Ask a pastor

[herev]

I'm a United Methodist Pastor (7 years, now), a probationary Elder in the Western North Carolina Conference. I am seminary trained (graduated at the top of my class!) I've been teaching Bible studies for most of my life.
Now that I've got your attention, none of that matters one iota. God has called me to pastor. If you have a question for a pastor, a need, a prayer request, etc. Feel free to post here or to PM me any time.

I am your servant.
Tommy

[ceedaisy]

What an excellent addition to our corner of the forum world! And to have someone to go to for advice is really an encouraging thing, at least to me.

So I will be the first "guinea pig" so to speak! LOL

I have been having issues with all the different denominations and what they think is right and/or pleasing to G-d. How do I know that I'm doing the right thing? What if I get a punishment of some sort from G-d because I didn't get a Father to forgive my sins? See where I'm going with this? I sense that the answer would lie in what my conscience feels, being that it is the Holy Spirit in us. What do you think?

[herev]

What an excellent addition to our corner of the forum world! And to have someone to go to for advice is really an encouraging thing, at least to me.

thanks, it was a suggestion made by Nehemiah_Center, and admin here on CF.

So I will be the first "guinea pig" so to speak! LOL let's get r done!


I have been having issues with all the different denominations and what they think is right and/or pleasing to G-d. How do I know that I'm doing the right thing? What if I get a punishment of some sort from G-d because I didn't get a Father to forgive my sins? See where I'm going with this? I sense that the answer would lie in what my conscience feels, being that it is the Holy Spirit in us. What do you think?
One of the wonderful things about our little denominations (under Wesley's foundation), is that we tend to be more pluralistic in our approach to understanding the will of G-d. Wesley's thoughts, now generally referred to as the Wesleyan Quadralataral (forgive any spelling, I'm typing fast), tell us that to discern G-d's will for us, either as individuals, or as the church, we are to:
1) prayerfully study the Scriptures
2) ask: How is this passage "Traditionally" interpreted in the history of the church?
3) ask: What does Experience tell me about G-d's will in regards to this? (eg: experiences I've had, things I've witnessed, things others have witnessed that I have heard of, etc)
4) Think: Using the G-d given ability to Reason, how do these things come together to assist me in forming an opinion, an intepretation of G-d's will for me in this paticulary situation.
Scripture
Tradition
Experience
Reason
(think STER to remember)
The problem you are facing of course is that you and I can do the same thing, follow the same steps, with the same questions (issue) studying the same passage and come to different conclusions.

We do the best we can. It is to me very comforting that I will never KNOW that I am right in my interpretations as long as we are on this side of eternity. For now we see imperfectly, but in His glory, we shall see perfectly.

So, what if you are wrong?

Here, we turn to Wesley's understanding of Grace.
Through Prevenient Grace, G-d has been seeking you out your entire life. You are a part of His diving plan. Through Justifying Grace, you have been made pure and holy the moment you gave your heart to Jesus as your lord and savior. Through Sanctifying Grace, He continues to remake you in His image, perfecting you to live a life worthy of one who calls themself a Christian.
But the most important thing here is GRACE. We are saved, not on our own merit, but because of our faith in Christ.
It seems easy for us to understand that we are never good enough to get into heaven, we must rely on grace; however, the other side of the same coin is tougher to accept, if we cannot ever be good enough to get in, that means we can never be bad enough to be kept out!
If we are saved by faith, we are not condemned by works, or by the lack of them. So, according to Wesley's understanding of grace as a free gift from G-d, neither earned or deserved, even if you and I are wrong on the particulars such as confession to a priest, etc., we are still saved by faith. When we get to heaven (and by faith in Christ, we will), THEN we will know for sure which of the things we got wrong and the pitiful few we might have gotten right.
We all sin and fall short of the glory of G-d, but we are all redeemed by the perfect blood of the lamb.

So, in short, Faith is the big part of the equation, all others are small stuff. Don't sweat the small stuff, just pray, study, seek, think, reason, strive to be the best Disciple you can, open to G-d's leading, conviction, love, and salvation. Don't sweat the small stuff.

hope that helps!

[ceedaisy]

That has been the best explanation I have received! Thank you very much. I was a huge help. And you had hit on something that also had bugged me a little. That was about our works. So once again a HUGE THANK YOU!!!! You know you just might be reverend material! Did you ever think about Pastoring? LOL just kidding!!! You are definitely Blessed!

[Davis]

Wow great post Pastor.
I wrestle with this sometimes as well. Not about converting to be a catholic or anything, but just if my beliefs are the right way. I have to remember that I'm never going to be perfect or get everything right. It is through Gods grace. Thank you for reminding me of that.

[herev]

I'm glad it helped.
NEXT?

[ceedaisy]

Hmmm you seem to be such an eager beaver that I thought I would think up another one. This one I have kind of posted before, but really didn't get a lot of opinions on.

Did you notice that it seems the Jewish Community awaits the arrival of the Messiah, but the Messiah they are looking for seems to do what the AntiChrist does in Revelations. Am I wrong? Would this by why they may be so easily swayed to worship him instead of the real Messiah?

[herev]

Hmmm you seem to be such an eager beaver that I thought I would think up another one. This one I have kind of posted before, but really didn't get a lot of opinions on.hmm, no wonder you didn't get much of a response;)
I'm not sure you'll get one out of me, either...lol

Did you notice that it seems the Jewish Community awaits the arrival of the Messiah, but the Messiah they are looking for seems to do what the AntiChrist does in Revelations. no, sorry, I didn't notice that at all.


perhaps you could delve into detail a bit more? Let me know what you mean by that.

Am I wrong? CAn't answer that without knowing exactly what you mean, sorry
Would this by why they may be so easily swayed to worship him instead of the real Messiah?
I think that the intent from Revelation is to show that MANY people will be easily swayed to follow the false messiah, not just Jews, but I'll await further input from you.
In Him,
tommy

[tryme]

The problem you are facing of course is that you and I can do the same thing, follow the same steps, with the same questions (issue) studying the same passage and come to different conclusions.

We do the best we can. It is to me very comforting that I will never KNOW that I am right in my interpretations as long as we are on this side of eternity. For now we see imperfectly, but in His glory, we shall see perfectly.

Thank you for saying that.
On another board I was talking to someone I considered a friend but all of a sudden communication stopped.
I had told him I did not think we could KNOW things for sure.
At least like you said not "on this side of eternity".
He seemed very irritated with me for having such a thought.

[herev]

Thank you for saying that.
On another board I was talking to someone I considered a friend but all of a sudden communication stopped.
I had told him I did not think we could KNOW things for sure.
At least like you said not "on this side of eternity".
He seemed very irritated with me for having such a thought.
you are very welcome!
The issue is one of epistemology
Main Entry: epis·te·mol·o·gy http://www.m-w.com/images/audio.gif (javascript:popWin('/cgi-bin/audio.pl?episte03.wav=epistemology'))
Pronunciation: i-"pis-t&-'mä-l&-jE
Function: noun
Etymology: Greek epistEmE knowledge, from epistanai to understand, know, from epi- + histanai to cause to stand --
As a matter of FAITH, I CAN know in my heart that I am saved, that Jesus died for me, that God exists, etc (think 1Jn 5:13), however, to factually know something that is faith-based is an oxymoron. If I could know it for a fact, then it wouldn't require faith--without faith, I am no longer saved, so I AM GLAD that I cannot KNOW factually that Jesus is my lord and savior--it MUST remain a matter of faith.

[ceedaisy]

When I had wandered around before on a few Jewish sites some time ago I saw they only listed three requirements. Maybe I had it wrong and they listed the three requirements Jesus DIDN'T fulfill. Still a few of the requirements (listed below with the web site address) I thought the antichrist was supposed to fulfill such as building the 3rd Temple.

http://www.messiahtruth.com/wanted.html

Position Available

- the Jewish Messiah

Job Description

To usher in the messianic era, as foretold in the Hebrew Bible, and to preside over the people of Israel as their king, sitting on the throne of King David.

Job Requirements

To execute and successfully complete the messianic agenda, as described in the Hebrew Bible, within one lifetime.

Prior Job Experience

None

Qualifications

The successful candidate will have attributes that must include, but not necessarily be limited to, the following:



1. Be the seed (a direct descendant) of King David, through King Solomon (e.g., 2 Sam 7:12-16)

2. Be a spiritual and military/political leader (e.g., Is 2:3, 11:2; Dan 7:14)

3. Be married and have children during his term (e.g., Ezek 46:16-17)

Performance Appraisal Criteria

The successful candidate will be expected to bring about certain conditions as part of his sovereignty, though some will commence prior to his being identified as the Messiah. These must include, but not necessarily be limited to, the following:



1. Arrival of Elijah the Prophet (e.g., Mal 3:23-24[4:5-6][2] (http://www.messiahtruth.com/wanted.html#_ftn2))

2. Building the Third Temple in Jerusalem (e.g., Ezek 37:26-28)

3. In-gathering of Jewish exiles to Israel (e.g., Is 11:12)

4. Reunification of Judah and Israel into one people (e.g., Ezek 37:22)

5. World peace (e.g., Is 2:4)

6. Universal knowledge of G-d (e.g., Is 11:9)

7. Resurrection of the dead (e.g., Is 26:19)

[HoosierMommy]

As a matter of FAITH, I CAN know in my heart that I am saved, that Jesus died for me, that God exists, etc (think 1Jn 5:13), however, to factually know something that is faith-based is an oxymoron. If I could know it for a fact, then it wouldn't require faith--without faith, I am no longer saved, so I AM GLAD that I cannot KNOW factually that Jesus is my lord and savior--it MUST remain a matter of faith.

Wow what a great thought! I grew up in the church, but have never heard anyone say anything like that. I'm going to file this away in the "really thought-provoking statements" in the back of my brain! :idea:

HoosierMommy

[herev]

When I had wandered around before on a few Jewish sites some time ago I saw they only listed three requirements. Maybe I had it wrong and they listed the three requirements Jesus DIDN'T fulfill. Still a few of the requirements (listed below with the web site address) I thought the antichrist was supposed to fulfill such as building the 3rd Temple.
http://www.messiahtruth.com/wanted.html
interesting, I've not seen this before. I'm not sure based on the site that it would be considered "official" Jewish theology or eschatology. Just not that sure of Judaism's current viewpoint.




I feel I would not be in a position to say what they they "think" or expect. But in answer to your original question, the antichrist will be accepted because he fulfills what people want, rather than what is foretold, that is true whether or not the duped person is Jewish, Christian, or pagan.

I am usually uncomfortable in making general statements about "the Jews" as if it will be all Jews who act this way.
In other words, the Jews today have an expectation of what they want in a new world leader, but so do Christians (and some will be sadly mistaken), so do Hindu's, Buddhists, and even new age atheists, so the potential for misunderstanding and plain ole missing out on the future coming of Christ is...well, it's an equal opportunity, eternal fatal error.

[herev]

Wow what a great thought! I grew up in the church, but have never heard anyone say anything like that. I'm going to file this away in the "really thought-provoking statements" in the back of my brain! :idea:

HoosierMommy:thumbsup: :bow:

[ceedaisy]

Thank you Herev. I have seen these same "qualifications" on another different site. And I do agree with not grouping one certain group to ALL act a certain way.

And you mentioned fulfilling and being foretold. From what I have read in researching, the Jewish faith does not except the Christian New Testament. It seems there is the opinion that it is faked, and written to make it look like Jesus fulfilled the prophecies in the OT, and also that there is no proof for the NT being an actual account of the life and times of Jesus.

So thank you for taking the time to listen to my musings. When I happen upon another one of my off the wall questions I will be back to bounce them off of you!

[herev]

you are most certainly welcomeThank you Herev. I have seen these same "qualifications" on another different site. And I do agree with not grouping one certain group to ALL act a certain way.

And you mentioned fulfilling and being foretold. From what I have read in researching, the Jewish faith does not except the Christian New Testament. It seems there is the opinion that it is faked, and written to make it look like Jesus fulfilled the prophecies in the OT, and also that there is no proof for the NT being an actual account of the life and times of Jesus.

So thank you for taking the time to listen to my musings. When I happen upon another one of my off the wall questions I will be back to bounce them off of you!

[herev]

I'll be away for a few days. I am going to be the Spiritual Director on a Boy's Chrysalis Flight this weekend. God bless.
Tommy

[herev]

I'm back!
Someone sent me a PM based on this thread and asked a question about not being very involved in church. I accidentally deleted it:blush: . Could you resend it?

[KCDAD]

I'm a United Methodist Pastor (7 years, now), a probationary Elder in the Western North Carolina Conference. I am seminary trained (graduated at the top of my class!) I've been teaching Bible studies for most of my life.
Now that I've got your attention, none of that matters one iota. God has called me to pastor. If you have a question for a pastor, a need, a prayer request, etc. Feel free to post here or to PM me any time.

I am your servant.
Tommy
I am interested to know why the Methodist Church does not follow the "priesthood of all believers" philosophy? Why is ordination such an essential rite in the church? Marriage, Baptism, Communion....

[herev]

actually, we believe very strongly in the Priesthood of all believers. We believe that ALL Christians are called to be ministers. However, we recognize that some are called and set apart to be ordained for a special set of ministries. Ordination recognizes that special call of the Spirit on a few who are to be set apart in this manner. But we definitively support and profess the Priesthood of all Believers!

[servant4ever]

Are the Wesleyan/Nazarene denominations similar to the moderate baptist denominations (like Baptist General Conference/American Baptist Conference)

[herev]

Are the Wesleyan/Nazarene denominations similar to the moderate baptist denominations (like Baptist General Conference/American Baptist Conference)

hello Chris!
I'm sure there are similarities, but just as many differences. The main commonality would be the general acceptance all of those share of other denominations.

[KCDAD]

actually, we believe very strongly in the Priesthood of all believers. We believe that ALL Christians are called to be ministers. However, we recognize that some are called and set apart to be ordained for a special set of ministries. Ordination recognizes that special call of the Spirit on a few who are to be set apart in this manner. But we definitively support and profess the Priesthood of all Believers!

But you need permission from the bishop to give communion or baptize don't you? Sounds like bureaucracy and heirarchy to me.

[amx]

Do the methodist still subscribe to holiness doctrine? It's a major push in the Church of the Nazarene.

[herev]

But you need permission from the bishop to give communion or baptize don't you? Sounds like bureaucracy and heirarchy to me.
I'm not sure what you mean by permission. to serve communion or to baptize, you need to be ordained or liscenced, yes. It has to do mostly with preserving the proper atmosphere and ensuring the proper doctrine of the moment more than it does being only certain persons.

[herev]

Do the methodist still subscribe to holiness doctrine? It's a major push in the Church of the Nazarene.
you might have to define "holinesss doctrine" for me, but if you mean what I think you mean, then yes, we believe as Wesley did, that we should be maintaining a constant drive towards sanctification.

[herev]

I have decided to leave staff because of priority and time constraints. As such, I will not be on CF as much. I am closing and unsticking this thread. All are free to PM me if they so desire.
God bless
Tommy