Truth

[Yehoshua]

Question from Chabad.org: Ask the Rabbi:
As a rabbi, I assume you believe that Judaism is THE truth. If so, how do you explain the fact that there are so many other religions, and only a tiny minority of the world's population believes as you do?
Jim (a Christian Missionary)
Answer:
Jim, do you have brothers and sisters? If you do, I'm sure you'll agree that each of you is different. One of you may be musical, another a sports freak, and yet another more academically inclined. Each of you is an individual, and that should be encouraged. It would be wrong of parents to treat all their kids the same. If they would have forced you all to play violin, or soccer, or to read Shakespeare it would have been counter-productive. Good parents know that each child has to be allowed to develop in their own unique way.
The nations of the world are all G-d's children. He doesn't treat them all the same because they aren't all the same. He wants each nation to develop in its own way. So each nation has a different path to reach their full potential. To the Jewish nation he gave the Torah as our way of expressing our souls. But Judaism is not for everyone. We don't believe that a non-Jew needs to become Jewish to find G-d. Just like a musically-talented child shouldn't be forced to play soccer. Anyone is welcome to convert, but that is up to them.
G-d created different nations because each has a unique contribution to offer the world. Maybe your "mission" should be to ensure that your nation fulfils that purpose.



I was wondering if there is such a person as a Jewish fundamentalist, the way that there are those folks in Christianity and Islam? If so, what percent of Jews would or could be classified as Fundamentalist? And, what would their core beliefs be?
Answer:
I'm not sure what your definition of fundamentalist is, but here's mine: A fundamentalist is someone who believes that theirs is the only true path, and anyone who does not follow their ways is evil. The fundamentalist sees only two options for the rest of humanity - join us or suffer the consequences. Other nations are there to either missionize or destroy, and any belief system that does not conform with theirs is to be eradicated.
A fundamentalist is not the same as an extremist. There are those who are passionate or even extreme about their own beliefs, whether a born-again Christian, devout Muslim, radical liberal or die-hard atheist. We can debate the pros and cons of each of these belief systems, but a strong conviction alone doesn't make you a fundamentalist. It is when you cannot accept that there may be another road to truth, that not everyone has to fit in to your own world view - that is when you have strayed into the realm of fundamentalism.
For this reason, Judaism can never tolerate fundamentalism. Quite simply, we don't believe that Judaism is for everyone. Jewish thought is comfortable with the belief that there are many paths to G-d; Judaism is the path for Jews, and non-Jews can find Him in different ways. They can live a moral and good life without keeping the laws or sharing the beliefs of Judaism. Anyone can join Judaism by converting, but this is not necessary - a non-Jew can be fulfilled, close to G-d, and earn a place in heaven without becoming Jewish. I think it is this universalistic approach that has saved Judaism from the plague of fundamentalism.
Don't get me wrong - there are certainly Jewish extremists, ratbags, troublemakers and whackos. But I don't know of any significant group of Jewish fundamentalists. Judaism poses a challenge to the fundamentalist: If you really love G-d so much, shouldn't you also love all His children, who are created in His image?


Is this the prevalent view in orthodox Judaism? I can't believe this is an acceptable viewpoint in any sense, philosophically or logically. It's like saying Nazism was just the German's people way to God or Paganism to the barbarians and so forth. Thankfully we have Yeshua's provocative statement: "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."

[visionary]

Is this the prevalent view in orthodox Judaism? I can't believe this is an acceptable viewpoint in any sense, philosophically or logically. It's like saying Nazism was just the German's people way to God or Paganism to the barbarians and so forth. Thankfully we have Yeshua's provocative statement: "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."Thankfully, we do have Yeshua's perspective that No one comes to the Father except through me....John 10:4 And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice....27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:He also said they know Him because they know His voice, not necessarily His name, and they are obedient to the voice. SO while they are scattered throughout nations, kingdoms, and religions, their heart speaks to them of the one who they are to follow, and they hear the Lord's voice and follow. We can not separate the wheat from the tares, nor can we sometimes distinquish who is the Lord's. That is why we are to love them all and understand there is many paths that lead to God. God may have to use nation and experience to speak to the heart of the hearer and lead them home, while others were lead by the Word of God and the Holy Spirit in a religious fashion. If more people were allowing God to do the evanglism, and obedient to His voice, then everyone will come to the place where... Isaiah 2:3 And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the house of the God of Jacob; and HEwill teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem.

[HaNotsri]

Yehoshua, that is a simplified version.

It is true that Judaism says that non-Jews do not need to convert (and thereby, become a full-fledged Jew) in order to achieve any sort of "salvation." God gave the Torah to the children of Israel and is a special obligation only to them. According to Judaismk, non-Jews can have be in the right with God by following the universal laws given to Noach after the flood, the sheva mitsvos shel B'nei Noach (the seven mitsvos of the children of Noah). These are seven basic principles that are characterstic of a just society and of a just individual. Within them, they contain just under 70 of the 613 mistvos in the Torah. The principles are:

1. To believe in only the One God of Israel
2. To not blaspheme the Divine Name
3. To not murder
4. To not be a thief
5. To be sexually moral
6. To set up a courts of law and justice
7. To not eat a limb off of a live animal (basically to treat God's creations with respect)

As I said these are the seven main principles, but they actually contain almost 70 of 613 mitsvos in the Torah. Sexual morality itself contain several different mitsvos.

To staive off the idea of universalism, halachically (according to Ramb"m I believe), a non-Jew would only be considered righteous according to these standards and have a place in Olam Haba'a if He believes that these standards a specifically God-given and Torah-truth. It's not enough simply to believe in some other religion (i.e. Islam and Christianity, the Christianity is a whole other story) that encompasses most if not all of those seven principles. Why? Because you are not trusting then that the 7 mistvos are min Shamayim (from Heaven). So universalism doesn't exist in Judaism either, however that doesn't mean a non-Jew must convert to Judaism for "salvation."

For the record (which may contradict what I stated above), most Orthodox authorities put Islam in a better position as far as truth goes than they do Christianity. Islam is strict monotheism, whereas in Christianity we believe in a trinity, three persons as one God. This concept provides a problem for both Orthodox Jews and Moslems. As does the belief that Jesus (a man) is God. Some Jewish authorities consider it shituf which is sort of a partnership with God and is sometimes an acceptable form of avodah zora (idol worship) for gentiles, but not Jews. Some consider straight avodah zora that is unacceptable for even gentiles. Nevertheless, one of the commentaries suggested that the advent of Christianity and Islam was a way of leading the pagan, idolatrous nations to the ultimate truth of the One God of Israel.

I hope that helps a little

Michael

[Sephania]

According to that definition above, Yeshua was a Radical Jewish Fundamentalist, and so were his Talmidim, and that Rabbi Sha'ul, well, he must be the most radical of all in Judaism.

:)

[Sephania]

HaNotzri, that is not what the Rabbi above is saying, in stating this:


For this reason, Judaism can never tolerate fundamentalism. Quite simply, we don't believe that Judaism is for everyone. Jewish thought is comfortable with the belief that there are many paths to G-d; Judaism is the path for Jews, and non-Jews can find Him in different ways.

He is dangerously bordering on New Age beliefs,totally not in line with true Judaism.


Jewish thought is comfortable with the belief that there are many paths to G-d; Judaism is the path for Jews, and non-Jews can find Him in different ways.



I am the Path ( way) , the truth and the light - Yeshua circa 30CE

And what is that way??

Narrow is the way ( straight is the gate) which leads to life, and few find it. - Yeshua circa 30 CE

[Yehoshua]

It seems as though Judaism once was a proselytizing religion: Matthew 23:15 "Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrities! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when he becomes one, you make him twice as much a son of hell as you are."

And note also The Way's universalism, not just within their own realm.

Galatians 3:7 Understand, then, that those who believe are children of Abraham. 8The Scripture foresaw that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, and announced the gospel in advance to Abraham: "All nations will be blessed through you."[a (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=55&chapter=3&verse=7&end_verse=9&version=31&context=context#fen-NIV-29095a)] 9So those who have faith are blessed along with Abraham, the man of faith.



Colossians 1:26 the mystery that has been kept hidden for ages and generations, but is now disclosed to the saints. 27To them God has chosen to make known among the Gentiles the glorious riches of this mystery, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory. 28We proclaim him, admonishing and teaching everyone with all wisdom, so that we may present everyone perfect in Christ.


Romans 3:29 Is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles too? Yes, of Gentiles too,


I could go on and on with quotes but I think the point is clear. I guess I was just baffled by the above statements from the supposed Ultra-Orthodox Chabad. Jesus said not to hide a lamp under a bowl or bed, but on a stand where the light can be seen by all.

[HaNotsri]

I think because you don't know the background surrounding what he's trying to imply, you are jumping to conclusions as to what you think he's saying. I bet you talked to that same rabbi and went a little more indepth and brought up some of the points that I said in my post, he will clarify his position to you more in much the same way I stated above

[ChavaK]

Is this the prevalent view in orthodox Judaism? I can't believe this is an acceptable viewpoint in any sense, philosophically or logically. It's like saying Nazism was just the German's people way to God or Paganism to the barbarians and so forth. Thankfully we have Yeshua's provocative statement: "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."
Actually, this is the view in all streams of Judaism.
Notice he says moral people have a path to G-d
without following Torah. The nazi's would hardly
qualify. The righteous of all nations have a place
in Olam Habah,,,,

[Talmidah]

Is this the prevalent view in orthodox Judaism?

Yes

[AlanGurvey]

Yehoshua-Is this the prevalent view in orthodox Judaism? IT IS THE VIEW OF JUDAISM

I can't believe this is an acceptable viewpoint in any sense, Thats up to you, if you want a G-d who sends the righteous unbelievers to hell so be it.

philosophically or logically. It's like saying Nazism was just the German's people way to God or Paganism to the barbarians and so forth. Nazism is purely negative, and Paganism isnt a way to god, but a way to live ones life to be worthy of salvation

Thankfully we have Yeshua's provocative statement: "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."
And heres where the name, Messianic Christianity comes in.:wave:

[Sephania]

Heard something interesting today.

'Pay me now or Pay me later.' :scratch: huh?

From a commercial, but a good way of expressing in todays language what was written almost 2,000 years ago by a Rabbi that studied under Gamiliel .:)

Do nothing out of rivalry or vanity; but, in humility, regard each other as better than yourselves - look out for each other's interests and not just for your own. Let your attitude toward one another be governed by your being in union with the Messiah Yeshua: Though he was in the form of G-d, he did not regard equality with G-d something to be possessed by force. On the contrary, he emptied himself, in that he took the form of a slave by becoming like human beings are. And when he appeared as a human being, he humbled himself still more by becoming obedient even to death - death on a stake as a criminal! Therefore G-d raised him to the highest place and gave him the name above every name; that in honor of the name given Yeshua, every knee will bow - in heaven, on earth and under the earth and every tongue will acknowledge that Yeshua the Messiah is ADONAI - to the glory of G-d the Father.

And more recently by a well known Messianic Artist:

The haughty man is humbled
The lofty one brought low
For the L-rd alone will be exalted in that day
When every knee shall bow
And every tongue confess
That Yeshua is the L-rd unto the glory of G-d.........

Come house of Jacob let us walk in the Light................walk in the Light of the L-RD.