Orthodox and Islam

[Dominus Fidelis]

Do any Orthodox leaders express respect for Islam?

[jckstraw72]

i sure hope not although ive read that one of hte Antiochian Patriarchs (or maybe Alexandrian) on more than one occasion said we should recognize Mohammed as a prophet. not sure if thats true or not.

[zhilan]

What do you mean by respect?

[ufonium2]

I personally have very little respect for Islam. This comes from personal interaction with Muslims locally, and for ridiculous behavior on the part of the Muslim leaders of the community (for instance, they asked for radio time to address the Jordan hotel bombing, and used it to blame the Jews).

On a local level, my parish (predominantly Arab) and our priest have no love for Islam. But, most of the families in my parish have been in America for nearly 100 years, and are MUCH more integrated into the local community than is the Muslim population.

On a national and international level, it's tricky. The Coptic Pope (who isn't Eastern Orthodox, by the way) said things that are, in my opinion, wrong. And his statements are being excused because he said them to save his life. But I can't go along with that. Would he convert to Islam to save his life? Would his flock?

Some of our Eastern Orthodox leaders have taken positions that I feel are way too political, especially concerning the Hezbollah/Israel issue. My priest tells a story of asking his Sunday school class to do a worksheet, and the first question was "What is your religion?" One kid put "Lebanese." Sometimes I think that particular perception sticks around into adulthood, even within the heirarchy. Just my honest opinion. Sorry if it offends anyone, but I think we should be as honest as possible to our guests.

[EricTheRed]

I dunno about a Orthodox official position, but I hate Islam.

[Dewi Sant]

Islam?

She's just another Christian Cult.
Not dissimilar to mormonism.


I shut up now, I've probably already got a stoning order :sigh:

[jckstraw72]

She's just another Christian Cult

isnt this what some Church Fathers originally thought when Islam was first starting, but then they realized it was a whole other religion?

[Teke]

I don't see Orthodox expressing any respect for man made religions. Which is what we recognize it as. It is not the Church.

It's a good idea to keep in mind when thinking of Islam and it's followers. That some of the followers are former self proclaimed christians who did not learn correct teachings of the Church. This is from my own observations.

Which means there are some who convert to Islam in an attempt to clarify their own philosophies. These type of people are not true Muslims, but seekers.

Personally I do feel compassion for the children and those who have grown to adulthood in predominant Islamic nations, in that they are very poorly educated having only the Quran and nothing else. IMO this is deprivation of a human soul. They are also prey to the more learned who seek to use them to further their political agenda.

The Muslims I've spoke with so far on this board, are not from the middle east, but from other nations and have simply converted to Islam. On a deeper level I believe it is a cry for help to the Church.

[rusmeister]

I'd add that Orthodox disrespect (if it can be called that) is for the creed of Islam, not the people.

You can't and shouldn't respect lies or mistakes or wrong beliefs. The most you can do is respect that people who hold them are (hopefully) seeking the truth.

I'm sure there are many good, fine and decent Muslim people and I certainly can respect such people. But they are not holding the true Faith. Why should I respect falsehood?

[Dewi Sant]

Good answer

[Orthodox Andrew]

I hate Islam, just like I hate adultery, murder etc.. I just try to love the people. Hate the sin, not the sinner.

[OnTheWay]

One first needs to understand that Islam is a belief system, not a group of human beings. Christ loves all people as does the Church. If you are asking if the Orthodox go as far as the Catholics with this "same God" stuff, the answer would certainly be no.

[Tsarina]

Do any Orthodox leaders express respect for Islam?

I never heard of it, but i hope not.

[Bushmaster78FS]

I am a former muslim. I was born and raised in a muslim family though in a secular muslim country. I do NOT respect Islam, and will never do so. I HATE THAT Political Correctness crap! I can h ave muslims as friends on cultural basis as Turks adapted cultural values from arabs for the sake of Islam, however this does not cause any respect for the religion itself or accept that its "half-truths" are revealed from God.

You can not be a friend with a muslim if you say "you hate his religion", he would take that as an insult, muslim would seek religious connection to the person who he wants to befriend. I do have colleagues who are atheists, this doesn't affect my dialogue with them, but for a muslim this is unacceptable.

Non-Christian religion section of this forum has bunch of muslims posting. Please go and observe their attitude. One of these attitudes that they believe they are the people of God in the sense of having the last and supreme revelation, so they are superior to everyone.


And this "same God" we worship matter. It is rather a deeper issue that can only be understood through Christian theology. It is certain that they seek and long for the "One and True God" and want to please Him and worship Him, but their way is not the way. Christ is the WAY. Muhammad didn't understand Christ's position, therefore we have what we have as Islam today.

[Bushmaster78FS]

i sure hope not although ive read that one of hte Antiochian Patriarchs (or maybe Alexandrian) on more than one occasion said we should recognize Mohammed as a prophet. not sure if thats true or not.

A prophet who taught that Christ was NOT DIVINE and He didn't die on the Cross? Is he out of his mind?

[Bushmaster78FS]

Personally I do feel compassion for the children and those who have grown to adulthood in predominant Islamic nations, in that they are very poorly educated having only the Quran and nothing else.

And I believe so does God. I believe their salvation is possible but it is nothing that I can decide or tell.

My grandma died as a muslim. Prayed her daily prayers all the time, fasted, gave her zakat, sacrificed her sheep during their sacrificial holy days, etc... She never knew I became a Christian, but if she had heard about it, she would have said "what is your business with the religion of the infidel/foreginers/westerners?" But she would say this out of ignorance not because she knew the truth.

Most of these people live and die without hearing a word from the Gospel, but God is just and merciful, He will judge them accordingly. I would not be surprised to see my grandma (which is my hope) with me in eternity, Lord have mercy on her soul.

[Bushmaster78FS]

I'd add that Orthodox disrespect (if it can be called that) is for the creed of Islam, not the people.

You can't and shouldn't respect lies or mistakes or wrong beliefs. The most you can do is respect that people who hold them are (hopefully) seeking the truth.

I'm sure there are many good, fine and decent Muslim people and I certainly can respect such people. But they are not holding the true Faith. Why should I respect falsehood?

This is possible in theory but not in practice, it won't work when you say that you don't respect "falsehood" (which is Islam) but still you want to be friends with a muslim or show love towards him. It just doesn't work. They base their relationships on religion and anything against religion will be against them, this is what is commanded in Quran.

[Xpycoctomos]

Do any Orthodox leaders express respect for Islam?
lol... I guess you got your answer about how many of US tend to feel. lol

I'm not comfortable with it either. I will say that I read a speech by an Orthodox Bishop (I believe it was the EP) some time ago. He was talking about tolerance and referred to Islam as a "Great religion" and the context was not simply saying it was Great as in "wide-spread" or " a religion to reckon with". I was dismayed and dissallusioned. But, bishops can say and do really stupid things. [shrugs]... but that certainly isn't the official word on the religion from the OC's POV.

John

[irishseventysix]

Do any Orthodox leaders express respect for Islam?
We may not have respect for the religion of Islam, but we are charged with the responsibility to have respect (dare I say love!) for all people as they are made in the image of God.

[Xpycoctomos]

We may not have respect for the religion of Islam, but we are charged with the responsibility to have respect (dare I say love!) for all people as they are made in the image of God.
This needed to be said and made clear. Thank you.

Although that may seem obvious it is psychologically easy for us humans to confuse there negative feelings for a cause or belief with the believer. And to the secular world that may seem fine enough. But that has nothing to do with Christianity. yOU know the old "love the sinner hate the sin" (who did we get that from????)

John

[88Devin07]

It is completely possible to hate the religion and love the person. But that doesn't mean they will love you back.

[Tsarina]

I am a former muslim. I was born and raised in a muslim family though in a secular muslim country. I do NOT respect Islam, and will never do so. I HATE THAT Political Correctness crap! I can h ave muslims as friends on cultural basis as Turks adapted cultural values from arabs for the sake of Islam, however this does not cause any respect for the religion itself or accept that its "half-truths" are revealed from God.

You can not be a friend with a muslim if you say "you hate his religion", he would take that as an insult, muslim would seek religious connection to the person who he wants to befriend. I do have colleagues who are atheists, this doesn't affect my dialogue with them, but for a muslim this is unacceptable.

Non-Christian religion section of this forum has bunch of muslims posting. Please go and observe their attitude. One of these attitudes that they believe they are the people of God in the sense of having the last and supreme revelation, so they are superior to everyone.


And this "same God" we worship matter. It is rather a deeper issue that can only be understood through Christian theology. It is certain that they seek and long for the "One and True God" and want to please Him and worship Him, but their way is not the way. Christ is the WAY. Muhammad didn't understand Christ's position, therefore we have what we have as Islam today.

I feel the same way you do, probably because we're coming from the same place here.

And it's true, you can't be have a Muslim friend and say you 'hate' Islam, they would definatley not like that. You know what's funny, that Muslim friend could even be the most Liberal, or not even care about Islam. But for some weird reason they all hold that identiy card that says "Muslim" on it, and they will, im most cases get offended if you "hate" Islam and let them be aware of it. I can't understand these Mohmmadins.

[repentant]

What's is weird is alot of things the Muslim do, and how they look, they took with them from the Church. Thing's like thier version of what we call a metania, or prostration (on the knees bowing) and also the beards and long hair. It's almost wierd when you look on the TV and see a group of Muslim leaders, they almost look like Orthodox clery, or monks. This also shows how old are Church really is..

[Dominus Fidelis]

One first needs to understand that Islam is a belief system, not a group of human beings. Christ loves all people as does the Church. If you are asking if the Orthodox go as far as the Catholics with this "same God" stuff, the answer would certainly be no.
Yes, thats what I'm asking...

[Bushmaster78FS]

We may not have respect for the religion of Islam, but we are charged with the responsibility to have respect (dare I say love!) for all people as they are made in the image of God.

TELL ME THIS when he is wearing a mask, pointing his AK-47 and shooting at me. :( :( :( :cry:

[Bushmaster78FS]

I can't understand these Mohmmadins.


Don't call him that. :D They get offended by that term nowadays as it resembles "Christians". They have been regarded as Muhammadans for centuries back in early Islamic history as "the followers of Muhammad" but it is not OK to call them because somehow that word means "they worship Muhammad"...

[Bushmaster78FS]

Yes, thats what I'm asking...


As far as I know "same God" stuff is written down in the Cathecism of Catholic Church, and Islam is recognized as an Abrahamic faith, which we believe is wrong, but on the other hand the purpose seems to be peaceful dialogue to me. Pope John Paul's main goal was to establish dialogue with muslims, maybe his idea of introducing them the Gospel, maybe the hopes of having muslims actually listen Christians regarding Christian theology rather than their own imams. This doesn't change the fact that Islam offers no salvation, and Allah is NO GOD AT ALL as Saint Paul put it in his epistles.

[Tsarina]

What's is weird is alot of things the Muslim do, and how they look, they took with them from the Church. Thing's like thier version of what we call a metania, or prostration (on the knees bowing) and also the beards and long hair. It's almost wierd when you look on the TV and see a group of Muslim leaders, they almost look like Orthodox clery, or monks. This also shows how old are Church really is..

It's true, the Muslims can look like Orthodox clergy. The long dark cassocks, beards and hats that they wear. That's why i thought it was important for our Clergy men to wear their pectoral crosses so we don't mix these guys up, lols.

They definatley took the prostrations from our Church, perhaps the headscard thing too, and turned it around in another extreme way.

Don't call him that. :D They get offended by that term nowadays as it resembles "Christians". They have been regarded as Muhammadans for centuries back in early Islamic history as "the followers of Muhammad" but it is not OK to call them because somehow that word means "they worship Muhammad"...

You can't call them anything basically, they get offended by anything and everything.

[irishseventysix]

TELL ME THIS when he is wearing a mask, pointing his AK-47 and shooting at me. :( :( :( :cry:
Hey...it's not like I'm nearly that loving, Bush. But it's what we're all called to. I pray that we all eventually love even under those circumstances.

Christ did under worse.