://www3.christianforums.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

[zerosaiyaman]

Oiy, does giving something the name "Christian" suddenly cure it from all darkness? Is the name "christian" where the power is found? Something that the church was labled with decades later, as originally it was called "The Way"? I think the problem is people forget two issues:

1. Anyone can call themselves anything, but only living it out will make them that thing.

I can call myself a murderer, but if I haven't killed anyone does that mean I still am? No, only if you kill someone not in defense or war does it make you a murderer. And then, a murderer can tell people they aren't one, but they still are.

A title means nothing! That must absolutely be understood by everyone. It is only the actions that make someone or something fall into a catagory, the name doesn't do it.

2. No one but Christ is allowed to be perfect in this life, lest anyone could boast that they were saved by works and not by grace. As it is, we all deserve the axe, and it is by grace we don't feel its sting, through faith by what Christ did for us. He and He alone is perfect.

This also leads right into the fact that the world is lost in darkness; we are the salt of the earth that keeps it from destruction. At the very end of Daniel, God says that the end will not come until the power of God's holy people is broken. That doesn't sound like isreal, especially since at the time Daniel wrote it, isreal was in exile! Rather, it seems directly alluding to the church. The fact the earth still exists means the church is being increadibly successful!

We also know by Revelations and all other prophesy that this success we are enjoying in our days of peace (ever growing into war) must end. Yes, we live in an age of profound peace right now. Crack open history books and read about just a few centuries ago if you don't believe me. This is the age of the Gentile; and an age of peace where the church is influential across the entire globe through its roots in earths strongest country. One day that must end.

So, has "christianity failed"? Well, if it had, we wouldn't be here to ask that question right now.

[VCViking]

If people are being saved from an eternity in hell, how is that a failure?

If only one person in the world a week became saved and was pulled out of the enemy's hands, then how can that be a failure?

[lakis]

God will save all in the kingdom!

[kristofferdaniel]

Very good article!

[Nadiine]

A title means nothing! That must absolutely be understood by everyone. It is only the actions that make someone or something fall into a catagory, the name doesn't do it.
I'm not 'in disagreement'... just a slight clarification-
I think a title does mean something, AND it's actions that prove character. BAD actions don't negate the title's meaning or definition... it just means the person's claim is in question as to the position.
As you said & I agree, we aren't perfect & will sin - sin is in the history of nearly every biblical figure & story. God's own people kept falling & becoming hard hearted.

We have to be careful; we're AMBASSADORS of Christ & that title is very meaningful - as is Christian, we just have to be careful how we act to honor that title imo. (& we will fail along the way!).

The fact the earth still exists means the church is being increadibly successful!
I totally agree :amen:


So, has "christianity failed"? Well, if it had, we wouldn't be here to ask that question right now.
:amen:

good post! :angel:

[StevenL]

Yes, christianity has utterly failed.....as it was supposed to. However, the kingdom of God is doing just fine.

[Nadiine]

Yes, christianity has utterly failed.....as it was supposed to. However, the kingdom of God is doing just fine.
Please provide scripture support where God says Christians/Christianity is SUPPOSED to fail - and fail HOW exactly? Fail in what?

[StevenL]

Any thinking person can read the Scriptures and see how the called-out are supposed to act and what they are to do and then look at the results of "christianity" through the centuries to see that it has NOT produced what is expected of the called-out ones.

Yeshua/Jesus did not come to establish a religion called christianity nor did he ever tell US to build "churches".

Christianity, along with every other man-made institution, is an abysmal failure and will burn with all the rest of the dross on the Day.

Those who have believed in Yeshua/Jesus 'til the end will be raised on that Day to Live. The institution we know today as "christianity" or "christendom" or "church" will no longer exist. Thank God.

[kristofferdaniel]

Nadiine & StevenL great input I can see that I will learn much from these forums.

[djconklin]

Any thinking person can read the Scriptures and see how the called-out are supposed to act and what they are to do and then look at the results of "christianity" through the centuries to see that it has NOT produced what is expected of the called-out ones.


Excellant point! I should add that the first Christians were called Christians because the people in the community could see that these people who followed Christ behaved differently than they used to. Since then, however, lots of people called themselves christians because it was popular to do so and because they used the cloak of religion (like some use the flag) to cover their own sins.

[neilius73]

Very enjoyable read.

[Nadiine]

Excellant point! I should add that the first Christians were called Christians because the people in the community could see that these people who followed Christ behaved differently than they used to. Since then, however, lots of people called themselves christians because it was popular to do so and because they used the cloak of religion (like some use the flag) to cover their own sins.
This is definitely one aspect to this yes.

But we have to remember prophecy. Scripturally, there's an apostacy before Jesus' coming - many Christians agree that they believe we're in that period of time - end times (even tho technically, the bible defines the time of the end beginning when Jesus first came to earth for his mission of salvation).

Seeing people leave the faith, and false churches being erected along w/ false teachings that He said would INCREASE and be more powerful, is just prophecy being fulfilled - it isn't "failure" - it's proof that God knows the future & is carrying out His plan over mankind in His timing.

If you go back to Elijah's time, Elijah thought ALL God's people had failed & resorted to idolatry and he was grieved. But God told Elijah that He kept 7000 of His people from bending the knee to Baal.
7000 isn't a whole lot! God didn't FAIL!

And, what does the bible tell us? FEW take the narrow path, MANY take the broad gate to destruction.

So biblically, I see no evidence of Christianity "failing" whatsoever! I see prophecy being fulfilled & the world set up to recieve the coming antichrist's lies.

[StevenL]

Biblically, the world received the antichrists' lies long long ago and we are living among the results of it.

Until we extend our "biblical" vision beyond our own times and understand that everything written is not about "us", we'll never get a grip on what has happened in the world for the last two thousand years.

We are not waiting to receive an "antichrist" and we are not waiting for the prophesied "falling away". That's a church delusion.

Christendom failed and fell many centuries ago. But most are still "seeing" these things coming in the future.

"Christianity" or "christendom" or "churches" (as we know them) are NOT the Ekklesia that Yeshua/Jesus said that He was going to build. They are a man-made delusion. The gates of Sheol/hades WILL prevail against them.

But Sheol/hades/grave/death will NOT prevail against the Ekklesia (called-out assembly) that Yeshua has built. These are going to Live. That's the Good News.

Many of the disagreements over this subject hang upon individual definitions of "church" or "christianity". These are simply my thoughts based upon my individual definitions that I've gleaned from my own studies and searchings. I reserve the right to be wrong about any particular subject. :)

God bless everyone.

[seekthetruth909]

It all comes down to ones definition of, “Christianity”.

Here is an interesting quote from Professor Sider,a theologian:

The simple reason that Evangelicals or Christians as you've stated it, look like the rest of the world is because they most likely have not been presented with sound biblical teaching and do not understand why they need a savior or what it even means to be saved. I was part of the Evangelical movement for a few years and then part of a non-denom church and all I heard week in and week out were topical sermons. I kept hearing how God loved me, and how He desired a relationship with me, and how He sent His son to die for me so He could have a relationship with me. I also heard that all I needed to do since I was basically a good person, was to ask Jesus into my heart and all would be forgiven. There was no public confession of sin, we never recited a creed, such as the Apostle's, the Nicene or the Athanasian creed, nor did we ever hear any of these mentioned. The Apostle's Creed is a very basic summation and statement of faith for Christians. It's been said that if you can not affirm the statements in that creed, chances are you're not a Christian.

First, where in the bible does it tell you to "ask Jesus into your heart" and where does it say you're a good person? All this feel good Christianity is poison to the true gospel message. If you're not hearing Christ crucified, died, buried, and risen for your sin or if you've never heard that, then you're in real trouble. You have no reason to be a Christian. The message we're hearing should be Christ-centered and cross-focused, if it isn't, something is seriously wrong. All the warm fuzzies of how Jesus loves you may make you feel all warm and good inside, but you won't recognize your need for a savior, something most Evangelical churches leave out of their gospel presentations. Until the law of God breaks you and proves to you that you have lived a life that is in opposition to God, until you know God's standard and know how you measure up to that standard, and everyone falls short, you will not know why you need a savior.

[HowGreatIsOurGod]

There are so many "assumptive" statements used as facts, the post is almost misleading. The United States of America is about the only country founded that cites God, scripture, and christian principals in it's founding writings. Even that being said, it obviously didn't make the USA a christian nation. There isn't such a thing.

I can say I am a liberal and a progressive, yet harbor deep convictions of conservatism and guide my actions by those conservative principals. Would I be a liberal because I said I was? I think not.

Therefore, anyone who follows evil and vanity cannot be of Christ's body. They are liars and deceitful and are not of the fruit of the Lord.

The ills of today are not the deserved fruits of the true believers. We are caught up in the unfolding of the war between higher powers than man. It is in my opinon, grossly unfair to question the true christian's responsibility for the evil done throughout time. We have not failed. Christ has not failed. Man has failed.
Amen!

[Nadiine]

Biblically, the world received the antichrists' lies long long ago and we are living among the results of it.

Until we extend our "biblical" vision beyond our own times and understand that everything written is not about "us", we'll never get a grip on what has happened in the world for the last two thousand years.

We are not waiting to receive an "antichrist" and we are not waiting for the prophesied "falling away". That's a church delusion.

Christendom failed and fell many centuries ago. But most are still "seeing" these things coming in the future.

"Christianity" or "christendom" or "churches" (as we know them) are NOT the Ekklesia that Yeshua/Jesus said that He was going to build. They are a man-made delusion. The gates of Sheol/hades WILL prevail against them.

But Sheol/hades/grave/death will NOT prevail against the Ekklesia (called-out assembly) that Yeshua has built. These are going to Live. That's the Good News.

Many of the disagreements over this subject hang upon individual definitions of "church" or "christianity". These are simply my thoughts based upon my individual definitions that I've gleaned from my own studies and searchings. I reserve the right to be wrong about any particular subject.
I disagree with your entire post.
Jude 24
Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present [you] faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,

These are simply my thoughts based upon my individual definitions that I've gleaned from my own studies and searchings
And THIS is what I consider is your largest error. Let me guess, you don't attend any church & are for the most part "self taught"?

[SteelDisciple]

I think American christianity is failing because of christians. You have the extremists, you have the people who don't really know their bible and instead make up their own ideas based on their PERSONAL beliefs, you have the pacifists who hide in their little bubble worlds...and of course...the lazy christian who doesn't do JACK.

We are, without a doubt the only religion that seems to NOT take our beliefs very seriously. (generalization)

[Nadiine]

...and of course...the lazy christian who doesn't do JACK.
LOL I like your flair for words.

Could it be alot of these Christians are the "Lukewarm" that God warns us about who will be Spewed out of His mouth ultimately I wonder??? :eek: :help:

[SteelDisciple]

LOL I like your flair for words.

Could it be alot of these Christians are the "Lukewarm" that God warns us about who will be Spewed out of His mouth ultimately I wonder??? :eek: :help:

I think you're right on that.

We need more christians that are closer to hot water, without the fancy bubbles. :)

[StevenL]

I disagree with your entire post.
Jude 24
Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present [you] faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,


And THIS is what I consider is your largest error. Let me guess, you don't attend any church & are for the most part "self taught"?
That's OK. I usually disagree with most of yours also. But we'll both live through it I think. :D

[Nadiine]

That's OK. I usually disagree with most of yours also. But we'll both live through it I think. :D
I don't care if you disagree with me.... your issue is disagreement w/ scripture which doesn't back you up.
I'd still like your verse support where Jesus says the church fails, Christians fail, HE fails,.... etc.

Maybe you should better specify what exactly you claim fails... your OP is rather vague.
What fails? How does it fail? In what way? And provide some scripture please.
thanx :angel:

[cac]

It's very simple, I believe that all who believe in Christ and His father and want to learn there ways will be saved. One thing else to keep in mind is that we are all sinners, There is not one human being who doesn't sin.
All fall short of the Glory of God.

Take me for example: I moke Cigars, I watch adult videos, look at adult magazines and even where adult clothing in public. But I also believe in Christ and his father, I believe that God has the power to heal me when the proper time comes.

[cac]

Oiy, does giving something the name "Christian" suddenly cure it from all darkness? Is the name "christian" where the power is found? Something that the church was labled with decades later, as originally it was called "The Way"? I think the problem is people forget two issues:

1. Anyone can call themselves anything, but only living it out will make them that thing.

I can call myself a murderer, but if I haven't killed anyone does that mean I still am? No, only if you kill someone not in defense or war does it make you a murderer. And then, a murderer can tell people they aren't one, but they still are.

A title means nothing! That must absolutely be understood by everyone. It is only the actions that make someone or something fall into a catagory, the name doesn't do it.

2. No one but Christ is allowed to be perfect in this life, lest anyone could boast that they were saved by works and not by grace. As it is, we all deserve the axe, and it is by grace we don't feel its sting, through faith by what Christ did for us. He and He alone is perfect.

This also leads right into the fact that the world is lost in darkness; we are the salt of the earth that keeps it from destruction. At the very end of Daniel, God says that the end will not come until the power of God's holy people is broken. That doesn't sound like isreal, especially since at the time Daniel wrote it, isreal was in exile! Rather, it seems directly alluding to the church. The fact the earth still exists means the church is being increadibly successful!

We also know by Revelations and all other prophesy that this success we are enjoying in our days of peace (ever growing into war) must end. Yes, we live in an age of profound peace right now. Crack open history books and read about just a few centuries ago if you don't believe me. This is the age of the Gentile; and an age of peace where the church is influential across the entire globe through its roots in earths strongest country. One day that must end.

So, has "christianity failed"? Well, if it had, we wouldn't be here to ask that question right now.
I believe war is murder, any kind of killing of human life is murder. Thats why I personaly never suport war, but i do suport our troops in the sence that I wish them a safe return home.

[kristofferdaniel]

Jesus Christ 'has not been a failure yet; for nobody has ever been sane enough to try his way.'GEORGE BERNARD SHAW (1856-1950) Great quote.

[kristofferdaniel]

Jesus Christ 'has not been a failure yet; for nobody has ever been sane enough to try his way.'GEORGE BERNARD SHAW (1856-1950) Great quote.
I don't know how to use the quote, I want to reply to something else.

[MatthewR]

Christianity has not failed.
Man has failed.
And Man will continue to fail.

[buck]

Christianty has not failed as long as there are christians spreading the word.
You can take a horse to water, but you can't make him drink. It's the same with people, you can tell them about Christ and sin and how to get saved. If they choose not to then you have done your work. Jesus also says to study his words. That means to know the Bible and find the place you need to worship.
Buck:amen:

[Moriah_Conquering_Wind]

Not failed but rather people's sin are too harden to acknowledge the conviction of the Holy Spirit to get saved. As long as sin keeps blinding people, fewer people will get saved.
To me, this statement makes it sound like sin is more powerful than Christ or the Holy Spirit.

Given MY background and former life? -- I disagree, of course. :D

[IrishGuy070890]

Yes, Christianity has failed