LCMS: Lutheran Service Book (LSB)

[synger]

Today my husband and I attended one of the workshops for the new Lutheran Service Book (http://lsb.cph.org/) (LSB), the new hymnal/worship book for the LCMS. I was interested to hear if others have looked at this yet.

It was very interesting to see how they took different settings for the Divine Service from both of the previous hymnals, so that no matter which setting you were used to using, you would find something familiar.

The seminar took us through the hymnal, pointing out the different parts of it and showing what is familiar to users of LW or TLH, and what is new or expanded. We also got to sing a number of the hymns, of course, and used some of the worship tools as well. It includes not only the service of Baptism, but the services of Confirmation and Holy Matrimony, so the congregation can read along. It has a new Service of Prayer and Preaching, which is designed to be used as a framework to teach points from the catechism.

A lot of the old hymns are included, some of the with restored text from before the Lutheran Worship book (which had not-so-gently updated and modernized some beloved hymn text). Also included are about 100 new hymns -- either new texts to familiar tunes or completely new (to Lutheran hymnals). I was pleased with the much stronger focus on Gospel-based hymns, which was one of the decision points in looking at which hymns would be included in the hymnal. In addition, there are eleven reciting tones of various major and minor moods by which to sing the Psalms, which are set out with specific markings to follow the use of the tones if your congregation sings the Psalms.


My husband was particularly impressed with how the book has been developed to be used not only in corporate worship, but as a home worship tool. It includes many more prayers, lectionaries, and the Table of Psalms. It includes settings for Daily Office and for Corporate and Individual Confession and Absolution. It even has the Small Catechism (including the Table of Duties and the Christian Questions and Answers, but not the commentary).

Granted, there will be hymns that are beloved that were not included. The section on National songs has been pared down a bit, too. And some of the wordings here and there have been changed a little. The keys of some of the responses have been lowered. But all in all, it looks like they did a fairly good job of field-testing it and getting comments on its usability in a congregational setting.

[Melethiel]

The workshop here is on Oct. 14.

[QuiltAngel]

We went to the workshop a week ago. You metions most of the good points. I like that they put the prayers for worship back at the very front. Don't have to go looking for them, although by now I should be able to find them is LW. The page numbering is great also.

They also used a method of binding that will last longer. Just a few more of the neat things they did.

Yeah, I am disappointed in a few songs in there, but I have to remember that no hymnal is going to please everyone.

[LilLamb219]

Now I can't wait for our workshop next weekend! :)

[synger]

Interesting tidbit. They had estimated/hoped for the whole series of hymnal workshops to reach about 9-12,000 people.

In the first few weekends of workshops, they've already had 9,000 people attend! There is GREAT interest in this new hymnal. It's rather exciting to think of.

[filosofer]

We will review on Oct. 28, although I have had a copy since the middle of August.

In Christ's love,
filo

[dinkime]

there was a news story tonight on our local fox station regarding this new hymnal (i live in st. louis)

[DaRev]

The workshop here is on Oct. 14.

I thought you were ELCA? :confused:

Why would an ELCA church have a Lutheran Service Book workshop??

Perhaps there's hope for them, yet!! ;)

[DaRev]

Today my husband and I attended one of the workshops for the new Lutheran Service Book (http://lsb.cph.org/) (LSB), the new hymnal/worship book for the LCMS. I was interested to hear if others have looked at this yet.

It was very interesting to see how they took different settings for the Divine Service from both of the previous hymnals, so that no matter which setting you were used to using, you would find something familiar.

The seminar took us through the hymnal, pointing out the different parts of it and showing what is familiar to users of LW or TLH, and what is new or expanded. We also got to sing a number of the hymns, of course, and used some of the worship tools as well. It includes not only the service of Baptism, but the services of Confirmation and Holy Matrimony, so the congregation can read along. It has a new Service of Prayer and Preaching, which is designed to be used as a framework to teach points from the catechism.

A lot of the old hymns are included, some of the with restored text from before the Lutheran Worship book (which had not-so-gently updated and modernized some beloved hymn text). Also included are about 100 new hymns -- either new texts to familiar tunes or completely new (to Lutheran hymnals). I was pleased with the much stronger focus on Gospel-based hymns, which was one of the decision points in looking at which hymns would be included in the hymnal. In addition, there are eleven reciting tones of various major and minor moods by which to sing the Psalms, which are set out with specific markings to follow the use of the tones if your congregation sings the Psalms.


My husband was particularly impressed with how the book has been developed to be used not only in corporate worship, but as a home worship tool. It includes many more prayers, lectionaries, and the Table of Psalms. It includes settings for Daily Office and for Corporate and Individual Confession and Absolution. It even has the Small Catechism (including the Table of Duties and the Christian Questions and Answers, but not the commentary).

Granted, there will be hymns that are beloved that were not included. The section on National songs has been pared down a bit, too. And some of the wordings here and there have been changed a little. The keys of some of the responses have been lowered. But all in all, it looks like they did a fairly good job of field-testing it and getting comments on its usability in a congregational setting.

We are already using the LSB hymnal. One of our families donated 100 pew editions, Altar Book, and organist accompaniments. The pre-order went in at the end of June and the pew editions were received at the beginning of September.

We had already been using the liturgies from the hymnal exclusively since the first of September, so there was an easy transition to using the new hymnal. We have not yet received the organist accompaniments yet, so we are limited to those hymns that are available in LW or HS98 until they arrive.

[synger]

I was leafing through my copy last night at home, humming this song and that. I stopped dead and started laughing out loud.

Hymn 666 is "Fear Not, O Little Flock, The Foe (http://www.cyberhymnal.org/htm/f/n/fnolflok.htm)".

Somebody had a sense of humor. I like that.

[Melethiel]

I thought you were ELCA?

Why would an ELCA church have a Lutheran Service Book workshop??

Perhaps there's hope for them, yet!!

I didn't say it was at my church. :P It's at the LCMS church in town, and I'm going because I'm an organist and collect hymnals. :P

[C.F.W. Walther]

We're so far out in the boonies that we still use the 1941 edition of THe Lutheran Hymnal. I wasn't here when the 1982 edition came out so I don't know if they voted to keep the older hymnal. The other church I belonged to also had the 41 version.

I'm actually glad they did. I go to other Lutheran Churches occasionally and the use the newer version with the supplement and about halfway through the service they lost me. I even play the organ and it seemed like total chaos. Between jumping back and forth between the two and using the bulletin I finally just layed down everything and just listened and jumped in when I knew part of it.

My point is, what about new converted members who join or potentialy new members who try and join in on the worship, to loose them halfway through the service becasue they can't keep up? I would hate to think that we could probably loose members just becasue they couldn't keep up.

Again I reiterate, I am a liturgical organist and even when I can't keep up there should be some concern at to the complexity of the order of service in some churches. Allmost like it's a secret society and you have to get up to speed on the secret handshakes and memorize all the moves. How can anyone concentrate on the content of the service whith all the confusion?

I guess I overstated it but....... whatever.

[synger]

I agree, Radidio. Some liturgies can be VERY confusing. I was rather nervous about that when we first visited our current church. I had vague memories of Lutheran and Episcopal services where you had to juggle three books and turn back and forth from page to page, and I always felt SO lost. And in turn, unwelcome, because it was obvious that I "didn't belong."

Our church uses the '82 hymnal currently, but the liturgy is put into the bulletin. We don't follow along in the hymnal. In fact, it took me a number of years (and one of the musicians who is steeped in Lutheran liturgy and hymnody to point it out) to realize that we do the full-blown order of Matins whenever we have a fifth Sunday in the month. I just followed along in the bulletin, and knew that some Sundays we sang stuff that I was getting familiar with, and some Sundays I had to pay more attention because we didn't sing it as often.

So from a non-Lutheran-coming-in perspective, I think it is VERY useful to have one consolidated service book, rather than switching back and forth and being confusing. And I look forward to being able to follow the services in the book, rather than just in the bulletin. I like having a better understanding of where someething comes from, rather than just having it presented week by week.

(this from the woman who was able to turn right to the Christian Year pages in the hymnal when my Baptist-raised husband finally realized after four years that the colors of the altar cloths changed sometimes, and asked why. I have always enjoyed reading hymnals and service books, to see how people worship. I know I'm in the minority.)

[DaRev]

This is what is so wonderful about the Lutheran Service Book. It is laid out is a VERY visitor friendly format. Our members love the way they can follow it with virtually no effort. Our congregation used to use the Creative Worship series (blechhh!!!:sick: ) and had the liturgies printed in full in the bulletin. But since the beginning of December, we have been using the LSB liturgies exclusively. So when the hymnals arrived, there was no real transition... and the services in the hymnal are laid out just as they were printed in the bulletin.

Our secretary loves the new hymnal, too!:clap:
Much less copying , collating, folding, etc... ;)

[QuiltAngel]

I was leafing through my copy last night at home, humming this song and that. I stopped dead and started laughing out loud.

Hymn 666 is "Fear Not, O Little Flock, The Foe".

Somebody had a sense of humor. I like that.



The presenter at the workshop we went to told us this hymn was placed there on purpose. Makes one appreciate the humor even more.

[filosofer]

Our secretary loves the new hymnal, too!:clap:
Much less copying , collating, folding, etc... ;)

And the tree-huggers of America appreciate less paper being used. ;)

In Christ's love,
filo

[Tetzel]

Ok, I've found a gripe. For "The royal banners forward go" They've changed to some new tune and also gotten rid of the setting of the hymn to "Herr Jesu Christ wahr'r Mensch und Gott", sadly this tune didn't make it into the hymnal at all.

[ctay]

I don't think we'll be getting the new hymnal, didn't ask the pastor why when he said they weren't getting it.

[LilLamb219]

I really enjoyed the workshop for the new hymnal. My complaint about the workshop was that it wasn't long enough! It was 3 hours long and went by so quickly. I enjoyed hearing our speaker who guided us through the book so that I can answer questions when someone asks...Why did they do THAT? ;)

I love the new hymnal!

[Melethiel]

I didn't get to go to the workshop. :(

I had too much homework that day...

[filosofer]

The workshop is a week from tomorrow, but I won't being going. Too bad, because I was looking forward to it. But I have enough on my plate as it is.

In Christ's love,
filo

[C.F.W. Walther]

We're too far out in the boonies to have a workshop. Guess it will just be a big surprise when it gets here. Course we're still using the 1941 edition so it might take another 40 years before it gets here :)

[LutherNut]

We're too far out in the boonies to have a workshop. Guess it will just be a big surprise when it gets here. Course we're still using the 1941 edition so it might take another 40 years before it gets here :)

The LSB is actually closer to the 1941 TLH than to LW. I honestly believe that it will be a rather easy transition for those congregations using TLH.

[JFox1]

:scratch: I haven't looked at it yet, but I ordered a copy. Why did they decide to make a new hymnal? What was wrong with the current one?

[filosofer]

There has always been a need/desire to publish a new hymnal every 20-25 years. Back in the late 1950's the LCMS began the process of updating the hymnal (TLH). However, events intervened and the publication (of LW) was delayed until 1982.

Also, there was the "jump out of sequence" problem of the Divine Services in LW. As good as LW is/was, that was a stumbling block instead an aid to worship.

In Christ's love,
filo

[DaRev]

:scratch: I haven't looked at it yet, but I ordered a copy. Why did they decide to make a new hymnal? What was wrong with the current one?

The TLH (red) hymnal was a product of the old Synodical Conference consisting of the LCMS, WELS, ELS, and SELC back in 1941. It became the mainstay for Lutheran worship for roughly 40 years. Then, in the late 60's there was a push to "modernize" the church which prompted the development of a new hymnal. The Synodical Conference was no more, and the LCMS had wanted to develop an inter-Lutheran hymnal, and so got together with the old ALC and LCA (both of which are now part of the ELCA) and the result was the "Lutheran Book of Worship" in 1978 (currently used by the ELCA). The LCMS convention rejected this hymnal and so the result was an "updated" version prepared by the LCMS in 1982 called "Lutheran Worship."

Many congregations did not like the "modern" version of worship or the hymnody and refused to buy and use the "new blue hymnal." Many congregations purchased the LW hymnal, but also kept the TLH because they didn't like the "modern" update to the page 15 communion service. Some congregations used the "new blue" hymnal, some used the "old red" hymnal, and some used both.

So as to have a single worship and hymn resource that all LCMS congregations could use (and because CPH no longer wants to print two different hymnals) the Synod deveolped the new Lutheran Service Book. It isn't really all that "new." It is basically the best parts of both the "blue" LW and the "red" TLH hymnals bound into one book. There are some newer service orders and hymns, but at the same time it retains the traditional Lutheran liturgies and hymnodies that have been the mainstay of Lutheran worship services for many, many years.

[filosofer]

The TLH (red) hymnal was a product of the old Synodical Conference consisting of the LCMS, WELS, ELS, and SELC back in 1941. It became the mainstay for Lutheran worship for roughly 40 years. Then, in the late 60's there was a push to "modernize" the church which prompted the development of a new hymnal. The Synodical Conference was no more, and the LCMS had wanted to develop an inter-Lutheran hymnal, and so got together with the old ALC and LCA (both of which are now part of the ELCA) and the result was the "Lutheran Book of Worship" in 1978 (currently used by the ELCA). The LCMS convention rejected this hymnal and so the result was an "updated" version prepared by the LCMS in 1982 called "Lutheran Worship."



Just a note: the move in the late 1960's was actually only a result of the desire and interest to begin work on a new hymnal in the late 1950's while the Synodical Conference was still in existence. As that relationship began to deteriorate, the "new" hymnal moved off center stage. After the Synodical Conf. disbanded, the new hymnal took on more LCMS focus, which then invited LCA and ALC.

Remember they had recently published LSH in 1958, so it took a while before their interest was piqued, and eventually joined the effort to produce a "new" one. So, while the LCMS was the prime mover for the new hymnal (ultimately LW), it lost leadership of the new hymnal project over the decade from 1968 to 1978.

As an aftermath of the LCMS withdrawing from LBW, LCA/ALC decided not to let the LCMS use the translated Psalms from LBW for LW, which meant the LCMS was stuck looking for a replacement in a short period of time. The NIV was chosen as Psalms texts because it was NIV royalty-free (for the hymnal). Of course, that also opened the floodgate for Bibles, Studies, Catechism, etc. all based on the NIV, which more than compensated for the hymnal use. IBS/Zondervan came out far ahead on the "free-royalty" deal.

In Christ's love,
filo

[GlennH]

The LSB is actually closer to the 1941 TLH than to LW. I honestly believe that it will be a rather easy transition for those congregations using TLH.
I also expect that it was not a mistake that LSB is a shade of red, rather than any other color.

[DaSeminarian]

Today I did the liturgy in our Matins service (both early and late service) I also attended my first voter's meeting and our church has voted unanimously to get the LSB. We have been using it for about 3 months at CTS/Fort Wayne and it is by far the best we have had.

It isn't perfect though and there are some areas that they could have done better, but over all it is a good hymnal and the layout is very good as well.

I suggest that all churches should get it and then we can all be united again.

[Studeclunker]

As soon as this hymnal came out our congregation was forced into the use of it. The change was originally promoted as a 'test run'. It never ended. Our pastor was one of those Yuppie types that thought newer is better. The rest of us had no choice.:sigh: We also never got a chance to see the book. The only copy was kept in the pastor's office.:scratch:

Perhaps a new hymnal is a good idea. I wouldn't know. Having come from ELCA (originally LCA) and also being double crossed by the church leadership (the Statement On Human Sexuality) I'm not very trusting of this kind of thing. Show me the new book, let me thoroughly go through it and decide for myself. DON'T shove it down my throat!:mad:

there is so much of this watering down of doctrine and policy going on now. The edges of our belief system are beginning to atomize to the point where I don't know what many churches base their belief system on. It's certainly not the Bible. That, by the way, includes the ELCA and is why I'm in the LCMS.

I can empathise with many people who are currently trapped in the Anglican church right now. They have a church hirearchy that has lost touch with what core Christian doctrine is. With the fracas going on about their Homosexual priest, it looks like the parisioners know proper doctrine better then their leaders! A very sad situation. That's where I was with the ELCA a few years back. So, yes, I can clearly empathise with them.

It's wonderful that some people have the money and time to attend conventions, workshops, and conferences. Don't forget, please, not all of your parisioners are so blessed! This new hymnal is very different from the previous. Dont, Please I beg you, don't shove it down the other member's throats. We all have a responsibility to our fellow brothers and sisters to be kind and understanding. Please so do. Patience is a virtue! One that is beloved of God.

[LilLamb219]

Our pastor encouraged the congregation to go to a special program that introduced us to the new hymnal and the congregation even paid :) We were able to go through the hymnal and bring it home to keep which was a bigger plus! Then we set up hymnals in the foyer for others who couldn't go to this class to flip through and check it out for themselves before it went through a vote to decide if we wanted to purchase them for use.

[DaRev]

This new hymnal is very different from the previous.

Apparently, you don't know a whole lot about the Lutheran Service Book. It is in many ways very similar to the previous two hymnals. If a church is used to the LW (blue) hymnal, it will seem very similar to them. If a congregation used the TLH (red) hymnal, it will seem very similar to them as well. It is, in fact, the best parts of both of the previous hymnals put into one book. Congregations that now use it have found the transition to be seamless. There really isn't anything new to learn in it. But there are some new things about it. I suggest that you check out the LSB website here (http://lsb.cph.org/).

[Studeclunker]

Revrend, if you are referring to the new one, yes. If you are referring to the blue, than you are entitled to your opinon, no matter how biased it may be. I've carried the blue (LW) hymnal for at least twelve years. I use it at home and know it very well. I'm one of those people who can sing the liturgy without looking at the page. I'm not bragging, one generally would have it memorized after around fifteen years of every Sunday, one should hope! By the by Rev, perhaps you can tell me what page in the LW the fourth setting begins. Perhaps I'm missing a few pages in mine.



In case you did'nt read this the first time, here's my stance on the presentation of this new hymnal:
It's wonderful that some people have the money and time to attend conventions, workshops, and conferences. Don't forget, please, not all of your parisioners are so blessed! This new hymnal is very different from the previous. Dont, Please I beg you, don't shove it down the other member's throats. We all have a responsibility to our fellow brothers and sisters to be kind and understanding. Please so do. Patience is a virtue! One that is beloved of God.


Similar, is not same. Even small changes can cause a distraction during the worship service. To me this is very upsetting. I'm there to concentrate on God, not some silly change that someone just HAD to have.

I don't oppose the new hymnal. I was asking that others whom are promoting it remember that we are Christian brothers and sisters. That we are supposed to treat each other with love and respect. Not arrogance!

[TheCosmicGospel]

I don't think we'll be getting the new hymnal, didn't ask the pastor why when he said they weren't getting it.

It is so sad. But many pastors saw their congregations go down in flames over LW. My attendance ran over 200+ a Sunday for every Sunday but 2 or 3 times. But they switched. Next year we did not hit 200+ but 2 or 3 Sundays. That church has never recovered. So some for good reason are going to be gun shy. When momma ain't happy, no one is happy. LCMS has lost pastors and members because they failed in putting out a decent hymnal. Hopefully momma has reason to smile again. :bow:

Peace and Joy
Cosmic

We are here to serve God, not solve God. - Cosmic

[LutherNut]

Revrend, if you are referring to the new one, yes. If you are referring to the blue, than you are entitled to your opinon, no matter how biased it may be. I've carried the blue (LW) hymnal for at least twelve years. I use it at home and know it very well. I'm one of those people who can sing the liturgy without looking at the page. I'm not bragging, one generally would have it memorized after around fifteen years of every Sunday, one should hope! By the by Rev, perhaps you can tell me what page in the LW the fourth setting begins. Perhaps I'm missing a few pages in mine.



In case you did'nt read this the first time, here's my stance on the presentation of this new hymnal:



Similar, is not same. Even small changes can cause a distraction during the worship service. To me this is very upsetting. I'm there to concentrate on God, not some silly change that someone just HAD to have.

I don't oppose the new hymnal. I was asking that others whom are promoting it remember that we are Christian brothers and sisters. That we are supposed to treat each other with love and respect. Not arrogance!

DaRev specifically mentioned the Lutheran Service Book (new one), not Lutheran Worship (blue one).

The LSB Divine Service setting one is exactly the same as LW Divine Service 2 first setting (p. 158). LSB Divine Service setting two is the same as LW Divine Service 2 second setting (except the Lent VERSE which is the same as setting 1). LSB Divine Service setting three is almost identical to TLH (old red hymnal) page 15 communion service. The differences are minimal and most likely are not noticable to a majority of users. LSB Divine Service setting four is almost the same as the Hymnal Supplement 98 liturgy. The only difference is the Gloria, which is actually based on a familiar hymn tune. (Setting four is not in LW).

The Lutheran Service Book is superior to Lutheran Worship in numerous ways. It more closely reflects the traditional liturgies and hymnody used in the LCMS over the years. LSB was not an attempt to "modernize" the church as LW was. The LW hymnal was abismal. The LSB is a refreshing return to traditional Lutheranism in the LCMS.

And I fail to see how that is "arrogant."

[Studeclunker]

Did you start reading this from the beginning, Luther? My use of the word Arrogant was in referrence to the presentation of the new hymnal. Not the creation of it (though I object to that too for different reasons). If you are going to join a conversation, especially if you wish to debate a point, please pay attention.

I don't oppose the new hymnal. I was asking that others whom are promoting it remember that we are Christian brothers and sisters. That we are supposed to treat each other with love and respect. Not arrogance!

Please take note that I stated clearly that my problem is with the promotion of the hymnal, not the book per se. If we don't like the current hymnal, why not go back to it's predicessor? We can just write the blue book off to the misguided progressiveism of the fifties and sixties. It would have saved considerable sums that could have been put to a much better use (literally thousands of dollars per congregation). I suppose it's all academic now, as it's practically fait acompli.:sigh:

[LilLamb219]

We've used the new hymnal for 2 Sundays now with a somewhat smooth transition. I've heard no complaints so far and personally I enjoy using the new book. There are so many wonderful things about it and I appreciate all the effort that went into creating it. I hope they keep this one for a while!

[DaRev]

Well, I for one fail to see how the presentation of it is "arrogant". Perhaps you could elaborate on what you mean by that.

The Missouri Synod is a divided church in many ways. One of the problems is the diversive use of worship materials. There has been three different hymnals in use in the synod for nearly 25 years. If someone moves to another city or visits in another church, there is no continuity in worship. The LSB solves at least this problem in the synod. It brings together the best and most widely used aspects of the three hymnals in use into one common worship resource. Those congregations that have regularly used either LW or TLH will find those parts included which are familiar and comforting. (That, BTW, is the point.) Those very few congregations who use the LBW will most likely see the biggest difference, and even that is minimal (depending on which order of service they are used to).

The new LSB hymnal is superior to any of the previous ones, and anyone who looks at it and uses it will see this. Don't write it off without at least looking at it. With all of the issues plaguing the LCMS, it's refreshing to see that they at least got this right.

[Studeclunker]

Well, I for one fail to see how the presentation of it is "arrogant". Perhaps you could elaborate on what you mean by that.


As soon as this hymnal came out our congregation was forced into the use of it. The change was originally promoted as a 'test run'. It never ended. Our pastor was one of those Yuppie types that thought newer is better. The rest of us had no choice.:sigh: We also never got a chance to see the book. The only copy was kept in the pastor's office.:scratch:


The new LSB hymnal is superior to any of the previous ones, and anyone who looks at it and uses it will see this. Don't write it off without at least looking at it. With all of the issues plaguing the LCMS, it's refreshing to see that they at least got this right.

I will repeat myself for the third time.:sigh:

Dont, Please I beg you, don't shove it down the other member's throats. We all have a responsibility to our fellow brothers and sisters to be kind and understanding. Please so do. Patience is a virtue! One that is beloved of God.

Just because someone doesn't agree with your viewpoint, Revrend, does not automatically make them wrong. I will agree, LW has considerable problems. The music was abysmal. It also was another hymnal that the congregations' leaders rushed out to buy. The same thing happened in our congregation this time. Only, there wasn't the money to buy the books. So, we were using a liturgy that came out of a book we weren't allowed to examine closely.

Some of the posters in this thread have described an excellent presentation of this hymnal. That's good. All I was asking for, was a little consideration for ALL the members of your congregation. So it takes a little time for the transition. Time, is something Christians have in abundance.;)

[QuiltAngel]

Studeclunker,
Are you saying your Pastor did now allow members to see copies of LSB nor made members aware of the workshops held in the fall? The workshops were open to everyone and those who preregistered received a copy of LSB.

If your congregation was not given the opportunity to look over the hymnal, I can understand your frustration. It is my understanding that because congregations felt forced into LW that there was an effort made to not have that happen again. I think that is one of the reasons why many are going to LSB as they felt like there was ample opportunity to see and review it before deciding to use it.

I am confused which hymnal you have felt like was forced on your church.

[LutherNut]

Did you start reading this from the beginning, Luther? My use of the word Arrogant was in referrence to the presentation of the new hymnal. Not the creation of it (though I object to that too for different reasons). If you are going to join a conversation, especially if you wish to debate a point, please pay attention.


Talk about "arrogance." :doh:

[DaRev]

Just because someone doesn't agree with your viewpoint, Revrend, does not automatically make them wrong. I will agree, LW has considerable problems. The music was abysmal. It also was another hymnal that the congregations' leaders rushed out to buy. The same thing happened in our congregation this time. Only, there wasn't the money to buy the books. So, we were using a liturgy that came out of a book we weren't allowed to examine closely.

My "viewpoint" is based on fact. Just becasue your pastor did a lousy job of introducing it, don't slam the whole project.

The fact is that the liturgies in the LSB are the same as what is found in the other hymnals. Now, I can understand if a congregation has exclusively used LW and is now using the setting 3 and setting 4 liturgies from LSB that they would see these as "different" or "new". If that is what you are talking about, then I would agree with you. The pastor has done a lousy job of transition. My congregation had been using the Creative Worship series (which is neither creative or worship) which contained elements of all of these service orders. I began weening them off of the Creative Worship by introducing the LSB liturgies over a year ago. They were used to following a different service order every week, so introducing the LSB orders was easy for them. They liked the occasional use of the LW Divine Service (p. 158) which my predecessor had used on occasion. They appreciated the occasional use of the TLH p. 15 service (LSB setting 3) that they were familiar with from years earlier. They also liked the setting 4 service, which comes from the HS98 book and parts of which were regular parts of the Creative Worship services. Transition for us to the new hymnal was easy. And the members of the congregation like it.


Some of the posters in this thread have described an excellent presentation of this hymnal. That's good. All I was asking for, was a little consideration for ALL the members of your congregation. So it takes a little time for the transition. Time, is something Christians have in abundance.;)

I haven't heard any negative comments about the new hymnal from any of my members. Of course, we have been using it for quite a while and the circumstances of our introduction were somewhat unique.