Divorce advice

[dawnsday]

A twenty year old boy marries a woman based soley on sexual attraction, believing everything else will fall into place with time. They are both christains at the time of the marriage. He finds sixteen years later, with two teenaged children, he never was "in love" with his wife. His wife has grown obese, is not, in his eyes, a good mother and is trying to turn his children against him. He tells himself he has tried everything to fix this marriage. His wife refuses counceling and now says she is no longer a christian and believes all people are god. He decides to divorce her. He will go to school so he can afford to, then leave. He is attracted to a younger woman. He has told her so. She has refused him, but he still plans to leave his wife. He says that the right thing to do is to divorce her and it would be wrong to stay just because he said "for better or for worse". He doesn't think he is sinning.

Based on the bible is he right or wrong.

[JVD]

He is wrong

[Wisdom's Child]

Even though he sounds very unhappy, it would be wrong to divorce.
Furthermore, as spiritual head of the household, it sounds like he has failed to be a proper spiritual leader to his family as well.
He needs to be seeking the Kingdom of Heaven, and not another woman.
You reap what you sow, I wish him a bountiful harvest...

[Kelly]

He's wrong. God hates divorce.

[Followers4christ]

In that case he is wrong,he should'nt be looking at another woman to marry.He should stay married and try to fix this marriage.Divorce is the easy way out of this problem.God Hates divorce(read Matthew 5:31 and 1 CORINTHIANS 7:10)God Bless :)

[flyingsum0]

Divorce is just a back door...unlocking the front door is the key

[spyderchick]

Hi there! This is a very tricky question and not so easy to give an answer. I will do my best to help you here. Please bear with me, this will probably be a long post. :P

I do not think it is our place as humans to judge whether or not he is wrong by wanting to divorce. Also to ppl who say "God hates divorce" and other proclammations of what God feels... can you please provide supporting evidence of this? It is not very helpful to people seeking honest advice when you simply spurt out comments like this. I don't think that we should presume to be so holy that we can tell other ppl what God does and does not hate unless it is a direct quote from the Bible. (As for God hating divorce, please see Mal. 2:16) Also, if you read the post, it said "based on the Bible, is he right or wrong" and I did not see many answers that were supported by scripture.

However, I think what you are seeking here is personal advice and when you ask for advice, you are going to get many different opinions and even opposing veiwpoints. Here is my (humble) opinion... There are many different scriptures in the Bible that speak of marriage and divorce and I will do my best to tell you the ones I know of off the top of my head.

Also, I think it is important to say that every case is different. We could not practically know every single detail about your situation and even if we did, it is not our place to make judgement. I do not think it is fair to say that God hates all divorce and that divorce is a sin in every situation. Would God expect a person to remain married to a spouse who severely abused them or their children? Would God want you to stay married to someone that openly rebuked God and tried to force you not to believe? Well... what would God want you to do? This is where you need to turn to scripture and to prayer.

Now whether or not you are commiting a sin to divorce is a totally separate issue from your attraction to the younger woman. This attraction can be considered adultery and may be interfering with your abilitiy to judge your feelings on your current marriage properly. My advice would be that you pray for the strength to avoid these temptations until you have resolved your current situation. These temptations are just more ways that Satan is trying to lead you to sin. You mention that he(you?) married this woman "based soley on sexual attraction" and that now she has "grown obese" and that he was never really in love with her. This will tell you right away that he(you?) has a problem with physical temptations and superficial things. This is an obvious weakness that you must pray about to find the answer.

As for your wife refusing counseling and no longer being a Christian, this is certainly a problem that would put strain on the marriage and the relationship. Of course, my first comment would be to be patient and pray for her and that she will open her eyes to God again. Also, what happened to change her? How did she just decide not to be a Christian anymore? Have you been a good role model and family leader for her? Have you, as the husband, guided her in a path that led to God? You must accept at least some responsibilty in this. It is never one-sided. Have you given yourself whole-heartedly to fixing the marriage or are you just looking for an easy way out that you don't have to feel bad about? Have you prayed and then listened for God's answer to you?

I fully believe that you have a lot of praying to do. I do not think that you should rush into the divorce. However, I am not saying you should not divorce at all. It may turn out that things happen that way. But don't let your physical emotions and desires lead you to jumping too quickly to divorce. Let God guide you on what to do (as opposed to just telling Him what you think you want and hoping He will make you feel at peace in your decision.)

Now, as for what the Bible has to say...

Marriage is not something to be taken lightly or casually. It involves a lifelong covenant, a solemn, purposeful, willful, binding agreement made before God, a man, and a woman (Genesis 2:24; Malachi 2:14).

It is pretty well agreed upon in the Christian community that divorce is not suggested or encouraged. The feelings that people have regarding this come from the clear statement in the Bible that God hates divorce (Malachi 2:16) and that no human being should separate two persons joined together in holy matrimony (Matthew 19:6).

However, divorce is a huge reality in our society so there must be more in the Bible to help guide us on what to do in these situations, right? Well, the opinions surrounding divorce also vary according to whether or not both spouses were Christians when they entered into the marriage. If both were Christians and they were married under God, then it most likely would be considered a sin to divorce. 1 Corinthians 7:10, 11 tells you that neither party should ever seek a divorce.

If one party is a Christian and the other was not, the Christian spouse is not supposed to seek a divorce from the unbelieving spouse. (Corinthians 7:12-14)

However, there may be exceptions to these cases. For example, if your spouse commits adultery (Matthew 5:32; 19:9) or if your spouse abandons you or refuses to live with you (1 Corinthians 7:15). If one of these two are present in your situation, then divorce may be an option. This is by far NOT a mandate and you should always be encouraged to seek every avenue other than divorce first.

A third situation where divorce may be an option is in the case of abuse. Then the guidelines stated in 1 Corinthians 7:12-15 may also apply. It is suggested that in the case of abuse, you seek every option available to repair the marriage and end the abuse and heal and move on in your relationship. Possible separation without divorce may be needed to keep the abused party safe until counseling and healing can begin. However, if the abusing spouse chooses not to get help and stay with the spouse, the abused spouse will not be bound to the marriage.

Okay, VERY tricky stuff here. This is exactly why people should be very careful about entering into marriages to begin with and not be hasty in your decisions. However, this warning is too little too late to people who find themselves already in the situation.

So in conclusion, I do not feel that any human on this earth has the right to tell you whether you should or should not get a divorce. I think it is suggested that you do not but ultimately it is between you and God. I hope that the things I have said and the scriptures I have provided can help guide you in your search for your answers.

God bless!

[4ujesus]

Let me first say that I understand the young man's struggle, but that is because He is looking at his circumstances from a physical point of view rather than a Spiritual one.

As a pastor I have counciled hundreds of couples who were struggling in their marriages, many to the point of wanting to divorce.

I have never counciled a couple to get a divorce, even though I feel there are some very limited Biblical outs to a marriage,(abandonment by an unbeliever, adultery), I believe it is never God's highest.

The first thing the young man must understand is that Love is not a feeling that you fall in and out of, it is a choice. I have also found that when the choice to love is made the feelings will in time follow.

In the Bible there are several different words that are used for what we define in english as Love.

First word is "Eros" which is a physically based selfish love.(where we get the word erotic). It is a self centered love that is based entirely on what others can do for you. has been defined as the love a new born baby has for it's mother. totally self centered. (A new born baby doesn't care about how tired mom is in the middle of the night, or that she just went through 16 hours of labor, screams until mom gets up to feed him)

"Eros" a self centered love that says what can you do for me.

Another word for love is "phileo", where we get the word philadelphia. This describes a brotherly love.

Finally we have the word "agape"
While "eros is a self centered, what can you do for me love.
"Agape" is an others centered, what can i do for you Love.

Has been defined as the love a mother has for her newborn baby. No matter how tired she is, she will drop everything in order to care for the needs of her child. Its not about her but is about the child

"Agape' Is a love for someone outside of yourself that is greater than the love you have for yourself.
"agape" is an unconditional love that does not change based upon the actions of others (or weight gain in this case]

Agape is best described in the famous love chapter in the Bible, 1 corinthians 13

Agape suffers long and is kind, agape does not envy, does not parade itself, is not puffed up, does not behave rudely, does not seek it's own, is not provoked, thinks no evil, does not rejoice in iniquity but rejoiceds in truth, bears all thing believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things AGAPE NEVER FAILS.

This selfless love is also found in the bibles most quoted verse, "for God so Agaped the world that he gave his only begotten son that whosoever believes in him will not perish, but will have everlasting life."

God so loved he GAVE

To often love in marriage is eros, looking not to give to our spouse, but to have our needs meet by them.

Ephesians 5:25 "Husbands love (Agape) you wives, just as Christ alos loved(agaped) the church and GAVE himself for her.

I would tell the young man, it is time to move from basing your love on physical feelings,(eros), and it is time for you to choose to love your wife unconditionally and to begin to lay down your life for her.

Ask God to help you to love her with an agape love and the feelings will follow. It is also important to note that you should love her this way even if it is not returned.

You might be saying, I can't do that!

you're right you can't, but God can. You see agape is the fruit of the Holy Spirit described in Galatians 5:22 "the fruit of the spirit is love(agape)"

Ask God to feel you with his Spirit that you might Love your wife with the Agape Love he intended you too.

God's highest is restoration. May he bless and restore your marriage and may it be a testimony to his grace.


Final note to all you singles. We are not to be unequally yoked together with unbelievers. Know that if you marry an unbeliever, they cannot have agape love for you as it is the fruit of the Holy Spirit. You wiil agape them and thay can only have eros for you. A recipe for difficulty, frustration and heartache.

Wait for the man or woman God has for you, as there is nothing better than two who have become one. Each have a selfless, Spirit filled love for one another.

Please let me know if I can be of help

God bless you

[linssue55]

A twenty year old boy marries a woman based soley on sexual attraction, believing everything else will fall into place with time. They are both christains at the time of the marriage. He finds sixteen years later, with two teenaged children, he never was "in love" with his wife. His wife has grown obese, is not, in his eyes, a good mother and is trying to turn his children against him. He tells himself he has tried everything to fix this marriage. His wife refuses counceling and now says she is no longer a christian and believes all people are god. He decides to divorce her. He will go to school so he can afford to, then leave. He is attracted to a younger woman. He has told her so. She has refused him, but he still plans to leave his wife. He says that the right thing to do is to divorce her and it would be wrong to stay just because he said "for better or for worse". He doesn't think he is sinning.

Based on the bible is he right or wrong.

God allows 3 reasons for divorce......

1. Adultery
2. Desertion
3. Physical abuse......

[dawnsday]

for the record, he's a friend (I'm a girl!) and i'm the woman he claimed to be in love with (he is fourteen years my senior and i thought of him as an uncle type, and NO i did not lead him on, he was delusional, maybe still is i don't know, but trust me he KNOWS he has no chance with me) I have been his close friend for over a year and don't know if cutting off our friendship is better or worse, (doesn't it say something about not turning your back on a fellow christian?) and he has no one else. trust me on this, he really has no one else...

this is my attempt to make sure he is fully aware of his choice and the consequences and all the possible view points on what he may do...if i can make him think twice about it, maybe there is a way to save his marriage, maybe not, but he needs more opinions and advice then i, at my age, and have never been being married, can give him.

[Svt4Him]

God allows 3 reasons for divorce......

1. Adultery
2. Desertion
3. Physical abuse......

Actually God allows being put out for only one of those reasons, adultery. You are not bound in desertion, and you certainly can divorce in abuse. God hates someone being put away, not divorced.

But this guy is wrong for falling for another while still married.

[Daily Miracle]

dawnsday,

You are being played (manipulated). If this guy has an interest in you, there's NO WAY he's going to tell you ANYTHING good about his marriage. The more he can convince you he's miserable, the more likely he'll get you to agree and play on his team.

He may be depressed, going through a mid-life crisis, or maybe he's really enjoying the feeling of courting someone again. He should be talking to his wife about his troubles. She could be completely in the dark, even though he's told you otherwise. I'll bet he likes the attention you give him while he plays the victim. You probably listen to his problems carefully without judgement, while his wife might put up more of a fight with him...if you were him, which woman would seem more pleasing?

It's hypocritical for him to say his wife isn't a Christian when he's not behaving very Christian-like himself. If this guy has an interest in someone outside his marriage, he can't very well claim to "have tried". If you had met him after he divorced, the picture would be different. Do you really want to be involved with someone that could dump his family so heartlessly for you?

My advice would be to tell this guy you'd think he was more honorable if he stopped talking to you about his marital troubles and worked on his marriage with his wife. With you on the sidelines as the consolation prize, he can't focus on his wife or his marriage like he should. There's someone that's meant for you, but he won't be married when you meet.

Just my opinion.

[linssue55]

for the record, he's a friend (I'm a girl!) and i'm the woman he claimed to be in love with (he is fourteen years my senior and i thought of him as an uncle type, and NO i did not lead him on, he was delusional, maybe still is i don't know, but trust me he KNOWS he has no chance with me) I have been his close friend for over a year and don't know if cutting off our friendship is better or worse, (doesn't it say something about not turning your back on a fellow christian?) and he has no one else. trust me on this, he really has no one else...

this is my attempt to make sure he is fully aware of his choice and the consequences and all the possible view points on what he may do...if i can make him think twice about it, maybe there is a way to save his marriage, maybe not, but he needs more opinions and advice then i, at my age, and have never been being married, can give him.

Oh, yes he does.....he has the Lord. We are NEVER alone! :)

I would break off the frienship, for you are now a deterent to him resolving his marriage (by no fault of your own). He has now made you an obstacle, get on with your life and he with his.

[linssue55]

Actually God allows being put out for only one of those reasons, adultery. You are not bound in desertion, and you certainly can divorce in abuse. God hates someone being put away, not divorced.

But this guy is wrong for falling for another while still married.

The three I mentioed are ok with God, AND according to the bible, Divorce means the right to re-marry. The only people that should not re-marry are widows.

[dawnsday]

dawnsday,

Do you really want to be involved with someone that could dump his family so heartlessly for you?
There's someone that's meant for you, but he won't be married when you meet.

Just my opinion.

first i knew him long enough and well enough before he said he had feelings for me to know he is not playing me. i also know he has been straight to his family about his plans because his daughter mentioned something about it to me. I also do NOT want him which i stated. He is not a hypocrite for saying his wife is not a christian because his wife declared that she is no longer a christian.

and i'll repeat i have no romantic feelings for him, the thought of it grosses me out a bit actually. so that is not an issue.

[dawnsday]

The three I mentioed are ok with God, AND according to the bible, Divorce means the right to re-marry. The only people that should not re-marry are widows.

where in the bible does it say a widow can not remarry?

[Grl4Christ987]

Technically, he can divorce her on the sole basis of the Scripture that states if your partner refuses to remain a Christian, then he can divorce her on that basis...but that does not mean he is entitled to still have an affair, as that is just as bad as abandoning the Faith.

In Christ,

Kimmie

[snugaboo]

The Guy is wrong. God doesn't like people to divorce



Amy

[4ujesus]

Technically, he can divorce her on the sole basis of the Scripture that states if your partner refuses to remain a Christian, then he can divorce her on that basis...but that does not mean he is entitled to still have an affair, as that is just as bad as abandoning the Faith.

In Christ,

Kimmie
Kimmie,

There is no verse in the Bible that says you can divorce your spouse if they "refuse to remain a Christian". On the contrary the Bible commands us to remain with the unbeliever as long as they are willing to remain in the marriage. That they might see Jesus in us and be won tho the Lord.

While we should never marry an unbeliever, once married, we should remain with them.

Marriage is a covenent before God for a lifetime, and should not be entered into or walked away from easily.

Physical abuse is grounds for seperation, for the womens safety, but I see no Biblical grounds for Divorce on those grounds alone. Often Physical abuse is accompanied by Adultery, and God does allow Divorce in such cases.

Divorce is never God's highest restoration of the marriage always is.

God speaks more about marriage in the Bible than he does the Church.

May we never take it lightly.

[twistedsketch]

When Jesus had finished saying these things, he left Galilee and went into the region of Judea to the other side of the Jordan. Large crowds followed him, and he healed them there.

Some Pharisees came to him to test him. They asked, "Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any and every reason?"

"Haven't you read," he replied, "that at the beginning the Creator 'made them male and female,' and said, 'For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh'? So they are no longer two, but one. Therefore what God has joined together, let man not separate."

"Why then," they asked, "did Moses command that a man give his wife a certificate of divorce and send her away?"

Jesus replied, "Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning. I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, and marries another woman commits adultery."

The disciples said to him, "If this is the situation between a husband and wife, it is better not to marry."

Jesus replied, "Not everyone can accept this word, but only those to whom it has been given. For some are eunuchs because they were born that way; others were made that way by men; and others have renounced marriage because of the kingdom of heaven. The one who can accept this should accept it."
Jesus never okays it unless your spouse has cheated on you, period. If He cannot okay it, I cannot okay it.

[linssue55]

where in the bible does it say a widow can not remarry?

Look under widow/widows in your concordance. :)

[linssue55]

Technically, he can divorce her on the sole basis of the Scripture that states if your partner refuses to remain a Christian, then he can divorce her on that basis...but that does not mean he is entitled to still have an affair, as that is just as bad as abandoning the Faith.

In Christ,

Kimmie

No, not so. She will always be a christain (once saved, always saved) the only difference now is she is CARNAL, out of fellowship....in reversionism......Once a child of God, in the Royal Family, ALWAYS a child of God.

Remember, (good or bad christians) it is always what the Lord does for us, not what we do, this is Grace.....ALL sins were paid for on the cross.

[Svt4Him]

The three I mentioed are ok with God, AND according to the bible, Divorce means the right to re-marry. The only people that should not re-marry are widows.

The three you mentioned are not all talking about divorce. One is talking about putting out, one about divorce, and the third isn't talked about at all.

[Reformationist]

A twenty year old boy marries a woman based soley on sexual attraction, believing everything else will fall into place with time. They are both christains at the time of the marriage. He finds sixteen years later, with two teenaged children, he never was "in love" with his wife. His wife has grown obese, is not, in his eyes, a good mother and is trying to turn his children against him. He tells himself he has tried everything to fix this marriage. His wife refuses counceling and now says she is no longer a christian and believes all people are god. He decides to divorce her. He will go to school so he can afford to, then leave. He is attracted to a younger woman. He has told her so. She has refused him, but he still plans to leave his wife. He says that the right thing to do is to divorce her and it would be wrong to stay just because he said "for better or for worse". He doesn't think he is sinning.

Based on the bible is he right or wrong.

Well, he'd be wrong because divorcing your spouse is a sin. It is not unforgivable but it is a sin. Additionally, it sounds like this guy has not tried everything nor does it sound, to me, like the guy still loves his wife. It sounds like he is just looking for a way to blame the divorce on his wife.

I'm curious. How is going to school going to help him afford to leave? If it was an abusive relationship, would the guy put up with the beatings so he could finish school? I doubt it so why is it okay to stay with someone just so you can go to school?

God bless

[dawnsday]

Jesus never okays it unless your spouse has cheated on you, period. If He cannot okay it, I cannot okay it.

he also says whosoever lusts after a woman in his heart has already commited adultery...on that point would his attraction to another woman be grounds for his wife to leave him

[dawnsday]

Look under widow/widows in your concordance. :)

i'm not finding it...

[linssue55]

The three you mentioned are not all talking about divorce. One is talking about putting out, one about divorce, and the third isn't talked about at all.Yes they are there. But I go by the originals, and it doesn't have to under the word divorce other terms are used.

[twistedsketch]

he also says whosoever lusts after a woman in his heart has already commited adultery...on that point would his attraction to another woman be grounds for his wife to leave him
I wouldn't say one thought, but if he even begins dating another woman, or if he does porn, she knows it, they talked, and he is completely unrepentant.

[dawnsday]

To be fair to him, here is his story straight from his mouth word for word, read this then tell me what you think, because i believe he thinks i'm being unfair:

> Im 20 years old I start hanging out with small group
at dance studio. the teacher crystal and I
> are doing the long stares... wow an older lady is
hitting on me way cool. we are crashed out on the
floor at one of the teachers and stuff happens. I
start going to her house every night were having a
great time. It's going good then she says will you
have a kid with me. I say I'm not going to just plant
a kid and walk away. I tell her I'm thinking about
going into psychiatry and she is pumped up.(this is
retrospect so bear with me). she suggests getting
married ironocly while we are in bed . we make
announcments to family... and start planning. this
all has happened in about six months. I take some
classes but end up dropping out. she gets pregnant
and things are getting rough. lots of argueing about
money more then anything. she starts doing some dance
lessons. private lessons and they all seem to be
doctors and psychiatrist there was one accountant.
her lessons with this foreign guy named von.... start
becoming longer and more frequent. we are driving buy
his house
> she screams duck and trys to pull my head down. it
was funny at the time but I ask some questions and
insist on meeting the guy. It wasn't a confrontation
I just introduced myself as her husband and presto he
didn't want lessons anymore. I know but I don't know
so we move on. a couple months later she gets
pregnant. our attention shifts to being parents and
things start getting better for a short time but money
issues come up again and again. Then we start fighting
about anything and everything it's getting bad. then
Josh comes along and things get better I'm having fun
making sure sure she is eating right (gag me I know)
but it's a good thing. Money is tight but we are
really enjoying the kids . Our peace and our piece of
mind always came back to the kids. things we did
together worked smoothly with the kids but not so
smooth without. Yes we had some good times but they
became less frequent as the kids became more
independant. eventually we learned to avoid alot of
> situations to avoid fighting and started growing
apart. This is an over simplification. I didn't give
her alot of things and I became less affectionate.
eventually I started getting all these relationship
tapes and books but we would read them and go back to
fighting about the same ********. It's not that any
one time was so horrible or that any one thing was
something we could not overcome it was the fact that
over time there seemed to be less and less between us
that we had to save. I know tat sounds cold but I
don't know any other way to describe the situation.
Then we start fighting about the kids
> keep in mind this is a very rough simplification. I
made alot of mistakes more to do with lack of
attention. In my defense my attention was not very
well recieved. that is my self serving skewed
version. I left out some of the good and the bad on
both sides but it is the bulk of my reason for wanting

[ronmathison]

A twenty year old boy marries a woman based soley on sexual attraction, believing everything else will fall into place with time. They are both christains at the time of the marriage. He finds sixteen years later, with two teenaged children, he never was "in love" with his wife. His wife has grown obese, is not, in his eyes, a good mother and is trying to turn his children against him. He tells himself he has tried everything to fix this marriage. His wife refuses counceling and now says she is no longer a christian and believes all people are god. He decides to divorce her. He will go to school so he can afford to, then leave. He is attracted to a younger woman. He has told her so. She has refused him, but he still plans to leave his wife. He says that the right thing to do is to divorce her and it would be wrong to stay just because he said "for better or for worse". He doesn't think he is sinning.

Based on the bible is he right or wrong.

In my opinion, as well as a good friend of mine's: I feel if there never was true love between both, it's not really marriage, but a sinfull-relationship based on sex.

As I recall, the bible speaks of marriage as a man clinging to his wife.

To answer the question, he's right.

[twistedsketch]

In my opinion, as well as a good friend of mine's: I feel if there never was true love between both, it's not really marriage, but a sinfull-relationship based on sex.

As I recall, the bible speaks of marriage as a man clinging to his wife.

To answer the question, he's right.
Marraige happens for better or for worse when you take the vows. One could view your argument as justification to divorce "for any and every reason" because you could say that just because you don't like your wife anymore the marraige has ended.

[ronmathison]

Marraige happens for better or for worse when you take the vows. One could view your argument as justification to divorce "for any and every reason" because you could say that just because you don't like your wife anymore the marraige has ended.

Vows are found in The Old Covenant, where they were allowed, yet not commanded. We are now in The New Covenant, since Christ's sacrifice, and Pentecost, where the Holy Spirit was poured forth upon all mankind.

God writes his laws upon our hearts. Surely God does not want anyone bound in a sinful relationship, where there never was true love between both.

Also, in Matthew, Jesus says to not make any vows at all.

[twistedsketch]

Vows are found in The Old Covenant, where they were allowed, yet not commanded. We are now in The New Covenant, since Christ's sacrifice, and Pentecost, where the Holy Spirit was poured forth upon all mankind.

God writes his laws upon our hearts. Surely God does not want anyone bound in a sinful relationship, where there never was true love between both.

Also, in Matthew, Jesus says to not make any vows at all.
It honestly sounds like you believe in free love rather than marraige.

When Jesus said not to swear, he was telling us to let your yes be a yes and your no be a no. Pharisees had a habit of swearing by this, that, or the other thing and you may or may not be bound to it depending on what you swear by and whether or not you're facing Jerusalem at the time. Jesus said to end this. That is what He meant by "Do not swear at all."

A sinful relationship is one where one or both parties has an ex-spouse or ex-sex partner who is still living. Except of course if the ex-spouse cheated.

"I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, and marries another woman commits adultery." - Matthew 19:9

[rodimus321]

In my opinion, as well as a good friend of mine's: I feel if there never was true love between both, it's not really marriage, but a sinfull-relationship based on sex.

As I recall, the bible speaks of marriage as a man clinging to his wife.

To answer the question, he's right.

Sorry to say but your "opinion" and your "feelings" really don't matter. Gods opinion is what matters and God says divorce is wrong period (except for the biblical reasons already listed).
As far as marrying for sex, Paul is the one that says if a man cannot control his desires then he should get married so he doesn't sin.

[daverain]

It honestly sounds like you believe in free love rather than marraige.

When Jesus said not to swear, he was telling us to let your yes be a yes and your no be a no.

it sounds to me,

like my friend ronmathison

-HONORS- marriage. (by saying what marriage -REALLY- is.)


Jesus says to not make -ANY- oaths at all.

No amount of babble, from mankind, in my opinion, suggests to do otherwise.


Peace in Christ.

[daverain]

.





God says divorce is wrong period

As far as marrying for sex, Paul is the one that says if a man cannot control his desires then he should get married so he doesn't sin.





Paragraph one:
--------------

This would mean divorce from a real marriage, which involves
-LOVE- between a man and a woman plus consumation, versus any mere 'legal-contract'.



Otherwise people of the same sex could be married in God's eyes wherever the law permits (like here in Canada)


Paragraph two:
--------------

Paul means people who 'burn with passion'

(this means people who love each other)



Peace in Christ.


.

[marciebaby]

Maybe if he hadn't seen his wife as just a sex object she wouldn't be so unhappy and resentful.

[marciebaby]

Where in the bible does it say that divorce is ok in the case of physical abuse? Not that I disagree, I just don't remember seeing it there anywhere.

[Svt4Him]

Sorry to say but your "opinion" and your "feelings" really don't matter. Gods opinion is what matters and God says divorce is wrong period (except for the biblical reasons already listed).
As far as marrying for sex, Paul is the one that says if a man cannot control his desires then he should get married so he doesn't sin.

Can you tell me again where it says that? See, if you think Jesus said divorce is wrong except for adultery, then you can't also add when someone leaves, nor can you add abuse, as that would be adding to God's word. If you understand that Jesus wasn't talking about divorce but putting away, then the Bible agrees.

What evidence is there that “put away” just means what it says and does not
mean divorce?

A. First, there is a GK word for divorce and it is not the one that is translated put away in
Matt 19:9.
1. Greek words:
a. APOLUO – “Put away”
b. APOSTASION - “Divorce”
2. It is argued that apoluo and apostasion are used interchangeably.
a. I recognize that some preachers have been deliberately saying “put away”
when they mean divorce.
b. But it is a misuse of the Greek and the English.
3. Interlinear: Mt 5:32 (KJV text)
But <de> I <ego> say <lego> unto you <humin>, That <hoti> whosoever <hos>
<an> shall put away <apoluo> his <autos> wife <gune>, saving <parektos> for
the cause <logos> of fornication <porneia>, causeth <poieo> her <autos> to
commit adultery <moichao> and <kai> whosoever <hos> <ean> shall marry
<gameo> her that is divorced <apoluo> committeth adultery <moichao>

B. Authorities on APOLUO:
1. Thayer says apoluo means, “to dismiss from the house, to repudiate.” (Thayer’s
Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament, pg. 66).
2. Bagster’s Analytical Lexicon: “Apoluo. Put away: To let go; to let loose; to
send away”

C. Authorities on the meaning of the English words "PUT AWAY":
Some English dictionaries do not even include divorce as a definition of “put away”
including:
a. Wordnet Dictionary:
“Put Away”
Definition:
1. [v] turn away from and put aside, perhaps temporarily; “She turned away from her
painting”
2. [v] eat up; usually refers to a considerable quantity of food; “My son tucked in a
whole pizza”
3. [v] kill gently, as with an injection, as of pet animals
4. [v] place in a place where something cannot be removed or someone cannot
escape; “The parents locked her daughter up for the weekend”; “She locked her
jewels in the safe”
5. [v] throw or cast away; “Put away your worries”
6. [v] lock up or confine, in or as in a jail; “The suspects were imprisoned without
trial”; “the murderer was incarcerated for the rest of his life”

Synonyms include: cast aside, cast away, cast out, discard, dispose, throw away,
throw out

b. The Collins English Dictionary © 2000 HarperCollins Publishers:
“Put Away”
verb[transitive, adverb(ial)]
1 to return (something) to the correct or proper place
example: he put away his books
2 to save
example: to put away money for the future
3 to lock up in a prison, mental institution, etc.
example: they put him away for twenty years
4 to eat or drink, esp. in large amounts
5 to put to death, because of old age or illness
example: the dog had to be put away

c. There was NO MENTION of divorce anywhere in the definition of “put away”.
1) Why is this significant?
2) Because apoluo is properly translated, “put away” and “put away”, in our
language does not mean divorce.
3) In the O.T. there were two parts to a divorce, and it is pretty much the same
today.
a) You file for divorce, and when the papers are completed you present them
to your spouse.
b) Then you put her away or send her out of the house. (Of course, in our
day the woman usually gets the house and the man leaves.)

D. Authorities on the meaning of Divorce:
“Apostasion”, properly translated “divorce” or “divorcement”. [Grk. 647] apostasion
(ap-os-tas’-ee-on) “neuter of a (presumed) adjective from a derivative of 868; properly,
something separative, i.e. (specially) divorce:--(writing of) divorcement” (Strong's).
Smith’s Bible Dictionary defines divorce as: “A legal dissolution of the marriage
relation.”

E. What about the fact that some versions of the N.T. translate apoluo as divorce?
1. It is true that several translations have translated apoluo as divorce in Matt 5:32 etc.
a. However, as far as I have been able to find out, the KJV was the first to translate
apoluo as divorce and it was certainly inconsistent in so doing.
1) Of the 11 times Jesus used the word apoluo the KJV rendered it “put away”
ever time except in one case – Matt. 5:32.
2) There is no apparent reason for the inconsistency.
b. Previous to the KJV was the Wyclilff version:
Mark 10:11 - “Whosoever putteth awaye his wyfe and maryeth another, breaketh
wedlock to herward. And if a woman forsake her husband and be maryed to
another, she committeth advoutry also.”
c. A margin note in The Geneva Bible translated from the Textus Receptus in
1560 (about 50 years before the KJV) concerning the term put away said, “that
is, was not lawfully divorced.”
1) Why is this worthy of note? It gives support to the idea that Jesus was talking
about men merely putting away their wives and NOT divorcing them lawfully.

d. Greek/English Interlinear (tr){BUT I} legw <3004> (5719) {SAY} umin <5213> {TO
YOU} oti <3754> {THAT} oV <3739> an <302> {WHOEVER} apolush <630> (5661)
thn <3588> {SHALL PUT AWAY} gunaika <1135> autou <846> {HIS WIFE,} parektoV
<3924> {EXCEPT} logou <3056> {ON ACCOUNT} porneiaV <4202> {OF
FORNICATION,} poiei <4160> (5719) {CAUSES} authn <846> {HER} moicasqai
<3429> (5738) {TO COMMIT ADULTERY;} kai <2532> {AND} oV <3739> ean
<1437> {WHOEVER} apolelumenhn <630> (5772) {HER WHO HAS BEEN PUT
AWAY} gamhsh <1060> (5661) {SHALL MARRY,} moicatai <3429> (5736)
{COMMITS ADULTERY.}
e. The ASV is widely respected as being the most literal and accurate version.
a. It consistently renders apoluo as “put away” in the passages relative to our
study, but never does it render it as divorce.
b. Had the ASV scholars understood apoluo to mean divorce they would have so
translated it.
2. What appears to have happened is that the KJV erred by translating apoluo as
divorce in one instance, probably due to Papal influence.
a. Then by the time many of the newer versions came along many scholars were
indoctrinated in the idea that Jesus meant divorce when he was talking about
merely "putting away", and therefore their biases were reflected in their decisions.
b. Considering that the KJV has been so respected and widely used there is no wonder
that many were influenced by it.

[rodimus321]

What evidence is there that “put away” just means what it says and does not
mean divorce?

A. First, there is a GK word for divorce and it is not the one that is translated put away in
Matt 19:9.
1. Greek words:
a. APOLUO – “Put away”
b. APOSTASION - “Divorce”
2. It is argued that apoluo and apostasion are used interchangeably.
a. I recognize that some preachers have been deliberately saying “put away”
when they mean divorce.
b. But it is a misuse of the Greek and the English.
3. Interlinear: Mt 5:32 (KJV text)
But <de> I <ego> say <lego> unto you <humin>, That <hoti> whosoever <hos>
<an> shall put away <apoluo> his <autos> wife <gune>, saving <parektos> for
the cause <logos> of fornication <porneia>, causeth <poieo> her <autos> to
commit adultery <moichao> and <kai> whosoever <hos> <ean> shall marry
<gameo> her that is divorced <apoluo> committeth adultery <moichao>

B. Authorities on APOLUO:
1. Thayer says apoluo means, “to dismiss from the house, to repudiate.” (Thayer’s
Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament, pg. 66).
2. Bagster’s Analytical Lexicon: “Apoluo. Put away: To let go; to let loose; to
send away”

C. Authorities on the meaning of the English words "PUT AWAY":
Some English dictionaries do not even include divorce as a definition of “put away”
including:
a. Wordnet Dictionary:
“Put Away”
Definition:
1. [v] turn away from and put aside, perhaps temporarily; “She turned away from her
painting”
2. [v] eat up; usually refers to a considerable quantity of food; “My son tucked in a
whole pizza”
3. [v] kill gently, as with an injection, as of pet animals
4. [v] place in a place where something cannot be removed or someone cannot
escape; “The parents locked her daughter up for the weekend”; “She locked her
jewels in the safe”
5. [v] throw or cast away; “Put away your worries”
6. [v] lock up or confine, in or as in a jail; “The suspects were imprisoned without
trial”; “the murderer was incarcerated for the rest of his life”

Synonyms include: cast aside, cast away, cast out, discard, dispose, throw away,
throw out

b. The Collins English Dictionary © 2000 HarperCollins Publishers:
“Put Away”
verb[transitive, adverb(ial)]
1 to return (something) to the correct or proper place
example: he put away his books
2 to save
example: to put away money for the future
3 to lock up in a prison, mental institution, etc.
example: they put him away for twenty years
4 to eat or drink, esp. in large amounts
5 to put to death, because of old age or illness
example: the dog had to be put away

c. There was NO MENTION of divorce anywhere in the definition of “put away”.
1) Why is this significant?
2) Because apoluo is properly translated, “put away” and “put away”, in our
language does not mean divorce.
3) In the O.T. there were two parts to a divorce, and it is pretty much the same
today.
a) You file for divorce, and when the papers are completed you present them
to your spouse.
b) Then you put her away or send her out of the house. (Of course, in our
day the woman usually gets the house and the man leaves.)

D. Authorities on the meaning of Divorce:
“Apostasion”, properly translated “divorce” or “divorcement”. [Grk. 647] apostasion
(ap-os-tas’-ee-on) “neuter of a (presumed) adjective from a derivative of 868; properly,
something separative, i.e. (specially) divorce:--(writing of) divorcement” (Strong's).
Smith’s Bible Dictionary defines divorce as: “A legal dissolution of the marriage
relation.”

E. What about the fact that some versions of the N.T. translate apoluo as divorce?
1. It is true that several translations have translated apoluo as divorce in Matt 5:32 etc.
a. However, as far as I have been able to find out, the KJV was the first to translate
apoluo as divorce and it was certainly inconsistent in so doing.
1) Of the 11 times Jesus used the word apoluo the KJV rendered it “put away”
ever time except in one case – Matt. 5:32.
2) There is no apparent reason for the inconsistency.
b. Previous to the KJV was the Wyclilff version:
Mark 10:11 - “Whosoever putteth awaye his wyfe and maryeth another, breaketh
wedlock to herward. And if a woman forsake her husband and be maryed to
another, she committeth advoutry also.”
c. A margin note in The Geneva Bible translated from the Textus Receptus in
1560 (about 50 years before the KJV) concerning the term put away said, “that
is, was not lawfully divorced.”
1) Why is this worthy of note? It gives support to the idea that Jesus was talking
about men merely putting away their wives and NOT divorcing them lawfully.

d. Greek/English Interlinear (tr){BUT I} legw <3004> (5719) {SAY} umin <5213> {TO
YOU} oti <3754> {THAT} oV <3739> an <302> {WHOEVER} apolush <630> (5661)
thn <3588> {SHALL PUT AWAY} gunaika <1135> autou <846> {HIS WIFE,} parektoV
<3924> {EXCEPT} logou <3056> {ON ACCOUNT} porneiaV <4202> {OF
FORNICATION,} poiei <4160> (5719) {CAUSES} authn <846> {HER} moicasqai
<3429> (5738) {TO COMMIT ADULTERY;} kai <2532> {AND} oV <3739> ean
<1437> {WHOEVER} apolelumenhn <630> (5772) {HER WHO HAS BEEN PUT
AWAY} gamhsh <1060> (5661) {SHALL MARRY,} moicatai <3429> (5736)
{COMMITS ADULTERY.}
e. The ASV is widely respected as being the most literal and accurate version.
a. It consistently renders apoluo as “put away” in the passages relative to our
study, but never does it render it as divorce.
b. Had the ASV scholars understood apoluo to mean divorce they would have so
translated it.
2. What appears to have happened is that the KJV erred by translating apoluo as
divorce in one instance, probably due to Papal influence.
a. Then by the time many of the newer versions came along many scholars were
indoctrinated in the idea that Jesus meant divorce when he was talking about
merely "putting away", and therefore their biases were reflected in their decisions.
b. Considering that the KJV has been so respected and widely used there is no wonder
that many were influenced by it.

Whats your point? I never said anybody could get a divorce for abuse or leaving. You can try to explain it away all you want, but divorce is wrong.
I am absolutely amazed at how much the Truth has been pushed aside by our society.

The New Testament texts (Mt 5:31–32; 19:7–9; Mk 10:4–12; Lk 16:18; 1 Cor 7:10–11) make the same point, permitting divorce only in the cases of irreconcilable adultery and unalterable abandonment.[/url]
Please feel free to explain these away as well.

You can't just divorce someone because you feel you married them for the wrong reasons.
[url="http://www.christianforums.com/editpost.php?do=editpost&p=19212978#_ftnref1"] (http://www.christianforums.com/editpost.php?do=editpost&p=19212978#_ftn1)

[rodimus321]

Paragraph two:
--------------

Paul means people who 'burn with passion'

(this means people who love each other)




Passion does not mean love.

In Acts 1:3 ‘passion’ translates pathein and refers to Christ’s suffering and death. This use of the term is still current. Elsewhere the same word is translated ‘suffer’ (e.g. Lk. 17:25; 24:26; Acts 17:3; Heb. (#_ftn1)etc.)

In Acts 14:15 and Jas. 5:17 av (#_ftn2) uses ‘passion’ to translate homoiopothēs. rsv (#_ftn3) ‘of like nature’ gives the sense of the Greek.

In its bad sense ‘passion’ translates pathos in Rom. 1:26; Col. 3:5; 1 Thes. 4:5 (in the NT (#_ftn4) this word always has the meaning ‘evil desire’), and pathēmata in Rom. 7:5 and Gal. 5:24 (a word which usually has the sense of ‘sufferings’). rsv also uses it 15 times to translate epithymia, ‘desire’ (usually in the plural) in the bad sense of that word. (*Lust.)

[dawnsday]

so then truely falling in love is supposed to be what marriage really is? isn't what's more important the promise you made to God? just cause you were young and stupid does that mean you don't have to live with your mistakes you can just run away from them.

[Svt4Him]

Whats your point? I never said anybody could get a divorce for abuse or leaving. You can try to explain it away all you want, but divorce is wrong.
I am absolutely amazed at how much the Truth has been pushed aside by our society.

The New Testament texts (Mt 5:31–32; 19:7–9; Mk 10:4–12; Lk 16:18; 1 Cor 7:10–11) make the same point, permitting divorce only in the cases of irreconcilable adultery and unalterable abandonment.
Please feel free to explain these away as well.

You can't just divorce someone because you feel you married them for the wrong reasons.


And I am equally amazed at how people use their understanding as their authority. So which version would you like to look at, since the greek is obviously not good enough:

(ASV) but I say unto you, that every one that putteth away his wife, saving for the
cause of fornication, maketh her an adulteress: and whosoever shall marry her
when she is PUT AWAY committeth adultery.

(Bible in Basic English) But I say to you that everyone who puts away his wife
for any other cause but the loss of her virtue, makes her false to her husband;
and whoever takes her as his wife after she is PUT AWAY, is no true husband
to her.

(Darby) But I say unto you, that whosoever shall put away his wife, except for
cause of fornication, makes her commit adultery, and whosoever marries one
that is PUT AWAY commits adultery.

(DRB) But I say to you, that whosoever shall put away his wife, excepting the
cause of fornication, maketh her to commit adultery: and he that shall marry her
that is PUT AWAY, committeth adultery.

(LITV) But I say to you, Whoever puts away his wife, apart from a matter of
fornication, causes her to commit adultery. And whoever shall marry the one
PUT AWAY commits adultery.

(MKJV) But I say to you that whoever shall put away his wife, except for the cause
of fornication, causes her to commit adultery. And whoever shall marry her who is
PUT AWAY commits adultery.

(Worldwide English) But I tell you, no man may send away his wife unless she has
committed adultery. If he does send her away, he is making her commit adultery.
And if a man marries a woman who has been sent away from her husband, he
commits adultery.’

(World English Bible) But I tell you that whoever puts away his wife, except for
the cause of sexual immorality, makes her an adulteress; and whoever marries her
when she is put away commits adultery.

(WYC) But I say to you, that every man that leaveth his wife [that every man
that shall leave his wife], except (for) [the] cause of fornication, maketh her to do
lechery, and he that weddeth the forsaken wife, doeth adultery.

(Youngs Literal Translation) But I—I say to you, that whoever may PUT AWAY
his wife, save for the matter of whoredom, doth make her to commit adultery; and
whoever may marry her who hath been PUT AWAY doth commit adultery.

[ronmathison]

isn't what's more important the promise you made to God?

Jesus says to not make vows.

Vows were allowed in The Old Covenant, or the law of Moses.

Christians are not under the law of moses, as found in Galatians 3:10.

Otherwise, people should be circumsised, not eat pork, stay home on Saturday, etc.

[daverain]

Passion does not mean love.





In its bad sense ‘passion’ translates pathos





Ah, BUT...


The word Paul uses

in 1 Corinthians 7:9,

is -NOT- pathos.

it is:

puroo

(strong's number 4448)

I found this in my Greek Interlinear N.T.

(thanks, Mom)

It (=puroo), is derived from

pur (# 4442), or -FIRE- .

It means (from my Greek dictionary) :

To kindle ie passion

to be ignited , glow , refined , etc.

(who told you it was pathos? )

---------------------------------

I can imagine a man and a woman

who love each other

and burn with passion

for each other, as well.


Can thee?



.

[daverain]

d. Greek/English Interlinear (tr){BUT I} legw <3004> (5719) {SAY} umin <5213> {TO
YOU} oti <3754> {THAT} oV <3739> an <302> {WHOEVER} apolush <630> (5661)
thn <3588> {SHALL PUT AWAY} gunaika <1135> autou <846> {HIS WIFE,} parektoV
<3924> {EXCEPT} logou <3056> {ON ACCOUNT} porneiaV <4202> {OF
FORNICATION,} poiei <4160> (5719) {CAUSES} authn <846> {HER} moicasqai
<3429> (5738) {TO COMMIT ADULTERY;}



It has been said

that the

-FORNICATION-

spoken above by Jesus

(which is still in The Old Covenant, b.t.w)

means that

if it was found out

that she

-WASN'T-

a -VIRGIN-

(= yet, she had -LIED- , and said that she -WAS- a virgin, at betrothment) ,

then it was permissable to -PUT HER AWAY-

(like what Joseph had planned to do with Mary)

The woman is identified, because it would be

-VERY-

hard to prove that the

-MAN-

had lied, and -WASN'T- a virgin, at betrothement.

This would indicate that true-love was -NOT- present between both.



Peace in Christ.

[Svt4Him]

It has been said

that the

-FORNICATION-

spoken above by Jesus

(which is still in The Old Covenant, b.t.w)

means that

if it was found out

that she

-WASN'T-

a -VIRGIN-

(= yet, she had -LIED- , and said that she -WAS- a virgin, at betrothment) ,

then it was permissable to -PUT HER AWAY-

(like what Joseph had planned to do with Mary)

The woman is identified, because it would be

-VERY-

hard to prove that the

-MAN-

had lied, and -WASN'T- a virgin, at betrothement.

This would indicate that true-love was -NOT- present between both.



Peace in Christ.

Where do you get this from, and what about one who was married before? As for the ot part, God is God in the OT, and equally God in the new, so why is it thrown out? And why does marriage have to be about love when there are cultures that prearrange marriage and the couple learn to love eachother? And why is it OT when Jesus says that one can put a spouse away for fornication?

[dawnsday]

and what do you think about seperation, time away, not divorce not dating other people for a trial period as a possible help for the marriage

[mysparrow]

A twenty year old boy marries a woman based soley on sexual attraction, believing everything else will fall into place with time. They are both christains at the time of the marriage. He finds sixteen years later, with two teenaged children, he never was "in love" with his wife. His wife has grown obese, is not, in his eyes, a good mother and is trying to turn his children against him. He tells himself he has tried everything to fix this marriage. His wife refuses counceling and now says she is no longer a christian and believes all people are god. He decides to divorce her. He will go to school so he can afford to, then leave. He is attracted to a younger woman. He has told her so. She has refused him, but he still plans to leave his wife. He says that the right thing to do is to divorce her and it would be wrong to stay just because he said "for better or for worse". He doesn't think he is sinning.

Based on the bible is he right or wrong.
According to the word , if the woman wants to stay in the marriage , he should not put her away, but there are many things that come into play, I suggest you read the word on it , and above all ask God .
God hates divorce , but made provisions , cause he knew it would happen.
please seek God on it before doing anything , and even if you choose to divorce , we are to abide by the laws of the land also, and as long as they
are married legally, should not date or see anyone else . if his sole interest in the woman was sexual to begin with it seems as if his walk with Christ was not foremost in his mind , and therein may be the problem. He should search his heart, and make sure his relationship with Jesus is all it should be , and that Jesus truly comes first , before anything else. I hope this helps some .:prayer: Im praying for the situation.

[mysparrow]

for the record, he's a friend (I'm a girl!) and i'm the woman he claimed to be in love with (he is fourteen years my senior and i thought of him as an uncle type, and NO i did not lead him on, he was delusional, maybe still is i don't know, but trust me he KNOWS he has no chance with me) I have been his close friend for over a year and don't know if cutting off our friendship is better or worse, (doesn't it say something about not turning your back on a fellow christian?) and he has no one else. trust me on this, he really has no one else...

this is my attempt to make sure he is fully aware of his choice and the consequences and all the possible view points on what he may do...if i can make him think twice about it, maybe there is a way to save his marriage, maybe not, but he needs more opinions and advice then i, at my age, and have never been being married, can give him.
Dawn he needs help from a male point of view , a pastor, etc. Trying to be a close friend to him given the circumstances will only make matters worse hon.
Although i admire your wanting to help, i think id be very careful about how close i allow myself , as long as his eyes are on you he will not be thinking of what God says, because he will be reacting in the flesh. just a thought.

[mysparrow]

and what do you think about seperation, time away, not divorce not dating other people for a trial period as a possible help for the marriage
all opportunities should be made for restoration, but from the convo you posted of his own words it seems as if the woman nor him were walking in the path God would have when they met or else they would not have entered into the sexual thing as quickly, and there seems no remorse for those actions, which leads me to think maybe they werent equally yoked to begin with , and christian is being used very loosely by him to describe himself and her at one time . I do not presume to judge but only say this to say that each of thems walk with Jesus is whats most important, and if they separate maybe they can get that straight first , and then seek restoration of the marriage and of the love it seems they never had . I feel for those children , cause so often they are the ones to pay for our mistakes , in thinking we can toss something away , just because it doesnt "feel right" now .

[dawnsday]

Dawn he needs help from a male point of view , a pastor, etc. Trying to be a close friend to him given the circumstances will only make matters worse hon.
Although i admire your wanting to help, i think id be very careful about how close i allow myself , as long as his eyes are on you he will not be thinking of what God says, because he will be reacting in the flesh. just a thought.

every man he knows has told him to do it, very supportive...no offence to men but it seems his male influences are very typical

[ronmathison]

God is God in the OT, and equally God in the new, so why is it thrown out?

Christians don't have to be circumsised, like it says to do in the old-covenant.
The law of Moses can be thrown out, because Christians aren't under it. Please see Galatians 3:10.

- Ron Mathison .

[ronmathison]

And why is it OT when Jesus says

The New Covenant began at Pentecost. Christ's sacrifice needed to take place first, so The Holy Spirit could be poured forth upon all mankind. This is why Jesus said that whoever is least in the kingdom of heaven, is greater than John the baptist. John the baptist lived and died, and was spoken about by Jesus, before Pentecost.

- Ron Mathison .

[dawnsday]

okay say he divorces...

can he marry again

and say he can't

will he go to hell if he does?

[ThankyouJesus]

for the record, he's a friend (I'm a girl!) and i'm the woman he claimed to be in love with (he is fourteen years my senior and i thought of him as an uncle type, and NO i did not lead him on, he was delusional, maybe still is i don't know, but trust me he KNOWS he has no chance with me) I have been his close friend for over a year and don't know if cutting off our friendship is better or worse, (doesn't it say something about not turning your back on a fellow christian?) and he has no one else. trust me on this, he really has no one else...

this is my attempt to make sure he is fully aware of his choice and the consequences and all the possible view points on what he may do...if i can make him think twice about it, maybe there is a way to save his marriage, maybe not, but he needs more opinions and advice then i, at my age, and have never been being married, can give him.

Dawnday: He is the only one that can change his way, you do sound sincere in trying to save his marriage ~ if you feel that he wants you ~ my advice is try to keep a distance ~ obviously he seeks lust and that is sin ~ it is better to keep a distance due to him having lust for you ~ this does not mean you have to hate him or be unfriendly ~ you can still be civil at the same time keep your distance. He needs to seek the Lord ~ not you.

peace be with you

[ThankyouJesus]

okay say he divorces...

can he marry again

and say he can't

will he go to hell if he does?

Dawnsday: Sorry I did not see this latest post before I answered my OP, he is currently in lust or some type of problem with his family matters ~ If I were you I would stay to your faith and keep the distance ~ he needs to turn to the Lord ~ I see you are very sincere and share your concerns with fellow Christians here ~ keep this faith and do not let lust or his problems bring you down.
peace

[SharonL]

The first connection I make is "He was never in love with her and she has become obese" these two go together. He loved her enough to stay with her while she labored to raise the children and now maybe feels used. Most of the time you find an obese person - look way beyond the pounds - there is usually a very logical underlying problem.

It is probably not only the wife that needs counseling - he also needs to go.

Next, what has happened to cause her to no longer believe in God, but thinks we are all gods.

If there is nothing there to cause concern, why is she turning her children against him.

It is very wrong to jump to judgement when only one side is heard.

Divorce is not an easy thing to say you should or should not do - we do not walk in their shoes.

If you do not have Bibical reason for divorce and you are miserable - then step away from it for awhile, but continue your family obligations - but seek guidance from the Lord and not another lustful relationship.