Why the Ancient Way?

[Vedant]

Why is this forum called the Ancient Way?

I don't understand.

Please explain.

Thanks!

[xristos.anesti]

Before the city of Antioch where Christians first stared being called Christians, the system of our faith was called THE WAY.

So, it stands to a reason for us who follow that ancient system of faith to have a forum called The Ancient Way.

[InnerPhyre]

Why the Ancient Way? Why NOT the Ancient Way? :)

[Michael the Iconographer]

Orthodox Christianity professes the Ancient Faith in Jesus Christ, as professed by the Apostles. Very little has been added to the faith since that time, and we have kept it preserved for 2000+ years.

[EricTheRed]

Old School

[Dust and Ashes]

Old School

:D :thumbsup:

[Dewi Sant]

Old School
^_^

[Monica, child of God]

Its like that orange juice commercial says: Simply Unfooled Around With.

Orthodox Christianity is pure, ancient Christianity. No reformation necessary.

M.

[Dewi Sant]

:amen: Its like that orange juice commercial says: Simply Unfooled Around With.

Orthodox Christianity is pure, ancient Christianity. No reformation necessary.

M.

[Vedant]

Orthodox Christianity professes the Ancient Faith in Jesus Christ, as professed by the Apostles. Very little has been added to the faith since that time, and we have kept it preserved for 2000+ years.

How do you know that?

[Oblio]

Why is this forum called the Ancient Way?

I don't understand.

Please explain.

Thanks!


Because the founding Fathers and Mothers of TAW deemed it so ;)

Welcome to TAW :)

[eoe]

How do you know that?
It is a matter of historical fact.

[choirfiend]

Because the same teachings have been taught that whole time, unchanged, and this is proveable through the writings of those who are believers, from the Apostles in their Gospels and Epistles to the letters and statements of the men they taught, straight on down the line. What James, Peter, Paul, Matthew, etc taught about Christ as they traveled, beginning communities of believers, is the same thing that we still teach about Christ. It was never changed, Truth preserved uncorrupt in spite of corruptable and corrupting men because the Holy Spirit was sent to guide into ALL truth, not just some, and Truth, who is Christ, cannot be corrupted in the community of believers which has Christ as its head.

[moses916]

How do you know that?

If you diligently study early church history, you'll come to realize which Church is true. :)

[Prawnik]

Because our Bishops were ordained by earlier Bishops, going back in an unbroken chain to the time of the Apostles. You will often hear us refer to this as "Apostolic Succession". A valid Bishop may ever only have been ordained as Bishop by someone who is part of that chain. This perpetuates Apostolic Succession.

To be an Orthodox Priest, one must be ordained as a Priest by a Bishop who has Apostolic Succession.

Apostolic Succession is one of the things that ensures that what the Orthodox Church teaches today does not contradict that which was taught before, all the way back to the time of Christ. Some minor additions have occured, but nothing that contradicts the Bible and early Church teachings.

The Church's other major protection against innovation and error is that much of the early Church's teachings were written down. Those writings survive today. Other Church teachings have been preserved in the form of unwritten Traditions. We can compare what a Priest or Bishop teaches today with what was taught before.

[knee-v]

How do you know that?

With the church we have the luxery of not requiring books ABOUT it's history; we can read ITS HISTORY as it happened. Instead of reading a book about the 3rd century of the church, we can read the writings that were written in the 3rd century. Same with the 1st century. Same with the 5th. Same with the 10th. Same with the 15th. Same with the 20th. Same with today. And what you will find is a Truth that has been professed unchanged from the earliest days till now. Others may have departed from it, but it has remained.

[Vedant]

Where can I read this history?

I'm intrigued.

[Vedant]

One more question...

Why are you called Eastern Orthodox instead of The Way, the way ancient Christians called themselves?

[Monica, child of God]

This is a good online source for starters at least:

The Orthodox Faith (http://www.oca.org/OCorthfaith.asp?SID=2)

[Monica, child of God]

Perhaps this would be a good chapter to start reading: The First Century (http://www.oca.org/OCchapter.asp?SID=2&ID=134)

[Monica, child of God]

I thought of another good introduction to what we are talking about Finding the New Testament Church (http://www.protomartyr.org/finding.html)

M.

[choirfiend]

Well, Christians called what they did The Way....then they were called Christians....Then, there was a split in Christianity. A group left, and the rest continued doing as they had been for the first 1000 years of Christianity. The group that left is called Roman Catholic today, and the group that remained needed a term to differentiate themselves from the other Christians who wished to follow another way. The word Orthodox means "right belief" and "right worship." Literally, it means, "right glory," but belief and worship are what constitutes right glory. So the people who knew the Way, and then were known as Christians, now are known as Orthodox Christians. We are called Eastern because geographically, we remained in lands that were farther east, and Rome took the West. We are the second largest church organization in the world, and the best kept secret in America:) But that's all changing as more and more people become dissatisfied with Christianity as they know it and look to the New Testament Church for answers--only to discover that it never disappeared, and is indeed alive and well.

[Vedant]

I want to cry, I don't know why, all of a sudden.

Maybe it's the orthodox concept of sin I just read about is something I've felt in my heart since I was a kid, but I always thought it was my own personal invention.

I guess I'm not that original, heh.

I don't know about the orthodox way, but the concept of sin being EXACTLY the same way I've always felt about it but never read anywhere up until 5 minutes ago was a really unique experience.

[Vedant]

That last article was amazing. Isn't it written in Revelation about 1,000 years of Jesus' reign?

[Vedant]

It's very interesting to look at church history...the first 1,000 years. Much that I've read about Roman Catholicism cites things after the great schism. Thomas Aquinas, e.g.

[Vedant]

I have another question.

After the splitting of the churches into Roman Catholics and Eastern Orthodox, have there been any significant breaks away from the Eastern Orthodox tradition.

That is, in the past millenium (around 800-900 years ago), have there been "protestant" churches born out of the Eastern Orthodox church?

I've just come to a realization that most if not all protestant religions have been born out of the Roman Catholic church, and not the Eastern Orthodox church. Can anyone help me with this?

I really didn't expect this to happen...wow.

[moses916]

No there have not been any protestant movements from the Eastern Orthodox Church, but there have been some wacky schismatics who create small sects here and there from the Church. Avoid them at all costs, they are very Orthodox on the outside but inside (lets leave it at that).... :)

[Prawnik]

It is not at all clear whether the Revelation was meant to be taken literally, and if not, how much. Remember, there are some 20,000 protestant denominations, all of whom read the Bible, and all of which have differing beliefs. New denominations literally appear daily. Many, if not most of those 20,000 claim to be based solely on a literal reading of the Bible. And no two denominations can agree on literal meaning of the Bible.

W/r/t the specific passage you quoted: "1000 years" may have been intended to signify "a very long time" to the target audience of Revelations.

Best to refer to what the Church Fathers had to say on the subject. Remember, they were holier than we are, and most lived at a time much closer to when Revelations was written, so their insight into its meaning is presumably clearer.

[Vedant]

It is not at all clear whether the Revelation was meant to be taken literally, and if not, how much. Remember, there are some 20,000 protestant denominations, all of whom read the Bible, and all of which have differing beliefs. New denominations literally appear daily. Many, if not most of those 20,000 claim to be based solely on a literal reading of the Bible. And no two denominations can agree on literal meaning of the Bible.

W/r/t the specific passage you quoted: "1000 years" may have been intended to signify "a very long time" to the target audience of Revelations.

Best to refer to what the Church Fathers had to say on the subject. Remember, they were holier than we are, and most lived at a time much closer to when Revelations was written, so their insight into its meaning is presumably clearer.

You're right. Amateurs shouldn't be allowed such great authority, in ANY discipline. I wouldn't trust amateur economists to make sure our economy runs smoothly. I wouldn't want a first-year med student to operate on me. So I'm completely with you on leaving it to professionals to interpret the Bible. I just thought it was interesting.

[eoe]

I don't know about the orthodox way, but the concept of sin being EXACTLY the same way I've always felt about it but never read anywhere up until 5 minutes ago was a really unique experience.
amazing huh?

Want to really have your mind blown? Read THIS (http://www.spurgeon.org/%7Ephil/history/ath-inc.htm) and THIS. (http://www.orthodoxinfo.com/inquirers/christcross.aspx)

You have just set foot an a path that will show you some amazing things. Keep asking questions. The truth can stand up to questions.

That is, in the past millenium (around 800-900 years ago), have there been "protestant" churches born out of the Eastern Orthodox church?
The churches of Jerusalem (http://www.jerusalem-patriarchate.org/intro.asp), Antioch (http://www.antiochian.org/), Alexandria (http://www.greekorthodox-alexandria.org/main.htm) and Constantinople (http://www.ec-patr.gr/) are all still in existance today and are all in communion with each other.
There have been some insignificant splinters but nothing at all like the protestant reformation and subsequent shattering of protestant christainity.

I've just come to a realization that most if not all protestant religions have been born out of the Roman Catholic church, and not the Eastern Orthodox church. Can anyone help me with this?
You got it my friend. Even the most staunch Lutheran or Calvinist has been affected by Roman additions to doctrine. Baptists Methodists whatever - they all came from Rome.
Heavy eh?

I really didn't expect this to happen...wow.
I found all ths out last August. Not only did I not expect to find this all out but I did not want to. IT hurt like mad too.
Much that I've read about Roman Catholicism cites things after the great schism.
That is because it did not exist before the schism. Of course the RC will disagree. The fact is that there was one Church before 1054. That church was concilliar and based upon the ecumenical councils with 5 main patriarchs as equals.

[choirfiend]

No, there hasn't been a Protestant movement from the Orthodox Church. There was another separation earlier, when the RCC and the EOC were still one in belief and communion, that occurred when there was a disagreement about the natures of Christ in 451 AD. Those that didn't follow the stated beliefs of the Church at that time are known as Oriental Orthodox. They have continued in the faith they had at the time (the 4th ecumenical council). We look forward to reunion with them when we agree on this important matter of Christ, kind of like we look forward to reunion with the RCC when we agree on a handful of teachings...but it looks a little more likely with the Oriental Orthodox.

Otherwise, it's pretty much been just those two big groups branching off--and the OO have stayed the same as they were in 451, pretty much. From an Orthodox viewpoint, the RCC has changed a lot since then, and from the same viewpoint, the Protestant groups that broke away from the RCC have changed more than a lot. mucho mucho mas!

[Vedant]

Does anyone know where I can find out about each of the orthodox churches in full communion with each other and the constantine church?

[Monica, child of God]

Are you looking to attend an Orthodox Church to see our services? If so, let us know which country and area you are in and we may be able to find something.

If you want a list of Orthodox Churches in communion with each other, I know that a list exists but I would have to look for it.

M.

[Michael the Iconographer]

How do you know that?

By comparing what is taught by the Orthodox Church to what is taught in the Apostolic Fathers of the Church.

[Akathist]

I;m sending a pm to you with links to Orthodox Churches in your city. All of them are truely Eastern Orthodox.

[eoe]

Does anyone know where I can find out about each of the orthodox churches in full communion with each other and the constantine church?
The names of the churches in my prior post are links to them. HERE (http://www.scoba.us/) is a website that gives a non-exclusive list (http://www.scoba.us/jurisdictions/) of Jurisdictions - SCOBA. Understand that while there may be some cultural differences in these churches - they all share the exact same faith.

If you are interested in early church fathers HERE (http://www.ccel.org/fathers2/) is a source for them too.

Keep those questions coming.

[OrthodoxyUSA]

Why is this forum called the Ancient Way?

I don't understand.

Please explain.

Thanks!

The Othodox are the most Ancient Churches in Christianity.

For instance, I belong to the Church of Antioch.... established 34 AD... found in ACTS 11.

Were still here!
Forgive me.....:liturgy:

[OrthodoxyUSA]

Lot's of good links on my website if you wish.

Forgive me...

[Dust and Ashes]

The Othodox are the most Ancient Churches in Christianity.

For instance, I belong to the Church of Antioch.... established 34 AD... found in ACTS 11.

Were still here!
Forgive me.....:liturgy:

I believe the address is in Damascus on Straight Street, right?

[Happy Orthodox]

For instance, I belong to the Church of Antioch.... established 34 AD... found in ACTS 11.

Were still here!

This is what really blows my mind!!!:crosseo:

[OrthodoxyUSA]

I believe the address is in Damascus on Straight Street, right?

Ah yes...

ACTS 9, the Baptism of Paul...

Straight Street, Damascus...

Forgive me....:liturgy:

[OrthodoxyUSA]

This is what really blows my mind!!!:crosseo:

Don't it though?

Forgive me...:liturgy:

[Vedant]

The Othodox are the most Ancient Churches in Christianity.

For instance, I belong to the Church of Antioch.... established 34 AD... found in ACTS 11.

Were still here!
Forgive me.....:liturgy:

This is what makes me cry.

I feel like I have amnesia.

I feel like I'm so disconnected.

I read a few more things that explained the structure and practice of the church using only the Bible instead of annoying dogma.

[MariaRegina]

This is what makes me cry.

I feel like I have amnesia.

I feel like I'm so disconnected.

I read a few more things that explained the structure and practice of the church using only the Bible instead of annoying dogma.

What do you mean?

Dogmas developed because of heretics. The church came together in its first council at the Council of Jerusalem as recorded in the Acts of the Apostles in your Bible. There they condemned as heretics those who were called Judaizers.

[RobNJ]

This is what makes me cry.

I feel like I have amnesia.

I feel like I'm so disconnected.

I read a few more things that explained the structure and practice of the church using only the Bible instead of annoying dogma.

But "only the Bible" without Holy Tradition, the Fathers, and the fullness of Orthodoxy IS to be "disconnected"... Find a Orthodox church & experience Divine Liturgy!! :amen:

[OrthodoxyUSA]

What do you mean?

Dogmas developed because of heretics. The church came together in its first council at the Council of Jerusalem as recorded in the Acts of the Apostles in your Bible. There they condemned as heretics those who were called Judaizers.

His eyes have been opened... The light makes you cry the first time you see it.:cry: :clap:

Forgive me....:liturgy:

[Vedant]

I have another question. I've been reading as much as I can about orthodox Christianity. Some of it has struck an awesome chord with me, other parts I don't feel the same way.

In this article: http://www.orthodoxinfo.com/praxis/selfabuse.aspx

It says that "sexuality is a part of our fallen nature".

Can one be orthodox if he or she willingly rejects a certain teaching? I mean, I completely disagree with this statement, and believe with my whole heart that this is wrong.

To me I believe that sexuality isn't necessary for divinity, but it is in it's entirety holy and awesome.

[Vedant]

About the dogmas, I learned about religion from the point of the creation of the Lutheran church, the Bible, and not much in between. This amnesia I feel is a result of not knowing where I came from...that is all the people in time in between Jesus and me during the past 2000 or so years.

It's just made everything really personal for me all of a sudden.

So, yes, I'm talking about tradition with the Bible together. All the protestant religions focus on the Bible and where we are today, and I feel that Roman Catholics focus or have focused on tradition, and the orthodox church is the only one that seems to cherish both in harmony.

[RobNJ]

I have another question. I've been reading as much as I can about orthodox Christianity. Some of it has struck an awesome chord with me, other parts I don't feel the same way.

In this article: http://www.orthodoxinfo.com/praxis/selfabuse.aspx

It says that "sexuality is a part of our fallen nature".

Can one be orthodox if he or she willingly rejects a certain teaching? I mean, I completely disagree with this statement, and believe with my whole heart that this is wrong.

To me I believe that sexuality isn't necessary for divinity, but it is in it's entirety holy and awesome.

Read the next sentence:
"It is evil only to the extent that we misuse it"
And notice what topic is specifically referred to in the article.... It's not abount "normal marital relations"

[OrthodoxyUSA]

I have another question. I've been reading as much as I can about orthodox Christianity. Some of it has struck an awesome chord with me, other parts I don't feel the same way.

In this article: http://www.orthodoxinfo.com/praxis/selfabuse.aspx

It says that "sexuality is a part of our fallen nature".

Can one be orthodox if he or she willingly rejects a certain teaching? I mean, I completely disagree with this statement, and believe with my whole heart that this is wrong.

To me I believe that sexuality isn't necessary for divinity, but it is in it's entirety holy and awesome.

Slow down... Sexuality is not spoken of as evil. In fact its a great thing when used correctly as intended by God.

From the same article....

Sexuality is part of our fallen nature. It is evil only to the extent that we misuse it...

These are things you should speak to a Priest about.


Forgive me....:liturgy:

[OrthodoxyUSA]

Sorry Rob,

Didn't see your post..

Forgive me...

[Vedant]

Read the next sentence:
"It is evil only to the extent that we misuse it"
And notice what topic is specifically referred to in the article.... It's not abount "normal marital relations"

I REALLY don't want this thread to devolve into arguing about sexuality, I only brought it up, because I don't understand that article and necessarily disagree with it. Anyway, my question was regarding the openness of the church. So please let's not talk about sexuality, because that's really not the root of my question. Sorry, if I made it seem that way.

It is, can I disagree with the orthodox church teaching at one point and still be orthodox? Is not believing one point of it, not believing all of it? Does it depend on what I don't believe? Thank you.

[Vedant]

I;m sending a pm to you with links to Orthodox Churches in your city. All of them are truely Eastern Orthodox.

Thank you!

Although, I really don't feel comfortable calling up a priest or walking into a random church. Sad, eh? But maybe in the future.

[Oblio]

Be wary of orthodoxinfo. Some good stuff there, also some controversial stuff. Not sure about what you were reading, but keep this in mind.

[choirfiend]

Reading about things in articles online is not the way to learn about Orthodoxy, in the end. It is something to be practiced, not just learned about, so in learning about it, it is good to see it practiced! While not feeling comfortable to walk into a random church now, please consider that it will be necessary in the future. A priest is the best personal resource for explaining Orthodoxy and helping you in any concerns you may have. They're generally nice people:)

Orthodoxinfo is good for many things, but it is a private site, and not the depository of information by any Church body--so there is no accountability for what is listed there, and certain personal opinions and biases and sometimes truly problematic things can crop up there. It is better to read things at OCA.org, GOarch.org, etc--and even better to read things with the balancing factor of someone to help you interpret what you read so you get the meaning the author intends and not what meaning you may assign, based on preconceived notions or errors.

[Theophorus]

I REALLY don't want this thread to devolve into arguing about sexuality, I only brought it up, because I don't understand that article and necessarily disagree with it. Anyway, my question was regarding the openness of the church. So please let's not talk about sexuality, because that's really not the root of my question. Sorry, if I made it seem that way.

It is, can I disagree with the orthodox church teaching at one point and still be orthodox? Is not believing one point of it, not believing all of it? Does it depend on what I don't believe? Thank you.

Certain things yes, others no. Dogma is dogma but much of Orthodoxy is faith practiced. We are not robots.

So you have a Lutheran background? I have always been impressed with the virtue I have seen exhibited by many Lutherans on this forum, and in person.

Welcome to TAW.

[Vedant]

So I was thinking about looking at one orthodox church this weekend, but I'm not that comfortable with it yet. I don't know what to expect really. Perhaps next week....

[Asinner]

So I was thinking about looking at one orthodox church this weekend, but I'm not that comfortable with it yet. I don't know what to expect really. Perhaps next week....

Blessings Vedant,

I would encourage you to go and experience Heavenly Worship . . .

God Bless :)