Pseudo Ephraem (c. 374-627)

[Gideon4God]

"All the saints and elect of God are gathered together before the tribulation, which is to come, and are taken to the Lord, in order that they may not see at any time the confusion which overwhelms the world because of our sins."

-Pseudo-Ephraem (c. 374-627)

Has anyone ever seen this quote before? Is it legit? If it is this could be a very early pre trib view. target=_blank>http://www.according2prophecy.org/ancient.html (http://www.according2prophecy.org/ancient.html)

[CopticOrthodox]

There are a couple other eary figures that believed either in the Rapture or the Millenial reign. Augustine believed in the millenial reign, but later repented when corrected. I think it was the same for Justin Martyr. I think the earliest Rapture was in the 400's or so, from a monkpriest near Constantinople. He was condemned for his heresy and stood alone. It's one possible way of reading the Bible, so it's not surprising that it surfaced early. The thing is though in each case it was the result of people trying to firgure stuff out for themselves, not being taught the faith passed down. More importantly, once the faith was set down & accessable, there was no more rising of these ideas. It's not a matter of a continuing tradition, a group believing in the pre-trib rapture down through the ages, it's a matter of a movement based on a "vision" starting in the early 1900's or so, and then when challenged searching through history to try to find someone they could claim a "connection" to. So if it's true, God let the true faith die out for centuries, and then brought it back through much, much later. To me that would mean that He broke His promise to always be with His Church. The Orthodox faith on the other hand has continuity from the earliest times to now. It's not just that it's old and the other is new, it's that it's continuous and the other is an idea that's spiratically popular.

[Gideon4God]

Thx, Copty.

[isshinwhat]

http://www.geocities.com/~lasttrumpet/ephraem1.html

Here is a good site which examines in detail the entire work in question. What at first appears to be an early example of Pre-Trib eschatology, is not after closer examination. It's a pretty good article, I think.

God Bless,

Neal

[Maximus]

The responses from Coptic Orthodox and isshinwhat were great. I would like to add a couple of things.

First, it is well to note that pseudo means "false." The supposed Pre-Trib rapture quote comes from "Pseudo-Ephrem" not the actual St. Ephrem. Besides, as isshinwhat pointed out, upon closer examination that quote does not refer to the Pre-Trib Rapture at all.

Second, belief in a literal, 1000-year millenium is called Chiliasm. It was rejected by the Church at the Council of Constantinople in A.D. 381, the same council that added the section on the Holy Spirit to the Nicene-Constantinopolitan Creed (aka the Nicene Creed). A later council, I believe it was Ephesus in 431, declared that Chiliasm is "superstition."

Thus any kind of literal millenialism is not an option for Orthodox Christians.

Although a couple of the early Fathers believed in a literal millenium, they most definitely did NOT believe in all the convoluted schemes of the modern Dispensationalist prophecy hawkers or in a Pre-Trib Rapture. Another thing they did not believe in was a dichotomy between Israel and the Church. The Fathers all believed that the Church is the New Covenant Israel.

[Reader Nilus]

"All the saints and elect of God are gathered together before the tribulation, which is to come, and are taken to the Lord, in order that they may not see at any time the confusion which overwhelms the world because of our sins."

-Pseudo-Ephraem (c. 374-627)

Has anyone ever seen this quote before? Is it legit? If it is this could be a very early pre trib view. target=_blank>http://www.according2prophecy.org/ancient.html (http://www.according2prophecy.org/ancient.html)

Yes I have seen it, and from talking with a couple of folks on a Syriac Board, it is spurious, and should not even have The blessed Saints name attached. S. Brock says nothing about this work at all that I can find.
Jeff the Finn

[Maximus]

Yes I have seen it, and from talking with a couple of folks on a Syriac Board, it is spurious, and should not even have The blessed Saints name attached. S. Brock says nothing about this work at all that I can find.
Jeff the Finn

Well said, Jeff.

That's why they call the author of that quote Pseudo-Ephrem!

If I recall correctly, the whole thing was dredged up by Grant Jeffrey, a well-known Dispensationalist who likes to claim the early Church was filled with Premillenialists.

[Reader Nilus]

Except that the Darbyites forget the Pseudo and claim it was St Ephram, I remember when I first came across that and thought I had nothing to say, and I quickly got over to the Syriac board on Yahoo to ask the brethren there what they knew. They will not listen to the genuine voice of Tradition but will latch on to every questionable writing to discredit the Church.
Jeff the Finn

[Gideon4God]

Copticy said it best.