Lutherans have gifts too?

[seajoy]

I've noticed in other parts of CF, that spiritual gifts seem to be discussed here and there.

Lots of folks seem to know exactly (or perceive to know) just where they fit in God's Mighty plan, and His ministry.

I don't think that Lutherans like to talk about this, as we don't want to seem haughty when it comes to what our gifts might be. You Pastors know what yours are, but what about regular folks like me?

How do you know what your purpose is in the ministry of Christ? Do some of you folks want to list your gifts, or perhaps make suggestions to others. It might be easier to see things in your neighbor than in yourself.

Personally, I could use some help with this. :)

Thanks, seajoy :preach: :D

[Confess]

I think it is exclusive to Lutheran teaching that we emphasis on vocations.

Many other denominations think of spiritual gifts as something only Christians can have and that they are some sort of wonderful, different and special thing that they didn't always have until they became Christians.

Lutherans do not see it that way.

When a man is called into ministry, God gives him the gifts to fulfill that ministry.

When a woman gets pregnant, God gives her the gifts to fulfill her vocation as mother.

Martin Luther said that it is a far more important job for a mother to change the soiled diaper of a baby then being a monk in solitude worshipping God daily.

Lutheran teach that we are all apart of the priesthood of believers. We all have a spiritual role in our life. Whether it is the mother cleaning the soiled diaper of her child, or a called and ordained minister of God. None of them are less important and none of them are of greater importance. The point is that we all are out there, either with our children or with the congregation or even with our neighbor, sharing Christ through our words and actions.

Some people have the gift of teaching, yet are not professional teachers out in the world. They are at home, teaching their children in the faith. Some women are at home with no children, yet volunteering their time and helping other when they can.

Many believe that we must always be in the world with the gifts that God has given us in order to be faithful stewards of those gifts.

For those people I hope they understand that their witness at home is just as valid and important as witnessing to a thousand people.

[seajoy]

When a woman gets pregnant, God gives her the gifts to fulfill her vocation as mother.

Martin Luther said that it is a far more important job for a mother to change the soiled diaper of a baby then being a monk in solitude worshipping God daily.

Some people have the gift of teaching, yet are not professional teachers out in the world. They are at home, teaching their children in the faith. Some women are at home with no children, yet volunteering their time and helping other when they can.

I totally agree with this...but what about after the kids are grown? My baby is soon to be married.

I've thought of helping out at our church's school, but with working, and my ails...that seems too overwhelming for me.

Wow, I sound whiny :sorry:

[QuiltAngel]

I go along with the vocation line of thought.

A good book to read is: God at Work: Your Christian Vocation in All of Life by Gene Edward Vieth. I have the book but have not gotten it read yet.

We don't have to have special gifts. What are some of the things you enjoy doing? Is there something you have wanted to try but have not done so yet?

[Studeclunker]

I've been told several versions of the same thing about this subject. First, this used to irritate Luther. He didn't have much patience for the followers of Zwinglii or the AnaBaptists, which is where this mindset came from. The story has it that a shoe maker asked Martin this question once and he answered, "What do you do for a living?"
"I'm a shoemaker," the man answered, puzzled.
"Then make the best shoes you can," Martin answered him.
Melanthion (the father of, ugh, Lutheran Pietsim) used to fret about this kind of thing as well. He and Martin Luther were sitting in a Tavern one time and Martin made the following statement, "Relax. The Lord's work is being accomplished while we are sitting here enjoying good company and an ale."

Dr. Rosenbladt used to say that we are often not even aware of our 'gifts'. This is because if we were, we would mess things up with our self-centeredness, our ego would get in the way.

Spectacular gifts of the spirit are not a complement to a congregation.:sigh: If one reads through the NT one will find that the more faithful congregations were quiet on this. The more faithless, needing the encouragement of the spirit, saw more of it. Corinth for example was rife with these 'gifts', and look at what a mess they had.:doh: If one has a strong congregation, the spirit is working. Notice I didn't say large. Large doesn't denote strength, just tickled ears. Still, sometimes the spirit needs a large congregation to support ministries that are necessary for the area involved. So large isn't bad by definition. Neither is small. Nor are the quiet gifts of the spirit that aren't revealed to us. They keep us humble and usefull for the Lord.;)

[Confess]

I totally agree with this...but what about after the kids are grown? My baby is soon to be married.

I've thought of helping out at our church's school, but with working, and my ails...that seems too overwhelming for me.

Wow, I sound whiny :sorry:
Now you fulfill yet another role in life.

Just as when God calls a man into ministry, he grants that man the gifts to fulfill the call, so too will God be there for you as you are now an "empty nester".

Your gifts will bless others whether you are volunteering, working, being there for your children during good and bad times, or when you are in the house alone making a craft.

Everything you do is because of God and the gifts he has given you. Everrything you touch, everyone you talk to is effected and blessed because of the gifts God has given you. We are all apart of the Body of Christ, none of us are useless.

[Edial]

I've noticed in other parts of CF, that spiritual gifts seem to be discussed here and there.

Lots of folks seem to know exactly (or perceive to know) just where they fit in God's Mighty plan, and His ministry.

I don't think that Lutherans like to talk about this, as we don't want to seem haughty when it comes to what our gifts might be. You Pastors know what yours are, but what about regular folks like me?

How do you know what your purpose is in the ministry of Christ? Do some of you folks want to list your gifts, or perhaps make suggestions to others. It might be easier to see things in your neighbor than in yourself.

Personally, I could use some help with this. :)

Thanks, seajoy :preach: :D
When Holy Spirit distributes gifts these are the gifts that would edify the church.
There are also other gifts (gifted watchmaker, psychologist). I am not talking about that.

The gifts of Holy Spirit are clearly defined ...

Some texts and then some comments ...

RO 12:5 so in Christ we who are many form one body, and each member belongs to all the others. 6 We have different gifts, according to the grace given us. If a man's gift is prophesying, let him use it in proportion to his n faith. 7 If it is serving, let him serve; if it is teaching, let him teach; 8 if it is encouraging, let him encourage; if it is contributing to the needs of others, let him give generously; if it is leadership, let him govern diligently; if it is showing mercy, let him do it cheerfully.


1CO 12:4 There are different kinds of gifts, but the same Spirit. 5 There are different kinds of service, but the same Lord. 6 There are different kinds of working, but the same God works all of them in all men.
1CO 12:7 Now to each one the manifestation of the Spirit is given for the common good. 8 To one there is given through the Spirit the message of wisdom, to another the message of knowledge by means of the same Spirit, 9 to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healing by that one Spirit, 10 to another miraculous powers, to another prophecy, to another distinguishing between spirits, to another speaking in different kinds of tongues, n and to still another the interpretation of tongues. n 11 All these are the work of one and the same Spirit, and he gives them to each one, just as he determines.

1CO 12:27 Now you are the body of Christ, and each one of you is a part of it. 28 And in the church God has appointed first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then workers of miracles, also those having gifts of healing, those able to help others, those with gifts of administration, and those speaking in different kinds of tongues. 29 Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? 30 Do all have gifts of healing? Do all speak in tongues n? Do all interpret? 31 But eagerly desire n the greater gifts.
And now I will show you the most excellent way.
1CO 13:1 If I speak in the tongues n of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. 3 If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, n but have not love, I gain nothing.

Comments:

1. Spiritual gifts are given to each and every believer in Jesus Christ.
2. No one has all the gifts, yet all have at least one of the gifts.
3. In governing the body there is a certain ranking in gifts.
4. In everyday functions, there is no ranking of gifts.
5. Having love is preeminent to having gifts and one should seek love first.

How does one recognize what gifts he has?

It is usually not by own realization, but by the words of others.
It is what others see in you, not what you see in yourself.

According to the list of gifts (and from what I see, seajoy), you have a gift of mercy, and encouraging.

Also, usually people that have certain specific gifts, they are also in need of that what they give out.

So, if one encourages others, he/she himself needs encouragement from others.
If one has mercy on others, he/she himself needs mercy from others.

It is like the source needs to be replenished all the time. And Holy Spirit replenishes it by Himself or through other people.

Thanks,
Ed

[C.F.W. Walther]

File on LCMS stance of Spiritual Gifts. Looks like they have changed their stance on gifts the last 20 years since the Charismatic movement has influenced the synod along with Ablaze. They use to deny certain aspects of the gifts.

https://www.lcms.org/graphics/assets/media/CTCR/spiritgifts.pdf

[seajoy]

How does one recognize what gifts he has?

It is usually not by own realization, but by the words of others.
It is what others see in you, not what you see in yourself.

According to the list of gifts (and from what I see, seajoy), you have a gift of mercy, and encouraging.

Also, usually people that have certain specific gifts, they are also in need of that what they give out.

So, if one encourages others, he/she himself needs encouragement from others.
If one has mercy on others, he/she himself needs mercy from others.

It is like the source needs to be replenished all the time. And Holy Spirit replenishes it by Himself or through other people.

Thanks,
Ed
Mercy, encouraging..... Me, really :confused: ? Cool :blush: . That really covers most folks at TCL, I think.

I do like to help others feel better, (but isn't that the standard answer from most Christians?)

I like to encourage others that suffer from OCD, and other mental illnesses. Been there, done that myself. See, now I feel I'm bragging and doing that haughty thing...I just can't stand that feeling. But I really want to know what God wants me to do in this world.

I like Studeclunker's post a lot (don't know how to do that double quote thing).

And QuiltAngel, you asked what I like to do, and what would I like to try. I love to talk...a lot :) . Most folks tease me about it quite a bit. I feel it's my responsibility to keep a conversation going. If I don't, people often sit there and stare...drives me nuts. I like to make people laugh (guess I'm a bit off topic right now :blush: ).

It appears I'm rambling...

Anyway, my gifts don't seem to stand out like some folks. I tried teaching sunday school to 7th & 8th graders once (I thought God was leading me to do that)...what a disaster. They ran the class, not me.
I tried visiting an old lady in the nursing home, and she died after my first visit :eek: .
I planned a ladies aid party once, and got a talking to that I didn't take care of things correctly....so you see where I'm going with this.
I once picked out the carpet for the parsonage...and the whole world (except the pastor's wife) was mad at me. Kinda like there is a rain cloud hanging over my church work.

Told ya I can talk a lot!

[synger]

There is vocation, which is a calling to the work of your life (be it for pay or not). My understanding is that the gifts of the Spirit are tools God gives to us to do that work.

I think that the whole idea of gifts of the Spirit has been thrown out of proportion from some denominations' insistence that tongues, specifically, is one of the prime indicators that you've been "baptised by the Holy Spirit" and given gifts of the Spirit. That sort of mindset is completely foreign to most Christians (Lutheran, Catholic, Reformed, etc.).

There are some interesting books out there that go through the gifts, and help you determine which ones you have. But I agree with some of the other posters... usually that discernment comes from others rather than yourself. Or in looking back over your life and seeing how the Spirit has led you to interact with people in general.

Me, I tend to be an encourager. God also has given me a strong gift of faith that has held firm through a LOT of experimenting and challenge. Even back in high school, I remember my dad asking why I had such "weird friends who always have so many problems." I couldn't answer him, really. They just... needed a friend they could talk to, you know? And I needed to listen.

Later in life, that need in me drove me to do volunteer work with people with AIDS (when it was still a new disease and very little was known about it), and later still, to become a Stephen Minister (a lay ministry of caring and listening) in my church. I still find myself falling into those habits of listening and encouraging -- at work with the junior web staff who struggle with the work or work ethic, at home with my husband and daughter, at church with the others in the choir who were rather intimidated by my skill when I first joined, and among my friends who are still drawn mostly from "the weird and wonderful" worlds of sci-fi fandom and Neo-Paganism.

Strangely, I haven't often thought of myself as an "encourager" or "faith-gifted" when looking at that list in the Bible. But in looking at my life, and how God has used me in others' lives, it's pretty clear.

Now, I feel like He's calling me to expand myself more into teaching and leading. I've fought Him on this, not wanting to leave my comfort zone, especially at work, where I'd much rather stay at the computer working all day rather than actually meeting and talking to people. But He's very slowly, yet very deliberately, changing my job to where I have to do what He's calling me to do. And I'm finding those skills are following me into home life and church life as well. So it's pretty clear to me that it's another calling. By God's strength, I'll do what He calls me to do.

I guess I'm saying all this to say that I believe the gifts of the Spirit are real, and powerful, and given to every Christian to fulfill the vocation God has given them. It should NOT be a dividing point, but too often is.

[seajoy]

Fantastic post, Synger. What you have said is really what my OP question was about.

[synger]

Fantastic post, Synger. What you have said is really what my OP question was about.

:hug: Glad to help, dear. I've been seeing some of the stuff you've been up against in other forums, and I understand the frustration. It's more than hurtful to be told in so many words that you're not a True Spirit-Filled Christian because you don't do thus-and-such or have this-or-that gift.

[Jim47]

I think it is exclusive to Lutheran teaching that we emphasis on vocations.

Many other denominations think of spiritual gifts as something only Christians can have and that they are some sort of wonderful, different and special thing that they didn't always have until they became Christians.

Lutherans do not see it that way.

When a man is called into ministry, God gives him the gifts to fulfill that ministry.

When a woman gets pregnant, God gives her the gifts to fulfill her vocation as mother.

Martin Luther said that it is a far more important job for a mother to change the soiled diaper of a baby then being a monk in solitude worshipping God daily.

Lutheran teach that we are all apart of the priesthood of believers. We all have a spiritual role in our life. Whether it is the mother cleaning the soiled diaper of her child, or a called and ordained minister of God. None of them are less important and none of them are of greater importance. The point is that we all are out there, either with our children or with the congregation or even with our neighbor, sharing Christ through our words and actions.

Some people have the gift of teaching, yet are not professional teachers out in the world. They are at home, teaching their children in the faith. Some women are at home with no children, yet volunteering their time and helping other when they can.

Many believe that we must always be in the world with the gifts that God has given us in order to be faithful stewards of those gifts.

For those people I hope they understand that their witness at home is just as valid and important as witnessing to a thousand people.


Great post, and quite true. :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[dinkime]

i know that one of my main gifts in the church is working with children -- i have started a sunday school class for toddlers (how many churches have that lol) and i lead the youthgroup...

one of my other gifts is mission work which is why i went to ukraine 2 summers ago and am planning to go again this summer...

you know what you like, are good at, etc...there is a place for whatever it is in your church -- you just need to find it! we have women who make the banners for the front of church, or set up communion for services, or set up mission displays...

i also think there are people who THINK they have certain gifts, but do not do them for the correct reasons (or they are not good at them) -- these people need to be counceled by their pastor and possibly find a new place for their gifts, or maybe even find a gift they were unaware of

[Jim47]

Mercy, encouraging..... Me, really :confused: ? Cool :blush: . That really covers most folks at TCL, I think.

I do like to help others feel better, (but isn't that the standard answer from most Christians?)

I like to encourage others that suffer from OCD, and other mental illnesses. Been there, done that myself. See, now I feel I'm bragging and doing that haughty thing...I just can't stand that feeling. But I really want to know what God wants me to do in this world.

I like Studeclunker's post a lot (don't know how to do that double quote thing).

And QuiltAngel, you asked what I like to do, and what would I like to try. I love to talk...a lot :) . Most folks tease me about it quite a bit. I feel it's my responsibility to keep a conversation going. If I don't, people often sit there and stare...drives me nuts. I like to make people laugh (guess I'm a bit off topic right now :blush: ).

It appears I'm rambling...

Anyway, my gifts don't seem to stand out like some folks. I tried teaching sunday school to 7th & 8th graders once (I thought God was leading me to do that)...what a disaster. They ran the class, not me.
I tried visiting an old lady in the nursing home, and she died after my first visit :eek: .
I planned a ladies aid party once, and got a talking to that I didn't take care of things correctly....so you see where I'm going with this.
I once picked out the carpet for the parsonage...and the whole world (except the pastor's wife) was mad at me. Kinda like there is a rain cloud hanging over my church work.

Told ya I can talk a lot!



Seajoy, I know where ou are coming from. I have always had a hard time seeing my gifts too, and that is normal. We aren't supposed to focus on us and what we do, but on what God has done for us. Wanting to do nice things only shows that God is in your heart. Your friendship is worth more then diamonds and gold. The love and friendship you show others is priceless. Just as you love your children. Do you think for a moment that they don't want your love? Or your husband?

Don't worry yourself about what gifts you have or how to use them. God will show you what He needs you do and give you the strength to do it.

I never feel as do anything, but my Pastor tells me otherwise. Just be yourself, be happy and love others as you love yourself. This is God's work for us: To believe on The One He sent to save us from our sins. Nothing more is required. We just bask in God's love and others see the glow. :)

I have to hit the hay now, but before I do, I want to thank everyone here for showing Christian love to each other. :wave:

[seajoy]

Thanks Jim...nice post :) :sleep:

[Edial]

Mercy, encouraging..... Me, really :confused: ? Cool :blush: . That really covers most folks at TCL, I think.
...
I like to make people laugh ...
...
I like to encourage others that suffer from OCD, and other mental illnesses. Been there, done that myself. See, now I feel I'm bragging and doing that haughty thing...I just can't stand that feeling. But I really want to know what God wants me to do in this world.
...
...
The objective is not to seek greater gifts, but to seek love.

Love is that "sauce" that keeps all the ingredients in place and together.

Check out verses 4-7. Don't they somehow "fit" within the gifts of encouraging and mercy?

Quiet gifts. Quality gifts.

1CO 12: 31 But eagerly desire n the greater gifts.
And now I will show you the most excellent way.
1CO 13:1 If I speak in the tongues n of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. 3 If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, n but have not love, I gain nothing.
1CO 13:4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5 It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

I do like to help others feel better, (but isn't that the standard answer from most Christians?)
...
Not necessarily.
When there is an argument, some of us (including myself) could forget the feelings of others.

I do not recall you arguing at any time.

Anyway, my gifts don't seem to stand out like some folks.
Good. ... these are the best kinds of gifts.
Background, behind-the-scene gifts.
These are the special agents whom God uses quietly.

I tried teaching sunday school to 7th & 8th graders once (I thought God was leading me to do that)...what a disaster. They ran the class, not me.
I tried visiting an old lady in the nursing home, and she died after my first visit :eek: .
I planned a ladies aid party once, and got a talking to that I didn't take care of things correctly....so you see where I'm going with this.
I once picked out the carpet for the parsonage...and the whole world (except the pastor's wife) was mad at me. Kinda like there is a rain cloud hanging over my church work.:eek: .
I guess that's clear.

It appears I'm rambling...

... I love to talk...a lot. Most folks tease me about it quite a bit. I feel it's my responsibility to keep a conversation going. If I don't, people often sit there and stare...drives me nuts.
...
Told ya I can talk a lot!
That's a gift of gab. :)

It should have been included on these tests on being a Lutheran ...

Ed

[Edial]

File on LCMS stance of Spiritual Gifts. Looks like they have changed their stance on gifts the last 20 years since the Charismatic movement has influenced the synod along with Ablaze. They use to deny certain aspects of the gifts.

https://www.lcms.org/graphics/assets/media/CTCR/spiritgifts.pdf
Good one.

Saved it.

Thanks, :)
Ed

[seajoy]

The objective is not to seek greater gifts, but to seek love.

Love is that "sauce" that keeps all the ingredients in place and together.

Check out verses 4-7. Don't they somehow "fit" within the gifts of encouraging and mercy?

Quiet gifts. Quality gifts.

1CO 12: 31 But eagerly desire n the greater gifts.
And now I will show you the most excellent way.
1CO 13:1 If I speak in the tongues n of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. 3 If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, n but have not love, I gain nothing.
1CO 13:4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5 It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.


Not necessarily.
When there is an argument, some of us (including myself) could forget the feelings of others.

I do not recall you arguing at any time.


Good. ... these are the best kinds of gifts.
Background, behind-the-scene gifts.
These are the special agents whom God uses quietly.

:eek: .
I guess that's clear.


That's a gift of gab. :)

It should have been included on these tests on being a Lutheran ...

Ed
Ed, you've made my day. I feel better about things already :) .

[Edial]

Seajoy, I know where ou are coming from. I have always had a hard time seeing my gifts too, and that is normal. We aren't supposed to focus on us and what we do, but on what God has done for us. Wanting to do nice things only shows that God is in your heart. Your friendship is worth more then diamonds and gold. The love and friendship you show others is priceless. Just as you love your children. Do you think for a moment that they don't want your love? Or your husband?

Don't worry yourself about what gifts you have or how to use them. God will show you what He needs you do and give you the strength to do it.

I never feel as do anything, but my Pastor tells me otherwise. Just be yourself, be happy and love others as you love yourself. This is God's work for us: To believe on The One He sent to save us from our sins. Nothing more is required. We just bask in God's love and others see the glow. :)

I have to hit the hay now, but before I do, I want to thank everyone here for showing Christian love to each other. :wave:
Jim, you're overstepping all the gifts and are going for the jugular - love. :)

Wise move. :)

[TheCosmicGospel]

Gifts are for the body.

Gifts are for the body.

GIFTS ARE FOR THE BODY.

Got it?

Read above until you get it.

Peace and Joy,
Cosmic

[DaRev]

Gifts are for the body.

...of Christ.

[DaRev]

I tried teaching sunday school to 7th & 8th graders once (I thought God was leading me to do that)...what a disaster. They ran the class, not me.

I absolutely love teaching that age group! They're old enough to have a conversation with and yet young enough to want to learn. The trick is to make it interesting for them, which I am still trying to master.

[The Princess Bride]

File on LCMS stance of Spiritual Gifts. Looks like they have changed their stance on gifts the last 20 years since the Charismatic movement has influenced the synod along with Ablaze. They use to deny certain aspects of the gifts.

https://www.lcms.org/graphics/assets/media/CTCR/spiritgifts.pdf
Why would they try to deny it? :scratch: :confused:

[ctay]

I've noticed in other parts of CF, that spiritual gifts seem to be discussed here and there.

Lots of folks seem to know exactly (or perceive to know) just where they fit in God's Mighty plan, and His ministry.

I don't think that Lutherans like to talk about this, as we don't want to seem haughty when it comes to what our gifts might be. You Pastors know what yours are, but what about regular folks like me?

How do you know what your purpose is in the ministry of Christ? Do some of you folks want to list your gifts, or perhaps make suggestions to others. It might be easier to see things in your neighbor than in yourself.

Personally, I could use some help with this. :)

Thanks, seajoy :preach: :D
Me too, I'm not sure what my gifts are, I do know teaching children is not one of them. I felt the Lord led me to the church I am right now but with the attitude of a lot of them this week after the pastor said he may be leaving (small church). I've been seeking answers all week. I happened to have it on a christian radio station yesterday morning on the way to bible study. They talked about if your in a rut and trying to find out what your supposed to be doing and don't have answers to stop unclutter your mind that God may be answering you but your not listening. They said it could be something your not finished with or he may have some other use for you.

[ctay]

Mercy, encouraging..... Me, really :confused: ? Cool :blush: . That really covers most folks at TCL, I think.

I do like to help others feel better, (but isn't that the standard answer from most Christians?)

I like to encourage others that suffer from OCD, and other mental illnesses. Been there, done that myself. See, now I feel I'm bragging and doing that haughty thing...I just can't stand that feeling. But I really want to know what God wants me to do in this world.

I like Studeclunker's post a lot (don't know how to do that double quote thing).

And QuiltAngel, you asked what I like to do, and what would I like to try. I love to talk...a lot :) . Most folks tease me about it quite a bit. I feel it's my responsibility to keep a conversation going. If I don't, people often sit there and stare...drives me nuts. I like to make people laugh (guess I'm a bit off topic right now :blush: ).

It appears I'm rambling...

Anyway, my gifts don't seem to stand out like some folks. I tried teaching sunday school to 7th & 8th graders once (I thought God was leading me to do that)...what a disaster. They ran the class, not me.
I tried visiting an old lady in the nursing home, and she died after my first visit :eek: .
I planned a ladies aid party once, and got a talking to that I didn't take care of things correctly....so you see where I'm going with this.
I once picked out the carpet for the parsonage...and the whole world (except the pastor's wife) was mad at me. Kinda like there is a rain cloud hanging over my church work.

Told ya I can talk a lot!
I tried teaching the 2nd and 3rd grade class, they got the better of me. LOL

[C.F.W. Walther]

Why would they try to deny it? :scratch: :confused:Lutherans idea of gifts is different that you idea of gifts. Our gifts are our inate gifts that God has given us to further His kingdom such as the gift to teach, preach, serve etc. In all the years I have been to the "other" churches have I never seen a true gift that you foster; and believe me I have been to many. The only thing I have seen is a phony, hypocritical, selfcentered response to Christianity. "Look at me--Look at what I can do !" "God is my cornucopia and He and I share the center of my universe."

Even though there is controversy in any church body you will never see more controversy, corruption, leading people astray, than in the broad base of dispesationlists or reformed. They spend so much time on innane stuff like "end times" and "Jews are the chosen race" that they have no time for teaching God's grace and mercy and forgiveness. They only have time for good works like the Hasiadic Jews !

---live in the NT and not the OT.

I'm not going to say anymore on this subject. It riles me up too much.

[DaSeminarian]

I absolutely love teaching that age group! They're old enough to have a conversation with and yet young enough to want to learn. The trick is to make it interesting for them, which I am still trying to master.

I agree with you Rev. That is the class I taught just before coming to Seminary. I have also enjoyed teaching the adult class in my fieldwork church when I have the opportunity.

The only thing for me is that I don't know that I have the energy needed to make it interesting for them (7th and 8th graders). Especially if you have a group that expects you to entertain them.

[DaRev]

I agree with you Rev. That is the class I taught just before coming to Seminary. I have also enjoyed teaching the adult class in my fieldwork church when I have the opportunity.

The only thing for me is that I don't know that I have the energy needed to make it interesting for them (7th and 8th graders). Especially if you have a group that expects you to entertain them.

I run a confirmation retreat every year with some of the other churches in our circuit. We go to a camp in New Jersey and we have had around 20 kids each time. It is mainly centered on instruction of some sort (this year it is the 10 Commandments) and worship. We work in some fun activities and free time and the kids love it. Some of them get bummed out because they can't go every year. It's mainly for confirmation ages, 6th thru 8th grades.

I have made this mandatory for my kids here.

[The Princess Bride]

Lutherans idea of gifts is different that you idea of gifts. Are you speaking in general or specifically to me? :)

Our gifts are our inate gifts that God has given us to further His kingdom such as the gift to teach, preach, serve etc. In all the years I have been to the "other" churches have I never seen a true gift that you foster; and believe me I have been to many. The only thing I have seen is a phony, hypocritical, selfcentered response to Christianity. "Look at me--Look at what I can do !" "God is my cornucopia and He and I share the center of my universe."

Even though there is controversy in any church body you will never see more controversy, corruption, leading people astray, than in the broad base of dispesationlists or reformed. They spend so much time on innane stuff like "end times" and "Jews are the chosen race" that they have no time for teaching God's grace and mercy and forgiveness. They only have time for good works like the Hasiadic Jews !

---live in the NT and not the OT.

I'm not going to say anymore on this subject. It riles me up too much.
I bolded the first portion of your post, because that is how I feel as well.

Sure, the giftings of the Spirit can be edifying to the body, BUT the whole point of them is to show the marvelous signs and wonders of a Living God to the UNsaved people.