Religious Tolerance

[Colabomb]

I stumbled upon this site while doing some study on Women's ordination (Every Christians should continually study their faith, even if they end up coming to the same conclusion on things).

This site is called Religious Tolerance? What is tolerant about this article?

http://www.religioustolerance.org/femclrgy.htm

[SumTinWong]

The first thing I noticed that was wrong about the article was they had the LDS as part of the Protestant church. Ummm no they are not even part of any church but their own that i am aware of.

"Gender discrimination will be viewed by many as a millstone around the necks of conservative denominations. It will present a serious barrier to the evangelization of non-Christians. Whenever religious institutions are perceived by the general public as operating to a lower ethical standard than the rest of society, religious conversion becomes more difficult to achieve."
Very true. I and my wife both had issues with this, while I was able to get by it, she was not. When she found out that the Episcopal church was willing to at least listen, she then began to consider it.

I dunno, is it not really a balanced look at the issue for sure but it is a general overview of where certain churches stand in the issue. I do not agree with most of it, but I found it to be eye opening anyway.

[Colabomb]

The first thing I noticed that was wrong about the article was they had the LDS as part of the Protestant church. Ummm no they are not even part of any church but their own that i am aware of.

"Gender discrimination will be viewed by many as a millstone around the necks of conservative denominations. It will present a serious barrier to the evangelization of non-Christians. Whenever religious institutions are perceived by the general public as operating to a lower ethical standard than the rest of society, religious conversion becomes more difficult to achieve."
Very true. I and my wife both had issues with this, while I was able to get by it, she was not. When she found out that the Episcopal church was willing to at least listen, she then began to consider it.

I dunno, is it not really a balanced look at the issue for sure but it is a general overview of where certain churches stand in the issue. I do not agree with most of it, but I found it to be eye opening anyway.
I understand why some accept the ordination of women. That's not my problem.

My problem, is that a site called "Religious Tolerance" is being very intolerant to the conservative Position.

[TomUK]

Do those groups not realise how much damage they are doing to their cause? After a year a so of study i am firmly leaning to an objection of women in the Priesthood. During that time i've across many resources similiar to the one you refer to. I mentioned in a thread a while ago about a book a bought about women in the Priesthood and the general thrust of the argument was that because men are mysoginist (sp?) pigs women should be allowed to become Priests :doh: Thankfully i also managed to find some resources which presented valid, well researched articles arguing the case for women Priests, but it is a shame that some very vocal liberals are making it very difficult for decent dialogue between liberals and conservatives.

[SirTimothy]

The new brand of tolerance is tolerant to everyone except the intolerant. Drives me crazy. Tolerant to all those who have abortions and want to take drugs... but those that take a stand against it, those people who are 'intolerant', they're intolerant to.

[No Swansong]

The new brand of tolerance is tolerant to everyone except the intolerant. Drives me crazy. Tolerant to all those who have abortions and want to take drugs... but those that take a stand against it, those people who are 'intolerant', they're intolerant to.

True so true.

I was once called "intollerable" because I made the statement that I thought all cities should instead of preventing a gay pride parade have a straight pride parade. I mean after all if homosexuals chose to march in a parade to celebrate their sexuality should not heterosexuals have the same option? (Yes I know it was poor logic)

The woman responded that people like me were intollerable. I asked her why I deserved less tolerance than others and she told me that because I chose to be intolerant. (yes her logic was also pretty flawed)

[CSMR]

Do those groups not realise how much damage they are doing to their cause?
Causes are damaged by bad arguments? What a happy view of the world you have!

[Colabomb]

Causes are damaged by bad arguments? What a happy view of the world you have!
Another frustrating problem, is confusing agreement with Tolerance.

I tolerate a lot of things I disagree with.

[SirTimothy]

I was once called "intollerable" because I made the statement that I thought all cities should instead of preventing a gay pride parade have a straight pride parade. I mean after all if homosexuals chose to march in a parade to celebrate their sexuality should not heterosexuals have the same option?

I want to run a straight pride parade.

[Colabomb]

I want to run a straight pride parade.
A couple years ago they had one in Columbus.

[TomUK]

I want to run a straight pride parade.

At univerisity we had societies for lesbians, gays, blacks, chinese, pagans, satan worshippers, transexuals, women and Muslims. However the union told us that we weren't allowed to have a mens society or a Christian society.

[No Swansong]

At univerisity we had societies for lesbians, gays, blacks, chinese, pagans, satan worshippers, transexuals, women and Muslims. However the union told us that we weren't allowed to have a mens society or a Christian society.


Really? What was their justification for such a decision?

[SumTinWong]

I understand why some accept the ordination of women. That's not my problem.

My problem, is that a site called "Religious Tolerance" is being very intolerant to the conservative Position.
Hey before I leave this thread let me just say this...

If you have been treated as a piece of junk because of your skin or your gender raise your hand.

If you have been denied access to basic human rights because of such things, raise your hand.

Yeah this site might not be the most tolerant, but I can guarntee you they are fighting for tolerance, wheras many other "conservative" sites are fighting against it.

There is a bias but it is on both sides not just one or the other. Many people tend to take things to an extreme to make a point, but even a zealot can still make good points but in wrong ways which is what i got from that site.

Go ahead and have a straight parade and look like a fool doing it. STraight people have not had the stuff kicked out of them for being straight.

Women's rights, gay rights, black rights, all of them stemmed from real problems. Have some of these organizations gone too far? Of course, but in teh end blacks and women have gotten the right to vote and to be called citizens here, and right now gays are trying for the same rights in marriage that we are afforded. Good for them.

As far as women in the priesthood, the whole it hasn't been done argument holds no water with me, because I live today not then. If a woman is called by God to lead, let her lead. I f a gay man or woman is called to lead, so be it let them lead. If a liar a thief or an adulterer is called to elad let them lead as well as long as they all are in repentance.

I dunno too many conservatives in this thread for me, I gotta go before I get banned for saying what I really want to say.

[Colabomb]

Hey before I leave this thread let me just say this...

If you have been treated as a piece of junk because of your skin or your gender raise your hand.

If you have been denied access to basic human rights because of such things, raise your hand.

Yeah this site might not be the most tolerant, but I can guarntee you they are fighting for tolerance, wheras many other "conservative" sites are fighting against it.

There is a bias but it is on both sides not just one or the other. Many people tend to take things to an extreme to make a point, but even a zealot can still make good points but in wrong ways which is what i got from that site.

Go ahead and have a straight parade and look like a fool doing it. STraight people have not had the stuff kicked out of them for being straight.

Women's rights, gay rights, black rights, all of them stemmed from real problems. Have some of these organizations gone too far? Of course, but in teh end blacks and women have gotten the right to vote and to be called citizens here, and right now gays are trying for the same rights in marriage that we are afforded. Good for them.

As far as women in the priesthood, the whole it hasn't been done argument holds no water with me, because I live today not then. If a woman is called by God to lead, let her lead. I f a gay man or woman is called to lead, so be it let them lead. If a liar a thief or an adulterer is called to elad let them lead as well as long as they all are in repentance.

I dunno too many conservatives in this thread for me, I gotta go before I get banned for saying what I really want to say.
What possessed you to respond in this manner?

[TomUK]

Really? What was their justification for such a decision?

For the Christian thing it was because we wouldn't allow a non-Christian to be in the committee. Guess who made up the committee of the muslim, hindu, gay committees...

For the mens society i really do not know.

[No Swansong]

What possessed you to respond in this manner?


Agreed.

Cola was just commenting that it was ironic that a group that reportedly espouses tolerance was being intolerant. It was an interesting observation.

[No Swansong]

Hey before I leave this thread let me just say this...

If you have been treated as a piece of **** because of your skin or your gender raise your hand.

If you have been denied access to basic human rights because of such things, raise your hand.

Yeah this site might not be the most tolerant, but I can guarntee you they are fighting for tolerance, wheras many other "conservative" sites are fighting against it.

There is a bias but it is on both sides not just one or the other. Many people tend to take things to an extreme to make a point, but even a zealot can still make good points but in wrong ways which is what i got from that site.

Go ahead and have a straight parade and look like a fool doing it. STraight people have not had the **** kicked out of them for being straight.

Women's rights, gay rights, black rights, all of them stemmed from real problems. Have some of these organizations gone too far? Of course, but in teh end blacks and women have gotten the right to vote and to be called citizens here, and right now gays are trying for the same rights in marriage that we are afforded. Good for them.

As far as women in the priesthood, the whole it hasn't been done argument holds no water with me, because I live today not then. If a woman is called by God to lead, let her lead. I f a gay man or woman is called to lead, so be it let them lead. If a liar a thief or an adulterer is called to elad let them lead as well as long as they all are in repentance.

I dunno too many conservatives in this thread for me, I gotta go before I get banned for saying what I really want to say.


Please read rule 3.3 You can't purposely bypass profanity filters.

Additionally slow down. If you will actually read Cola's posts you will find that he was researching one of these issues that you are going on about. I can assure you that he has done so for almost every issue he has an opinion about on a regular basis.


Have you?

When was the last time you purposely sought out the dissenting opinions to your own in order to better understand? He does it on a regular basis. And yes Columbus had a straight parade and Cola did not attend. His reason? He doesn't see any purpose in inflamming an already volatile issue.

As for the comment concerning conservatives have you read any of the other threads? Currently there is a thread posted by someone who is re-examining their own stance on women's ordination. There is another thread by Cola who has mentioned that he is going to give ECUSA a chance anyway.

Besides there are far fewer conservatives here than liberals.

[SumTinWong]

What possesed me? Intolerance I suppose. The very idea that someone would want to hold a "straight" pride parade because gays have their own parade is in my opinion idiocy and by far missing the point of these parades.

I was responding to his pointing out that a tolerance site wasn't so tolerant (which I agreed to by the way) that it is not uncommon for many of the so called tolerant sites to go to an extreme to make a point. Which this site has done.

As for the rest I can't stand racists, gender biased jerks, and pathetic homophobes, so i guess I let loose with those things on my mind because the people that complain the most about these organizations usually (but not always)harbor some of these traits themselves.

[SumTinWong]

Please read rule 3.3 You can't purposely bypass profanity filters.
I did not bypass anything. I said what I said and it was filtered. If I wanted to bypass the filter I would have disguised the words to say the same thing but in a different manner.

Additionally slow down.

If you will actually read Cola's posts you will find that he was researching one of these issues that you are going on about. I can assure you that he has done so for almost every issue he has an opinion about on a regular basis.
You can assure me that he has? Neat.

Have you?
Yes

When was the last time you purposely sought out the dissenting opinions to your own in order to better understand?
I do it all the time when I visit and read materials from various sources.

He does it on a regular basis. And yes Columbus had a straight parade and Cola did not attend. His reason? He doesn't see any purpose in inflamming an already volatile issue.
Are you his PR person or something?

As for the comment concerning conservatives have you read any of the other threads?
Yes I have.

this is not about colos pointing out the intolerance of that site, my remarks were mainly aimed at the "let's have a straight parade mentality". We clear now?

[No Swansong]

What possesed me? Intolerance I suppose. The very idea that someone would want to hold a "straight" pride parade because gays have their own parade is in my opinion idiocy and by far missing the point of these parades.

Actually I do not consider it idiocy but I do consider it inflammatory. I don't believe that the people who want these straight parades (which Cola did not support by the way) miss the point of gay pride parades, indeed I believe that they understand the point and their answer to this point is demonostrated by having a Straight Parade. Again I do not agree with inflamming an already volatile situation but the fact that they do does not mean they miss the point.

In addition, of the considerable number of homosexuals who I know, most do not support the gay pride parades themselves.


I was responding to his pointing out that a tolerance site wasn't so tolerant (which I agreed to by the way) that it is not uncommon for many of the so called tolerant sites to go to an extreme to make a point. Which this site has done.

So you agree with his point, that it is ironic for a group of people who depend upon a call for tolerance to make their point, to
be intollerant themselves.


As for the rest I can't stand racists, gender biased jerks, and pathetic homophobes, so i guess I let loose with those things on my mind because the people that complain the most about these organizations usually (but not always)harbor some of these traits themselves.

Wow what a completely unbiased, non-prejudicial, statement. So hatred of those who disagree with you is Ok though right?

[No Swansong]

I did not bypass anything. I said what I said and it was filtered. If I wanted to bypass the filter I would have disguised the words to say the same thing but in a different manner.


You can assure me that he has? Neat.


Yes


I do it all the time when I visit and read materials from various sources.


Are you his PR person or something?


No his father I know him better than anyone except God


Yes I have.

this is not about colos pointing out the intolerance of that site, my remarks were mainly aimed at the "let's have a straight parade mentality". We clear now?

He didn't call for the parade I did and I only did so as a method of pointing out the hypocrisy of those who are intollerant of those who they perceive to be intollerant.

[SumTinWong]

So you agree with his point, that it is ironic for a group of people who depend upon a call for tolerance to make their point, to be intollerant themselves.
That is what i said but I also pointed out that the other side who pretend to be unbiased and whatever do it as well.

Wow what a completely unbiased, non-prejudicial, statement. So hatred of those who disagree with you is Ok though right?
I never said I was not biased, I am very biased and I admit it. I never said hate , I do not hate the jerks.

[SumTinWong]

No his father I know him better than anyone except God
Ahhh I see so in a way you are the PR machine. Got it.

He didn't call for the parade I did and I only did so as a method of pointing out the hypocrisy of those who are intollerant of those who they perceive to be intollerant.
I did not say he did, once again I was commenting to the forum using his post as a catapault.

[No Swansong]

Ahhh I see so in a way you are the PR machine. Got it.

No not PR simply coming to his defense. As I always will.


I did not say he did, once again I was commenting to the forum using his post as a catapault.

Your post certainly did not appear to be addressed to the forum in general. It appears to be directed immediately at Cola

[No Swansong]

That is what i said but I also pointed out that the other side who pretend to be unbiased and whatever do it as well.

Except their argument does not depend upon tolerance. The ones here who are being intolerant depend on tolerance to make their point.


I never said I was not biased, I am very biased and I admit it. I never said hate , I do not hate the jerks.

No but you said you can't stand. What is the difference between this and those who say they can't stand homosexuals for example?

[SumTinWong]

No but you said you can't stand. What is the difference between this and those who say they can't stand homosexuals for example?
Hate is a pretty powerful word. To hate something is total abhorrence of that something. If i say i cannot stand broccoi it conveys that I don't like it. If I say I hate broccolli that carries with it a greater emotion.

If someone says I cannnot stand gays and blacks, that person is not as dangerous as the person who says I hate **** and ******s. See what i mean?

I cannot believe I have to spell this out for you...

No not PR simply coming to his defense. As I always will.
Your choice, but you will have to discard that mod hat while doing it as that would throw your bias position in the toilet.

[No Swansong]

Hate is a pretty powerful word. To hate something is total abhorrence of that something. If i say i cannot stand broccoi it conveys that I don't like it. If I say I hate broccolli that carries with it a greater emotion.

I have already admitted you did not say hate.

If someone says I cannnot stand gays and blacks, that person is not as dangerous as the person who says I hate **** and ******s. See what i mean?

I cannot believe I have to spell this out for you...

You don't I understand the difference between what you posted and the word Hate. I used the wrong word I fully admit this. The point I was making is that you can't stand people because they can't stand other people. What is the difference?


Your choice, but you will have to discard that mod hat while doing it as that would throw your bias position in the toilet.

To begin with I have not acted as a moderator here. And being a moderator would not interfere with my coming to his defense. I am permitted to disagree with you and to tell you so. A moderator's main responsibility is to encourage an adherence to the rules of the board in order to further the stated purpose of the board. I would never moderate a thread in which I am an active participant.

[Colabomb]

What possesed me? Intolerance I suppose. The very idea that someone would want to hold a "straight" pride parade because gays have their own parade is in my opinion idiocy and by far missing the point of these parades.

You are allowed an opinion. As am I.

Btw, I did not say I liked the parade, I simply mentioned that it existed. If you noticed, I did not link to it, praise it or encourage it. I kept my views on the parade private. Do not make assumptions.

I was responding to his pointing out that a tolerance site wasn't so tolerant (which I agreed to by the way) that it is not uncommon for many of the so called tolerant sites to go to an extreme to make a point. Which this site has done.

They have made no point other than they believe that my views, and anyone who agress with them, to be bigoted, on par with Racism.



As for the rest I can't stand racists, gender biased jerks, and pathetic homophobes, so i guess I let loose with those things on my mind because the people that complain the most about these organizations usually (but not always)harbor some of these traits themselves.

I am neither a Racist, a gender biased jerk or a homophobe.

I do not believe any of the posters in this thead to be so either. I admit there are self-proclaiming conservatives that are, but I'd be willing to bet that idiots such as Fred Phelps are the minority conservatism. That is why their claims are so sensational, because they are not the norm.

Now, as I am none of the things you mentioned. Can you point out a post in this thread that was Racist, Mysogenist or Homophobic? If not, why did you respond so angrily?

[Colabomb]

Ahhh I see so in a way you are the PR machine. Got it.

I will GLADLY answer for myself. I do not run to daddy looking for a defense. He saw a misunderstanding, and as he has an insight into my personality he commented.

But as that seems to bother you, feel free to ask me any questions so we can clear up the misunderstanding.

[Colabomb]

You used it as a catapult?

So, should I use issues such as women in ordination and acceptance of homosexuality to go off on a rant on revisionism in the Christian church?

No, because I have more respect than that.

[No Swansong]

You used it as a catapult?

So, should I use issues such as women in ordination and acceptance of homosexuality to go off on a rant on revisionism in the Christian church?

No, because I have more respect than that.

I understand your frustration son but it is not the same thing. What Uncle Bud did was use your post as a catapult not an issue. To be fair to him it is not unusual. Although it certainly appears that his comments were directed to you, it is possible that he simply used your post to comment upon the rest of the issues brought up in the thread.

[Colabomb]

His post was unwarranted. The discussion was not attacking his position, only the actions of a particular site.

I admit that there are sites on the conservative side of the aisle that do the same. But this does not justify the hostile tone in what was otherwise a peaceful thread. No one was being attacked.

[Colabomb]

There was no reason to go into a rant about big brother Conservative oppression.

[Colabomb]

Bringing racism into this, is nothing but a pitiful appeal to emotion.

[No Swansong]

There was no reason to go into a rant about big brother Conservative oppression.

Son please do not overreact to his overreaction.

[SumTinWong]

Look I am going to be the grown up here and end this now (as i should have not even bothered to begin with I see that now).

So things are crystal clear:
I never said that Colo was anything, implied that he was anything, or was being intolerant. I responded to his post because he responded to mine. I should have taken to task his father instead who was the first I believe to bring on the straight parade remark. For that misunderstanding i apologize.

For the rest, you guys tell me to calm down and then vomit on me. Nice.

I cannot stand racists, gender biased people and homophobes. What makes me different then them? Simple. I still love them even though I cannot stand them. I love them enough to educate them, and to try and show them where they are wrong in their ideologies about these people. Most of the time their problems are based on stereotypes and myths, and it should be very easy to see why we are different. I cannot stand them but have hopes that i will. They cannot stand because...

Now last but not least and believe me this is the last post from me in this thread.

Bigots are rampant here at CF, whether they be against certain races creeds or genders, they are all bigots. I try and do my best to point out the discrepincies between perception and reality whenever possible.

It should be obvious to all those involved (as it was to you Colo) that a Straight parade would be counter productive and against the very reasoning why these folks have had to have parades to begin with. Because of idiot bigots. They HAVE to come out and shout because for so long they were opressed by the same groups that are now offended (although not as hatefully outwardly) and want to try and "even things up a bit".

So yes this website is supposed to be about intolerance and at some level they are suppsed to be tolerant themselves. But if you are attacked over and over again by conservatives because you embrace and not smack, you too would develop this type of bias.

If I have offended you Colo, I am truly sorry for this. Sometimes in my passion for defending people that I feel are being attacked I take up a broad sweeping sword and end up hitting people that I should not have. In this case I was in the wrong, and i will leave my posts up as a symbol of my ignorance and arrogance, and will ask for yours and the rest of the STR crowd as well.

[No Swansong]

Look I am going to be the grown up here and end this now (as i should have not even bothered to begin with I see that now).

No what you should have done is not posted in a manner that took the form of an attack making accusations that simply did not apply.


So things are crystal clear:

Good I appreciate clarity.

I never said that Colo was anything, implied that he was anything, or was being intolerant. I responded to his post because he responded to mine.

Your post certainly does make implications. Whether they were intended or not only you know. You say that they weren't then I have no reason to not believe you.

Concerning the fact that he responded you are correct he responded to your comments in your post. In fora like this it is not uncommon for these misunderstandings to occur. The best way to avoid them is to not direct comments to individuals intended to be responses to others.



I should have taken to task his father instead who was the first I believe to bring on the straight parade remark. For that misunderstanding i apologize.

It appears you misunderstood that as well. The only reason I mentioned it was to share a story about a woman who was practising the same form of hypocrisy that those on the website that Cola was referring to. Neither Cola nor I defended them, in fact we both consider them inflammatory and counter-productive.

For the rest, you guys tell me to calm down and then vomit on me. Nice.

As far as I know no one other than I asked you to calm down and I can assure you my initial purpose was just to cool the thread. From that point I only responded to you.

I cannot stand racists, gender biased people and homophobes. What makes me different then them? Simple. I still love them even though I cannot stand them.

So point out for me the racist, homophobe or gender biased person on this thread please. You were certainly raging against the wrong people.


I love them enough to educate them, and to try and show them where they are wrong in their ideologies about these people.

And of course you realize that many of them make the same argument?

Most of the time their problems are based on stereotypes and myths, and it should be very easy to see why we are different. I cannot stand them but have hopes that i will. They cannot stand because...

It would be interesting at this point to know how you define a racist, a homophobe and a gender biased person.


Now last but not least and believe me this is the last post from me in this thread.

I hope this isn't true as understanding is important.

Bigots are rampant here at CF, whether they be against certain races creeds or genders, they are all bigots. I try and do my best to point out the discrepincies between perception and reality whenever possible.

Of course you realize that your definition of perception and reality may be completely different from theirs. What makes yours so right that you insist that they change their ideology?


It should be obvious to all those involved (as it was to you Colo) that a Straight parade would be counter productive and against the very reasoning why these folks have had to have parades to begin with. Because of idiot bigots. They HAVE to come out and shout because for so long they were opressed by the same groups that are now offended (although not as hatefully outwardly) and want to try and "even things up a bit".

There is a lot wrong with this comment but this is not the appropriate place to address it.


So yes this website is supposed to be about intolerance and at some level they are suppsed to be tolerant themselves. But if you are attacked over and over again by conservatives because you embrace and not smack, you too would develop this type of bias.

I am sure that everyone who has posted on this thread so far agrees with you prejudice and hatred are not a Christian attitudes. Can you point out one that doesn't?

If I have offended you Colo, I am truly sorry for this. Sometimes in my passion for defending people that I feel are being attacked I take up a broad sweeping sword and end up hitting people that I should not have.

Again it could easily be avoided by differentiating between posters. I think most of this could have been avoided.

In this case I was in the wrong, and i will leave my posts up as a symbol of my ignorance and arrogance, and will ask for yours and the rest of the STR crowd as well.

And I will leave mine up as a symbol of my tendancy to overreact. Is that fair?

[CSMR]

Yeah this site might not be the most tolerant, but I can guarntee you they are fighting for tolerance, wheras many other "conservative" sites are fighting against it.The point is that these people have come up with a notion of "tolerance" which is supposed to be good and used it as a means to be "intolerant" of intolerant people. The notion of tolerance here is contradictory. If you want to say that certain people are "fighting for tolerance" then you need to say what tolerance is first since we only have as yet a contradictory notion that doesn't stand up. Propose your own and we can see if it makes sense and if it is a good or bad thing to fight for.

[Tetzel]

I want to run a straight pride parade.

I don't like the idea of anyone celebrating their sexuality, regardles of orientation. We should not celebrate something that drives so many of us to so much sin. We should mourn it.

Call me up when it's time for the "shame parade" ;)

[RedneckAnglican]

I don't like the idea of anyone celebrating their sexuality, regardles of orientation. We should not celebrate something that drives so many of us to so much sin. We should mourn it.

Call me up when it's time for the "shame parade" ;)

ditto...

[TomUK]

I don't like the idea of anyone celebrating their sexuality, regardles of orientation. We should not celebrate something that drives so many of us to so much sin. We should mourn it.

Call me up when it's time for the "shame parade" ;)

Good point!

[higgs2]

I disagree, it's not something to celebrate or mourn. It is. We don't have "Sense of Smell" parades. We don't mourn our ability to speak, although sin often is involved when we talk. It just is. Shame and pride are both overrated, in my opinion.

[No Swansong]

I disagree, it's not something to celebrate or mourn. It is. We don't have "Sense of Smell" parades. We don't mourn our ability to speak, although sin often is involved when we talk. It just is. Shame and pride are both overrated, in my opinion.

This I can get on board with. You know I have never done a comparative study but it seems to me that the New Testament spends much more time discussing the sins that we commit with our mouths than with the err.... other parts of our body.

[higgs2]

This I can get on board with. You know I have never done a comparative study but it seems to me that the New Testament spends much more time discussing the sins that we commit with our mouths than with the err.... other parts of our body.
What fun to agree! :) :thumbsup: can't rep you again, though.

[john23237]

I don't like the idea of anyone celebrating their sexuality, regardles of orientation. We should not celebrate something that drives so many of us to so much sin. We should mourn it.

Call me up when it's time for the "shame parade" ;)

Human sexuality, including orientation, is a gift of God and used as God intended it, a loving part of the Divine plan. To "mourn" it is to insult God by demeaning one of His many gifts. It is not our sexuality, but rather the abuse of it, that drives so many of us to so much sin. Can that not be said of many of God's gifts? Instead of bewailing one of God's gifts, we should be giving thanks for it and learning to exercise enough self control to use it in the loving fashion for which it was created. Be thankful and have pride in what God has given us. Use it, as we should all we have been given, to His greater glory.