World Methodist Council news

[Morgaine1205]

World Methodists approve further ecumenical dialogue

July 20, 2006

By Joan G. LaBarr*

SEOUL, South Korea (UMNS) - World Methodists have unanimously approved a resolution authorizing further dialogue with the Roman Catholic Church, with the stated aim of "full communion in faith, mission and sacramental life."

The rest of the story can be found here:

http://www.umc.org/site/c.gjJTJbMUIuE/b.1863123/k.FF49/World_Methodists_approve_further_ecumenical_dialogue.htm


What do you think?

[evviva]

What do I think?
I have mixed feelings.
On one hand I think the joint declaration of 1999 doesn't say anything new, so we can subscribe it.
I also believe that we should have friendly realtionships. We are in the third millennium and we certainly can't afford to still be at odd with other Christians.
But on the other hand... ***... I feel very bad. How come they can even think of having full communion? How would it ever be possible? They obey the Pope, pray the saints, worship the Virgin Mary... we all know those things! To have full communion means that we fully recognize each other's doctrine as Christian truth and that their ministers can work in our churches and vice versa! That's horrible! Of course it's not going to happen, but the mere idea is a nightmare.
Besides, let's be honest. They are 1.2 billion and we are 80 million! Guess who is going to give up on issues?
And in fact our delegation was in the first row for the Mass dedicated to the Immaculate Conception of the Virgin Mary (*). But I never heard of the Pope attending a service for the Renewal of the Covenant...

(*) It is the day when the RCC celebrates the dogma of the Virgin Mary being concived by the Holy Spirit in the mother's womb.

[svdbygrace]

I am so happy to see this ecumenical dialoge! :clap:Let us pray that one day our Lord's prayer will be again be fully fulfilled "that they all may be one". :crossrc: :preach: :priest: :liturgy:

[ClementofRome]

We all need a good lesson in Church history.


edited for niceness....I wasn't thinking clearly. Forgive me.

[aigiqinf]

What do I think?
I have mixed feelings.
On one hand I think the joint declaration of 1999 doesn't say anything new, so we can subscribe it.
I also believe that we should have friendly realtionships. We are in the third millennium and we certainly can't afford to still be at odd with other Christians.
But on the other hand... ***... I feel very bad. How come they can even think of having full communion? How would it ever be possible? They obey the Pope, pray the saints, worship the Virgin Mary... we all know those things! To have full communion means that we fully recognize each other's doctrine as Christian truth and that their ministers can work in our churches and vice versa! That's horrible! Of course it's not going to happen, but the mere idea is a nightmare.
Besides, let's be honest. They are 1.2 billion and we are 80 million! Guess who is going to give up on issues?
And in fact our delegation was in the first row for the Mass dedicated to the Immaculate Conception of the Virgin Mary (*). But I never heard of the Pope attending a service for the Renewal of the Covenant...

(*) It is the day when the RCC celebrates the dogma of the Virgin Mary being concived by the Holy Spirit in the mother's womb. Not quite. The catholic church refuses to remove you from its membership rolls unless you die, or are excomminicated. Thereby inflating their membership.

[herev]

MOD HAT ON
look, we kinda get to discuss whatever we want amongst ourselves, but let's be nice
I think the opinions on the world council need to be expressed, but let's not turn this into a Catholic bashing session.
for what it's worth, by the way, Catholics do not worship Mary and to say so is considered extremely insulting.
Let's be good Wesleyans and be polite to our brothers and sisters in Christ
mod hat off

[Morgaine1205]

MOD HAT ON
look, we kinda get to discuss whatever we want amongst ourselves, but let's be nice
I think the opinions on the world council need to be expressed, but let's not turn this into a Catholic bashing session.
for what it's worth, by the way, Catholics do not worship Mary and to say so is considered extremely insulting.
Let's be good Wesleyans and be polite to our brothers and sisters in Christ
mod hat off

Well said! (can I say that about a 'mod hat on' post? :) )

[herev]

Well said!
thanks
(can I say that about a 'mod hat on' post? :) )technically, no, but this is wp, we're all about grace;)

[svdbygrace]

thanks
technically, no, but this is wp, we're all about grace;)

:D ^_^ Well said!

[svdbygrace]

I think our Articles of Religion are a major divide too since most of them are in refrence to pre-Vatican II practice.

[joyfulthanks]

Opinions about this aside, does anybody here really believe that the Catholic Church (who won't even let other Christians receive communion in their church) is really going to someday concelebrate with Methodists?

I think we Methodists would be willing, but I don't think the Catholic Church is gonna' budge on this one unless we agree to somehow come under their authority. I don't forsee the day in my lifetime when a Methodist minister is going to stand in a Catholic Church and offer the sacraments alongside a priest, unless some rogue parish somewhere does it on its own.

-Grace

[markbelieves]

Opinions about this aside, does anybody here really believe that the Catholic Church (who won't even let other Christians receive communion in their church) is really going to someday concelebrate with Methodists?

I think we Methodists would be willing, but I don't think the Catholic Church is gonna' budge on this one unless we agree to somehow come under their authority. I don't forsee the day in my lifetime when a Methodist minister is going to stand in a Catholic Church and offer the sacraments alongside a priest, unless some rogue parish somewhere does it on its own.

-Grace
I don't expect that there will be full communion between the RC and anyone else anytime soon. Right now even a catholic is out of communion if they have commited a mortal sin and have not confessed it at confession with a priest. How would they then allow a Methodist, or any other denom for that matter, participate in communion when they view all of us being in a state of mortal sin?

[ClementofRome]

It seems to me that the RCC and the UMC (esp) are worlds apart in both doctrine, practice and especially socially. Here are just a few sticking points:

-Papal authority
-Male priesthood
-stance on abortion
-transubstantiation

Now those are no small differences. What do you really think is driving this agenda item for the World Methodist Council?

[Artos]

Lets not discuss in ignorance and out of ignorance.

The dialogue with the RCs have been on since the 1960s.Best to read the official dialogue documents first and see what has been agreed as common ground, what are the key issues and what are issues that will probably take a long time to resolve.

The documents of the RC- Methodist dialogue should be available over the internet. (Sorry- I havent checked. Try Google) They are known by names of places where the UMCouncil met egDenver 1971, Dublin 1976 and Honolulu 1981...etc

The most interesting ones are Denver and Dublin. Read it as a basis for discussion of present situation.

Hope it helps.

[Jabronie]

MOD HAT ON
look, we kinda get to discuss whatever we want amongst ourselves, but let's be nice
I think the opinions on the world council need to be expressed, but let's not turn this into a Catholic bashing session.
for what it's worth, by the way, Catholics do not worship Mary and to say so is considered extremely insulting.
Let's be good Wesleyans and be polite to our brothers and sisters in Christ
mod hat off
Thank you.

[silentpoet]

As a man I respect the pope. I believe he is a good man and a decent world leader. However I have even more respect for a former Nazarene district superintendent that I know and would be quicker to listen to him. I do think we need to have communication and as much respect as we can with all faiths. Even those apart from Christianity. But I think we should not let our respect for individuals and their right to worship or not as they see fit influence us more than God's leading in this area.

[a_ntv]

As a man I respect the pope. I believe he is a good man and a decent world leader. However I have even more respect for a former Nazarene district superintendent that I know and would be quicker to listen to him. I do think we need to have communication and as much respect as we can with all faiths. Even those apart from Christianity. But I think we should not let our respect for individuals and their right to worship or not as they see fit influence us more than God's leading in this area.

From a catholic point of view the Methodist Chuch, as the Anglicans, are the nearer to us between protestans.

Other denominations, like Calvinists and Baptists, are really more distant.

But now is impossible to think to a union. Catholic ecumenism is nowadays mainly oriented not toward protestantism, but in fact with the CVII the CC is moving toward Orthodox Churches.
This is surely a right way for us to follow, but the differences with protestants will increase.

[mike1reynolds]

How would it ever be possible? They obey the Pope, pray the saints, worship the Virgin Mary... we all know those things! To have full communion means that we fully recognize each other's doctrine as Christian truth and that their ministers can work in our churches and vice versa!Marian veneration is optional for Catholics, as is veneration of saints, and they get offended if you call it worship. They ask saints and Mary to pray for them rather than praying to them.

The Pope isn’t so very different from whatever the chief justice of the Methodist Judiciary Council is called. We wouldn’t be acknowledging the authority of the Pope any more than they would be acknowledging the authority of the Methodist Judiciary Council.