[open] Question about the word "peace"

[christianmomof3]

I was watching a video of a church conference yesterday and the brother speaking talked about the uniting bond of peace in Eph 4:3, and about how many verses in the Bible tell us that God is the God of peace and that peace is spoken of in so many verses throughout the Bible and Paul's epistles end with peace and Jesus said He leaves His peace with us and anyway, I wondered what the word for peace is that Jesus would have used. Because He spoke Hebrew, right? So, even though the NT was written in Greek, didn't Jesus speak in Hebrew? So, was the word for peace Shalom then? Someone said it might have been Salem - but is that hebrew also or is it Greek? I do not know languages well, but I started thinking about that and am wondering.
Thanks, Dana

[chunkofcoal]

I've been pondering the word Shalom myself recently.
I watched a tv program once called Jewish Jewels and they were discussing the meanings of the Hebrew letters and some of the words - each letter has a meaning and when you look at the letters of a word you can get a different understanding of the word.
When one looks at the letters of Shalom, it means "destroying the authority that holds together chaos."

That gives me a whole new perspective on passages like -
Now the sojourning of the children of Israel, who dwelt in Egypt, was four hundred and thirty years. And it came to pass at the end of the four hundred and thirty years, even the selfsame day it came to pass, that all the hosts of the LORD went out from the land of Egypt.
(Exo 12:40-41)

And:

But when the fullness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law, To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.
(Gal 4:4-5)

And -

For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.
(Rom 5:6)

"In due time" means 'set and proper time'.

And when we start to ponder these things, we can understand this -

To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven: A time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted; A time to kill, and a time to heal; a time to break down, and a time to build up; A time to weep, and a time to laugh; a time to mourn, and a time to dance; A time to cast away stones, and a time to gather stones together; a time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing; A time to get, and a time to lose; a time to keep, and a time to cast away; A time to rend, and a time to sew; a time to keep silence, and a time to speak; A time to love, and a time to hate; a time of war, and a time of peace. What profit hath he that worketh in that wherein he laboreth? I have seen the travail, which God hath given to the sons of men to be exercised in it. He hath made every thing beautiful in his time: also he hath set the world in their heart, so that no man can find out the work that God maketh from the beginning to the end. I know that there is no good in them, but for a man to rejoice, and to do good in his life. And also that every man should eat and drink, and enjoy the good of all his labor, it is the gift of God. I know that, whatsoever God doeth, it shall be forever: nothing can be put to it, nor any thing taken from it: and God doeth it, that men should fear before him.
(Ecc 3:1-14)

The opposite of Shalom/Peace is not "war" but "chaos".
So the God of Peace/Shalom would basically mean "God who destroys the authority that holds together chaos". There is peace in that when you start to understand it and then you can get a new perspective on this passage -

And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose. For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified. What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?
(Rom 8:28-31)

Hope that helps! :)

[debi b]

Shalom is a real BIG word in terms of meaning :D

[plum]

i saw the same program, debi! :thumbsup:

[Henaynei]

so a war that fights to destroy chaos is a war of peace - yes and omeyn! There are certainly plenty purveyors of chaos afoot in the world today and those seeking to bring their activity to an end are excoriated shamelessly :( as men of hatred and viciousness

b'Shalom
Henaynei

[plum]

ok i thought of something after Hen just posted that last part...

Note Phineas' behavior in this passage and what it was in response to:
1 While Israel was staying at Shittim, the people began to have sexual relations with the women of Moab. 2 These invited the people to the sacrifices of their gods, and the people ate and bowed down to their gods. 3 Thus Israel yoked itself to the Baal of Peor, and the Lord's anger was kindled against Israel. 4 The Lord said to Moses, "Take all the chiefs of the people, and impale them in the sun before the Lord, in order that the fierce anger of the Lord may turn away from Israel." 5 And Moses said to the judges of Israel, "Each of you shall kill any of your people who have yoked themselves to the Baal of Peor."
6 Just then one of the Israelites came and brought a Midianite woman into his family, in the sight of Moses and in the sight of the whole congregation of the Israelites, while they were weeping at the entrance of the tent of meeting. 7 When Phinehas son of Eleazar, son of Aaron the priest, saw it, he got up and left the congregation. Taking a spear in his hand, 8 he went after the Israelite man into the tent, and pierced the two of them, the Israelite and the woman, through the belly. So the plague was stopped among the people of Israel. 9 Nevertheless those that died by the plague were twenty-four thousand. 10 The Lord spoke to Moses, saying: 11 "Phinehas son of Eleazar, son of Aaron the priest, has turned back my wrath from the Israelites by manifesting such zeal among them on my behalf that in my jealousy I did not consume the Israelites. 12 Therefore say, "I hereby grant him my covenant of peace. 13 It shall be for him and for his descendants after him a covenant of perpetual priesthood, because he was zealous for his God, and made atonement for the Israelites.' "
In one of the audio commentaries for Torah Club volume 1, something stood out to me. I heard it over a year ago, so forgive my bad memory... what they said was that in all of the Scriptures, the one person specifically called a peacemaker (probably seen in another translation) is this man Phineas who slay two people and killed them. So why would something so violent be called peacemaking? And why would G-d make a covenant of peace (shalom) with Phineas' house?
Well it makes more sense to me that this kind of peacemaking is like fighting against chaos. The sin of the Israelites having relations with Moabitesses was so great, so chaos-causing, so against G-d's Torah... that a violent crime was the way to show G-d that His law judged even unto death. And it brought the end to the plague they experienced and it brought favor upon Phineas.

[Wags]

Yup he smote the moabities - but yet Ruth , who was a moabite is the great grandmother of King David.

Think there might be some importance to that - but that discussion is for another thread.

[Tishri1]

Peace (shalom)

http://www.ancient-hebrew.org/files/27_peace.gif When we hear the word peace we usually associate this to mean an absence of war or strife but, the Hebrew meaning of the word shalom has a very different meaning. The verb form of the root word is shalam and is usually used in the context of making restitution. When a person has caused another to become deficient in some way, such as a loss of livestock, it is the responsibility of the person who created the deficiency to restore what has been taken, lost or stolen. The verb shalam literally means to make whole or complete. The noun shalom has the more literal meaning of being in a state of wholeness or with no deficiency. The common phrase shalu shalom yerushalayim (pray for the peace of Jerusalem) is not speaking about an abcense of war (though that is part of it) but that Jerusalem (and by extension all of Israel) is complete and whole and goes far beyond the idea of "peace".

http://www.ancient-hebrew.org/27_peace.html

[Sephania]

Boy, you guys are all posting my Paleo stuff. But I do have something to add that I was just shown by HaShem recently,regarding Sha'alu Shalom Yerushalyim.

What is the peace of Jerusalem? It's restoration to G-ds throne, to His Holy mountain is it not? And when will that happen, can we make it happen? Only when the Prince of Shalom comes will it happen.

The peace in Jerusalem will not come until She as a whole accepts the Sar Shalom, Yeshua.

When he came the first time it was not to bring peace but a sword, but when he comes again it will to usher in that longed for peace by many a many generation.

[Henaynei]

awesome posts people!

[MattyJames]

ok i thought of something after Hen just posted that last part...

Note Phineas' behavior in this passage and what it was in response to:

In one of the audio commentaries for Torah Club volume 1, something stood out to me. I heard it over a year ago, so forgive my bad memory... what they said was that in all of the Scriptures, the one person specifically called a peacemaker (probably seen in another translation) is this man Phineas who slay two people and killed them. So why would something so violent be called peacemaking? And why would G-d make a covenant of peace (shalom) with Phineas' house?
Well it makes more sense to me that this kind of peacemaking is like fighting against chaos. The sin of the Israelites having relations with Moabitesses was so great, so chaos-causing, so against G-d's Torah... that a violent crime was the way to show G-d that His law judged even unto death. And it brought the end to the plague they experienced and it brought favor upon Phineas.

Beautifully said Eirene. This reminds me of the Old "Colt .45" or better know as "The Peacemaker" ;) .

And what about "Blessed are the Peacemakers, for they shall be called the Sons of God." Matt 5. Very telling verse I think.

Not a bad thread guys. :thumbsup:

Shalom in Messiah.

Matt James

[Sephania]

That was then , this is now. It was all to keep the purity of Israel before Messiah. Now we are to die to ourselves, put off the things of the world, each must do this to have Yeshua's peace reign within them.

[debi b]

Abraham is a fabulous example of how to deny yourself.

Matt 8:11 (Yeshua talking) And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven.

According to Yeshua Abraham is in the kingdom of heaven (so are Isaac and Jacob :) )

John 8:36 (Yeshua talking) Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw, and was glad.

According to Yeshua Abraham understood the need for Messiah. He also made souls in Haran ;)

Rev 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Hbr 4:3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.


Re-examine Abraham and his life with the backdrop of die to yourself and it is a different read. If then the understanding is this, it has always been the path :D

[christianmomof3]

I watched a tv program once called Jewish Jewels and they were discussing the meanings of the Hebrew letters and some of the words - each letter has a meaning and when you look at the letters of a word you can get a different understanding of the word.
When one looks at the letters of Shalom, it means "destroying the authority that holds together chaos."


The opposite of Shalom/Peace is not "war" but "chaos".
So the God of Peace/Shalom would basically mean "God who destroys the authority that holds together chaos". There is peace in that when you start to understand it and then you can get a new perspective on this passage -

Hope that helps! :)

Thank you! I have never heard that before! That is very interesting!

[christianmomof3]

ok i thought of something after Hen just posted that last part...

Note Phineas' behavior in this passage and what it was in response to:

In one of the audio commentaries for Torah Club volume 1, something stood out to me. I heard it over a year ago, so forgive my bad memory... what they said was that in all of the Scriptures, the one person specifically called a peacemaker (probably seen in another translation) is this man Phineas who slay two people and killed them. So why would something so violent be called peacemaking? And why would G-d make a covenant of peace (shalom) with Phineas' house?
Well it makes more sense to me that this kind of peacemaking is like fighting against chaos. The sin of the Israelites having relations with Moabitesses was so great, so chaos-causing, so against G-d's Torah... that a violent crime was the way to show G-d that His law judged even unto death. And it brought the end to the plague they experienced and it brought favor upon Phineas.
That is interesting! I did not realize that Phineas was called a peacemaker. What is the verse reference for that? It reminds me of one of my favorite women in the Bible - Jael, who killed an enemy by feeding him and then stabbing him through the temple with a tent stake while he was sleeping and she was later called blessed among women.

[christianmomof3]

Thank you for all the wonderful replies! Does anyone know what the word for peace was that the Lord Jesus actually said in the New Testament?

[Henaynei]

Thank you for all the wonderful replies! Does anyone know what the word for peace was that the Lord Jesus actually said in the New Testament?"Shalom"

[christianmomof3]

"Shalom"
That is what I thought. The definition helps it to make more sense. Thank you!

[Sephania]

Do you know Haveinu Shalom Alecheim?
'
If not go here to hear to hear it :) http://twilightbridge.com/festivals/hanukkah/midi.htm

Second from bottom left column


Shalom Chaverim - Heveinu Shalom Aleichem

Peace, my friends, till we meet again. Let us have peace.

Actually in the book of John (chapter 20:19-)Yeshua says just this to his Talmidim, until we meet again ( isn't that wonderful, he was telling them they would see him again! ) and giving his peace.

Wonderful!



APPEARANCE TO DISCIPLES IN YERUSHALAYIM
Then that same day at evening, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the leaders of the Yehudim, Yeshua appeared and stood among them.
"Shalom aleichem," He said to them, and told them how displeased He was that they did not trust the report of those who had seen Him after He arose. But, they thought they were seeing a ghost.
So, Yeshua said, "Why are you troubled? Why do you think that way? See my hands and my feet. It is I! Touch me and see. A ghost does not have flesh and bones as you see I have."
When He showed them His hands and His side, the disciples celebrated.Yet they still were doubting in amazement.
They were all sitting at dinner. Yeshua said, "Do you have anything to eat?" They gave Him a piece of broiled fish, and He ate it in front of them. "Shalom aleichem," Yeshua said to them again. "As Abba has sent me, so I send you the same way." Then He breathed out on them and commanded, "You will receive the Ruach HaKodesh! Whose sins you send away, they will be sent away from them. Whom you strengthen, they are strengthened."

[christianmomof3]

Do you know Haveinu Shalom Alecheim?
'
If not go here to hear to hear it :) http://twilightbridge.com/festivals/hanukkah/midi.htm

Second from bottom left column


Actually in the book of John (chapter 20:19-)Yeshua says just this to his Talmidim, until we meet again ( isn't that wonderful, he was telling them they would see him again! ) and giving his peace.

Wonderful!
Thank you - I knew the song growing up - and there is a dance to it I think if I remember correctly - but I never knew the meaning of it - like most things I learned in my Reform Jewish upbringing - they were never concerned about the meaning of things it seemed - it was just do it because it is a Jewish thing to do. :sigh:

[Sephania]

Sounds like my Rabbi,

Rabbi, why do we do _______?

Why? Because it's Tradition!

:)

[christianmomof3]

Sounds like my Rabbi,

Rabbi, why do we do _______?

Why? Because it's Tradition!

:)
That is what I grew up with and that has never been a good enough reason for me. I want to know why is it a tradition? What is it based on, where did it come from and what is it's meaning?
My oldest dd who is 13 takes after me in that way and she is driving me crazy just like I probably did to adults when I was young. Even now, I am sure I ask to many questions for some people's liking. :o

[Henaynei]

Sounds like my Rabbi,

Rabbi, why do we do _______?

Why? Because it's Tradition!

:)Tradition that glorifies HaShem and that reinforce His instructions are a great blessing :) The Rabbis would applaud the desire to know more both about Torah and Tradition - such study with a humble heart can only lead to greater kavannah!:thumbsup: