Protocols of Zion

[Nessuno]

Watched this show on PBS regarding anti-semitism in the 21st century and they did alot of talking about the title of this msg. How, even though it's complete bunk, ppl still end up believing it to be true.

If breaking LH; pls delete past here.
Since I didn't read, see the movie and intentionally changed the station whenver anything about the davinci code came on I really do no know much about it. All I do know is from personal experience.

This person read that book. Told me he didn't believe it to be true. So he tells me about the picture where John is supposed to be MM. So I pull up that picture in hi rez on the PC. He goes. "See, that's a woman !!!" I went, well, does look feminine. But then I pulled up some other pictures and found them not be the gender in which I thought, so I called him back inside. Asked him, "Is this a male or female?" to which he complained about me trying to set him up. Well, I had three pictures,1 looked male and was, 1 looked female and was, 1 looked male and was female. Amazingly, he got all three wrong and was still convinced the MAN int he painting was a woman. So even though he said he did not believe it to be true, when I asked him about specific details, all of those he believed to be true.

LH delete end here.

So my question is: Are there any similarities between these two pieces of fiction besides the ability to have ppl consider true regardless of reality ?

Am I breaking Lashon Hara when I tried to demonstrate a similarity between the two, even though I am anonymous and no names were mentioned? I just wanted to share it because it was actually scary how the obvious truth was avoided each time.

[plum]

I admit I avoided the Da Vinci Code like the plague. Never read it. No interest at all.

And I don't even know the other book...

what are you trying to convey? That the books are similar? I'm sorry if I don't really follow :)

[Nessuno]

That even though they are completely bunk, over time ppl believe that they are true if just a couple believe them to begin with.

Ahh, Gospel of thomas is coming to mind as well. Like most if not all of the apocrypha (sp). A couple believe it, and then as more time passes, more end up thinking it's true because they've heard it and never did the research.

[Yovel]

Sounds like B-O-L-O-G-N-A to me. Oscar Myer of course. :D

[Nessuno]

My point is this. These are lies that the enemy is using to undermine everything... even to rewrite history if that whole "holocost never happened" thing takes off.
As far as I know there is only one way to combat lies and that's with the truth.
If we don't learn how to use the truth effectively (as it could also be used against us if we are well versed in the details regarding the lies)... if we don't learn how to use the truth effectively than it will end up being twisted against us.
Revelation 1:16-2016 And he had in his right hand seven stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp twoedged sword: and his countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength. Revelation 1:16-2017 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:
It sounds like the L-rds going to that, so should we not try to do like He does?

[visionary]

Da Vinci Code is an avenue not worth venturing on if you are looking for salvation.

In catholic focklore, these tales circulate and re-invent themselves over the centuries and for various purposes. They circulate and fire the imagination of many, who join secret societies to learn more. The Lord has warned us not to venture into secret, because His truth will be in plain sight in His Word.

[Nessuno]

Da Vinci Code is an avenue not worth venturing on if you are looking for salvation.

In catholic focklore, these tales circulate and re-invent themselves over the centuries and for various purposes. They circulate and fire the imagination of many, who join secret societies to learn more. The Lord has warned us not to venture into secret, because His truth will be in plain sight in His Word.
This isn't about looking for salvation thru the crap that's out there. It's about learning enough about the crap to accurately show those that have fallen prey to it the truth in a way that they can see it for what it is.

Eg. If I tell you there's gravity and you don't believe me cause you watched a movie and it said gravity doesn't exist. If I show you that gravity does work by dropping a ball, then you know the movie is wrong. If I didn't know what gravity was, then I couldn't prove to you that it exists. So how could I convince someone who believes in all the crap out there unless I know and can demonstrate or otherwise prove that it is crap.

I wanted this thread to be able to show me how to argue against things like protocols of zion, davinci code, and whatever else is floating around out there. If you just tell ppl it's wrong, their arms go up like attacking what they believe in, and then you've had the reverse affect and they end up believing in it more. However, if you ask them about the flaws in it, then they may research it or ask you about it and realize it's crap. How can I know the flaws in crap unless I know about crap?
The only other option is to just not try to show those that have fallen prey to it, and pray in private.
Personally, prayer and action seems a bit better than just prayer alone.
I can pray someone feeds that hungry guy on the corner, or I can pray and go give him a sandwhich.

The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.
- Edmund Burke (1729-1797)

[stone]

I haven't watched that movie or read the book, don't plan to either. There are much better things a person can do with their time than to get caught up into proveing things that don't exist. An example could be ufo's. How do you prove to people they don't exist? How do you prove that they don't exist to people that can pass a polygraph test and claim that they've been abducted. I know that there is no such thing, and that there is no proof of et vehicles, but they will swear up and down that there are.

Most of the folks that believe that it may be true are probably those that don't believe that J-sus is g-d as well. Probably gives atheist a better pov to take of j-sus, and folks from other religions.

We know the truth round these parts and are happy to share with anyone else that comes round lookin for it. :thumbsup:

[Nessuno]

I haven't watched that movie or read the book, don't plan to either. There are much better things a person can do with their time than to get caught up into proveing things that don't exist. An example could be ufo's. How do you prove to people they don't exist?
This isn't about ufo's. This was supposed to be about the protocols of zion.
Having information like, who started the rumor, how it progressed or changed, just the simple facts about it should prove it wrong, or atleast invoke reasonable doubt enough to have a person look for the truth.

Example: I grew up in the states and trusted both my HS science books and the teachers. Yet, they completely paint a picture that evolution is true. I saw a show regarding some of the details presented in HS books. Then, I did some research and found out all the details that end up looking like a marketting campaign to sell the idea that we don't need G-d to resolve creation... making a successful attack upon the first thing in the Bible. Weakening the foundation. If I never saw that one show regarding the misleading information in the very science books I trusted to be true, I'd still believe in evolution right now. Heck, the Cambrian explosion alone seems to indicate G-d's hand in creation rather than evolution. You put that together with past manipulation, falsification and the way that things are presented and you have a compelling arguement based on facts which are all checkable and proveable, to the conclusoin that evolution is false. That's the way I can defend my belief in a way that could raise reasonable doubt in the person saying evolution is true.

That's what I think that show on Antisemitism in the 21st century was trying to do. Give out the information necessary to rebuttle and defend any comments regarding the protocols of zion.

If someone is believing the poz based on hearing the information from someone they trusted or reading it from a book they trusted, why can't the truth about such things convince them otherwise ? OR cause just enough doubt so that they research it themselves (even if they just want to prove you wrong about the matter).
Think i'm just in the wrong forumn here. This is more of a faith based or faith biased propaganda warfare type issue.

Just to touch on the Ufo thing. I dont' believe they exist, though if someone came by my house and parked it in the driveway, I would reconsider where I stood on the matter.

[Nessuno]

I am beginning to think that arguments regarding trying to convince ppl about things like the davinci code and this pos thing may be futile.
Homines quod volunt credunt. - men believe what they want.

But then I start thinking that some lawyer convinced a jury that OJ was innocent. It just seems that when I watch the other side, they all seem to be able to argue their points. Even if the argument is based on complete falsities, there's no one that points that out which just seems a shame. So thinking about all the different arguements about all the different things that ppl believe, think that I'm only going to choose one thing and put together an argument regarding that. This way it's doable and not overwhelming and I don't have to research too much stuff that I really don't want to... or I may just completely leave it in G-d's hands cause it's really tiring thinking about it.

[Misty Minister]

Watched this show on PBS regarding anti-semitism in the 21st century and they did alot of talking about the title of this msg. How, even though it's complete bunk, ppl still end up believing it to be true.

If breaking LH; pls delete past here.
Since I didn't read, see the movie and intentionally changed the station whenver anything about the davinci code came on I really do no know much about it. All I do know is from personal experience.

This person read that book. Told me he didn't believe it to be true. So he tells me about the picture where John is supposed to be MM. So I pull up that picture in hi rez on the PC. He goes. "See, that's a woman !!!" I went, well, does look feminine. But then I pulled up some other pictures and found them not be the gender in which I thought, so I called him back inside. Asked him, "Is this a male or female?" to which he complained about me trying to set him up. Well, I had three pictures,1 looked male and was, 1 looked female and was, 1 looked male and was female. Amazingly, he got all three wrong and was still convinced the MAN int he painting was a woman. So even though he said he did not believe it to be true, when I asked him about specific details, all of those he believed to be true.

LH delete end here.

So my question is: Are there any similarities between these two pieces of fiction besides the ability to have ppl consider true regardless of reality ?

Am I breaking Lashon Hara when I tried to demonstrate a similarity between the two, even though I am anonymous and no names were mentioned? I just wanted to share it because it was actually scary how the obvious truth was avoided each time.
I have to tell you, I found the Protocols to be a laugh riot.

[HadassahSukkot]

Henaynei has a really good post here (http://www.christianforums.com/showpost.php?p=32040670&postcount=5) that everyone should check out that speaks more to the history of the Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion.

Let's discuss this here.