What the?

[Alice the Sister]

I go to a First Baptist Church in TN and we are not very 'charismatic'.

I think the forum description should be changed. I don't know that many churches in our area that are charismatic. Not the Catholic ones or the non-denominational ones.

I go to all these with my friends and stuff.

The non-denom on is sort of, but not "TO THE EXTREME"...


Sub-topic: What makes a church charismatic?

[AlabamaMan]

But thats just it, we don't go by our own area, we have people here from all over the world and there are many people who are baptists, catholics, methodists, etc. who are charismatic.

Charismatics believe in the Gifts of the Spirit operating in the church. That's a short answer.

[Alice the Sister]

well duh, I wouldn't figure you'd be like, "UH OH TENNESSEE ISN'T CHARISMATIC LETS NOT INCLUDE ANY RELIGION IN TN BECAUSE>....."

I didn't think it'd be like that.

Why are black people more charismatic?

[AlabamaMan]

I think the forum description should be changed. I don't know that many churches in our area that are charismatic. Not the Catholic ones or the non-denominational ones.


This was why I posted my previous post, by this post you sounded like just because people in your area were not representative of the forum description that we should change it. Sorry if I misinterpreted it.

[Alice the Sister]

True, but I never said "changed to what" so it made the statement irrelevent.

[SUNSTONE]

I go to a First Baptist Church in TN and we are not very 'charismatic'.

I think the forum description should be changed. I don't know that many churches in our area that are charismatic. Not the Catholic ones or the non-denominational ones.

I go to all these with my friends and stuff.

The non-denom on is sort of, but not "TO THE EXTREME"...


Sub-topic: What makes a church charismatic?

What should it be changed to?

What is "to the extreme"?

[SUNSTONE]

well duh, I wouldn't figure you'd be like, "UH OH TENNESSEE ISN'T CHARISMATIC LETS NOT INCLUDE ANY RELIGION IN TN BECAUSE>....."

I didn't think it'd be like that.

Why are black people more charismatic?

Why do you ask?

[SpiritPsalmist]

I go to a First Baptist Church in TN and we are not very 'charismatic'.

I think the forum description should be changed. I don't know that many churches in our area that are charismatic. Not the Catholic ones or the non-denominational ones.

I go to all these with my friends and stuff.

The non-denom on is sort of, but not "TO THE EXTREME"...


Sub-topic: What makes a church charismatic?
What forum are you referring to? This forum labled "Charasmatics" or "Christian Forums"?

If it's the "charasmatic", well, there are plenty of other forums within Christian Forums where you may feel that you fit in better. This forum is specifically set up for those who are of "Charasmatic" persuasion and desire to discuss subject important to us without being harrassed by those who don't agree with our view.

If it's just the term Charasmatic. . .well. . .that merely includes ALL who believe the gifts of the Spirit are still actice today. I know many of non-charasmatic type denominations that believe this, including Baptists.

No one is excluded from fellowship in here. . . it is just not to include debating between those who do believe in the Charasmatic theology and those who do not.

[stratcar]

Just to maybe clear something up, and not to start a debate.....

There are many non-charasmatic denominations that believe the gifts of the Spirit are still not only in effect today, but are vitally important to the health of the body of Christ. The issue is not gifts in general, but what I refer to as the "sign gifts," which are basically tongues, healings, prophecies, and miracles. Those are the four that charasmatic and non-charasmatic Christians basically differ on.

Non of the four affect anyone's salvation, but depending on how you interpret them from scripture, it may affect you rate of growth or overall maturity level within the body of Christ.

Later bros

[Alice the Sister]

I dunno, I just wondered what you meant by it when I've never seen any real examples of it.

[SpiritPsalmist]

I dunno, I just wondered what you meant by it when I've never seen any real examples of it.

I'm sorry if I'm having a blonde moment here but "real examples of what?"http://www.anchoredbygrace.com/smileys/mmesmile.gif

[Grace_Alone4gives]

I believe in gifts of tongues and prophesy etc...however, DO NOT...I repeat, DO NOT, beleiev that ALL people need these gifts as a sign of baptism in the Holy Spirit. Yet, I post here...

[superdave]

You may not realize this- but the Charismatic Movement is huge- especially in third world countries where thousands are coming to Christ each day. I think that this forums title is apporiate- We are Charismatic... that's our belief. Charismatics are in every religion- Catholic, Baptist, Methodist, Penecostal, Non-Denominational...

[SpiritPsalmist]

I believe in gifts of tongues and prophesy etc...however, DO NOT...I repeat, DO NOT, beleiev that ALL people need these gifts as a sign of baptism in the Holy Spirit. Yet, I post here...

I don't believe people "need" these gifts as a sign either. I do believe they are "a" sign, however, the main sign is the "fruit" of the Holy Spirit.

Being that the tongue is the most difficult member of the body to train (see James 3:4-6) I believe it extremely important that the Holy Spirit get a hold on it as quickly as possible. Even though one who speaks in tongues can still ignore the promptings of the Holy Spirit, one who speaks in tongues frequently does not accomplish it (ignoring the HS) very easily. http://www.anchoredbygrace.com/smileys/1poke.gif

As in the smiley example, the yellow smiley being the HS keeps poking until we respond as He directs. I can't say that those who don't speak in tongues don't feel this poking like those who do, but in comparison with those I know who do and those I know who don't there seems to be a more positive response from those who do.

Those who do, on a frequent basis, not just from time to time tend to grow and mature in the faith in leaps and bounds and are more frequently the overcomer rather than the overcome.

That's my experience with it anyway.

[Alice the Sister]

Mr. SuperDave. You said some stuff about third world countries. Is the charismatic movement just because they're third world.

Do you have to be poor to be charismatic? No wonder why nobody's charismatic in my area.

[SUNSTONE]

I don't believe people "need" these gifts as a sign either. I do believe they are "a" sign, however, the main sign is the "fruit" of the Holy Spirit.

Being that the tongue is the most difficult member of the body to train (see James 3:4-6) I believe it extremely important that the Holy Spirit get a hold on it as quickly as possible. Even though one who speaks in tongues can still ignore the promptings of the Holy Spirit, one who speaks in tongues frequently does not accomplish it (ignoring the HS) very easily. http://www.anchoredbygrace.com/smileys/1poke.gif

As in the smiley example, the yellow smiley being the HS keeps poking until we respond as He directs. I can't say that those who don't speak in tongues don't feel this poking like those who do, but in comparison with those I know who do and those I know who don't there seems to be a more positive response from those who do.

Those who do, on a frequent basis, not just from time to time tend to grow and mature in the faith in leaps and bounds and are more frequently the overcomer rather than the overcome.

That's my experience with it anyway.

That picture is so cute! :hug:

I was laughing at it for several minutes! :D

[SUNSTONE]

Mr. SuperDave. You said some stuff about third world countries. Is the charismatic movement just because they're third world.

Do you have to be poor to be charismatic? No wonder why nobody's charismatic in my area.

The guy said third world countrys, where did he say anything about poor?

:scratch:

[BigToe]

no, you do not have to be poor to be charismatic. charismatic churches can be found in all denominations. some can be seen simply by people dancing and shouting and raising their hands in worship. some may be seen by members practicing different spiritual gifts. there are tons of different things you can see an example of. i go to a church of mostly college students (most of them are white middle to upper class) and it is pretty charismatic. i used to go to a southern baptist church that had several members who were very charismatic, some who weren't and people of every varrying degree in between.

as for the people speaking in tongues not ignoring the Holy Spirit as easily, and i know this is a tangent so i appologize ahead of time. you can pm me with a response if you would prefer to do so... i believe in the gifts you have mentioned. i do not have the gift of tounges. i know many who do and many who dont. just because they don't have the gift of tounges doesnt mean it is easier for them to ignore the Holy Spirit. there are many other gifts someone might have. and i think its kinda harsh to say if you lack certain gifts it is harder to respond to the Holy Spirit... don't you? perhaps i misunderstood your point. in which case, i would love to understand what you meant and would appreciate you clarifying it. either briefly here or in pm would be great. thanks.

[SpiritPsalmist]

Questions about the Charasmatic beliefs are welcome and debate is acceptable among those who are of Charasmatic persuasion. However, if you're wanting to criticize the Charasmatics for their beliefs, this is not the forum to do it in :)

[SpiritPsalmist]

no, you do not have to be poor to be charismatic. charismatic churches can be found in all denominations. some can be seen simply by people dancing and shouting and raising their hands in worship. some may be seen by members practicing different spiritual gifts. there are tons of different things you can see an example of. i go to a church of mostly college students (most of them are white middle to upper class) and it is pretty charismatic. i used to go to a southern baptist church that had several members who were very charismatic, some who weren't and people of every varrying degree in between.

as for the people speaking in tongues not ignoring the Holy Spirit as easily, and i know this is a tangent so i appologize ahead of time. you can pm me with a response if you would prefer to do so... i believe in the gifts you have mentioned. i do not have the gift of tounges. i know many who do and many who dont. just because they don't have the gift of tounges doesnt mean it is easier for them to ignore the Holy Spirit. there are many other gifts someone might have. and i think its kinda harsh to say if you lack certain gifts it is harder to respond to the Holy Spirit... don't you? perhaps i misunderstood your point. in which case, i would love to understand what you meant and would appreciate you clarifying it. either briefly here or in pm would be great. thanks.

As in the smiley example, the yellow smiley being the HS keeps poking until we respond as He directs. I can't say that those who don't speak in tongues don't feel this poking like those who do, but in comparison with those I know who do and those I know who don't there seems to be a more positive response from those who do.

Please refer to this part of my statement again. I did not say it was easy for anyone to ignore the HS. Just in my experience of what I have seen in others there has been a greater positive response from those who do. . .on a frequent basis do, not just whenever the Holy Spirit comes upon them and they feel like it. There is a difference.

There is genarally less struggle with depression over issues the HS reveals. The spirit reveals the person repents and goes on with living for the Lord. With those who are not baptised and speaking in tongues in the HS I've seen more falling back and more depression over past sins. There are less illnesses. Less stress. Less of everything that is distructive. These are just my 40 plus years of observation. And we still cannot ignore that we are told that praying in this prayer language builds us up spiritually.

I don't believe people who don't speak in tongues are any less saved than those who do. Those who do are just taking full advantage of what God has given to them.

I believe and scripture very much supports that a prayer language is for every believer. It says this is for the building up of one's faith. Since God says He is not a respector of persons, it makes no sense that He would give one person something to build them up in their faith but withhold it from another.

The gift of tongues and interpretation are a different issue. Not everyone has that gift.

[Grace_Alone4gives]

as for the people speaking in tongues not ignoring the Holy Spirit as easily, and i know this is a tangent so i appologize ahead of time. you can pm me with a response if you would prefer to do so... i believe in the gifts you have mentioned. i do not have the gift of tounges. i know many who do and many who dont. just because they don't have the gift of tounges doesnt mean it is easier for them to ignore the Holy Spirit. there are many other gifts someone might have. and i think its kinda harsh to say if you lack certain gifts it is harder to respond to the Holy Spirit... don't you? perhaps i misunderstood your point. in which case, i would love to understand what you meant and would appreciate you clarifying it. either briefly here or in pm would be great. thanks.

amen to that.

My experience is that 'God' is the reason we draw close to Him...nothing we do or do not do. I have met several people who speak in tongues that are very lead by the Spirit. And on the other hand - I have met a larger amount of people that speak in tongues during worship services etc... yet return to their wordly ways after...and struggle with depression. My experience is that tongues is powerful and prayerful...but not a medicine for healing etc...that only comes from God and God alone. Without tongues or with tongues...doesn't matter - what matters is your relationship with God.....and he understands every language.

[SUNSTONE]

If healing was done by God and God alone, then why is it, that Jesus in some places couldn't do many miracles?

Also when people asked Him for healings and miracles, He would say "let it be done according to your faith."

[Grace_Alone4gives]

healings are ALWAYS done by God alone...although sometimes He uses his sheep. It is never US that heals.

If I prayed for you and you were Healed......would you give me the glory, or God? I wouldn't even deserve a thankyou - but God would deserve the praise.

[SUNSTONE]

healings are ALWAYS done by God alone...although sometimes He uses his sheep. It is never US that heals.

If I prayed for you and you were Healed......would you give me the glory, or God? I wouldn't even deserve a thankyou - but God would deserve the praise.

I am not talking about credit, because with God all things are possible. So without Him, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

I believe that God always works through man. That the Holy Spirit lives inside the believer, and thus we have the gifts of the Spirit.

I firmly believe that we are not waiting on God, but that God is waiting on us. The He has already provided everything to defeat sin, to defeat diseases, and problems in our lives.

The bible says, we have not because we ask not. And if God was the one doing everything, then why should we ask?Why should we do anything? Because of sewing and reaping laws. Jesus showed us the way, but it is our unbelief that henders us wayyyyyy to often!

You have the Holy One living on the inside of you. What are you going to do? Live a life of defeat thinking it is God will, or step up like Jesus did, and get things done! Change your life! Change the lives of others around you!
:clap:

[SpiritPsalmist]

amen to that.

My experience is that 'God' is the reason we draw close to Him...nothing we do or do not do.

Of course the only reason we can draw close to Him is due to His Love, Mercy, and Grace. But James 4:8 says, (NKJV) Draw near to God and He will draw near to you."

This verse is telling us to be the instigater. And of course there is nothing outside of Him that is good in me. So I must depend totally on Him. . .I must even depend on Him to show me how to pursue Him. But if I am not interested in drawing near to Him, He will not force Himself upon me. I must show interest. . .and that's just the beginning of a wonderful and intimate relationship with our God.

I have met several people who speak in tongues that are very lead by the Spirit. And on the other hand - I have met a larger amount of people that speak in tongues during worship services etc... yet return to their wordly ways after...and struggle with depression.

I have met these people too. However, I'd like to point out that speaking in tongues only occasionally or even just once a week at a worship service accomplishes about the same thing as medicine taken only occasionally when it's been perscribed for daily use.

Done only occasionaly, most definately does achieve the poor results you have observed. It makes for a sickly and weak Christian who falls apart every time the enemy attacks, routinely falls back into their old lifestyle, has no strength to overcome the enemy, and as the Bible puts it, is a spring spewing forth putrid water that is not spiritually nourishing to anyone. And then they can't understand "why God never does anything for them".

My experience is that tongues is powerful and prayerful...but not a medicine for healing etc...that only comes from God and God alone.

According to Rom 8:26 says, "Likewise the Spirit also helps in our weaknesses. For we do not know what we should pray for as we ought, but the Spirit Himself makes intercession for us." Sounds like medicine to me. And it's coming from God. . . It certaintly ain't coming from me.

Without tongues or with tongues...doesn't matter - what matters is your relationship with God.....and he understands every language.

You are correct. The most important part is our relationship with God. And part of that relationship involves receiving every gift He offers for our benefit. (NKJV)1 Cor 14:4 "He who speaks in a tongue edifies himself". (Amplified) "He who speaks in a [strange] tongue edifies and improves himself."

I don't know about you Hope, but I need a lot of improving. And if God's Word says I will spiritually improve by speaking in tongues, then I'm going to do it and I'm going to incourage others in doing it. I need all the help I can get.

http://www.anchoredbygrace.com/smileys/sheildsmile.gif

[SpiritPsalmist]

healings are ALWAYS done by God alone...although sometimes He uses his sheep. It is never US that heals.

If I prayed for you and you were Healed......would you give me the glory, or God? I wouldn't even deserve a thankyou - but God would deserve the praise.

James 5:14, 15 says, "Is anyone among you sick? Let him call for the elders of the church, and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord. AND the prayr of faith WILL save the sick, and the LORD WILL raise him up."

Of course only God does the healing but we are still told to do something and it is according to our faith (the prayer of faith) they will be healed.

I would thank God for healing me and thank you for your obedience in doing what His Word says to do. When we don't obey. . .others may go without because of it.