So lonely...

[repentant]

There has been something on my mind bothering me lately. Well for a while. Anyway it is about finding that someone. I was with someone for a few years, and we broke up a year ago. She was Catholic, which in the beginning was fine, but when time came around to talk about marriage, that is where the issue came in. You know what Church to get married in, Baptize kids in, etc. Obviously I would not budge from Orthodoxy, and she wouldn't budge from Catholicism. So we broke up on a friendly basis, and still keep in contact from time to time.

Now it has been a year, and obviously I want to meet the "one" whom I want to marry. I don't want to go to the usual places, likes bars and clubs obviously, and Church doesn't have much of a selection, lol. Either they are too young, or the ones of age are already taken. Not a big conregation on Sundays. I have met some at work, but although I am attracted to them, they are not someone who I would want to spend the rest of my life with, so usually after one date, I just cut it off. And the ones who come to me, are also ones that I could see no future with. Lately I have been in a semi depressed mood, being 27 now with no potentials so to speak.

So the question I ask, is what do I do? Where can an Orthodox person meet other Orthodox people besides Church? Not to mention the fact that it would be a little ackword tryin to pick someone up in Church, lol. what can I do? Do I just try with someone who is not Orthodox and see if maybe the open up to it? I just don't want to waste time again like the last one. Not to mention the fact the most of the women I have met lately are agnostic or atheist, like the last one. She came up to me out of the blue at work one day, we talked, exchanged numbers, went out that weekend, and I was like no..

Can anyone help? Where is there to meet someone?

I don't know, I thought maybe writing this would help..

[JasonV]

I would run, not walk, to my ex-girlfriend and learn to compromise on the religion issue. Even Paul had great things to say about the unbelieving spouse...

[repentant]

I would run, not walk, to my ex-girlfriend and learn to compromise on the religion issue. Even Paul had great things to say about the unbelieving spouse...


I have thought of talking it over, but it's too late now. Also I will not compromise when it comes to this. I will be married in an EO Church (if I ever get married) and my kids will be Baptized in the EOC.

It's not really the fact that she is Catholic, it's just that she is the same way with her Church. Funny thing is, she is not really religious, nor is her family. But on this issue she is steady. The only Church she ever went to as long as I knew her, was with me, or else she never would have went..

[MariaRegina]

Plan to attend a pan-Orthodox retreat like the one which the Antiochians put on at the Village or in Santa Barbara. This year they had the Evangelical Conference in Colorado Springs. I have been to two of them and they are a wonderful way to meet new people, and well worth the cost.

The talks are very spiritual.

[repentant]

Plan to attend a pan-Orthodox retreat like the one which the Antiochians put on at the Village or in Santa Barbara. This year they had the Evangelical Conference in Colorado Springs. I have been to two of them and they are a wonderful way to meet new people, and well worth the cost.

The talks are very spiritual.

yea but then you get into the long distance thing, I don't know.

I think I just neeed to vent...

I wish it was as easy as what happened with my friend..

[Akathist]

I have thought of talking it over, but it's too late now. Also I will not compromise when it comes to this. I will be married in an EO Church (if I ever get married) and my kids will be Baptized in the EOC.

It's not really the fact that she is Catholic, it's just that she is the same way with her Church. Funny thing is, she is not really religious, nor is her family. But on this issue she is steady. The only Church she ever went to as long as I knew her, was with me, or else she never would have went..

I do understand about the fact that you could not compromise on these issues.:thumbsup:

Is there some "grandma types" at your parish that could help set you up?

Also, consider visiting other parishes near you to widen your group of friends. You might go and visit local seminaries. I have heard jokes about how there are a lot of single women who work and live near seminaries. :cool:

There are some single internet forums that allow you to specify that you only want to meet Orthodox singles.

[rusmeister]

Come to Moscow for 3 months as a student or on business. I'll hook you up with some great people (friends/acquaintances of the Schmemann/Solzhenitsyns) in the church behind the McDonald's across from the Central Telegraph (Fr Vladimir Lapshin). Shouldn't take too long! ;)

Oh, and I strongly disagree with the comment on compromising on the religion issue (if you're serious about your faith). On a serious note, I feel your pain - went through it for years, myself, but there's a limit to what you can make happen yourself. The other part of the equation is who God leads you to. Still, I was married less than 4 months after arrival here (I had met the girl a year prior in the States) and our 15th anniversary is coming up - going to a hotel in Suzdal'!

[Matrona]

Come to Moscow for 3 months as a student or on business. I'll hook you up with some great people (friends/acquaintances of the Schmemann/Solzhenitsyns) in the church behind the McDonald's across from the Central Telegraph (Fr Vladimir Lapshin). Shouldn't take too long! ;)

Are there boys in Russia? :P :D

[Akathist]

Except immigration is really really hard.

A fiancee visa from Russia would take about one or two years.

It takes 2 to 3 years for a married spouse of an American to get a K visa.

Now, these are just estimates. There are times when it takes less time. Our fianancee VISA from Serbia took over two years but was delayed because the embassy in Belgrade was closed and when the papers arrived at Macedonia, that very day, that country went into civil war. (Should have seen the signs... I know!)

Just be aware that it is not an easy process, nor is it cheap.

[repentant]

I love to come to Russia, don't know how possible that is though, lol. How about mail order? Lol..

As far as grandma types, there is. But what do I say? And I have been thinking about oing to a different parish, but I don't like to go form place to place you know..

[Akathist]

I love to come to Russia, don't know how possible that is though, lol. How about mail order? Lol..

As far as grandma types, there is. But what do I say? And I have been thinking about oing to a different parish, but I don't like to go form place to place you know..

Before I was ready to even think about dating ever again, I was visiting a local parish about an hour from my parish. We went there during the Presanctified services and I was invited to come back again. I went again and started to talk with a man very very close to my age. Some one let me know he was single but of course, I was not ready to pursue this.

I am starting to get ready now. It is hard to meet single men in their 40's though. You are younger and have a greater chance.

Anyway, I only visit that other church about four times a year, but it is enough to start to get to know people there.

[repentant]

Stinks cause there used to be this Serbian Orthodox girl who lived in my complex, but she moved. Didn't know she was SO until she was gone...

[rusmeister]

Except immigration is really really hard.


You bet it is!!!

.......

:doh:
Oh, wait, you're talking about immigrating to America... :P


I love to come to Russia, don't know how possible that is though

It's as possible as you want it to be. You have to WANT it, tho'. (I find a lot of people want things the way they want to win the lottery- it's great, as long as it falls in their laps...) Not that God is necessarily leading you to Russia, but if you're looking for an Orthochick, and especially if you "rap the roosky", you'd be in like Flynn here with just a little patience.
Trick is, you have to have another real purpose besides looking for a mate, imho...

[repentant]

You bet it is!!!

.......

:doh:
Oh, wait, you're talking about immigrating to America... :P


It's as possible as you want it to be. You have to WANT it, tho'. (I find a lot of people want things the way they want to win the lottery- it's great, as long as it falls in their laps...) Not that God is necessarily leading you to Russia, but if you're looking for an Orthochick, and especially if you "rap the roosky", you'd be in like Flynn here with just a little patience.
Trick is, you have to have another real purpose besides looking for a mate, imho...


Well I have work, would need some cash to stay a while, and wouldn't have another purpose besides seeing Russia, lol. A place I have been wanting to go actually.

[kamikat]

Have you tried things like match.com? My MIL has had great luck in meeting men. BTW, XR, if you think finding single men in their 40's, try meeting single men in their 60's and 70's:D She says the questionaire is VERY detailed and she has met 3 men, all local and all very nice. The site below seems to be the only Christian dating site, when googling, the rest are for Orthodox Jews.
http://www.orthodoxchristiandating.com/
Don't feel bad about using an on-line service. I know several people who have. Most people have trouble meeting people once they are finished with school. You're in contact with a limited number of people each day and if you have specific requirments, as you do with religion, that makes it even more difficult. Since faith is so important, try to relax the other standards a bit, maybe she doesn't have to be a knockout, maybe extend your age range a bit, ect. As someone who is married to an atheist, I applaud your stance on your faith. Being married to a unbeliever is hard.

kamikat

[Asinner]

Repentant,

If being married is what God knows is best for you, then I am certain He already has the perfect woman picked out for you! If I were you, although it is difficult I'm certain, be patient and continue to pray about it. Seek ye the Kingdom of God first, and then all other things shall be added. God loves you and knows what you need, even before you ask . . . He is faithful.

God Bless :)

[Petronius]

Are there boys in Russia? :P :D

They are in the army...

[Michael the Iconographer]

I would run, not walk, to my ex-girlfriend and learn to compromise on the religion issue. Even Paul had great things to say about the unbelieving spouse...
Faith is not an issue that can be compromised on.

[Matrona]

They are in the army...
So.... I should start looking in Chechnya?? :D

[Momzilla]

Repentant,

I would also suggest online dating sites. For now, don't worry too much about the long-distance relationship things. One of the surest ways to cut yourself off from possibilities is to put a bunch of rules in place before you even start dating someone. (indeed, unless it's *really* obvious that someone is not for you, you might try two or three dates before you give up one someone. Just sayin', is all.)

If I were looking for a mate, I would mention it privately to my priest, and let him to the talking to the grandmotherly types. It can be easier that way.

I wish you the best of luck in your search.

[InnerPhyre]

Bro lemme tell you.....for a long time I'd go to my favorite pub on the weekends and I was never looking for women there. Never. It never occured to me that God would send me someone in a bar. Well when I wasn't looking was the time when I found my beloved, there in that pub. We became friends for probably 5 months and eventually started dating. She's now a catechumen in the Church and will be Chrismated this winter, God willing. I'm not saying go on pub crawls or anything :) I'm just saying that you shouldn't necessarily rule out places because you think you wouldn't find a Godly woman there.

[InnerPhyre]

Oh also, there are a couple of cute single professional girls in my church who would like to find an Orthodox man....but that would mean hopping from the big Cathedral over to my little OCA church for a visit ;)


Seriously though, my dating life wasn't taking me anywhere for a long while, so I totally stopped looking for a woman and it was then that God sent me the most wonderful woman I could have ever hoped for. Sometimes letting go of the steering wheel is what gets us to our destination.

[Xpycoctomos]

I would be open to anyone who's a Christian. if things start to get serious, then you can start to talk about how important it is that your kids are raised int eh Orthdoox Church. But you don't want to say this right away.. you might wierd the girl out implying marriage in kids after only one date! lol

My belief is taht generally speaking one will warm up to orthodoxy until they are eventually completely sold.

Also, you said "I don't want to waste my time again". Do you honestly think you wasted your time with the otherr girl? I can't imagine you both didn't learn a thing or two about your own selves, how to comproimise, how to love, how to give unselfishly and things that you DID do but that you would never do again. Hardly a waste of time. All part of the plan my friend. Let God's plan happen. We date in order to find that person... but that doesn't mean that anyone who was not that ONE person was a waste of time. I know it's cliche, but that "broken road" country song is true.

Good luck *(by the way, I do understand your frustration... I REALLY do. Yeah, I'm married now, but there were days not too long ago when I couldn't imagine how God was ever going to find someone for me... especially being orthodox! My gf (now my wife) wasn't even Orthodox at the time... and thought it was wierd. She's Orthodox now :)),

John

[Mary of Bethany]

My son was in the same state at about the same age as you, Repentant. He is a very strong (non-Orthodox) Christian who despaired of ever finding a girl who shared his strong faith. He had plenty of girl "friends" but they weren't romantically interested, and wouldn't even really give him a chance.

But then one of those friends and he were literally thrown together in an auto accident, and through the process of visiting each other in the hospital and convalescence, realized they loved each other. They just celebrated their first wedding anniversary last month.

I'm not recommending an auto accident as the preferred way to meet your future wife, :D but things do have a way of changing quickly sometimes. Prayer and patience. :crosseo:


mary

[JasonV]

I did not mean to offend some of you here about my compromise comment. In my view, I don't need other's to believe as I do. So I could marry a Muslim and it wouldn't matter. Life is short. Love is precious. And in my view, it is not possible to prove that one's theology is "true" in a scientific manner.

And if emotion were a sufficient sign, then, as William James said: "What immediately feels most 'good' is not always most 'true,' when measured by the verdict of the rest of experience. . . . If merely 'feeling good' could decide, drunkenness would be the supremely valid human experience." (Varieties of Religous Experience, 26.)

Peace.

[kamikat]

So I could marry a Muslim and it wouldn't matter. Life is short. Love is precious. And in my view, it is not possible to prove that one's theology is "true" in a scientific manner.
Peace.

It's not a matter of proving one's theology. Could you marry a Muslim if she insisted on a Muslim ceramony? If she insisted that any future children you two have be raised Muslim? It's that when religion is a big part of someone's life, it can cause conflict if your partner doesn't share it.

[Tsarina]

There has been something on my mind bothering me lately. Well for a while. Anyway it is about finding that someone. I was with someone for a few years, and we broke up a year ago. She was Catholic, which in the beginning was fine, but when time came around to talk about marriage, that is where the issue came in. You know what Church to get married in, Baptize kids in, etc. Obviously I would not budge from Orthodoxy, and she wouldn't budge from Catholicism. So we broke up on a friendly basis, and still keep in contact from time to time.

Now it has been a year, and obviously I want to meet the "one" whom I want to marry. I don't want to go to the usual places, likes bars and clubs obviously, and Church doesn't have much of a selection, lol. Either they are too young, or the ones of age are already taken. Not a big conregation on Sundays. I have met some at work, but although I am attracted to them, they are not someone who I would want to spend the rest of my life with, so usually after one date, I just cut it off. And the ones who come to me, are also ones that I could see no future with. Lately I have been in a semi depressed mood, being 27 now with no potentials so to speak.

So the question I ask, is what do I do? Where can an Orthodox person meet other Orthodox people besides Church? Not to mention the fact that it would be a little ackword tryin to pick someone up in Church, lol. what can I do? Do I just try with someone who is not Orthodox and see if maybe the open up to it? I just don't want to waste time again like the last one. Not to mention the fact the most of the women I have met lately are agnostic or atheist, like the last one. She came up to me out of the blue at work one day, we talked, exchanged numbers, went out that weekend, and I was like no..

Can anyone help? Where is there to meet someone?

I don't know, I thought maybe writing this would help..

Mabe this will help?

http://www.asna.ca/articles/200609-04.html

[ThePilgrim]

Are there boys in Russia? :P :D

There are boys here.

:-p

*feels repentant's pain*

[Matrona]

There are boys here.

:-p

*feels repentant's pain*

Well come on over and sit a spell! ;) :blush:

[Lotar]

I think I've made a similair thread before. I didn't find my fiancee until after I gave up and stopped looking.

My advice would be to just get out there and make as many Orthodox friends as you can. Visit other parishes, go to Youth events, ect. Just meet people and you'll be supprised who you might find.

My fiancee used to organize OCF events and orchestrated me getting elected Treasurer just so she could hang out with me. :D Now we're getting married in less than 3 weeks.

[JasonV]

It's not a matter of proving one's theology. Could you marry a Muslim if she insisted on a Muslim ceramony?

Yes, I could.

If she insisted that any future children you two have be raised Muslim?

Of course. Mainstream Muslims are just as good of people as Mainstream Christians.

It's that when religion is a big part of someone's life, it can cause conflict if your partner doesn't share it.

Generally, true. But for me personally, no. I knew an Antiochian Orthodox girl who had a Muslim boyfriend. When they finally were serious enough to discuss marriage, neither would budge on the religion issue. They broke up, and she was seriously depressed. I don't know what ever happened to that woman, but it was a wake-up call for me as to why taking theology too seriously can be mentally destructive.

I use her example as to why I will not forbid my own wife and children from marrying someone they love, no matter the faith.

[eoe]

So I could marry a Muslim and it wouldn't matter.
And your children would be...?

Anyhoo...

My advice is to stop looking. Pray that God's will be done and go on with your life.

[Xpycoctomos]

I did not mean to offend some of you here about my compromise comment. In my view, I don't need other's to believe as I do. So I could marry a Muslim and it wouldn't matter. Life is short. Love is precious. And in my view, it is not possible to prove that one's theology is "true" in a scientific manner.

And if emotion were a sufficient sign, then, as William James said: "What immediately feels most 'good' is not always most 'true,' when measured by the verdict of the rest of experience. . . . If merely 'feeling good' could decide, drunkenness would be the supremely valid human experience." (Varieties of Religous Experience, 26.)

Peace.

But jason, your quote is exactly why Repentant didn't move on with the relationship. I am sure it would have felt good to shove aside deep convictions and rationalize it saying "well, they believe in the Trinity too, so who cares?" and continue with the relationship. But he had to shove aside his emotions and go wtih what is good and true. From his POV, that is the Orthdoox Church... a church which says if you care about Truth then you will work to instill it in your children and ONE of the most important ways to start doing that is by baptizing them. That's Orthodoxy (which may be where part of the disconnect is becuase you aren't orthodox and therefore do not subscribe to the mindset of a visible Church... but that's a different thread). It would be dishonest for Repentant to do otherwise. Especially agreeing to marry someone and raising your children in a religion that speaks ill of the Faith. But even without that... that's Repentance's conviction. And to go ahead and raise his kids Catholic for the sake of loving and feeling loved and not for Truth would be going against the very virtue exmplified in the quote above.

I have to say, your post is odd here becuase you make a point based on assumptions that, as Orthodox, we obviously don't and cannot assume. It's as if I went into your forum and said "Well, obviously the Church is a visible institution which has always existed and that institution has said "anathema" to anyone who denies real presence, therefore obviously that is not somethign that can ever be left up to someone's individual conscience" SUch would be ridiculous becuase I imposed assumptions that are foreign to Anglican doctrine to prove a point and my post would end up useless at best and add to confusion and even arguing at worst.

John

[Lotar]

It has nothing to do with being good people or not, it is having the central focus of our lives in common with each other.

An Orthodox Christian cannot marry a Muslim anyways. She would have been automatically excommunicated for that.

The idea of marrying someone with a different religion is utter nonsense to me. I couldn't even imagine marrying a Catholic or NC.

[Xpycoctomos]

Of course. Mainstream Muslims are just as good of people as Mainstream Christians.

This is a false premise. This is simply not the question. No one is saying that Muslim's are all bad people. No one is saying that all Christians (or Orthodox) are good people. No one here is saying "make sure she's orthodox, and from there, who cares". I don't remember Repentance saying "I couldn't marry her because, obviously, being a Catholic and all, she wasn't a good person, I was afraid that raising my child Catholic would turn them into bad people." It's the idea that if we as parents feel we have found the truth, then we have an obligation to raise them in that truth. To do otherwise would be dispicable. You, from your words, are not sure that you ahve found the truth, or you do not feel that truth is objective. Fine. That's not Orthodox. Is that Anglican? (I suppose that's a thread for Anglicanism). If so, you are at the best place and bringing your child to Church or the Mosque is really quite beside the case. But can you see how what your saying has absolutely no connection to Orthodoxy. I mean, you may as well start a thread on why, fundamentally, Orthodoxy is non-sense. Not that that's what you are concsiously trying to say... but you would be just as much at odds with TAW as you are now (except you would also offend people unnecessarily).

Just some observations,

John

[drpepper101]

...

[Xpycoctomos]

It has nothing to do with being good people or not, it is having the central focus of our lives in common with each other.

An Orthodox Christian cannot marry a Muslim anyways. She would have been automatically excommunicated for that.

The idea of marrying someone with a different religion is utter nonsense to me. I couldn't even imagine marrying a Catholic or NC.
I think everyone has there own tolerance level, andfortuantely we have the church to guide us in these decisions. Mixed marriages are allowed, but to be sure, they are allowed as dispensations. I, for one, could have easily married my current wife were she to remain a Catholic (she had agreed that the kids could be raised Orthodox which is not for grabs). However, while I would support any man or woman that wanted to marry a protestant (honestly, they would eventually convert if the EO spouse was serious enough and their marriage was good... I mean she was already willing to allow the kids to be raised Orthodox.. that says something), but I don't think I could have brought myself to do it. Perhaps that's because that's a stage of my life I left behind, and there would be so much that wouldn't be able to share with my wife (at least at the beginning) and I would constantly feel that I were pushing her into the OC which wouldn't be cool, so there would kust be too much of a disconnect. With Catholics, although I get more into it on the net, I am in real life always ELATED and OVER-JOYED to meet a serious Catholic and we have so much to talk about and share rather than disagree on. On paper the filioque and the Pope matter a great deal... but honestly, it's overshadowed by how much we have to share. So, it wouldn't bother me that my wife believed in the Primacy of peter and in the odd wording of the Filioque... agree to disagree, talk about all the stuff we have in common and raise the kids Orthodox :) But, if the OC strictly prohibited marying a person outside of the OC (which is did at one time in the very early Church) then I would obey that.

PURELY my POV, (and not to force it on anyone)

John

[eoe]

I don't know what ever happened to that woman, but it was a wake-up call for me as to why taking theology too seriously can be mentally destructive.

Rephrase "Don't take your religion so seriously that it hampers your ability to do what you want."

I think the Anglicans could do with a little less compromise myself.

[kamikat]

So, it wouldn't bother me that my wife believed in the Primacy of peter and in the odd wording of the Filioque... agree to disagree, talk about all the stuff we have in common and raise the kids Orthodox

The problem, John, is if you had met a serious Catholic girl, she would have not permited you to raise the children Orthodox. This is where the religious conflict come in. For Catholics, it is a mortal sin to get married by anyone but a Catholic priest. Then, while OBOBers have told me that this isn't true today, my dad had to agree, in writing, to raise their children Catholic. The same agreement was put forth to my own husband when we looked into getting our civil marriage convalidated. He refused to sign the agreement.

[kamikat]

Please remember that this is an Orthodox subforum of CF. Non-Orthodox members may not debate Orthodox beliefs in this section of CF.

[drpepper101]

...

[drpepper101]

...

[ThePilgrim]

Well come on over and sit a spell! ;) :blush:

*Scoots a little closer* What's a nice girl like you doing in a place like this?

[ThePilgrim]

Of course. Mainstream Muslims are just as good of people as Mainstream Christians.

What does that have to do with anything? Is religion only about morality for you?

Fr. Schmemann once said, "People are always making the mistake of thinking that Christianity is about making bad peopel good. It isn't. It's about making dead people alive."

I use her example as to why I will not forbid my own wife and children from marrying someone they love, no matter the faith.

Does Christ mean anything to you? Do you believe that you should love Him above all else?

I'm glad that you won't forbid your wife from marrying someone that she loves, no matter the faith *scratches head* ;-)

Grace and peace,
John

[JasonV]

But jason, your quote is exactly why Repentant didn't move on with the relationship. I am sure it would have felt good to shove aside deep convictions and rationalize it saying "well, they believe in the Trinity too, so who cares?" and continue with the relationship. But he had to shove aside his emotions and go wtih what is good and true.

I guess the quote could work both ways John.

From his POV, that is the Orthdoox Church... a church which says if you care about Truth then you will work to instill it in your children and ONE of the most important ways to start doing that is by baptizing them. That's Orthodoxy (which may be where part of the disconnect is becuase you aren't orthodox and therefore do not subscribe to the mindset of a visible Church... but that's a different thread).

I was baptised Antiochian not two years ago John. But I left because of various issues I have with the very idea of "orthodoxy".

It would be dishonest for Repentant to do otherwise.

So long as he subsribes to this idea of "right vs wrong" then I would have to agree. Im going to try and tread lightly here seeing that Im a guest of TAW, and I no longer identify myself as Orthodox.

Especially agreeing to marry someone and raising your children in a religion that speaks ill of the Faith. But even without that... that's Repentance's conviction. And to go ahead and raise his kids Catholic for the sake of loving and feeling loved and not for Truth would be going against the very virtue exmplified in the quote above.

Granted, but shold Repentance decide one day that Eastern Orthodoxy is not the "TRUTH" per se, then he may very well regret this decision for the rest of his life. I'd hate to see that.

I have to say, your post is odd here becuase you make a point based on assumptions that, as Orthodox, we obviously don't and cannot assume.

I know. But Im doing it in a way that I don't believe violates the forum rules for guests. If Im wrong, I hope a mod will contact me asap and let me know. Again, my apologies to anyone who feels like Im over-stepping my bounds here.

An Orthodox Christian cannot marry a Muslim anyways. She would have been automatically excommunicated for that.

Very sad Lotar. I personally cannot accept that type of theology. I don't see anything divine about it.

The idea of marrying someone with a different religion is utter nonsense to me. I couldn't even imagine marrying a Catholic or NC.

Well, I don't believe in "truth" as many do. I think that Truth is relative. So for me, it's not "nonsense".

You, from your words, are not sure that you ahve found the truth, or you do not feel that truth is objective. Fine. That's not Orthodox. Is that Anglican? (I suppose that's a thread for Anglicanism).

I've answered this already. And no, it's not Anglican either. It's me. Im very happy with it, and I'll take it up with God when I die.

But can you see how what your saying has absolutely no connection to Orthodoxy.

No, I was trying to make a human connection with Repentance, not a theological one. One guy to another. Call it romance, call it a fairy-tale, but I think it's terrible to allow petty differences like our theological beliefs to get in the way.

Human language is horribly insufficient when describing God. To even attempt to do so, in my view, is folly in the extremene. I would ask, how can man describe the indescribable?

I mean, you may as well start a thread on why, fundamentally, Orthodoxy is non-sense.

What would be the point? If it's true to you, then that's good enough for me. :)

[Khaleas]

The problem, John, is if you had met a serious Catholic girl, she would have not permited you to raise the children Orthodox. This is where the religious conflict come in. For Catholics, it is a mortal sin to get married by anyone but a Catholic priest. Then, while OBOBers have told me that this isn't true today, my dad had to agree, in writing, to raise their children Catholic. The same agreement was put forth to my own husband when we looked into getting our civil marriage convalidated. He refused to sign the agreement.
My best friend was raised Catholic and wanted to get married in a Catholic service. However, her husband (who goes to church a whole lot more) is Lutheran and refused to agree to raise their kids Catholic (which wasn't a big deal for my friend - she just wants them to be Christian). But man, they had a really hard time finding someone who would marry them.
I guess I lucked out. My hubs was Catholic (on paper, never confirmed) and after a few times coming with me he was definitely willing to convert. We were married before he converted and his actual Chrismation happened a lot sooner than planned, but then again the Navy does odd things.
I agree with many here. Stop looking. I did and I definitely sworn off anyone in the Navy (got hurt a few times) and then I went over to a friends house for dinner and there he was, grilling up some great steaks.
My friend mentioned above, honestly, they met on the website Hot Or Not. Now, if you can meet there, you can meet anywhere. (for those who don't know, Hot or Not is a website where people put up a picture for others to rate how hot (or not) you are).

[Lotar]

Very sad Lotar. I personally cannot accept that type of theology. I don't see anything divine about it.



Well, I don't believe in "truth" as many do. I think that Truth is relative. So for me, it's not "nonsense".



I don't see what is sad about it at all.

What is sad is the situation that you are in. It would have been better had you never been baptized at all. I pray that some day you do repent.

[JasonV]

He's an Anglican, he could probably become a Muslim and it wouldn't really matter much to his church. They've got priests that are Hindus.

No, it would matter. These are not very kind words. I realize Im at TAW, but I would expect more courtesy than that. :(

It would also be wise for members here to realize that Im expressing my personal views. They do not reflect the teachings of the Anglican Communion.

[Greg the byzantine]

No, it would matter. These are not very kind words. I realize Im at TAW, but I would expect more courtesy than that. :(

It would also be wise for members here to realize that Im expressing my personal views. They do not reflect the teachings of the Anglican Communion.

I don't mean this as a personal attack, but weren't you preaching gnosticism not too long ago, some mumbo jumbo about universal truths, and you had a webpage filled with twirling masonic symbols?

[JasonV]

I don't mean this as a personal attack, but weren't you preaching gnosticism not too long ago, some mumbo jumbo about universal truths, and you had a webpage filled with twirling masonic symbols?

If you've read my cf page, then you'll see I talk about that briefly. The Gnosticism I preached (and still do) is not ancient gnosticism. No Pleroma or Archeons for me thanks. It's more of an inclusive, find your own path, type of Gnosticism that I studied.

As for Freemasonry, yep, Im a Master Mason. Im currently serving as the Junior Deacon of my Lodge. Freemasonry, contrary to select belief, is not a religion. It's more of an ecumenical fraternity. I know that Orthodoxy thinks ecumenism is evil, but I don't, never did, never will.

As much as I enjoyed what I was doing, I wanted to be part of a local faith community. Bishop John Shelby Spong's work influenced my decision to unite with the Episcopal Church. His vision is extraordinary and a needed light in this dark world.

Course, I already know what RCC and EO's think of Spong (as well as many Anglicans) but I don't really care what they/you think of him. He's my religious hero. He should be made a Saint.

Have a nice day.

[Greg the byzantine]

The Gnosticism I preached (and still do) is not ancient gnosticism. No Pleroma or Archeons for me thanks. It's more of an inclusive, find your own path, type of Gnosticism that I studied.

So much for the Straight and Narrow Path Aye ;)

[JasonV]

So much for the Straight and Narrow Path Aye ;)

Yeah, but few there be who find it. And EO's number in the tens of millions. :P

[Greg the byzantine]

Yeah, but few there be who find it. And EO's number in the tens of millions. :P

Ah but we were warned there would be weeds among the wheat :)

[JasonV]

Ok bro. You win. Have a nice day.

I think being ex-Orthodox may be a bit too touchy for folks here. I'll do my best to stay out of TAW for that very reason. I don't want to argue. I think Orthodoxy is a beautiful religion generally, and the Divine Liturgy is the best out there. But some times it just doesn't work for people. There is an ex-Orthodox (OCA) priest who converted to Anglicanism and is now the Rector of a nearby Episcopal church. I should talk to him about his reasons for leaving, and maybe share them in the future? But only if that's acceptable at TAW.

[Lotar]

Another suggestion for Repentant:

Try joining Orthodox Circle, if you haven't already. I'm sure you could meet a few girls that way.

[repentant]

Whoah..

Well I appreciate everyones comments and suggestions. I do just need to pray about it, as I have been. Patience is not one of my virtues, lol..

[repentant]

Haha Lotar, love the Borat avatar..isn't there going to be a movie with him?

[Orthosdoxa]

I should talk to him about his reasons for leaving, and maybe share them in the future? But only if that's acceptable at TAW.

It's not up to me to say what's acceptable or not. But I can't imagine anything less interesting. People have always defected from the Truth, it's how all the heterodox groups got started. What would be the purpose of such a discussion?

Back to the OP: As others have stated, it happens when you stop looking... did for me anyway. Not that looking is bad. GDE came here hoping to meet an Orthodox guy, and has now been married to Vasya for 6 months. So you never know. :)

LK

[ThePilgrim]

It's not up to me to say what's acceptable or not. But I can't imagine anything less interesting. People have always defected from the Truth, it's how all the heterodox groups got started. What would be the purpose of such a discussion?

Back to the OP: As others have stated, it happens when you stop looking... did for me anyway. Not that looking is bad. GDE came here hoping to meet an Orthodox guy, and has now been married to Vasya for 6 months. So you never know. :)

LK
It's hard, though, when you feel like you're ready to start life but aren't really able to.

*sigh*

[Orthosdoxa]

Talk to me about it -I didn't meet Moses until I was 27. My brother didn't meet his wife til he was in his mid-30's. It's all about God's timing, though I know that doesn't make the waiting any easier...

LK

[Tsarina]

I think I've made a similair thread before. I didn't find my fiancee until after I gave up and stopped looking.

My advice would be to just get out there and make as many Orthodox friends as you can. Visit other parishes, go to Youth events, ect. Just meet people and you'll be supprised who you might find.

My fiancee used to organize OCF events and orchestrated me getting elected Treasurer just so she could hang out with me. :D Now we're getting married in less than 3 weeks.

Good advice there, Lotar. I hope this will help the people who are seeking out there.

Also, don't forget to pray!

Moving forward, Lotar, are you excited about the big day? It wasn't to long ago when you told us when the big day was going to happen, and this seemed so long ago. Time goes by quickly!

[Akathist]

The problem, John, is if you had met a serious Catholic girl, she would have not permited you to raise the children Orthodox. This is where the religious conflict come in. For Catholics, it is a mortal sin to get married by anyone but a Catholic priest. Then, while OBOBers have told me that this isn't true today, my dad had to agree, in writing, to raise their children Catholic. The same agreement was put forth to my own husband when we looked into getting our civil marriage convalidated. He refused to sign the agreement.

I made red the part I wanted to comment on. Actually the Catholic Church has agreed in a joint meeting with the EOC that an Orthodox Priest may perform a wedding with a Catholic spouse marrying an Orthodox spouse.

I have trouble finding it but the scopa website has it.

I spoke with my Priest about this recently and was told that he would marry a Catholic and an Orthodox but would not allow an Orthodox to be married by a Catholic Priest. (Maybe some Catholic Priests would say the same thing but what he said was exactly what the scopa stuff said as well.)

The issue of how the children would be raised in a marriage between Orthdox and Catholic does not appear to have been fully worked out in the scopa material.

[Mytheodos]

I hope this helps...


To avoid lonliness - avoid isolation. Now you must recognise the thing about a lonly person is that they are more often than not isolated and depressed and the last thing a depressed person wants to do is get involved - that's why Im not giving you a choice - GO AND GET INVOLVED - preferably in something that helps others. God gives (not exclusivley as some churches and preachers teach) to those that give!:)
Ask God to help you see where you can serve others - this is the best cure for lonliness I PROMISE - and when you do - the chances of you meeting new people is soooo much greater!:) Remember a man reaps what he sows - so sow into other peoples lives!

Remember that married people are often excellent matchmakers so hang out with couples as well as singles

Mytheodos.

[NewToLife]

My advice is to pray and leave it to God, I looked for years and found no one but when I simply prayed God that he would either give me the strength for a celibate life or give me a wife with whom I could live a Christian life I was astounded to meet my wife within 6 weeks without actively seeking at all.

[ufonium2]

There is an ex-Orthodox (OCA) priest who converted to Anglicanism and is now the Rector of a nearby Episcopal church. I should talk to him about his reasons for leaving, and maybe share them in the future?

No need; I can probably sum it up for you. He started thinking things like, "I can't believe in a God that ___________." You could put tons of things in the blank: would let people suffer, asks me not to eat meat two days a week, opposes homosexuality, etc. But in reality, all of those boil down to "I can't believe in a God who doesn't think exactly like me." So then, he remade God in his own image, in his own mind. But that's okay by him, because by that point he'd begun to think of God as an abstraction anyway. So God for him believed X and Y, while God for this other guy believes A and B, but it's all relative . At that point, it's atheism. God is not different things to different people. Can't be. And he justifies it by saying that the fruits of relativism can be seen in all the "good people" of other faiths, as if religion exists to make good, happy people, rather than to connect us to God.

That's why ecumenism, as you define it, is wrong. At its core, it is atheistic. I mean, the whole premise is that God doesn't matter. So actually atheism is probably better. Ecumenism, as you describe it, is telling God that while you acknowledge that He exists, that He's not really important.

[ufonium2]

Oh yeah, repentant, sorry to further hijack your thread. Back on topic, let me share this with you: Girls want a guy who is willing to get married eventually, and isn't going to pull the stereotypical guy stunt of freaking out about commitment three years into a relationship. But, most girls I know are freaked out by guys who are obviously over-anxious to marry. They might see themselves as being a person you've deemed acceptable to marry, rather than a really special person you've fallen in love with, and so the relationship gets weird. Does that make sense?

[Xpycoctomos]

The problem, John, is if you had met a serious Catholic girl, she would have not permited you to raise the children Orthodox.


Actually the Catholic Church allows a special dispensation for Catholic/Orthodox families to raise their kids in the Orthodox Church. I have both read that in several places and have had friends and preists in the US as well as a priest-friend of mine in Spain tell me the same. I don't say that to "shove it in your face" but rather only to show that I am not basing this off of some midnight conversation I had with a Catholic friend. The dispensation has to be granted (and isn't just given willy-nilly) but it is there.

John

[Xpycoctomos]

Jason, I wasn't trying to attack you at all. I was calling you out on writing AS IF we agreed with your assumptions. I wasn't offended until I now that I realize you were Orthodox. So, I would imagine you understand the Orthodox mindset about what we would or would not agree with. I originally thought you were an unassuming Anglican who came in here and didn't know exactly what Orthodox believed on this matter.

It's fine that you believe what you want. I am not trying to tell you want to believe. But don't come in here, try to convince others of your newfound beliefs while knowing the whole time that they ar UNorthodox. I have a very hard time (now that I know you were Orthodox) that you came in here with ONLY the best of intentions and not also to "convert" others to your own new personal theology. No one is coming to your home telling you why you don't believe the right thing. Why would you do the same thing? And in a thread that isn't about Jason's theology but about a devout Orthodox looking for guidance in an Orthodox way.

Again, don't be so sensative to think we are telling you what you must believe. We're merely saying to you that this is a haven for those that wish to learn about orthodox and/or remain Orthodox. If they don't, they are free to leave.

John

[ShiFuBill]

I bet I've got a situation no one else faces. Very few unmarried women come here to work and there are very few Orthodox who live here also. As I go to the only Orthodox Church in the whole island I know every church going Orthodox here. Very few Chinese have become Orthodox, and most of those who have were women brought in by their spouses. I have tried dating non-Orthodox but it has never gone well. The internet isn't a good option because while a long distance relationship is tough, well, no one wants one this long. What frustrates me more is that I've dedicated my self to becoming a priest (and that certainly narrows the field) but I want to have a family, so as much as I'd like the number of our churches (to 2) that's on hold. But, as a monk told me this summer, if God has put this in my heart he won't abandon me. So I wait while reading theology and watching Lost.......... At least I got a dog.

[Xpycoctomos]

Feel fortunate that you have a n Orthodox Church (in China?) in the first place... wow! Anyhow, how long are stationed there for? I know this isn't easy, but perhaps you just have to plan on putting that part of your life on hold for a few years until you come back home. I could be totally off, but it seems like you don't have a choice. Can you explain your sitation again? Why are you there... where is there... etc.

Sounds really tough, but as that Monk said, God is definitely looking out for you... easy for me to say.

John

[ShiFuBill]

Feel fortunate that you have a n Orthodox Church (in China?) in the first place... wow! Anyhow, how long are stationed there for? I know this isn't easy, but perhaps you just have to plan on putting that part of your life on hold for a few years until you come back home. I could be totally off, but it seems like you don't have a choice. Can you explain your sitation again? Why are you there... where is there... etc.

Sounds really tough, but as that Monk said, God is definitely looking out for you... easy for me to say.

John

I live in Taiwan, which has a dominant Chinese culture. I'm not stationed here, I just live and work here and I'm not going back home except for visits. And if/when I become a priest, God willing I will work here.

But you are right, we are fortunate to have an Orthodox Church here, 8 years ago there wasn't one. I was baptized here and can proudly tell people I'm Taiwanese Orthodox.

[JasonV]

John,

It was my mistake to reply in the first place. I suppose I deserved being the whipping-post of the day.

I should have known better.

Though I still stand by my first post, I will refrain from such "liberal" comments in the future while in TAW.

[kamikat]

Actually the Catholic Church allows a special dispensation for Catholic/Orthodox families to raise their kids in the Orthodox Church. I have both read that in several places and have had friends and preists in the US as well as a priest-friend of mine in Spain tell me the same. I don't say that to "shove it in your face" but rather only to show that I am not basing this off of some midnight conversation I had with a Catholic friend. The dispensation has to be granted (and isn't just given willy-nilly) but it is there.

John

I realize that you're not shoving it in my face and I also realize that my info is 40 years old, based on what has happened in my own family. However, I find it hard to believe that if a "good Catholic girl" was serious about her faith, she would allow you to raise the children Orthodox. Most Catholics, at least the ones my age or older, were taught that the Orthodox are schismatics. Even if it were techinally ok'ed by a priest, who would willingly allow their spouse to take their children to a schismatic church?
kamikat

[Xpycoctomos]

You may be right. I was just pointing out that it is allowed and so there is room for give. (if anyone has info to the otherwise, can you post some kind of reference so I can correct myself and be sure it's good info?)

And I don't think that a Catholic is less serious for allowing their children to be baptised and raised in the Orthodox Church. The catholic Church has a different outlook on the nature of the Church and Her boundaries and very specific ways of defining and differentiatiing schism from heretical. The OC is generally not so formed in this area, so we tend to be more black and white: you're either in or you're out.

So, I think that a devout Catholic, while ideally raising her/his children Catholic, could rationalize raising their children orthodox if those were the terms of the marriage. Im not saying ALL could... but I think it can happen. For an Orthodox, however, it isn't even an option. So, it's either raise your kids Catholic and risk excommunication (although i wonder if this really happens) or raise em Orthodox.

John

[ufonium2]

Jason,

It is extremely bad form to start a thread about my post in another forum without telling me. I'm not going to argue in the Anglican forum, just as you shouldn't have argued here. But you should have at least done me the courtesy of not talking about me behind my back. Whatever anyone in TAW has said to you, you came here. And they did it to your face. If you were interested in honest debate, you would have PMed me for clarification of my post. But obviously you aren't, so have fun knocking down your strawman over at STR.

Repentant, I'm really sorry for perpetuating the derailment of your thread.

[Tsarina]

Whoah..

Well I appreciate everyones comments and suggestions. I do just need to pray about it, as I have been. Patience is not one of my virtues, lol..

Problem solved.

Keep praying, don't stop. You will see wonders happen. :angel:

[JasonV]

Jason,

It is extremely bad form to start a thread about my post in another forum without telling me. I'm not going to argue in the Anglican forum, just as you shouldn't have argued here. But you should have at least done me the courtesy of not talking about me behind my back. Whatever anyone in TAW has said to you, you came here. And they did it to your face. If you were interested in honest debate, you would have PMed me for clarification of my post. But obviously you aren't, so have fun knocking down your strawman over at STR.

Repentant, I'm really sorry for perpetuating the derailment of your thread.

This isn't High Schoool, don't be so dramatic. I didn't use your name out of respect for your privacy. I wanted to discuss the issue of ecumenism=evil. I am forced, per forum rules, to do so in my own forum. I would have prefered to do it here, but as you very well know I cannot.